Is there anything else I can do to give my PC a new lease of life?

[DerpaHerpaLurpa]

Hello fellow IT enthusiasts...

I've had my current build since 2012 (I think) and since then the only components I've upgraded have been my GPU or Storage and I've finally reached the point now where I'm starting to see performance issues when I play newer titles on higher settings.

My current build is as follows:
CPU: i5 3570K (3.4 GHz, using intel stock cooler which I've left in for years hence why I've not OCd it yet...)
RAM: Corsair Dominator Platinum 1866MHz 8 GB
Motherboard: ASRock Z77 Extreme4
GPU: EVGA Nvidia GeForce GTX 970
PSU: OCZ ModXStream Pro 700W
Storage: Corsair Force GS 128 GB
Western Digital 1TB SATA 7200 RPM
... Some random 1TB Hitachi drive I've had for aaaages... (which I think is nearly dead).

(I've already started migrating the contents of the Hitachi drive over to my new WD drive which still encounters the same performance issues)

Now, I'm aware that my Z77 board, 3570K and my DDR3 RAM is quite old now so I can understand the decrease in performance, however I'm just wondering before I go and splash some major cash on a new machine if there's any way I can upgrade my current setup and milk some performance out of it?

The only changes I can think of making on my current rig are:
- Configure watercooling and overclock my CPU
- Buy some more DIMMs and upgrade my memory to 16GB
- Buy a 500GB - 1TB SSD and install games on there (people are still using SATA for gaming and I think any SSD I add would just become bottlenecked)
- Do a fresh install of Windows

I'm aware that doing any of the above will most likely give me a slight performance boost, but its not future proof due to the fact that I'm only increasing the amount of old tech that my computer has to work with.

My analysis has led me to believe that my 970 should be adequate for the next year or two and my storage shouldn't be an issue.

I feel that the older tech I'm currently using (CPU, Motherboard, RAM) is letting me down and is due for an upgrade.

I'm going to do some further testing to confirm the root cause(s) (although I feel my CPU must have been a bottleneck for years) but in the meantime I'd find it really helpful if anyone has any advice on my current situation!

In the event that I do have to upgrade, I saw this build on Crit.tv which feels like the 2017 version of my current PC, however I will only be looking to buy the below components (unless other upgrades are suggested):
- Intel Core i5-7600K
- Corsair H115i
- Gigabyte GA-Z270X-Ultra Gaming
- Corsair RM 850 80+ Gold PSU
- 16 GB Corsair Vengeance RGB DDR4

The above components I've listed comes to a grand total of £768.03.

Ouch.

The last thing I have to say is sorry for the length of this post!

Many Thanks,
Tom

 

[RimStain]

How old is your windows install? That would be the first thing I would try. Could be corrupted or full of Malware and that is causing it to slow down

3570K and a GTX970 will still be good for a few years of 1080p high quality gaming. Just get an Aftermarket Cooler and overclock it to 4.5-4.5 GHz

 

[dudmont]

the cpu and mobo aren't really an issue yet(maybe want to replace them when the next generation of cpus/mobos come out). question, is the ram setup a 1x8 or 2x4?(either way, I think 16gb is the minimum necessary these days, I would upgrade the ram, if it were me).
Get a 212 evo and OC that cpu some, keep your voltage below 1.3 volts and you'll be fine. A ssd for storage is nice, but only speeds up loading, doesn't help a lick in FPS. You would do well to spend some time making sure your Windows is paired down to as minimal a bootup as possible. Bloat and unneeded programs sap performance a great deal.

 

[10tacle]

As others have said, it's not your Ivy Bridge core hardware. You should upgrade to 16GB memory. Today, 8GB is like 4GB in 2012. Time to upgrade. I would not bother overclocking the CPU as that does very little for FPS improvement in games these days (I have proven that in benchmark tests). Regarding the GTX 970 (of which I have two in SLI), it's starting to show its age. I'm getting some stuttering at 1440p in some of the newer games due to the memory (3.5GB direct access, slower .5GB extra access). Even at 1080p the 970 is starting to show its age in newer DX12 titles and not get 60FPS.


I would get a GPU upgrade and 16GB of memory (and do a clean install of Windows as others mention). Regarding memory, be careful because sometimes even if you have the same memory model and buy a second kit, they may not work very "nicely" with the original 2x4GB kit you bought and throw errors causing crashes. Been there, done that. You may be better off selling your current memory on eBay or Craig's List and then buy a new 2x8GB kit. FYI memory in kits (2x, 4x) are tested to work together at the factory and guaranteed. Also you can sell your 970 for still a fairly decent price to offset that new GPU upgrade (going on eBay for $150-$175 USD every day).

For the GPU upgrade, I'd recommend a 1060 6GB that is factory overclocked. It can come within 10% of the performance of a stock 1070 for well over $100 less.

 

[RimStain]

As others have said, it's not your Ivy Bridge core hardware. You should upgrade to 16GB memory. Today, 8GB is like 4GB in 2012. Time to upgrade. I would not bother overclocking the CPU as that does very little for FPS improvement in games these days (I have proven that in benchmark tests). Regarding the GTX 970 (of which I have two in SLI), it's starting to show its age. I'm getting some stuttering at 1440p in some of the newer games due to the memory (3.5GB direct access, slower .5GB extra access). Even at 1080p the 970 is starting to show its age in newer DX12 titles and not get 60FPS.


I would get a GPU upgrade and 16GB of memory (and do a clean install of Windows as others mention). Regarding memory, be careful because sometimes even if you have the same memory model and buy a second kit, they may not work very "nicely" with the original 2x4GB kit you bought and throw errors causing crashes. Been there, done that. You may be better off selling your current memory on eBay or Craig's List and then buy a new 2x8GB kit. FYI memory in kits (2x, 4x) are tested to work together at the factory and guaranteed. Also you can sell your 970 for still a fairly decent price to offset that new GPU upgrade (going on eBay for $150-$175 USD every day).

For the GPU upgrade, I'd recommend a 1060 6GB that is factory overclocked. It can come within 10% of the performance of a stock 1070 for well over $100 less.

If a game is CPU dependent you will get more FPS from overclocking. What testing have you done? It' won't make a difference if the bottleneck is the GPU

8GB is plenty for games. Unless you edit video or have a fetish for 20 open chrome tabs you are fine. 16GB will not increase performance at all.

Upgrading from a 970 to a 1060 is not a good upgrade, you are really not gaining enough to justify spending the money:
http://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Nvidia-GTX-970-vs-Nvidia-GTX-1060-6GB/2577vs3639

Overclock CPU with a cooler and reinstall windows this will cost you 40 squid and a few hours. If it doesn't fix your problem your only out a bit of cash + you got a cooler for your CPU which is really something you should get anyway to prevent throttling and extend the life of your CPU.

 

[DerpaHerpaLurpa]

I'm amazed at how positive your responses have been. Thanks everyone.

To be fair, what you're all saying is correct regarding my CPU/RAM scenario, as the usage on task manager whilst I've been playing games is relatively high (as you'd expect) but it isn't maxed out. I just didn't think Task Manager was a reliable enough source...

My Windows install is rather old now which is why I was looking to do a clean install, I did upgrade to Windows 10 about a year or two ago though.

I think my next step is to reinstall Windows and see what happens.

In the event that a reinstall does not resolve my issues, I'll look at getting a new CPU cooler and then overclocking my CPU (which I'm looking at doing anyway), then maybe getting some more memory.

I guess maybe I was being too pessimistic about my current components!

I'll let you know how it goes.

 

[10tacle]

If a game is CPU dependent you will get more FPS from overclocking. What testing have you done? It' won't make a difference if the bottleneck is the GPU

I have done a lot of testing. Crytek's engine (C1-C3), Far Cry 3-4, Battlefield 3-4, Witcher 3, Fallout 4, Project Cars, DiRT Rally, Grid Autosport. I've run those games at 1440p and 1080p with my 970 SLI rig with the 4690K stock (3.5GHz) and overclocked to 4.7GHz. VERY little FPS increase in those games just on CPU overclocking. Definitely not worth the increased voltage and heat output. For other things like productivity apps, that's a different story. GPUs in Afterburner are running a higher % in usage than the CPU, so there is no CPU bottleneck. This two and a half year old Haswell build still has a lot of legs left.

8GB is plenty for games. Unless you edit video or have a fetish for 20 open chrome tabs you are fine. 16GB will not increase performance at all.

I wasn't referring to FPS performance. I was referring to smoother game play. Especially if you are running other apps in the background like video recording, anti-virus, etc. Some of today's games are hitting 7GB in RAM use (or allocation at the very least). I mean let's be honest here. In 2011 when I built my i5 2500K Sandy Bridge, 4GB was considered lowballing as guys were building with 8GB. There comes a time to accept that upgrades are needed when playing new games.

Upgrading from a 970 to a 1060 is not a good upgrade, you are really not gaining enough to justify spending the money:

http://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Nvidia-GTX-970-vs-Nvidia-GTX-1060-6GB/2577vs3639

It is if you get a factory overclocked one and overclock it and sell your 970. It's a very worthwhile inexpensive (net inexpensive selling the 970) upgrade especially when dealing with more VRAM. And he's talking about life extension, not complete upgrading. More games today like Watch Dogs 2 are using in excess of 4GB VRAM even at 1080p: http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/watch_dog_2_pc_graphics_performance_benchmark_review,9.html

Any more GPU power than that is a waste with a 60Hz 1080p monitor. More GPU power is better spent on a Gsync 1080p monitor or a 60Hz 1440 monitor where a 1070 would be the worthwhile upgrade.

 

[RimStain]

I have done a lot of testing. Crytek's engine (C1-C3), Far Cry 3-4, Battlefield 3-4, Witcher 3, Fallout 4, Project Cars, DiRT Rally, Grid Autosport. I've run those games at 1440p and 1080p with my 970 SLI rig with the 4690K stock (3.5GHz) and overclocked to 4.7GHz. VERY little FPS increase in those games just on CPU overclocking. Definitely not worth the increased voltage and heat output. For other things like productivity apps, that's a different story. GPUs in Afterburner are running a higher % in usage than the CPU, so there is no CPU bottleneck. This two and a half year old Haswell build still has a lot of legs left.

Most of these games are GPU bound. You can look at any review to see that more frequency will equal more FPS some games are minimal some you can get 10+%

I wasn't referring to FPS performance. I was referring to smoother game play. Especially if you are running other apps in the background like video recording, anti-virus, etc. Some of today's games are hitting 7GB in RAM use (or allocation at the very least). I mean let's be honest here. In 2011 when I built my i5 2500K Sandy Bridge, 4GB was considered lowballing as guys were building with 8GB. There comes a time to accept that upgrades are needed when playing new games.

"smoother game play" is directly related to average FPS. The only way it gets smoother is to have a better average FPS. 8GB is enough to just game and he is concerned about budget. There very few games that recommend 16GB and none where it is the minimum requirement. It's only going to to give you a gain when you have a game open and some other programs and you are tabbing between them. .It's definitely an upgrade you should do but not essential and not fps related

It is if you get a factory overclocked one and overclock it and sell your 970. It's a very worthwhile inexpensive (net inexpensive selling the 970) upgrade especially when dealing with more VRAM. And he's talking about life extension, not complete upgrading. More games today like Watch Dogs 2 are using in excess of 4GB VRAM even at 1080p: http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/watch_dog_2_pc_graphics_performance_benchmark_review,9.html

Any more GPU power than that is a waste with a 60Hz 1080p monitor. More GPU power is better spent on a Gsync 1080p monitor or a 60Hz 1440 monitor where a 1070 would be the worthwhile upgrade

I still don't think it's worth upgrading. such small gains, the VRAM is an advantage but there are so few games that would use it and the 6GB in the 1060 is for VR not for 4K textures while running a game in 1080p

 

[DerpaHerpaLurpa]

Ok so far I've reinstalled Windows and my PC is much quicker now and I'm not having nearly as many issues when loading things.

Today my EVO 212 arrived and I've OC'd my CPU to 4.0 GHz (I'm going to continue tweaking it over the next few days).

My game performance is much better; rarely dropping below 40 frames and usually sticking between 50-60 frames so I'm happy (I understand this is relative to the game I'm playing -- Mass Effect Andromeda).

In regards to overclocking... I know that the aim of the game is to find the sweet spot between voltage and clock speed, but I've currently got my voltage on auto (my gut tells me that's not what I should be doing).

I want to change my voltage to fixed (if that's what I should be doing) however I'm not sure what would be an ideal voltage to start on.

If anyone has any tips on overclocking that'd be great!

Currently my CPU idles at ~30-35 °C and when I use prime95 to stress test it, it peaks at 89 °C (which is higher than desired I know).

I've been playing Mass Effect quite a lot today and my CPU is averaging between 60-70 °C which I think is pretty good, but To be honest I don't remember seeing it go any higher whilst I have been playing.

Thanks for the help so far guys, any further pointers would be a bonus!

 

[dudmont]

well, in order to get a fixed voltage, we need to know what it's running at on auto, with your cpu set at 4.0ghz. Get that number, and then, in your bios, find the cpu menu that has voltage number. Input that auto voltage number into your cpu voltage spot(and switch the voltage to fixed or manual control), and start working the system downwards, lowering the voltage say .025 volts at a time, until the system is no longer stable. Use Prime95, or some other benchmarking program, for a little while(say 15-20 minutes), after each voltage drop. When the system crashes, and it will at some point, you add back a little voltage, run your benchmark program again for a little while, and look for another crash, if you don't get get one, then you have a safe voltage. At that point, you can start to work your overclock, assuming you have a low enough voltage number(with Ivy bridge, I'd keep the voltage below 1.3 no matter what). What I mean by this is, add about .05 volts for every .1ghz you add to clock speed.

 

[DerpaHerpaLurpa]

Ok well I've ran a stress test and the highest my voltage is going is 1.291 V. The lowest is 0.951 V.

Should I start at 1.291 V and work my way down or is it safe to assume that 0.951 V is the minimum before it crashes?

 

[dudmont]

start at 1.291. Drop it to 1.275 and then do a stress test. Keep going(dropping voltage) until it crashes(when it crashes, you might have to reset the bios, so it might be wise to keep notes of your voltages). The lower the number, the better. It will give you more voltage headroom to overclock. If the temps get above 80C or so, then don't add more voltage.

 

[DerpaHerpaLurpa]

Hi Everyone,

I thought I'd give it a few weeks to settle before confirming the outcome of all my changes, but to summarize:

- I did a clean install of Windows (which sorted out quite a few of my issues).
- Upgraded from my stock intel cooler (to a CM Evo 212) and OC'd my CPU which is now running at 4.1 GHz, 1.120 V & maxes out at 75 °C when stress testing, ~60-65 °C when playing games (might keep going, but I'm more than happy with it atm).

(Those 2 factors boosted my performance the most)

- I bought 2 more 4GB DIMMs to make a total of 16 GB DDR3 which hasn't caused any noticeable boost in performance, although I can keep more applications open in the background (plus having all my DIMM slots full looks very aesthetically pleasing!).

Huge thanks to everyone who gave me a suggestion because for a relatively small price, I've been able to squeeze a lot of performance out of my build.

Cheers!
Tom

 

[RimStain]

Hi Tom, Sorry just caught up with this one again. Nice work glad you were able to get some noticeable gains! You can also squeeze a little more out of your graphics card by downloading MSI afterburner or a similar program. There are some guides on how to use but basically a slight increase to core clock (~10%) and memory speeds (~5%) and increase your power target to whatever the card max is and set the bias to the power target.

Your overclock looks good, low volts and ~20 below max temp on a stress test. Definitely room for a bit more but as you start to hit the higher end of what the chip can handle you will notice the amount of power you need to get 1 multiplayer increase on the CPU (stable) is just too much to justify the heat it introduces. It seems to be around 4.4-4.6 with these cPUs