Question Intel Alder Lake - hybrid arch causes problems?? - Still reality or is it FUD today??

[Wolverine2349]

Do tasks still have issues getting assigned to e cores that should not?



Do the e cores get used properly and actually help for most software that should be in background?? Or even software running in background that should run e cores, could they be an issue and cause stuttering or something cause e cores are so much slower than p cores? I know technically on Ryzen systems some cores are faster than others, but that is just clock speed and gap is not remotely close to massive difference between P and e cores on Alder Lake where e cores not only are clocked much lower, they also have massively higher latency and much much worse IPC, so could background software get confused or is Windows 10 and 11 perfectly able to handle it or is it software dependent or both????



From my experience I have seen there are issues, but maybe I was not doing it right or unlucky or maybe it is fixed now for all software??

 

[geofelt]

Today, I have a 12900K and am running windows 10.
On a side monitor, I keep a copy of task manager open.
It looks to me like windows is doing the correct thing.
On some games like civ 5, I see what appears to be the 8 E threads with low levels of cpu activity.
There will be from 2 to 4 heavy use P threads.
Supposedly, win 11 does a better job, but so far as I can tell, 10 is doing fine.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Today, I have a 12900K and am running windows 10.
On a side monitor, I keep a copy of task manager open.
It looks to me like windows is doing the correct thing.
On some games like civ 5, I see what appears to be the 8 E threads with low levels of cpu activity.
There will be from 2 to 4 heavy use P threads.
Supposedly, win 11 does a better job, but so far as I can tell, 10 is doing fine.

Do you have a manual all P core overclock or leave everything at defaults??

And do you notice any smoothness or stuttering issues due to e core switching? Or is it perfectly smooth and as smooth or even smoother compared to a Zen 3 system?

 

[geofelt]

Do you have a manual all P core overclock or leave everything at defaults??

And do you notice any smoothness or stuttering issues due to e core switching? Or is it perfectly smooth and as smooth or even smoother compared to a Zen 3 system?

I leave all at default.
I notice that all is smooth.
At low loads, I see on task manger speeds momentarily reaching 5.0

Overclocking is no longer a way to get something for nothing.
The default turbo mechanism will boost a core or two when conditions permit to a higher point that all core overclocking can achieve.
Those conditions are low total load and temps <70c.

If your use can make use of all available threads, then overclocking may be useful.
And, then be prepared for much heat.

I have no experience with zen 3.
But, monitoring these forums, I sense a lot more issues with ryzen than amd.
Often ram related.
FWIW, I also see a lot of issues coming from aio users vs. air cooler users.

These new chips are so crazy fast.

 

[Wolverine2349]

I leave all at default.
I notice that all is smooth.
At low loads, I see on task manger speeds momentarily reaching 5.0

Overclocking is no longer a way to get something for nothing.
The default turbo mechanism will boost a core or two when conditions permit to a higher point that all core overclocking can achieve.
Those conditions are low total load and temps <70c.

If your use can make use of all available threads, then overclocking may be useful.
And, then be prepared for much heat.

I have no experience with zen 3.
But, monitoring these forums, I sense a lot more issues with ryzen than amd.
Often ram related.
FWIW, I also see a lot of issues coming from aio users vs. air cooler users.

These new chips are so crazy fast.

Monitoring these forums you sense a lot more issues with Ryzen than AMD. Well Ryzen is AMD? Was that a typo?

 

[geofelt]

Monitoring these forums you sense a lot more issues with Ryzen than AMD. Well Ryzen is AMD? Was that a typo?

Thank you for the catch. I fixed the post to say vs. intel.

 

[TerryLaze]

I know technically on Ryzen systems some cores are faster than others, but that is just clock speed and gap is not remotely close to massive difference between P and e cores on Alder Lake where e cores not only are clocked much lower, they also have massively higher latency and much much worse IPC, so could background software get confused or is Windows 10 and 11 perfectly able to handle it or is it software dependent or both????

The OS is not perfect by any means in doing this but the idea is that only "small" threads (little compute) that don't need to be processed very fast will end up on the e-cores so neither IPC or latency is important at all, it's a dump to keep main cores clean.
The positive is that the p-cores still keep their max clocks even if all cores are doing things while on ryzen the difference between running one thing on one core and running the same one thing on one core while all cores are doing something can be bigger than 30%
3775Mhz if all cores are under load against 5.05Ghz if single core.
https://www.anandtech.com/show/1621...e-review-5950x-5900x-5800x-and-5700x-tested/8

 

[Wolverine2349]

The OS is not perfect by any means in doing this but the idea is that only "small" threads (little compute) that don't need to be processed very fast will end up on the e-cores so neither IPC or latency is important at all, it's a dump to keep main cores clean.
The positive is that the p-cores still keep their max clocks even if all cores are doing things while on ryzen the difference between running one thing on one core and running the same one thing on one core while all cores are doing something can be bigger than 30%
3775Mhz if all cores are under load against 5.05Ghz if single core.
https://www.anandtech.com/show/1621...e-review-5950x-5900x-5800x-and-5700x-tested/8

Yes true. That's why I like a manual overclock much better. I can get one CCX to 4700MHz and one to 4525MHz on a 5900X passing all stability tests. In that case should be very little difference between cores only like 3.8 difference in speed.