Question I'm looking for experience-based advice on an EOL machine ?

[devparam02]

Hello Tom's Hardware,

I have an HP Z440 Workstation which has been my daily machine for almost 7 years now. It is powerful enough for my work needs. I recently upgraded the graphic card and everything works as expected, except the HDDs.

The HDDs have a mind of their own. Occasionally, I will hear the usb disconnect sound and one of my HDDs will decide to go for a walk. All of my HDDs do this from time to time, but I've isolated the problem to a couple of HDDs. I can also hear the click of death from time to time.

If I restart my machine and reconnect the plugs/cables to that particular HDD, the HDD comes back to life again.

I would like to believe that I have good quality SATA cables from Corsair and OEM power cables.

Its good to note that I've always had this problem with these HDDs, and some of them are over 15 years old at this point. Also, I have SSDs in this, and they have never had any issues. These SSDs are over 2 years old.

What do you reckon is happening?

• HDD EOL failure ?
• Machine motherboard, SATA plug points on the motherboard dying ?

Also important to note that this machine has been shifted a few times - from Malaysia to India, and then from India to UK and now from UK to Sydney. Always in checked in luggage. Obviously doing the safe thing and disconnecting everything that can be disconnected before packing.

Do you think its time to retire this machine or are the symptoms just symptoms of HDD failure and I would be able to plug in a new HDD in and squeeze a few more years from this machine?

Thanks for reading and for the replies.

 

[Lutfij]

Welcome to the forums, newcomer!

I recently upgraded the graphic card and everything works as expected, except the HDDs.
What did you upgrade the GPU with? You state that the prebuilt in your possession is 7 years old. So we're to assume you didn't change the PSU in the prebuilt across the 7 years?

I went looking through the spec sheet for the prebuilt and it shows that it came with two different PSU flavors, one that's 525W and the other being 700W, which one do you have and what did it power prior to your GPU upgrade?

Did you make sure your BIOS was updated prior to performing the GPU upgrade?

Its good to note that I've always had this problem with these HDDs, and some of them are over 15 years old at this point.
You should retire the HDD's if they are indeed 15 years old. be sure to backup any mission critical data off of them and replace the HDD's with something concurrent.

 

[SkyNetRising]

The HDDs have a mind of their own. Occasionally, I will hear the usb disconnect sound and one of my HDDs will decide to go for a walk.
All of my HDDs do this from time to time, but I've isolated the problem to a couple of HDDs. I can also hear the click of death from time to time.

How many drives?
List model names of your drives. Drive model names can be found in Device Manager.
Are they internal (SATA connected) or external (USB connected) ?
If internal - are they connected to motherboard or a discrete SAS raid card?

Diagnose your drives. Use HDtune health. Show screenshots - health section.
(upload to imgur.com and post link)

 

[devparam02]

Hello Lutfij,

Thank you for the quick reply! Happy Easter!

I have a 700 watt OEM PSU, haven’t changed it since I got this prebuilt. The old GPU was the Quadro K2200 and the new one is the 2060.

I’ve not updated the BIOS for a few years now. I think the last release for the BIOS was the final one. But I’ll check this.

So do you think there’s a good chance that the HDDs are dying but the machine itself has a few more years of life left, based on what we know so far?

 

[alceryes]

You've had the computer for 7 years, but the HDDs are 15+ years old...? Are these HDDs a transplant from another system? If yes, was the disconnect issue happening in the other system?

 

[SkyNetRising]

So do you think there’s a good chance that the HDD are dying but the machine itself has a few more years of life left, based on what we know so far?

Without proper diagnostics - all anyone can offer is just a guessing game.
Diagnose your drives.

 

[devparam02]

Hello @SkyNetRising @alceryes @Lutfij

I had a Quadro K2200 and replaced it with a 2060. The 700w PSU has remained the same since I got this prebuilt.

I’ve updated the BIOS today from 2.59 to 2.61. Update went through, but issue still exists. The BIOS was not updated prior to the GPU upgrade.

Thankfully, I was able to backup most of the data on all HDDs to an external HDD (I know, not safe). I plan to purchase a new HDD once in Sydney and then migrate all backups to that HDD.

I’ve never had the option to be able to test these HDDs in another system. But one of my HDDs died recently.

I’ve attached images from HDtune health. The HDDs are internal SATA connected.

The model names of my HDDs are:
ST2000NM0008-2F3
WDC WD20EZRX-00D
ST31000528AS
WDC WD 6400AAKS-0

https://imgur.com/a/MKvkqFj

 

[stonecarver]

To divide the issue and get to is it the machine or the drives just do a simple to the point test.

Get a spare SSD and use only that unplug every other SSD and hard drive and reinstall Windows 10. Test the machine if it works as it should than the old ageing hard drives are the issue.


By the way please if you ever decide to just delete everything on your "C" drive make sure you save your drivers that are in your Windows, system 32 folder that HP does not have them for download any more.

I run a lot of the HP Z family of PC's and yes my drivers are backed up and in a safe place as it took a week of going to many , many web pages to locate real non virus drivers. There like looking for hen's teeth if you know what I mean.

 

[SkyNetRising]

Interface CRC errors can signal about bad sata cables or sata controller overheating.
Replace sata cables.

Are drives connected to motherboard or sas raid card?

 

[devparam02]

To divide the issue and get to is it the machine or the drives just do a simple to the point test.

Get a spare SSD and use only that unplug every other SSD and hard drive and reinstall Windows 10. Test the machine if it works as it should than the old ageing hard drives are the issue.


By the way please if you ever decide to just delete everything on your "C" drive make sure you save your drivers that are in your Windows, system 32 folder that HP does not have them for download any more.

I run a lot of the HP Z family of PC's and yes my drivers are backed up and in a safe place as it took a week of going to many , many web pages to locate real non virus drivers. There like looking for hen's teeth if you know what I mean.

Now that you mention this, I did get frustrated enough a long time ago and disconnected all HDDs and left the SSDs in there. Worked without any issues and did not get any problems with boot up and shutdown. No freezes at all.

Thanks for the HP drivers heads up. Thankfully, I'm able to download these pretty reliably, so I'm not worried about that.

 

[devparam02]

Interface CRC errors can signal about bad sata cables or sata controller overheating.
Replace sata cables.

Are drives connected to motherboard or sas raid card?

Hello there,

The drives are connected to the motherboard and not a SAS raid card. The older SATA cables have been replaced with newer Corsair ones about 1.5 years ago, but the problem still remains.

 

[dingo07]

Why are we even talking about HDD's... they're cheap enough to add a new one that's larger and throw away the old ones.
I would install a 250GB SSD as the Boot Drive first.
Then add a new HDD as a data drive to replace the old ones. It'll be a brand new machine!

 

[devparam02]

Why are we even talking about HDD's... they're cheap enough to add a new one that's larger and throw away the old ones.
I would install a 250GB SSD as the Boot Drive First.
Then add a new HDD as a data drive to replace the old ones. It'll be a brand new machine!

Hello @dingo07
My apologies. I think I was being unclear (as usual)

The question isn't whether I can save my HDDs or not. This is me trying to find out if the problem exists with my HDDs, cable or motherboard.

You see, I'm relocating to Sydney, and I don't have a lot of money left because my company has become insolvent. I want to use this machine if the experience here is for it. I will discard this machine in the UK if the advice is against taking it with me.

Once again, apologies for being unclear and I hope you can add your thoughts to this discussion because my mind isn't quite working right now. With everything going on, I'm depending on the experience of this forum to guide me.

 

[dingo07]

Investing the time and energy to diagnose is a waste of time IMO.
What's the total amount of data you need to store?
I'm looking at 2 x 6TB WD60PURZ, and a 2TB WD20PURZ that are collecting dust. You pay shipping and a little bit more and one ore all can be yours.
Problem solved.

 

[devparam02]

Hello @dingo07

I definitely appreciate the offer and had I money to spare, I would love to take you up on it.

Just to reiterate, I'm not trying to diagnose the problem and find out how I can I fix it.

I'm trying to find out if the collective advice here is to trash the entire computer in the UK and get a new one in Sydney/anywhere or take the computer with me. Just trying to find out what the risk estimate is. I know that my HDDs are dying. I don't think I need to confirm that. But I am suspicious whether this machine is non-problematic. Thats all this discussion is about.

Sorry if I wasn't being clear.

 

[SkyNetRising]

I know that my HDDs are dying. I don't think I need to confirm that.

Nope. Not sure, how you can know that.
Health of your drives is detected as good (at least those drives, you provided health screenshots for).

But I am suspicious whether this machine is non-problematic.

Problematic cables, bad cable contacts/loose connections, possible sata controller overheating.

It is powerful enough for my work needs. I recently upgraded the graphic card and everything works as expected, except the HDDs.
I'm trying to find out if the collective advice here is to trash the entire computer in the UK and get a new one in Sydney/anywhere or take the computer with me.

You said it yourself - performance needs are satisfied.
Change cables. Upgrade storage.
A single 6TB drive would fit all your data just fine. Avoid Seagate Barracuda drives.

 

[devparam02]

Nope. Not sure, how you can know that.
Health of your drives is detected as good (at least those drives, you provided health screenshots for).

Problematic cables, bad cable contacts/loose connections, possible sata controller overheating.

You said it yourself - performance needs are satisfied.
Change cables. Upgrade storage.
A single 6TB drive would fit all your data just fine. Avoid Seagate Barracuda drives.

Hello @SkyNetRising

This is exactly the kind of critical answer I'm looking for!!!

I think my HDDs are dying because at this point they are over 10-15 years old. One of my HDDs died a few months back. I've also replaced the cables about 2 years ago with corsair high quality cables. I'll have to pay around 650 Australian dollars to purchase luggage to carry this with me. I'm heavily leaning towards giving it away here after stripping away the most important parts and getting a new one in Australia. I don't think I want to tinker around with cables and wires.

Performance needs are satisfied, but I think its time to retire this old lady.

Thank you @SkyNetRising @Lutfij @alceryes @stonecarver @dingo07 for all your help!

 

[stonecarver]

I have an HP Z440 Workstation

I'll have to pay around 650 Australian dollars to purchase luggage to carry this with me

I'm trying to find out if the collective advice here is to trash the entire computer in the UK and get a new one in Sydney/anywhere or take the computer with me

You could look on www.gumtree.com and if you wanted to still have a HP Z440 sell yours and if cheap get one when you get there. Or what you might find after you make the move.

As we get closer to EOL for Windows 10 there are going to be lots of people who will consider an unsupported Windows 11 compliant computer as a brick/doorstop.

There will be some good PC's here and there that pop up for cheap.

Than later you just have to put your data on a new machine and who knows maybe the new machine will have some healthy drives already.

 

[SkyNetRising]

I'll have to pay around 650 Australian dollars to purchase luggage to carry this with me.

650 AUD ? Why so much?
Is that because of large size pc case?
You could probably make it much smaller, if components are removed from pc case and shipped without it.

 

[devparam02]

You could look on www.gumtree.com and if you wanted to still have a HP Z440 sell yours and if cheap get one when you get there. Or what you might find after you make the move.

As we get closer to EOL for Windows 10 there are going to be lots of people who will consider an unsupported Windows 11 compliant computer as a brick/doorstop.

There will be some good PC's here and there that pop up for cheap.

Than later you just have to put your data on a new machine and who knows maybe the new machine will have some healthy drives already.

Yes, this is great and practical advice!

 

[devparam02]

650 AUD ? Why so much?
Is that because of large size pc case?
You could probably make it much smaller, if components are removed from pc case and shipped without it.

The HPZ440 looks deceptively light, but is infact a heavyweight. I'm calculating the cost of purchasing a suitcase as well because its entirely possible that the wife and kids are going to use all the ones we have. I will remove the 2060 from there and take it with me, but the rest will be sold off, sans a few HDDs, which I'll carry with me.

 

[stonecarver]

The HPZ440 looks deceptively light, but is infact a heavyweight.

I agree these HP Z computers are bricks. If you ever get a chance to lift a HP Z 800 the big brother yeah it's a brick ++

Also keep in mind not to lock yourself to the HP Z when you get there you should also be on the look out for a computer that is Windows 11 CPU complaint if you have to replace it anyways and if your starting fresh you could erase that off your future if HP Z 440 CPU's are on the non approved Microsoft official list for Windows 11.

But keep in mind when your back out there replacing PC if that is the path you went. Compliant CPU or non compliant Windows 11 approved.

If you know you way around Windows putting Windows 11 on the HP Z is not an issue with the work arounds and these HP Z machines run like butter on Windows 11.