News Intel's Flagship Core i9-12900K 'Alder Lake' Smashes Ryzen 9 5950X in Geekbench

[Makaveli]

As of now none of it matters, for the numbers you never know how what they used was configured.

It just looked funny to me all the AMD users get posed.

Edit the last 3 Intel processors I bought was because AMD had really nothing as good at the time for my use.
I5 2500K, i7 4790K, i5 10600K
You could argue the point on the 10600K but it's still a good CPU.

Yup its not that important a full review its far more important and that is what most people are waiting for 1 single benchmark at the end of the day means very little.

And who is getting posed? Making an assumption about people you don't know personally online kinda futile.

And there is nothing to argue I have better things do with my time.

 

[Redneck5439]

As of now none of it matters, for the numbers you never know how what they used was configured.

It just looked funny to me all the AMD users get posed.

Edit the last 3 Intel processors I bought was because AMD had really nothing as good at the time for my use.
I5 2500K, i7 4790K, i5 10600K
You could argue the point on the 10600K but it's still a good CPU.

You are correct in that a single benchmark will never give us the full picture. I have just been pointing out that for the past two Intel releases all we have gotten is a few cherry picked benchmarks (that of course all favor Intel systems) and a bunch of tech articles detailing how the upcoming 12900K is just going to totally destroy the R9 5950X in absolutely everything. The reason I try to separate the hype-train from reality is people see these articles, plan their next builds and blindly buy Intel based on fluff. Thus far the only benchmarks I've seen that we can derive any CPU performance from have been userbenchmark (a total joke) and Geekbench 5. Geekbench 5 had the 11900K "beating" the R9 5950X by a "wide margin" with their crippled Zen 3 system set-ups and we all know how that turned out. The 11900K vs the 5950X or 5900X was a total joke (the 5900X beats it across the board at the same price point). Earlier someone posted the true Geekbench 5 numbers for the 5950X and here are the true numbers for the 5900X:

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/9524098

I think everyone would have to agree that the true Geekbench 5 results for Zen 3 are much higher than the reported benchmark results in all the articles floating around out there. I would like to know what they did to cripple the Zen 3 systems in their "official tables".

Looking at articles like this someone who isn't tech savvy would be led to believe that the upcoming Alder Lake processors are going to be 20%+ more powerful than anything else on the market and that just will not be the case. Intel through shier boost clock "balls to the wall" high PL2 and thermals will probably achieve better single core performance and may retake the "gaming crown" by a small margin, however in multi core applications and productivity they will be behind 1 year old existing Zen 3 processors. That's a far cry from what this article (and multiple others all over the internet) is suggesting.

 

[Redneck5439]

It's the same amount of power, 250W was also the PL2 for the 11900k.
Also PL2 should only run for 56sec, running it for an hour means that power limits are lifted which makes the result irrelevant, it's basically like showing overclocking numbers and passing them off as normal numbers.

The 12 the gen will have dark silicone in the form of the fused off AVX wich will mean more surface for the same heat which should result in better thermals.

Zen 3 was already beaten by rocket lake.

Spoiler

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-core-i7-11700k-cpu-review

View: https://i.imgur.com/JAfWaMM.jpg

Zen 3 was already beaten by Rocket Lake?? While I will be the first to admit I was impressed with what Intel was able to do on 14nm (+ whatever) Rocket Lake fell well short of "beating" Zen 3. Some of the mid range and lower end skews (11600 and 11400) were very competitive and based on price points better buys than their Zen 3 counterparts, however in the high end market Rocket Lake was / is a joke.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxiuvQPL_qs

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2VrHzqz750

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jVAfk4AG3A

 

[spongiemaster]

Some of the mid range and lower end skews (11600 and 11400) were very competitive and based on price points better buys than their Zen 3 counterparts, however in the high end market Rocket Lake was / is a joke.

So, basically, for the majority of the market, Intel has a better product available. I'm sure they're ok with that. There is no Zen 3 counterpart to the 11400. AMD isn't even trying to compete in the lower end by their own admission right now, so Intel wins by default.

 

[gggplaya]

So, basically, for the majority of the market, Intel has a better product available. I'm sure they're ok with that. There is no Zen 3 counterpart to the 11400. AMD isn't even trying to compete in the lower end by their own admission right now, so Intel wins by default.

AMD has older chips for the low end market, not Zen3. Right now, since AMD will be switching sockets with the next generation. It does make Intel very competitive with their 14nm++++++ product. With Zen4 though, I'd buy AMD just because I like how they tend to stick with their sockets much longer. Hopefully this time around they'll require a larger bios chip with more memory.

 

[VforV]

The fact that Zen3 and Zen3+ is still on AM4, makes this the best socket since I can remember.

On my B450 I went from Zen+ to Zen2 (for no extra cost on the deal) and now I still have the option to chose Zen3 and most likely Zen3+ (I have an MSI MAX MB, so I know it will be supported no matter what - even unofficial if that's the case).

I can only praise AMD for this. Although I suspect going forward we will never see a socket having such a long life. Maybe for 3 generations only.

 

[gggplaya]

The fact that Zen3 and Zen3+ is still on AM4, makes this the best socket since I can remember.

On my B450 I went from Zen+ to Zen2 (for no extra cost on the deal) and now I still have the option to chose Zen3 and most likely Zen3+ (I have an MSI MAX MB, so I know it will be supported no matter what - even unofficial if that's the case).

I can only praise AMD for this. Although I suspect going forward we will never see a socket having such a long life. Maybe for 3 generations only.

AM4 was certainly better than any intel socket in the past 12 or so years. They've gotten more generations out of it for more years than Intel. But AM4 was huge letdown due to the size of the Bios chip memory. If they anticipated from the beginning and required board manufacturers to spec larger bios chips. They could have gotten all generations onto all boards. A newer chip on an older chipset just wouldn't have all the new features. Hopefully AMD learned from that with the new AM5 socket coming out.

 

[spongiemaster]

Intel latest beats what is soon to be AMD last GEN, amazing

Alder Lake and Zen 4 are not likely to go head to head at any point. AMD's next gen isn't scheduled for release until Q3 of next year at the earliest, could be Q4. By that point, Intel will be competing with Raptor Lake, not Alder Lake.

 

[spongiemaster]

Hopefully AMD learned from that with the new AM5 socket coming out.

I'm sure they did. They learned to never make that promise again because it turned out to be far more of a pain for them than it was probably worth.

 

[Redneck5439]

Alder Lake and Zen 4 are not likely to go head to head at any point. AMD's next gen isn't scheduled for release until Q3 of next year at the earliest, could be Q4. By that point, Intel will be competing with Raptor Lake, not Alder Lake.

I agree, Zen 4 will be targeted at Raptor Lake not Alder Lake. At this point I'm not even sure AMD will bother with a Zen 3 refresh. I think they are holding off until they get a better idea of what Alder Lake will bring. If Alder Lake's performance is what I expect it to be AMD may not feel the need to refresh Zen 3. Most of the time productivity related performance takes a back seat to gaming performance, however I fully expect the 5950X to outperform the 12900K and the 5900X to outperform the 12700K in multi core performance. Alder Lake should hold a small advantage in single core performance (Adobe, ect) so productivity will be a "mixed bag" that overall favors the high end Zen 3 processors. That means the main difference will come down to gaming performance. I fully expect Alder Lake to hold 5 - 6% overall advantage in gaming. Will that be enough of a reason for AMD to bother with refreshing Zen 3, or will they save 3D-VCache (stacking) for Zen 4?

 

[Redneck5439]

So, basically, for the majority of the market, Intel has a better product available. I'm sure they're ok with that. There is no Zen 3 counterpart to the 11400. AMD isn't even trying to compete in the lower end by their own admission right now, so Intel wins by default.

To be perfectly honest the 5600X and the 11600K are very close in performance, the advantage Intel had at launch was price and availability. Last time I had checked the prices and availability the 11600K was cheaper and the 5600X was still a challenge to find and overall had scalper's pricing. Now the 5600X is in stock and the price is the same as the 11600K. You can't go wrong with either one, however the 5600X overall has better productivity and gaming performance and of course if your already on a AM4 platform the obvious upgrade would be the 5600X.

 

[artk2219]

The fact that Zen3 and Zen3+ is still on AM4, makes this the best socket since I can remember.

On my B450 I went from Zen+ to Zen2 (for no extra cost on the deal) and now I still have the option to chose Zen3 and most likely Zen3+ (I have an MSI MAX MB, so I know it will be supported no matter what - even unofficial if that's the case).

I can only praise AMD for this. Although I suspect going forward we will never see a socket having such a long life. Maybe for 3 generations only.

Probably AM2(+), some boards could support chips from Athlon 64 to Phenom II x6, prior to that, Socket A, then socket 7 on AMD's side. AM3+ gets an honorable mention since you could use the entire Phenom II or FX lineup on it, but AM2+ had a longer list of supported chips, Asrock actually made an AM2+ and AM3+ combo board that supported DDR2 and 3. With Intel, it would probably the second revision of 775 since it similarly allowed use from a P4 to Core 2 Quad, then it would also be socket 7 (I thought about 370 but it didnt have quite the same staying power). Socket 7 was pretty awesome honestly, you could pick from AMD, Centaur, Cyrix, Intel, or Via, and all of them had chips that would work on the same socket so long as your motherboard had support for it (or close enough support for it), it was a troubleshooters dream . Technically Socket 1151 should be on the list, but intel had to screw it up with Z370 and Z390. That being said if youre ok with bios mods and have a decent socket 1151 board you could support everything from Skylake to Coffee Lake, that similarly would have been an awesome socket were it not for Intel pulling an Intel :-/.

ASRock > N68C-GS FX

Supports AM3+ Processor; Supports Dual Channel DDR3 1600 / DDR2 1066; Integrated NVIDIA GeForce 7025 graphics, DX9.0 VGA, Pixel Shader 3.0; Gigabit LAN 10/100/1000 Mb/s; 5.1 CH HD Audio (VIA VT1705 Audio Codec); Supports ASRock XFast RAM, XFast USB Technologies; Supports ASRock Instant Boot...

www.asrock.com

 

[spongiemaster]

To be perfectly honest the 5600X and the 11600K are very close in performance, the advantage Intel had at launch was price and availability. Last time I had checked the prices and availability the 11600K was cheaper and the 5600X was still a challenge to find and overall had scalper's pricing. Now the 5600X is in stock and the price is the same as the 11600K. You can't go wrong with either one, however the 5600X overall has better productivity and gaming performance and of course if your already on a AM4 platform the obvious upgrade would be the 5600X.

I agree with this, but the CPU market doesn't start at $270 which is where the 5000 series starts. Most of the market is below that price point, and AMD isn't trying to compete there.

 

[Redneck5439]

I agree with this, but the CPU market doesn't start at $270 which is where the 5000 series starts. Most of the market is below that price point, and AMD isn't trying to compete there.

I agree, AMD isn't trying to compete in the lower end CPU market right now. I think this is due more to Covid 19 shortages than anything else though. AMD has had a hard time keeping their 5600X, 5800X, and especially their 5900X and 5950X in stock. I think instead of trying to release a lower tier than the 5600X they focused on their existing skews. To be perfectly honest the entire industry has just been crazy this last year, and AMD isn't alone with silicon shortages, supply issues and scalper pricing:

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i...e=11400-_-19-118-241-_-Product&quicklink=true

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i...-_-Product&quicklink=true&Item=9SIAPMXFBH6861

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i...=11600k-_-19-118-235-_-Product&quicklink=true

https://www.newegg.com/amd-ryzen-5-...tion=5600x&cm_re=5600x-_-19-113-666-_-Product

If I were trying to build a lower end system right now the i5 11400 is out of stock and the scalper "used" price is just as much as the 11600K and 5600X... Choosing between the 11400 or 11600K, the 11600K would be the obvious pick. If you wanted the very best 6 core performance available the 5600X is the same price. Right now due to product availability the best processor to build with in the lower range is the 5600X.

 

[VforV]

I agree, Zen 4 will be targeted at Raptor Lake not Alder Lake. At this point I'm not even sure AMD will bother with a Zen 3 refresh. I think they are holding off until they get a better idea of what Alder Lake will bring. If Alder Lake's performance is what I expect it to be AMD may not feel the need to refresh Zen 3. Most of the time productivity related performance takes a back seat to gaming performance, however I fully expect the 5950X to outperform the 12900K and the 5900X to outperform the 12700K in multi core performance. Alder Lake should hold a small advantage in single core performance (Adobe, ect) so productivity will be a "mixed bag" that overall favors the high end Zen 3 processors. That means the main difference will come down to gaming performance. I fully expect Alder Lake to hold 5 - 6% overall advantage in gaming. Will that be enough of a reason for AMD to bother with refreshing Zen 3, or will they save 3D-VCache (stacking) for Zen 4?

Tom from MLiD said it in two different videos by now that his sources told him AMD wanted to bring V-Cache even as early as Zen2 (there is proof in the design) and also with Zen3 at launch in 2020, but they did not make substantial progress until Q1 2021, so that's why they will do it late with the Zen3+ refresh. And of course Zen4.

They always intended to make the biggest jumps in performance, not only to beat intel, but to destroy them. As big as the perf jump was possible. They want to win and win by a mile and keep that big difference as long as they can because they know intel is not gonna stay beaten for long (as Alder Lake is proof they are coming back)... so AMD needs that momentum going.

That's why they will not let Alder Lake spread it's wings and take the crown for long, if at all and AMD will bring Zen3+ ASAP. It will come in Q4 2021, right on the heels of Alder Lake, even if it's a paper launch, just to steal intel's thunder.

 

[Makaveli]

AM4 was certainly better than any intel socket in the past 12 or so years. They've gotten more generations out of it for more years than Intel. But AM4 was huge letdown due to the size of the Bios chip memory. If they anticipated from the beginning and required board manufacturers to spec larger bios chips. They could have gotten all generations onto all boards. A newer chip on an older chipset just wouldn't have all the new features. Hopefully AMD learned from that with the new AM5 socket coming out.

Totally agreed.

I jumped on to AM4 with x570 + 3800x in Dec 2019 by Jan 2021 upgraded to 5800X and this will most likely see an upgrade to a 3d chip.

So that will be 3 processor upgrades in the span of time all with double digit IPC increases not complaining at all.

 

[Notorious^]

Intel latest beats what is soon to be AMD last GEN, amazing

Yea but AMD groupies took to the interwebs to throw it in intels owners face when zen3 was released. Same statement was made and ignored. Its only acknowledged now when the shoe is on the other foot. shocker...

 

[spongiemaster]

That's why they will not let Alder Lake spread it's wings and take the crown for long, if at all and AMD will bring Zen3+ ASAP. It will come in Q4 2021, right on the heels of Alder Lake, even if it's a paper launch, just to steal intel's thunder.

Which will mean nothing to everyone but keyboard warriors on message boards. VCache is going to be an expensive feature reserved for highend chips at release. Even on enthusiast boards like this one, it's a rare bird using a 5950x or any of Intel's higher end HEDT cpu's as $750+ is a tough pill to swallow for the majority of the market. Threadripper has been completely priced out of the enthusiast desktop market. There is no indication AMD has any intention of releasing a CPU priced below the 5600x at any point in the near future. So, while a $1000 5950x with v-cache may keep the performance crown for AMD vs Alder Lake, Intel is supposedly going to have a full product stack with Alder Lake. What ever Alder Lake CPU's Intel releases below $200 are going to crush the 3000 series AMD is still peddling at that price point. For most people, that's all they will care about.

 

[Redneck5439]

Which will mean nothing to everyone but keyboard warriors on message boards. VCache is going to be an expensive feature reserved for highend chips at release. Even on enthusiast boards like this one, it's a rare bird using a 5950x or any of Intel's higher end HEDT cpu's as $750+ is a tough pill to swallow for the majority of the market. Threadripper has been completely priced out of the enthusiast desktop market. There is no indication AMD has any intention of releasing a CPU priced below the 5600x at any point in the near future. So, while a $1000 5950x with v-cache may keep the performance crown for AMD vs Alder Lake, Intel is supposedly going to have a full product stack with Alder Lake. What ever Alder Lake CPU's Intel releases below $200 are going to crush the 3000 series AMD is still peddling at that price point. For most people, that's all they will care about.

As stated prior, it will all depend on availability in this new market. For over a year 5900X processors were being scalped for $800, 5950X processors were going for $1200, RTX 3080 gpus are selling for double there MSRP at $1600+... I've been reading on site after site how Intel wasn't going to be effected by the "great silicon shortage" because they fab their own stuff, Intel was going to be able to just flood the market with all the processors and GPUs anyone would need. Well, the reality is that Intel's most popular processors are also sold out and are also being scalped for way more than they are worth and pricing them into categories that make no sense. The budget 11400 is being scalped for as much as the 11600K which is priced the same as the 5600X (even though the 5600X has overall better performance). Intel has a full product stack planned but if its unavailable what does it matter that they technically offer something that can't be bought. If you have to pay as much for a budget processor as you would for a mid range processor why in the world would you buy it? Intel has admitted several times that the silicon shortage will continue through 2022. The most popular processors will sell out quickly, will remain extremely hard to find and will only be available at scalpers pricing.

Beyond availability and scalpers its also prudent to point out that Intel's price points for its processors make no sense at all. The 11400 I'm leaving out of the discussion as AMD has no budget processor with Zen 3 to compare to and currently its only available though scalpers. Intel set the price of their 11600K to be the same as the 5600X (even though the 5600X outperforms it), they set their 11700K to be the same as the 5800X (even though the 5800X outperforms it) and they set their 11900K to the same as the 5900X. The worst of the offenders is the 11900K with 8 cores being priced the same as the 12 core 5900X. The 5900X has the same single core performance, slightly better gaming performance and absolutely destroys the 11900K in multi core productivity workloads. Intel's pricing never made sense for Rocket Lake, lets hope their pricing makes more sense for Alder Lake.

 

[Redneck5439]

Yea but AMD groupies took to the interwebs to throw it in intels owners face when zen3 was released. Same statement was made and ignored. Its only acknowledged now when the shoe is on the other foot. shocker...

A large army defeating a small army will only be a footnote in history, a small army defeating a much larger army in a pitched battle will never be forgotten. Its why militaries across the globe still study Alexander the Great's battlefield tactics. Intel with 10 times the R&D budget is expected to have better processors than AMD. The fact that AMD with a fraction of Intel's R&D budget was able to release a generation of processors that dominated Intel is why it was really big news. Intel only made it worse with the release of Rocket Lake which is still outperformed by its Zen 3 counterparts.

 

[VforV]

Which will mean nothing to everyone but keyboard warriors on message boards. VCache is going to be an expensive feature reserved for highend chips at release. Even on enthusiast boards like this one, it's a rare bird using a 5950x or any of Intel's higher end HEDT cpu's as $750+ is a tough pill to swallow for the majority of the market. Threadripper has been completely priced out of the enthusiast desktop market. There is no indication AMD has any intention of releasing a CPU priced below the 5600x at any point in the near future. So, while a $1000 5950x with v-cache may keep the performance crown for AMD vs Alder Lake, Intel is supposedly going to have a full product stack with Alder Lake. What ever Alder Lake CPU's Intel releases below $200 are going to crush the 3000 series AMD is still peddling at that price point. For most people, that's all they will care about.

I keep seing intel fanbois saying like we already know with 100% certitude that Zen3+ with V-Cache will only be reserved for top tiers, because Lisa showed a 5900x prototype, but we have zero confirmation or even rumors that that is the case.

If AMD brought Infinity Cache to GPUs for the entier stack, I'm sure they will do the same with V-Cache for CPUs (even if it's not the same thing, it's the same thought process). So when the 5600x with V-cache comes to beat 12600k don't act surprised about it. It will be a full stack of Zen3+ to fight intel's full stack of Alder Lake.
And the sub $300 market will be the discounted regular Zen3 5600x.

Intel with 10 times the R&D budget is expected to have better processors than AMD. The fact that AMD with a fraction of Intel's R&D budget was able to release a generation of processors that dominated Intel is why it was really big news. Intel only made it worse with the release of Rocket Lake which is still outperformed by its Zen 3 counterparts.

Exactly. But I guess simping and shilling is more important than that, so we get what we have now...

 

[Redneck5439]

Was just looking over the architecture of Alder Lake vs Willow Cove and Zen 3... While Alder Lake overall makes a lot of improvements over Willow Cove in most cases the improvements in architecture put it on par with Zen 3. The biggest "issue" I see with Alder Lake is its extra wide decoder which will give Alder Lake a power and latency penalty (higher power consumption and higher latency). While a lot of Alder Lake's architecture will provide a substantial increase in multi core / productivity its looking more and more like a "Zen 2 effect". Zen 2 had a substantial IPC increase over Zen+, however it didn't carry over into gaming performance due to the latency penalty. Its looking more and more like Alder Lake is going to have the same latency issues which will hinder gaming performance. That's not to say gaming performance will be bad, but it may not be an improvement over Rocket Lake.

 

[RodroX]

I honestly couldn't care much about geekbench results this time around. Well I never really cared about it to begin with.

The reason why (this time around) is that you can't go wrong with any of the CPU brands today. Both Intel and AMD have really strong processors for both Desktop and Notebooks. And thats great for us, the consumers and DIY builders. We have lots of chips to pick from.

IN my humble point of view, for the time been Intel remains the CPU to go for any gamer looking for strong performance at decent cost (basically the Core i5 10400/11400 or the likes) are the best deals today. And if Intel can keep the price of the new Core i5 near the ones we have now It will probably remain the CPU to go in the future too.

As for content creators and the likes, the ones that really need strong performance and as many cores as you can get, should wait to see more benchmarks.

It will be amazing if intel can pull a strong win against AMD, cause that will probably (with some hope) make AMD realize they should go back competitive prices and products. Don't get me wrong here, Zen 3 cpus are awesome, but they cost too much compared to intel similar offers.

 

[Redneck5439]

I honestly couldn't care much about geekbench results this time around. Well I never really cared about it to begin with.

The reason why (this time around) is that you can't go wrong with any of the CPU brands today. Both Intel and AMD have really strong processors for both Desktop and Notebooks. And thats great for us, the consumers and DIY builders. We have lots of chips to pick from.

IN my humble point of view, for the time been Intel remains the CPU to go for any gamer looking for strong performance at decent cost (basically the Core i5 10400/11400 or the likes) are the best deals today. And if Intel can keep the price of the new Core i5 near the ones we have now It will probably remain the CPU to go in the future too.

As for content creators and the likes, the ones that really need strong performance and as many cores as you can get, should wait to see more benchmarks.

It will be amazing if intel can pull a strong win against AMD, cause that will probably (with some hope) make AMD realize they should go back competitive prices and products. Don't get me wrong here, Zen 3 cpus are awesome, but they cost too much compared to intel similar offers.

Intel 10th gen processors are the best "value" "bang for your buck" right now. Intel 11th gen pricing is just insane compared to their direct Zen 3 counterparts:

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i...=11600K-_-19-118-235-_-Product&quicklink=true
VS
https://www.newegg.com/amd-ryzen-5-...e=5600x-_-19-113-666-_-Product&quicklink=true

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i...=11700K-_-19-118-233-_-Product&quicklink=true
VS
https://www.newegg.com/amd-ryzen-7-...e=5800x-_-19-113-665-_-Product&quicklink=true

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i...on=11900k&cm_re=11900k-_-19-118-231-_-Product
VS
https://www.newegg.com/amd-ryzen-9-...e=5900x-_-19-113-664-_-Product&quicklink=true

Keep in mind that the 5600X slightly edges the 11600K in performance (while costing the same). The 5800X has better performance than the 11700K (while costing the same) - point in fact the 5800X goes toe to toe with the much more expensive 11900K. Then there is the total mismatch of the 5900X vs the 11900K... while costing the same the 5900X has two more cores and four more threads than the 11900K and simply dominates it across the board.

The value argument could be made for the 11400 as AMD has no comparable Zen 3 product, however due to high demand it is out of stock and going for scalpers pricing making it as expensive as the 11600K and 5600X.

Right now the best bang for your buck is with Intel 10th generation. When comparing Intel 11th generation to Zen 3, the smart money is on Zen 3.

 

[RodroX]

Intel 10th gen processors are the best "value" "bang for your buck" right now. Intel 11th gen pricing is just insane compared to their direct Zen 3 counterparts:

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i...=11600K-_-19-118-235-_-Product&quicklink=true
VS
https://www.newegg.com/amd-ryzen-5-...e=5600x-_-19-113-666-_-Product&quicklink=true

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i...=11700K-_-19-118-233-_-Product&quicklink=true
VS
https://www.newegg.com/amd-ryzen-7-...e=5800x-_-19-113-665-_-Product&quicklink=true

https://www.newegg.com/intel-core-i...on=11900k&cm_re=11900k-_-19-118-231-_-Product
VS
https://www.newegg.com/amd-ryzen-9-...e=5900x-_-19-113-664-_-Product&quicklink=true

Keep in mind that the 5600X slightly edges the 11600K in performance (while costing the same). The 5800X has better performance than the 11700K (while costing the same) - point in fact the 5800X goes toe to toe with the much more expensive 11900K. Then there is the total mismatch of the 5900X vs the 11900K... while costing the same the 5900X has two more cores and four more threads than the 11900K and simply dominates it across the board.

The value argument could be made for the 11400 as AMD has no comparable Zen 3 product, however due to high demand it is out of stock and going for scalpers pricing making it as expensive as the 11600K and 5600X.

Right now the best bang for your buck is with Intel 10th generation. When comparing Intel 11th generation to Zen 3, the smart money is on Zen 3.

Well I did wrote about the 10400 and 11400 and the likes (10400F and 11400F). Never mentioned a single word about the Core i5 11600K/11700K/11900K and all the rest of the CPU you wrote about it.

The rest is your opinion which is great and I respect that, altough from your post it seems to be focused on whats available in the US, which is also fine but it does not tell the whole market picture.

In other markets which I tend to look (and buy) very often for components, the situation may or not be similar. In any case I still believe that you can't go wrong right now, as I wrote, the performance delta for "similar" product lines is close to each other so anything you pick would be fine. Also considering the CPU alone is not fair, since people upgrading may be able to keep thier motherboard and ram, and so the equation change.

Finally about "the smart money is on Zen 3" I kinda agree up to some extent. But then again if you are not in a hurry and/or your system performs well enough and works without isues for you, then the "smart money" (this time around) may be to just wait. I mean not much of a point to expend money on a platform that wont have any future upgrades.

Once again this is my opinion.