Masquerade vs Requiem

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Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

So, let me see if I have all of this correct...

Requiem is essentially an alternate-world take on the world of
darkness? So it looks similar but is different at the same time?

That's confusing, especially as both it and masquerade are coming
under the 'world of darkness' tag.

What are the substantial differences between the two?
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

In the borning days of the third millennium, Planetar wrote:
>So, let me see if I have all of this correct...
>
>Requiem is essentially an alternate-world take on the world of
>darkness? So it looks similar but is different at the same time?

Not really. There are elements of the original WoD in the new one, but
they are NOT the same. For one thing, metaplot has been deemphasized out of
existence in the new WoD. No more Antideluvian plots to take over the world.
The focus has narrowed so city politics is about as high as the danse macabre
goes.

Also, I noticed a thematic shift. The creepiness and hidden horror side is
much more prominent. The doomed beauty side is less prominent. This feels
much more like Call of Cthulhu to me than the old WoD did. (I, personally,
heartily approve of this development)

>That's confusing, especially as both it and masquerade are coming
>under the 'world of darkness' tag.

The new WoD completely supercedes the old. (The Cyber Ninja StoryFascist
Death Squad will be by later to steal all of your old books and erase your
memories) Any WoD stuff you see published by WW from now on will be the new
system.

>What are the substantial differences between the two?

There are a lot. The dice rolling is different, the Clans and Covenants have
been rearranged, the history has been. . . forgotten, etc. Think of it like
moving from America to England. Sure, a lot of things are similar, but the
differences are many and will trip you up if you don't get to know them.
(Tell a Brit you saw a bum on the street and it means something very different
than what an American thinks it means.)

--
Brian Merchant (remove 'remove' and 'example' from email)

Puritanism didn't keep the puritans from sinning, it just kept
them from enjoying it.
--Father Joe Breighner
Country Roads
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Brian Merchant wrote:
> In the borning days of the third millennium, Planetar wrote:
>
>>So, let me see if I have all of this correct...
>>
>>Requiem is essentially an alternate-world take on the world of
>>darkness? So it looks similar but is different at the same time?
>
>
> Not really. There are elements of the original WoD in the new one, but
> they are NOT the same. For one thing, metaplot has been deemphasized out of
> existence in the new WoD. No more Antideluvian plots to take over the world.
> The focus has narrowed so city politics is about as high as the danse macabre
> goes.
>
> Also, I noticed a thematic shift. The creepiness and hidden horror side is
> much more prominent. The doomed beauty side is less prominent. This feels
> much more like Call of Cthulhu to me than the old WoD did. (I, personally,
> heartily approve of this development)
>
>

So, exactly what Planetar said, then?

William
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

> Not really. There are elements of the original WoD in the new one, but
> they are NOT the same. For one thing, metaplot has been deemphasized out of
> existence in the new WoD. No more Antideluvian plots to take over the world.
> The focus has narrowed so city politics is about as high as the danse macabre
> goes.

So it IS an alternate world then. As in, the history and such is very
different, but you still have vampires with disciplines, and some of
the clans have survived. And it's less with the history and more with
the 'getting on with unlife' idea.

> Also, I noticed a thematic shift. The creepiness and hidden horror side is
> much more prominent. The doomed beauty side is less prominent. This feels
> much more like Call of Cthulhu to me than the old WoD did. (I, personally,
> heartily approve of this development)

I always thought V:TM was much more of a horror-from-ages past than
the whole doomed beauty thing, especially in its early years. After
all, what were the Antediluvians if not the vampire world's version of
Cthulhu etc.
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Planetar wrote:
>
> > Also, I noticed a thematic shift. The creepiness and hidden horror side is
> > much more prominent. The doomed beauty side is less prominent. This feels
> > much more like Call of Cthulhu to me than the old WoD did. (I, personally,
> > heartily approve of this development)
>
> I always thought V:TM was much more of a horror-from-ages past than
> the whole doomed beauty thing, especially in its early years. After
> all, what were the Antediluvians if not the vampire world's version of
> Cthulhu etc.

Definitely not Cthulhu. Cthulhu wouldn't plot to murder God - God is
irrelevant to Cthulhu.

--
Elizabeth D. Brooks | kali.magdalene@comcast.net | US2002021724
Listowner: Aberrants_Worldwide, Fading_Suns_Games, TrinityRPG
AeonAdventure | "Dobby likes us!" -- Smeagol
-- http://www.theonering.net/scrapbook/view/6856
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

In the borning days of the third millennium, Planetar wrote:
>> Not really. There are elements of the original WoD in the new one, but
>> they are NOT the same. For one thing, metaplot has been deemphasized out of
>> existence in the new WoD. No more Antideluvian plots to take over the world.
>> The focus has narrowed so city politics is about as high as the danse macabre
>> goes.
>
>So it IS an alternate world then. As in, the history and such is very
>different, but you still have vampires with disciplines, and some of
>the clans have survived. And it's less with the history and more with
>the 'getting on with unlife' idea.

I would call it a replacement instead of an alternative. To me, an
alternative world implies that both exist in some way. As far as published
material goes, the new WoD completely replaces the old WoD.

--
Brian Merchant (remove 'remove' and 'example' from email)

Puritanism didn't keep the puritans from sinning, it just kept
them from enjoying it.
--Father Joe Breighner
Country Roads
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Planetar <tadhgk@gmail.com> wrote:
: I always thought V:TM was much more of a horror-from-ages past than
: the whole doomed beauty thing, especially in its early years. After
: all, what were the Antediluvians if not the vampire world's version of
: Cthulhu etc.

You would say that the 1st ed. Vampire core book was about monsters that
had slept for thousands of years? That the game discussed more how to
bring characters into horror encounters with these monsters than with
the title of "personal horror"?

(Not that V:tM in any of its numerous incarnations ever lived up to that
slogan.)

//T
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Planetar wrote:

> So, let me see if I have all of this correct...
>
> Requiem is essentially an alternate-world take on the world of
> darkness? So it looks similar but is different at the same time?
>
> That's confusing, especially as both it and masquerade are coming
> under the 'world of darkness' tag.

As the other poster has said, the Masquerade (and the other
modern-day supernaturals for that matter) are done. The books are all
out of print and no further material will be published for that setting.
The Requiem is the new World of Darkness, as will be Werewolf: the
Forsaken and Mage: the Awakening, when they are eventually released.

> What are the substantial differences between the two?
Well, the scope of things is a lot more focused I find. Worldwide
vampire influence isn't discussed in detail. There is no Camarilla or
Sabbat. Vampires divide themselves into Clans (by blood lineage) and
Covenants (by personal philosophy), but politics are largely at the city
level or lower. Vampires are more free to act as they see fit.
It's hard to tell whether the new flavour will be better or worse
(that's really a subjective opinion anyway), but if nothing else they
have succeeded in re-injecting the world with the mystery and suspicion
which was always the foundation of it's stories.
From a system perspective, the World of Darkness has been rebuilt
from the ground up. If there's one thing the system really needed, it
was a serious re-think, and that's exactly what it got. This is not to
say things are entirely alien, mind you. The system still uses
Attribute + Skill, still rolls d10's, and a lot of familiar terms litter
the pages of the two books released so far.
However, the system has been designed from the get-go to facilitate
and even encourage crossovers (although they are not required, of
course.) You create your character as a mortal using the World of
Darkness corebook and then apply a template from the splatbook of choice
(ie: Vampire the Requiem) to convert that mortal into the appropriate
beastie.
Rolling dice has been refined to discourage rolling umpteen ten to
fifteen die pools each round of combat. Bonuses and Penalties add or
subtract dice *before* they are rolled, and the target number is always
8. Always.
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

William <wilit0613@postoffice.uri.edu> wrote in message
news:2peoq0FfmtdtU1@uni-berlin.de...
> Brian Merchant wrote:
> > In the borning days of the third millennium, Planetar wrote:
> >
> >>So, let me see if I have all of this correct...
> >>
> >>Requiem is essentially an alternate-world take on the world of
> >>darkness? So it looks similar but is different at the same time?
> >
> >
> > Not really. There are elements of the original WoD in the new
one, but
> > they are NOT the same. For one thing, metaplot has been
deemphasized out of
> > existence in the new WoD. No more Antideluvian plots to take over
the world.
> > The focus has narrowed so city politics is about as high as the
danse macabre
> > goes.
> >
> > Also, I noticed a thematic shift. The creepiness and hidden
horror side is
> > much more prominent. The doomed beauty side is less prominent.
This feels
> > much more like Call of Cthulhu to me than the old WoD did. (I,
personally,
> > heartily approve of this development)
> >
> >
>
> So, exactly what Planetar said, then?
----------
No, not at all. An alternate take would imply that it's the same
world, with the technocracy, the antediluvian plots, Lucita running
around, the Cappadocians being replaced by the Giovanni etc. etc. but
somehow the players are not involved in any of this, but in something
else.

--
You are Not entering Chapeltown.
We walk on two legs, the one abstract
the other surreal.
All important political action should be
aimed at persuading people of the
necessity of further sacrifices.
- Ardian Vehbiu, "Handbook for
Aspiring Stalinists"
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Stephen Williams <steve1.williams@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:m_SYc.9412$7i2.461412@news20.bellglobal.com...

> The Nosferatu are still inhumanly ugly
----------
Not necessarily... some of them look like Max Schreck, others are just
somehow very creepy.

--
You are Not entering Chapeltown.
We walk on two legs, the one abstract
the other surreal.
All important political action should be
aimed at persuading people of the
necessity of further sacrifices.
- Ardian Vehbiu, "Handbook for
Aspiring Stalinists"
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

"Teemu T Vilen" wrote
> Planetar wrote:
> : I always thought V:TM was much more of a horror-from-ages past than
> : the whole doomed beauty thing, especially in its early years. After
> : all, what were the Antediluvians if not the vampire world's version of
> : Cthulhu etc.
>
> You would say that the 1st ed. Vampire core book was about monsters that
> had slept for thousands of years? That the game discussed more how to
> bring characters into horror encounters with these monsters than with
> the title of "personal horror"?

Not the one I had. Not even a little bit.

> (Not that V:tM in any of its numerous incarnations ever lived up to that
> slogan.)

I disagree. Completely. My experience with the game was exactly that - and
it got really, really creepy on occasion. I'm using, by the way, person
horror in the sense of "this is so creepy and scary I'm sleeping with the
lights on," not "oh my god I'm gonna barf 'cause of all the gore."

And yes, I did once sleep with the lights on after a VtM game. But just the
once.

Joel Morton
 
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