Question I'm looking for a UPS for monitor, PC and it's peripherals, but can't decide on the power draw ?

[zgzdgz]

I'm looking for an UPS that maybe either be made, by APC or the CYBERPOWER, and, as for the power, since the it's corsair RMx1000w + UR59C, maybe a speaker , maybe 900-1500W would suffice, but then there is the "VA" rating, does it matter that much ? And from what I could understand, the the sine-wave is the only way to go in order to be sure with sensitive electronics.

 

[Ralston18]

Regarding power draw.

Most UPS manufacturer's provide some sort of calculator to help size the UPS.

However the calculators tend to lean towards a more expensive choice.

What is often forgotten is the reason for a UPS.

A UPS is intended to provide power just long enough for the end user to conduct an graceful system shutdown when external power is lost. The purpose being to avoid damage and or corrupted files from an unexpected system/windows shutdown.

Not to keep gaming, watching movies, playing music etc.

If continuing to game, watch a movie, play music is the intent then a generator is a more viable alternative during power outages. (Likely moot anyway as the power outage may have taken out the internet service.)

All I need is about 5 minutes of UPS time to shut down.

Some situations require more time so the UPS has to be sized accordingly. Maybe time for some quick backup.

As for VA and sine waves I will defer to others regarding the details there.

One question: what sensitive electronics are in use?

FYI:

https://gadgetmates.com/best-uninte...the difference,be compatible with all devices.

For the most part, more needs to be known about the overall requirements.

 

[zgzdgz]

Regarding power draw.

Most UPS manufacturer's provide some sort of calculator to help size the UPS.

However the calculators tend to lean towards a more expensive choice.

What is often forgotten is the reason for a UPS.

A UPS is intended to provide power just long enough for the end user to conduct an graceful system shutdown when external power is lost. The purpose being to avoid damage and or corrupted files from an unexpected system/windows shutdown.

Not to keep gaming, watching movies, playing music etc.

If continuing to game, watch a movie, play music is the intent then a generator is a more viable alternative during power outages. (Likely moot anyway as the power outage may have taken out the internet service.)

All I need is about 5 minutes of UPS time to shut down.

Some situations require more time so the UPS has to be sized accordingly. Maybe time for some quick backup.

As for VA and sine waves I will defer to others regarding the details there.

One question: what sensitive electronics are in use?

FYI:

https://gadgetmates.com/best-uninterruptible-power-supply-ups-in-2024#:~:text=Q: What is the difference,be compatible with all devices.

For the most part, more needs to be known about the overall requirements.

Well mostly speakers, monitor, pc and whats connected to the pc, game controllers, peripherals, etc. I think the main use would be, in case of a damage to the data or the electronics itself, so even 15-5~ minutes left in battery mode, would be enough to prevent the damage, but that's it, also maybe in case in the power surge, or an indirect lightning strike, as far as I heard it does offer some protection as well.

 

[Ralston18]

Power surge:

Protection is provided via Joules.

Joules are cumulative: One or two big hits or perhaps a number of smaller hits.

Once the cumulative total is reached there is no more protection.

FYI (not an endorsement or recommendation). You can easily find other similar links.

https://www.cdw.com/content/cdw/en/articles/hardware/how-to-choose-a-surge-protector.html

However, that said, when it comes to lightning strikes of any sort then all bets are off.

The current will go any way it can find to go: AC, audio, video, network, alarm system, camera system, coax - wires of any type.

Good chance that the spark will also simply jump through the air enroute to ground (earth). That is what lightning does anyway.

 

[zgzdgz]

Power surge:

Protection is provided via Joules.

Joules are cumulative: One or two big hits or perhaps a number of smaller hits.

Once the cumulative total is reached there is no more protection.

FYI (not an endorsement or recommendation). You can easily find other similar links.

https://www.cdw.com/content/cdw/en/articles/hardware/how-to-choose-a-surge-protector.html

However, that said, when it comes to lightning strikes of any sort then all bets are off.

The current will go any way it can find to go: AC, audio, video, network, alarm system, camera system, coax - wires of any type.

Good chance that the spark will also simply jump through the air enroute to ground (earth). That is what lightning does anyway.

Hmm, I see. So UPS still does protect it from various types of power surges, but only up to a point, say a 1000J, but is that really enough?

 

[Ralston18]

With lightning and/or poor power service I would be hard-pressed to know if 1000J is enough.

Depends on where you live (not asking).

My policy is to unplug most things when storms are predicted - especially if I am not going to be home. If home, I may unplug some but not all. Taking the chance that if things get really bad that I will have time to unplug everything else.

Fortunately we do not have inherent power problems (surges). Not true for all too many members here.

Lightning strikes can be millions of Joules. Direct hit making almost all forms of protection moot.

FYI:

https://blog.tripplite.com/what-are-surge-protector-joules-and-how-many-do-i-need

https://www.cdw.com/content/cdw/en/articles/hardware/how-to-choose-a-surge-protector.html

(For reading and reference purposes. Not recommending or endorsing any given product).

I have two small UPS's that allow about 5 minutes operation time for me to shutdown when power fails.

Both with "Surge energy rating(s)" at 350 J.

If your cirumtances, environment, and budget allow then having 1000J would "be enough".

Maybe get a UPS with an indicator that show when surge protection is gone.

 

[zgzdgz]

With lightning and/or poor power service I would be hard-pressed to know if 1000J is enough.

Depends on where you live (not asking).

My policy is to unplug most things when storms are predicted - especially if I am not going to be home. If home, I may unplug some but not all. Taking the chance that if things get really bad that I will have time to unplug everything else.

Fortunately we do not have inherent power problems (surges). Not true for all too many members here.

Lightning strikes can be millions of Joules. Direct hit making almost all forms of protection moot.

FYI:

https://blog.tripplite.com/what-are-surge-protector-joules-and-how-many-do-i-need

https://www.cdw.com/content/cdw/en/articles/hardware/how-to-choose-a-surge-protector.html

(For reading and reference purposes. Not recommending or endorsing any given product).

I have two small UPS's that allow about 5 minutes operation time for me to shutdown when power fails.

Both with "Surge energy rating(s)" at 350 J.

If your cirumtances, environment, and budget allow then having 1000J would "be enough".

Maybe get a UPS with an indicator that show when surge protection is gone.

I see. Yes, nothing can defeat the lightning strike, and as for the UPS, do you have any good ups in mind friend ?

 

[bill001g]

There are really only 2 numbers you care about. The maximum watts it will run. VA is a related value and is used in advertising since it is always a bigger number. You want to use the watts number. This is the maximum amount of power the unit is designed to deliver on a constant basis. This would be the total power of all the device you plug in.

The next number a bit harder to find is how many amp hours the batteries have. This will tell you how long the batteries will last in a perfect world where there is no wasted power in the conversion from dc to ac.

This is where being somewhat good at simple math and knowing the formula watts=volt x amps.

So let say your UPS has a 9 amp hour battery. Since batteries tend to be 12 volts you get 108 watt hours. Which means it can deliver 108 watts for 1 hour.

Batteries produce less power, more lost to heat, if you draw them at a faster rate. Too complex to get actual number but you can do quick and dirty estimates. So let say your equipment uses 1080 watts instead of 108. This would mean the batteries could produce the power for 6 minutes.


This is where you have to be kinda careful. You can have 2 UPS both rated at 1000 watts but one has a single 9ah battery and the other has 2 9ah batteries.

You can generally get the details on the batteries if you look for what the replacement packs are. Most UPS batteries will degrade after 3 years even if you never go to battery power mode.

 

[zgzdgz]

There are really only 2 numbers you care about. The maximum watts it will run. VA is a related value and is used in advertising since it is always a bigger number. You want to use the watts number. This is the maximum amount of power the unit is designed to deliver on a constant basis. This would be the total power of all the device you plug in.

The next number a bit harder to find is how many amp hours the batteries have. This will tell you how long the batteries will last in a perfect world where there is no wasted power in the conversion from dc to ac.

This is where being somewhat good at simple math and knowing the formula watts=volt x amps.

So let say your UPS has a 9 amp hour battery. Since batteries tend to be 12 volts you get 108 watt hours. Which means it can deliver 108 watts for 1 hour.

Batteries produce less power, more lost to heat, if you draw them at a faster rate. Too complex to get actual number but you can do quick and dirty estimates. So let say your equipment uses 1080 watts instead of 108. This would mean the batteries could produce the power for 6 minutes.


This is where you have to be kinda careful. You can have 2 UPS both rated at 1000 watts but one has a single 9ah battery and the other has 2 9ah batteries.

You can generally get the details on the batteries if you look for what the replacement packs are. Most UPS batteries will degrade after 3 years even if you never go to battery power mode.

I see, Yeah I've seen those power calculators, it does seem to calculate near exact time that's left in the battery when going into the full power mode. Though I've heard that people are using those "sine-wave" or in general "inverters" of some kind with their UPSs, does it serves any kind purpose ?

 

[bill001g]

In some ways it would be nice if computers used 12 volts dc then you could just put some batteries in line between the AC converter and the computer.

Sine wave UPS and more important generators have become much more common. Modern electronics power supplies have become much more efficient at converting the AC city power to DC. They have all kinds of fancy chips that use the sine wave signal to get the optimum conversion. Using simulated sine wave or worse square wave UPS and generators can damage this equipment. Most time it is just more inefficient but this also means the wasted power is going to heat in these chips which likley reduces their life.

Although you should always get a sine wave UPS if you can afford it you have to remember this only matters when you are running on the battery. In normal conditions the UPS is just passing power from the city. So you are not really running your sensitive equipment for long periods of time on the battery generated power. It is not the best thing to do but most times power outages are only a couple seconds in most big cities and you are turning the machine off for longer ones.

A generator though is a very different story since you likely plan to run for hours. If you follow the RV forums it doesn't destroys the equipment immediately it takes quite a bit of time it seems. I suspect it varies greatly by device.

 

[zgzdgz]

In some ways it would be nice if computers used 12 volts dc then you could just put some batteries in line between the AC converter and the computer.

Sine wave UPS and more important generators have become much more common. Modern electronics power supplies have become much more efficient at converting the AC city power to DC. They have all kinds of fancy chips that use the sine wave signal to get the optimum conversion. Using simulated sine wave or worse square wave UPS and generators can damage this equipment. Most time it is just more inefficient but this also means the wasted power is going to heat in these chips which likley reduces their life.

Although you should always get a sine wave UPS if you can afford it you have to remember this only matters when you are running on the battery. In normal conditions the UPS is just passing power from the city. So you are not really running your sensitive equipment for long periods of time on the battery generated power. It is not the best thing to do but most times power outages are only a couple seconds in most big cities and you are turning the machine off for longer ones.

A generator though is a very different story since you likely plan to run for hours. If you follow the RV forums it doesn't destroys the equipment immediately it takes quite a bit of time it seems. I suspect it varies greatly by device.

Well, say you are doing the bios update, will generator or the UPS should be your safest bet in that kind of situation? I know that gigabyte makes motherboards that has a secondary bios chip, but it's only on few selected boards.

 

[bill001g]

You have to remember your computer is not pulling much power if all you are doing is flashing a bios. You buy a UPS based on using maximum load for worst case but they will run much longer at lower power draw.
I would not worry very edge cases like losing power during a bios update. Lets say it would happen how much you want to spend on ups etc compare to the cost of replacing a motherboard for something that you seldom do.

A UPS is more if you have been typing in say a huge document and the power goes out. You can quickly save it and shut the machine down so you take no chance of something being corrupted by just turning the machine off. Windows though is very good at recovery of the OS itself if you just power off the machine.
I would bet a very large percentage of computer users run with no UPS and it tends to just be some smaller inconvenience restarting their computer and programs.

All depends on how often the power goes off where you live.