Its an AMD world afterall

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No euducated person here should have a beef with intel...just like slvr. i would like to see more competition...

when amd first introduced the athlon and intel and amd got into that little race up and over 1ghz...it was amazing how fast computers developed...now intel has no "real" compitition and is just taking it easy...


Proud owner of DOS 3.3 :smile:
 
"Oh ya has the best chipsets of any manufacture, best support, best warrenty, and when you think about it best ideology make money and more money and some more money."

There's just something missing there......hmm.....oh yeah! "best price" =/ and quite soon, AMD will outperform Intel, not that I have any beef against intel.
 
There's just something missing there......hmm.....oh yeah! "best price" =/ and quite soon, AMD will outperform Intel, not that I have any beef against intel.
But how much longer can AMD run while losing money or barely gaining any profits? Will it do a bit of good to outperform Intel if the company has gone bankrupt while getting to the point where they can outperform Intel?

Look at AMD and how they are basically working with roughly the same "basic" core design that they started with when they introduced the Athlon. You would think that AMD would have at least put something better out than the current cores, considering all the time that has lapsed since the advent of the Athlon. How much more is that "basic" core design gonna ramp in speed/performance?

Intel saw this years ago when they first started developing the P4 series, and they introduced the early P4 Williamettes, (which weren't fully developed yet, possibly due to AMD breaking the 1 Ghz barrier first). But even now, the P4 has matured and anybody who thinks straight is not laughing at the current top of the line Northwood core P4's and their current dominance of the desktop CPU market.

And the P4 has the capacity to ramp higher in speed and performance, whereas most of AMD's processor cores are reaching the limits of their capabilities. And if you were to ask me, I would say that Intel is using DAMNED good business practice and business foresight in preparing for the future as they have. I wish I could have as much foresight into the future as this, then I would be very rich too!

And since this time, Intel has improved upon the new designs, added things such as SSE, SSE2, HT, etc... Intel has actually diversified their research and come up with some pretty interesting additions to their processors. I cannot say that I have seen as much from AMD, although they have come up with a few things. Since the advent of the P4, AMD has been fraught with paper launches, bad publicity, a bad PR system, and bad management decisions. And of course, this all sets Intel up in a VERY good and enviable position. Intel has the leisure to develop new processes and additions at will, and releasing them to the public only as they feel threatened by AMD's developments.

As I see it at this point, unless A64 gains a QUICK foothold on the market, and the software developers support it by writing 64 bit optimized code, Intel has the future in their sights(and hands), and will remain dominant in the desktop CPU segment. AMD will fall further behind in their research, and eventually AMD will become a second-rate processor developer, and will never be able to truly compete for the "performance" crown again.

<font color=blue> Ok, so you have to put your "2 cents" in, but its value is only "A penny's worth". Who gets that extra penny? </font color=blue>
 
> Dont know yer guys beef with Intel, just a damned
> company that markets better has more money and has
> friends in the big OEM's oh and has 13+ fabs 2 on
> the go last I checked.

I have absolutely NO beef with intel... or AMD (well other than a total bs pr rating.) I just would like to see more real comp for intel AND amd to drive both companies futher and harder.

Shadus
 
I agree with everything that you said, Groveling_Wyrm. ... Except the end bit.

AMD will fall further behind in their research, and eventually AMD will become a second-rate processor developer, and will never be able to truly compete for the "performance" crown again.
As you said, <i>if</i> the Opteron and/or A64 don't end up catching on enough to take back a bit of the market and make AMD some money, then yeah AMD will probably fall behind in their processor R&D. But I find it hard to forsee AMD going back to being a second-rate processor developer.

I mean AMD is a pretty big company that processor development is only a small division of. I think AMD would rather just cut the red out of their budget by selling off their processor intellectual properties and stop producing processors themselves. They have plenty of other things that they <i>do</i> make money on to keep around a lame department that'll always be sapping their finances. Which is why I see another company eventually buying the right to produce Athlons (or use some of the tech, or whatever) instead of AMD becoming VIA. (Here's a scary thought: a VIA Athlon.)

But other than that tiny difference I completely agree with you. It's all about business. No matter how good a future Athlon may or may not perform, so long as the company itself is so piss poor then the quality of their product is inconsequential to their survival.

<pre><A HREF="http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20030905" target="_new"><font color=black>People don't understand how hard being a dark god can be. - Hastur</font color=black></A></pre><p>
 
😀 this is funny.
AMD will release their new chips, which will be drooled over by enthusiasts alone... (a VERY small part of the market) and these guys moaning about the price of a P4- are you SERIOUSLY thinking you will be able to afford the new athlons when they are released?!!
Nope.... didnt think so.
Then Intel will release the Prescott, with a blaze of publicity and a blitz of advertising, most family systems will ship with this "amazing new Intel that you can burn cds with, rip music with, as it gets your kids into college, whilst it simultaneously walks the dog, does the dishes etc etc" (thats advertising talk there! :) )....

and Intel will retain a massive chunk of the market, probably maturing the chip until it gathers appreciation from enthusiasts (much like the 800fsb HT P4's).

Its great that AMD have devoted fans, and Intel needs some competition to prevent it getting sloppy, but bashing Intel is just rediculous when you consider what they have brought to the pc world we all enjoy.

............................................
Render times? You'll find me down the pub...
 
I will agree, Intel has brought some amazing new technologies to the world. However, with AMD being more of a "thorn" in Intel's foot, rather than a complete and truly consistent competitor, Intel has been lucky enough to remain the master of the CPU market. When they lost the race to 1 Ghz, Intel should have lost more marketshare, but AMD floundered an opportunity to strip Intel of MASSIVE amounts of marketshare, rather than 1-10 percent.

A better business would have been more effectual against Intel, and would have maximized on the opportunity and weakness that Intel had shown. And by bringing more competition to Intel, not only will Intel be forced to introduce new technologies quicker, but the competing company will surely have good offerings for us consumers too...

So, to sum it up, Intel has given us much, but they could have been forced to give us more, by more competition.

<font color=blue> Ok, so you have to put your "2 cents" in, but its value is only "A penny's worth". Who gets that extra penny? </font color=blue>
 
Somehow, I can't see it happen, no matter how the Scotty will will stink and dissipate as much heat as a nuclear reactor, AMD doesn't seem to me like a company that can rule a market...

Roses are <font color=red>red</font color=red>, violets are <font color=blue>blue</font color=blue>, post something stupid and I won't reply to you!
 
It’s funny that you truly believe that Intel could have lost market share when the 1ghz race was lost and the willy was out. Intel is very future set in their business projections. You should take the time and listen to one of the web casts that they have for their quarterly results. They know what’s coming before we even consider it. Like IBM they are probably one of the best run companies around.

The willy was a bump and it was obvious they knew what the core was like compared to AMD's offerings since they got all major OEM's less HP to dump AMD before they even got into full production of the core. They were guaranteed sales just because of that. Also they can out produce AMD 12x over something that companies like Dell like. Dell “We need 300,000 of yer newest 3.2’s”. Intel “be there Monday”.

People that underestimate Intel as a business or their strategies need to take some more time and look at the company as a company not as a CPU like some people do.

-Jeremy


:evil: <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=5341387" target="_new">Busting Sh@t Up!!!</A> :evil:
:evil: <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?pcm=1400777" target="_new">Busting More Sh@t Up!!!</A> :evil:
 
So it'd be even weirder to see nVidia producing Athlons in the future. They would practically produce entire PCs then. Graphics, sound, northbridge, CPU... It'd be weird, but it could be very cool. And then again it could just be spreading their resources into too many markets.

ROFL, nVidia reseraching, developing, & manufacturing Athlons instead of AMD!?!? That day would <b><i>ultimately</i></b> suck if/when nVidia ever had that kind of monopoly & marketing power. Y'all are correct, some legal countermeasures must be taken in order to prevent the hardware market to get so out of whack that one hardware company( or especially Graphics Chip developer) has THAT dominant of a hold that it can obliterate the competition like a breeze. We need competition to some extent. And actually, some monopolies are actually much better for the public than having competion in certain circumstances. But this circumstance does not apply.

In honesty, I'm not dissapointed at all with situation as of now. It's good for companies to work together to acheive the ultimate quality product, interfacing with one another is of vital importance. BUt if companies start forming such strong alliance where it beomes A + B + C vs. X + Y + Z, then that will be dreadful because each company will only provide decent support for its rival companions.


My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
 
And since this time, Intel has improved upon the new designs, added things such as SSE, SSE2, HT, etc... Intel has actually diversified their research and come up with some pretty interesting additions to their processors. I cannot say that I have seen as much from AMD, although they have come up with a few things.
Although this statement is definately true, AMD can't be entirely to blame for the lack of extra R&D. Intel just has so much more muscle power & resources than AMD that I am very surprised they were even capable of inventing thhe 3D-NOW extension technology.

My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
 
Also, PopeGoldX has 4 threads that are on the frontpage of the threadlist here in the CPU forum. GROAN!!!!! Is this ever going to end Pope?????? I'm not trying to put the boy down for his opinions or anything, but every thread this dude posted is equivalent to "Intel sucks" or "AMD rules" I use mostly AMD myself, but I have plenty of good things to say about Intel too.

My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
 
I am not knocking Intel's marketing capabilities, nor their business practice. In fact, I believe that Intel has one of the best and most farsighted business practices in the market today. However, as a business owner myself, I have become practiced at spotting weaknesses in my competition. When Intel "hiccuped" and switched to the P4, they were at a weak spot. The real saving grace was, in fact, their marketing, and bullying power (IMO), and that is why AMD did not gain marketshare at that time.

However, as I had stated, a more aggressive company could have taken advantage of this, and moved in for more marketshare than AMD actually did grab. This period in time was AMD's "Golden opportunity" to grab the attention of the world, and they almost did, but they didn't quite get there.

AMD may not have had the production capabilities to produce as many processors as Intel, but they didn't need to either. All they had to do was produce as many processors as they could sell, and they could have sold more, with a more aggressive legal and marketing campaign, thus taking more marketshare. AMD failed to do this, thus my statement about a better company taking better advantage of this.

And to answer your other statement, I own stock in Intel. I know Intel's business strategies and for the most part, attempt to emulate many of these strategies in my own business practices, as they have many sound business strategies.

<font color=blue> Ok, so you have to put your "2 cents" in, but its value is only "A penny's worth". Who gets that extra penny? </font color=blue>
 
I agree with that statement, and in fact, was trying to extrapolate the same idea...

However, in making that statement, I was merely pointing out that Intel had much more R & D muscle to flex, and it showed in all these developments.

<font color=blue> Ok, so you have to put your "2 cents" in, but its value is only "A penny's worth". Who gets that extra penny? </font color=blue>
 
Cool, I didn't realize that. Do you think AMD will pull off better marketting with their AMD64? Afterall, the Enthusiast community has been drooling over Hammer for more than 2 years now. Surely, some attentian has been drummed up in the marketting world by now. But then again, I could be completely wrong.

My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
 
Afterall, the Enthusiast community has been drooling over Hammer for more than 2 years now.
Well, I don't know... Because of the delays, I get the impression that some of the drooling has already dried out...

Let's wait and see...

:evil: <font color=red><b>M</b></font color=red>ephistopheles