News Intel's Pat Gelsinger on 'Super Moore's Law,' Making Multi-Billion Dollar Bets

[Admin]

Intel CEO Pat Gelsinger expanded on Super Moore's Law and the company's multi-billion dollar bets during a roundtable question and answer session with the press.

Intel's Pat Gelsinger on 'Super Moore's Law,' Making Multi-Billion Dollar Bets : Read more

 

[-Fran-]

Those were some very interesting answers, for sure.

So Intel is not quite licensing X86, but doing the same thing AMD is doing trying their best to offer the same exact "bleeding edge" design IP they would themselves use for their own CPU/accelerator lines. That's interesting and highly dangerous to AMD. It was also interesting the example of Qualcomm and how you can read between the lines there that most of their low power nodes are probably (or most likely) used by them instead of Intel itself. And the awkward explanation around Moore's Law; I'm not sure if it should be taken seriously, but I guess I can understand what he's trying to say.

What I'm a bit wary of is this explicit mention of "WIntel is back with a vengeance" hint. Sure, get in bed with MS, but don't do your monopolistic garbage anymore Intel, please. Also, I hope AMD can keep MS happy, so they keep on getting their business for the consoles and Surface stuff going forward.

Regards.

 

[warezme]

Intel has been stagnant for so many generations of chips because it was on top and felt no need to move beyond 4 cores and a slight bump in performance while racking in the cash. It got caught with it's pants down. Catching up now and reaching competitiveness isn't necessarily doing anything super Moore's Law or whatever they want to call it. It's finally providing tangible performance and feature updates they have ignored for generations. I have no sympathy for them.

 

[waltc3]

Interesting to see Intel finally interested in the future (since the present is not so hot for them...) Neither Intel nor AMD has manufactured and sold "x86" CPUs for many years (something Apple can't quite figure out.) The CPUs they sell are compatible with the x86 instruction set but not even close to being limited by it. All of the bunk you may read on Mac sites about how "limited" current x86 CPUs are is pure bunk. It did apply in the 80's and 90's--it no longer does, and hasn't for a long time. It's been a long time since either company has sold chips like 8086/88 80/2/3/4/86 CPUs that were authentic "x86" CPUs in their day. Anyway, it's good to see Intel hustling for a change...

 

[passivecool]

We feel comfortably ahead…

This has been the problem of the last ten years. Intel got way to comfortable being ahead.
Now I am comfortably sure that they have felt the breath of the wolf in the small of their neck and are have been feeling anything other than comfortable.
But since 'corfortable' was quoted seven times in the article, we can all rest assured that intel has the intent to use the crushing force of many billions to get itself comfortable again.

So that it can go back to sleep, undisturbed, like a man rudely woken by a loud neighbor or a bad dream.

 

[PapaCrazy]

Intel has been stagnant for so many generations of chips because it was on top and felt no need to move beyond 4 cores and a slight bump in performance while racking in the cash. It got caught with it's pants down. Catching up now and reaching competitiveness isn't necessarily doing anything super Moore's Law or whatever they want to call it. It's finally providing tangible performance and feature updates they have ignored for generations. I have no sympathy for them.

The quad core limit upset enthusiasts like us who frequent these kinds of forums, but I'm comvinced their overall market stagnation came from a neglect of efficiency. Servers that were sucking down more watts, requiring more cooling and higher energy bills than necessary, in addition to their inflated HEDT/Xeon prices. Mobile chips (in a laptop/device market that dwarfs gaming PCs/workstations) have been overheating, wearing down batteries, and possibly causing higher failure rates than previous generations. This lack of efficiency prompted Apple to go from customer to competitor in a short time, and led to AMD's domination particularly in mobile. While I might entertain the idea of an Alder lake desktop, I will accept nothing else but an AMD CPU in my next laptop I purchase. They will not catch up to TSMC, and all of the companies TSMC is producing chips for, until their node (regardless of nm measurement of name) is atleast as efficient.

This has been the problem of the last ten years. Intel got way to comfortable being ahead.
Now I am comfortably sure that they have felt the breath of the wolf in the small of their neck and are have been feeling anything other than comfortable.
But since 'corfortable' was quoted seven times in the article, we can all rest assured that intel has the intent to use the crushing force of many billions to get itself comfortable again.

So that it can go back to sleep, undisturbed, like a man rudely woken by a loud neighbor or a bad dream.

A classic case of resting on laurels. Hopefully other American tech companies, and Intel itself, studies it as a cautionary tale.

 

[korekan]

They realize that with AI in chip going forward x86 might be run on arm and vice versa and with minimum different performance. They will be doomed once it completely released. Just like blackberry and nokia

 

[Howardohyea]

Interesting to see a deep dive and interview with Intel's CEO, reminds me of the article back then with an interview with Bob Swan. I hope more of these articles show up, with more companies

 

[cyrusfox]

While I might entertain the idea of an Alder lake desktop, I will accept nothing else but an AMD CPU in my next laptop I purchase. They will not catch up to TSMC, and all of the companies TSMC is producing chips for, until their node (regardless of nm measurement of name) is atleast as efficient.

I have an AMD 4700U laptop spec with 32GB of DDR4 and a 1tb m.2 WD Black SN750, and it flies! But if I had to do it again, I wouldn't nor would I recommend it due to the persistent bugs. Most well known are the USB driver issues (Random disconnecting, really great when offloading pictures from a photo shoot). How about the web cam also randomly not working same with mic and speakers.
Even with my crappy Intel Celeron platforms that I subjucate the kids to show much better stability. I can't wait for Alder lake and am especially excited for what the e-cores can do there (Alder lake makes way more sense on the mobile to be switching to efficiency). Hopefully you have better luck than me, but I will side step AMD platforms until they can figure out how to write better drivers and support their platform to a better level of stability. Intel has us spoiled expecting everythign to jsut work thanks to the amazing driver support and QC they put there platform before launch, I really took for granted that stability until programs crash at critical times, takes me back 20 years...

 

[PapaCrazy]

I have an AMD 4700U laptop spec with 32GB of DDR4 and a 1tb m.2 WD Black SN750, and it flies! But if I had to do it again, I wouldn't nor would I recommend it due to the persistent bugs. Most well known are the USB driver issues (Random disconnecting, really great when offloading pictures from a photo shoot). How about the web cam also randomly not working same with mic and speakers.
Even with my crappy Intel Celeron platforms that I subjucate the kids to show much better stability. I can't wait for Alder lake and am especially excited for what the e-cores can do there (Alder lake makes way more sense on the mobile to be switching to efficiency). Hopefully you have better luck than me, but I will side step AMD platforms until they can figure out how to write better drivers and support their platform to a better level of stability. Intel has us spoiled expecting everythign to jsut work thanks to the amazing driver support and QC they put there platform before launch, I really took for granted that stability until programs crash at critical times, takes me back 20 years...

Dang, I had heard about the USB issue on X570 mobos, but assumed that wasn't an issue on the laptops. Thank you for the heads up. Had my eye on the upcoming Asus 16" OLEDs that use AMD 5900hx, but I will look further into issues before making any decisions. Stability is my #1 priority.

 

[watzupken]

The quad core limit upset enthusiasts like us who frequent these kinds of forums, but I'm comvinced their overall market stagnation came from a neglect of efficiency. Servers that were sucking down more watts, requiring more cooling and higher energy bills than necessary, in addition to their inflated HEDT/Xeon prices. Mobile chips (in a laptop/device market that dwarfs gaming PCs/workstations) have been overheating, wearing down batteries, and possibly causing higher failure rates than previous generations. This lack of efficiency prompted Apple to go from customer to competitor in a short time, and led to AMD's domination particularly in mobile. While I might entertain the idea of an Alder lake desktop, I will accept nothing else but an AMD CPU in my next laptop I purchase. They will not catch up to TSMC, and all of the companies TSMC is producing chips for, until their node (regardless of nm measurement of name) is atleast as efficient.

I agree. I was certainly very annoyed at Intel for stagnating the CPU market for more than a decade of dual and quad core CPUs, and their extensive toll gates to get a more feature rich CPU. For example, if you want hyper threading, then you pay more. More cache, sure, pay more. Overclocking, pay more get a K series processor + a Z series motherboard. Comparatively, the product stack is a lot more simplified with AMD's Ryzen. You generally buy a chip, and it is unlocked for CPU and memory overclocking, and without a need for a top end chipset. Plus you generally get Hyper threading out of the gate and cache sizes that differs due to number of cores, and not artificially limited.

I also agree that Intel is losing market share mostly due to poor power efficiency with their chips. Which I believe is the reason why big companies are moving to create their own custom SOC with ARM cores. If anything, Apple's M1 chips showed comparable performance with substantial power savings over any X86 processors. I've decided to try out the M1 chip at the start of the year, and seriously, I've never looked back after that. It may not have amazing single core performance for example, but at no point do I feel that it is slow. The battery life and the lack of any active cooling is a win for me. Also at this point, I think AMD offers more bang for buck when compared to Intel's Tiger Lake when you consider that AMD offers more cores and better multithreaded performance for their U series processor, and their H series are cheaper than an Intel equivalent by quite a fair bit. Alder Lake may change this, but I feel Intel's priority to squeeze out more performance is not going to change the fact that the chips will still be more power hungry and run hotter when the system is under load.

Intel has lost their competitive advantage in their fab, and I feel they are unlikely to win it back anytime soon. Their competitors were chugging along aggressively, while Intel was sleeping then. And even now, their competitors are still aggressively pushing forward.

 

[watzupken]

I have an AMD 4700U laptop spec with 32GB of DDR4 and a 1tb m.2 WD Black SN750, and it flies! But if I had to do it again, I wouldn't nor would I recommend it due to the persistent bugs. Most well known are the USB driver issues (Random disconnecting, really great when offloading pictures from a photo shoot). How about the web cam also randomly not working same with mic and speakers.
Even with my crappy Intel Celeron platforms that I subjucate the kids to show much better stability. I can't wait for Alder lake and am especially excited for what the e-cores can do there (Alder lake makes way more sense on the mobile to be switching to efficiency). Hopefully you have better luck than me, but I will side step AMD platforms until they can figure out how to write better drivers and support their platform to a better level of stability. Intel has us spoiled expecting everythign to jsut work thanks to the amazing driver support and QC they put there platform before launch, I really took for granted that stability until programs crash at critical times, takes me back 20 years...

I've been using AMD Ryzen processors on desktops, NUC like system and laptops over the last 4 to 5 years, and I don't think this sort of instability happens often. The USB issue was an annoyance as it intermittently disconnects and connects my mouse and keyboard, but I think AMD addressed that issue some time back. Otherwise, I've not really experience any teething issues since the second gen Ryzen. Intel systems are generally more stable, but does not mean that they are issues free. Take for example their recent Rocket Lake launch, I think it was also a messed up release with teething issues which you can lookup online.

 

[Endymio]

I agree. I was certainly very annoyed at Intel for stagnating the CPU market for more than a decade of dual and quad core CPUs,

Had automobiles progressed at the same rate during that decade as CPUs did, we'd all be driving $5,000 Toyota's that go 400mph and get 200mpg. I'll take a little "stagnation" like that.

For example, if you want hyper threading, then you pay more. More cache, sure, pay more.

OMG, paying more to get more. Shame forever on Intel for creating such a concept. Thankfully, no other company uses such a medieval philosophy. Like cars, again, for instance. Whatever option you want on your new vehicle, just tell the dealer and they'll toss it in for free, no matter how much it lists for.