therock003

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What's the importance of RAM on overclocking? I'm asking because i'm building a new PC with intentions to overclock, and i have trouble choosing the RAM. At first i thought to go for this CORSAIR HX3X12G1600C9 XMS3 DDR3 12GB (6X2GB) (http://www.e-shop.gr/show_per.phtml?id=PER.553120) but i see that with less money and lower timings, i can buy OCZ Gold Low-Voltage 6GB DDR3-1600 Ram Kit (http://www.plaisio.gr/product.aspx?product=1206141&HYMNIMITAHITITADIAVLOU=1600MHz&catalog=20&HYMNIMIMEGETHOS=3+x+2GB&category=69977727&MSCSProfile=DCCDF22EB27065BE6D1C166B2ADF9B3B4DB92543448E3E246BD08C7B49848EBE4DF6867FD01CB388F0F7AE8835D8D2647E0BF62FC35A8F832481C4A64A1CC1855A37AB1D26BC986E491F0D2CAC47215C6718F51CDC621901A78EB7184F7E3B70F9289AD082241676DD7EE37C067B70D1EA80A3E23F407DDD636E26CAAD9DDC27) they're 6GB of course instead of 12 which is the first kit but price pers stick they go way cheaper.

Anyway what i'm saying is should i go now for the cheaper 1600Mhz Ram i can get, and if i see it fit i could go for 2k or 2133 sticks on the future?
 

Cache

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What kind of work are you doing? Most people won't need 12gigs of RAM and so the expense of having it just... well, unless you need it for specific applications it's just not necessary on most systems.

OCZ is generally pretty good, though, and if the timings are better (and you don't need the additional overhead of 12 gigs) you'll be fine.
 

Zenthar

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I don't really know about i7 overclocking so I will let someone else answer the more technical questions.

First, do you really need 12GB, most people are still arguing if it is worth going over 3GB for i7?

Second, you have to know that using 2 kits of the OCZ RAM, you might not be able to run it at exactly the rated timing since these spec are given for the kit if used "solo". If you use 2, you might have to increase voltage, relax timing and/or else. Since the single kit is already rated at 1.65V, you might not be able to increase voltage.
 

therock003

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Is it really not necessary?6x2 i mean. My use includes CAD and graphics applications and i thought more RAM would be important as long as it is within my price range.

3xOCZ gold goes ofr 31.6 EUR per stick while 6x2 Corsair goes for 44.83 per stick.

Any idea why the significant price difference? The OCZ seems to have lower timings for less money.

So timings and specs apply per kit? So 2 kits could possibly provide different specs is what you're saying right?

And another question. Will i need more than 1600 for overclocking?
 

Zenthar

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That's what an operator once said on a OCZ forum and given the number of times people buy two dual kits and end-up here saying "it doesn't work" I think it's fair to assume it's true.

The other kit is probably pricier for just that, it is rated for the whole 12GB kit so if you are unable to get it to run properly as advertised, you can probably get a refund. Either they get tested more to make sure they work, or they are higher clocked RAM that were "binned down" (ex: take two 3GB 2000MHz kits and run them only at 1800MHz to make sure they only need 1.65V).
 

therock003

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I see what you're saying and i want aware of that fact, thank you for letting me know.

So basically it's best to buy them as a kit for optimal performance. I dont know if 12GB are required even from my kind of work, but if they are, i'll make sure to get the 6x2 instead of 2 kits 3x2.

On another note, what voltage is good for ram to run on? Any idea as far as overclocking goes, how far can i raise the dimm voltage? I guess buying RAM with as low voltage as it can get must be desirable right?
 

Zenthar

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For the voltage the rule of thumb is "the lower the better", moreover the i7 cannot go over 1.65V or risk physical damage to the CPU.

If you had found a 6GB kit rated only a 1.6V, you could always try to add the "spare" 0.05V when adding a second kit to reach the rated spec, but since the 6GB kit is already at 1.65V, not possible to compensate that way.

If you want absolute best performance without compromise (and tweaking trouble), yes you have to get the more expensive 12GB bundle.
 

therock003

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Well Of course, cause hey come at 1.2v and with oc you up them to 1.475, but i was talking about RAM voltage which seems to run higher. CPU voltage and run voltage dont have to much now, do they?

If you had found a 6GB kit rated only a 1.6V, you could always try to add the "spare" 0.05V when adding a second kit to reach the rated spec, but since the 6GB kit is already at 1.65V, not possible to compensate that way.

If you want absolute best performance without compromise (and tweaking trouble), yes you have to get the more expensive 12GB bundle.

Also here's a mushkin 12GB kit.

http://www.plaisio.gr/product.aspx?product=1209469&HYMNIMIMEGETHOS=6+x+2GB&category=69977727&catalog=20

Costs 20 EUR more but it supposedly have integrated heatsinks (is it important?) plus it works at 1.6V. IS this .05 volt difference so significant in order to boost frequency, and lower the timings?

BTW i hear people up their RAM Vdimms up to 2.00v! How can they get away with it?
 
Some people running non-i7 run RAM at 2V, but nobody I know of is running an i7 with RAM at 2V. I'm running mine at 1.64V in the BIOS, and I would tend to stick fairly closely to the intel spec.
 

Zenthar

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The thing is i7 has on-chip memory controller, if you use more than 1.65V for the RAM, you risk damaging the CPU. DDR3 that runs over 1.65V are either for old C2D/C2Q boards supporting DDR3 or AM3 boards (don't know if there is voltage limit for the Phenom II) for DDR2, higher voltage was rather common and many performance DDR2 would use 2.1V.
 

therock003

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I see, thanks for letting me know. So there's no way to overclock RAM that comes with stock voltage at 1.65? What if you underclock it's frequency that lessen the voltage and lower the timings. Or if you could get the timings slower could you boost the frequency?

It seems that if i want to boost 920 to 225 i would need a 1800Mhz to run 1:1. Of course that's a big if, cause lots of things depending on getting it to 225. Securing the right RAM isnt the only thing.

I'm just trying to plan ahead on getting the right hardware and make the most of it.

BTW you were right about the kits. Ijust checked the values for OCZ Platinum and seem to be way unproportionate for different kit size.

2GB values 40 EUR
3GB values 159 EUR
and
6GB values 279 EUR!

http://www.plaisio.gr/productlist.aspx?HYMNIMITIMINGS=7-7-7-24&Manufacturer=OCZ&category=69977727&catalog=20

Even, more expensive than the Corsair 12GB Kit, just for being 6GB with lower timings by 2 cycles (Dont know how much of a difference that would make - is it mostly synthetic?)
 

Zenthar

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You can overclock RAM that comes with 1.65V, but you will have to keep the stock voltage. As far as timing/speed and every possible RAM settings, I haven't seen benchmarks for a while, but speed is often more important than timing.