A lot of people are missing the point that Microsoft is not just selling these to the consumer, but also for business. I myself being an IT Director have been waiting for the x86 Surface forever and will be most likely deploying them through our company when they come out. The only reason Microsoft is building their own tablet line is because OEM’s have been dragging a** on design and innovations for years. I mean come on; you are still using same old crappy touch pads that you have been for the past 5 years.
Just for the record I have owned an iPad, HP Touchpad (hacked CM9 on it as well) and an Asus Transformer Prime. I sold them all because they simple could not do what I need them too. They are great for home use watching movies and some light IT work, but for a corporate IT stands point, they just don’t cut it. Also I don't feel like paying for a separate app for everything that I need to do that a normal PC can do for free.
And for those that can’t use Google, there is already a FREE program that will bring the Start button back in Windows 8 and a registry hack the will make the Desktop your Default start UI. So just stop your crying about it.
Also if anyone would ever buy a Surface to use with Photoshop or CS6, then they just need to walk to the edge of a cliff and jump off. The world doesn't need any more ID10ts in it.
I want an ultrabook, I also want a tablet, this will do both so therefore I am geeting what I want when I buy it.
As far as not having a proper start menu, it's not an issue for me as I tend to use the taskbar anyway and millions and millions of other people have been ditching the start menu in favour of that as proved by the customer improvement program
The opinion of a few part-time techno-dweebs that can't let go of the past is not something that interest big business, 400 million PCs ship each year and from next year a huge number of those will ship Windows 8 pre-installed and by 2015 they will be getting ready to do exactly the same with Windows 9 which will likely cause mass-hysteria by being an entirely Cloud-based OS "Cloud 9" and the dweebs will shake their fists even harder "I am going to buy another copy of Windows 8 just to spite them"
I think it's a good idea. A problem with PCs is that bulk manufacturers usually use off-the-shelf hardware to keep costs down. On top of it, I found that craplets, even after you clean them off, do affect the system's stability in a bad way. I have an OEM copy of Windows 7 for my desktop, and it's many times more stable and reliable than the version that came on my laptop. So, just having vanilla Windows could help.
There's PC enthusiasts out there with top-end parts, which I feel helps Microsoft have a hard-core PC user base. However, most people don't build home-made PCs. They can be quite superior to a Mac. However, because there's less crap and they push the envelope, Apple has an advantage selling massly-made prebuilt computers.
Many corporations will have a hard time buying PC parts and building the systems. This is where I can see the Surface possibly getting some attention.
[citation][nom]Shin-san[/nom]I think it's a good idea. A problem with PCs is that bulk manufacturers usually use off-the-shelf hardware to keep costs down.[/citation]
I don't think W8 will stop manufacturers from having off the shelf hardware. And if surface goes well I'm ready to bet that we will see sooner than later some kind of "build your own tablet" solutions.
And by the way having a big touch screen with W8 and a desktop central Unit to power it would provide enhancements in a lot of technical domains such as 3D designing and so on. Because I acknowledge that nothing is better than keyboard for office work but to design 3D models mouse is not the best tools.
M$ is dreaming. The Pc is dead even Gates admits it and even in tablet form the Surface pro is a $1400 PC ($1000 for the tablet with the goofy keybord with the awkward UI (how much for a new license in Win 8, I know W7 to W8 is $40 but a new OEM version on the table...$100-120?) and another $400 or more for Win 8 versions of office and other software that will have to be rewritten to work in the Metro interface.
Or I can spend $5/month and get a M$ approved version of a virtual W7 to run on my ipad through the cloud. Why do I need to have the full version of Office on a tablet? I just need a nice looking interface to get to the cloud via WiFi or LTE (If damm AT&T ever gets the rear in gear). Stop looking in the rear-view mirror, heck even M$ is pushing the cloud along. Something is telling me that you will be able to boot the next iPad into multiple OS's (iOS, OS X and perhaps even W8. Though, as I pointed out above, I don't think it will matter too much longer when all our computing is done in the cloud, hopeful through voice recognition so no keyboard is needed.
"Dave Bowman: Hello, HAL. Do you read me, HAL?
HAL: Affirmative, Dave. I read you." - It's not that far away!
For those people who complain about the idea of Windows 8 on a desktop, imagine pairing it with Leap Motion (Which looks to be getting released not long after W8) and think of some of the amazing stuff you'd be able to do, especially when using multiple monitors...
[citation][nom]belardo[/nom]FAIL! Windows7 tablets have been around for about 2 years. They run the same software TODAY that Win8 tablets will run tomorrow.[/citation]
What you fail to realize is that win7 tablets do not sell because of 2 main factors:
1) The hardware is crap. I have what is apparently a $500 tablet (got mine for free, fun but long story). This thing had an Atom CPU, 1GB of ram, 160GB HDD, and 6 cell battery which made the form factor HUGE compared to everything else. Honestly I would never buy this product, and if I 'needed' a tablet PC I would only throw down $350 for it (heck my smaller, lighter, nearly as long battery life Acer was $300 over 2 years ago, all the tablet did was add a reversible hinge on the screen, and a touch input). Now after adding another GB of ram, and a bigger/faster HDD it is an OK machine, but still not worth the $500 retail price tag.
2) Windows 7 absolutely stinks on ice for touch screens. Windows 8 on a touch screen is not only 'better' than win7, it is almost ideal. Seriously, the touch on 7 was slow, inaccurate, and lacking in functionality such as multi-touch, and pressure sensitivity. Just by installing Win8 without the manufacturers drivers I gained multi touch (2 points), pressure sensitivity (at least enough to differentiate between a hover and a click), and excellent accuracy that goes for the center of the touch instead of the upper left corner of the touch. The difference between win8 on the netbook/tablet vs the PC was barely comparable. The PC ran well, but the interface was clunky (but much better on RP than CP or DP... actually it was acceptably useful in the latest build, a little more improvement and keys/mice will be 1st class citizens again). Meanwhile, the gutless netbook flew much faster on win8 than anything it previously had (win7, and various linux builds), and win8 was really made for touch. I think people will be pleasantly surprised.
Remember, MS knows that win7 tablets are not selling, that is WHY they made surface in the first place. Not to take over the market, but to get their partner manufacturer's to get their act together, and act as a benchmark for others to hit on performance per $. And I stand by what I have said before; companies WANT tablets to replace antiquated technology such as LRTs, and other annoying and dated logistical equipment. Seriously, use an LRT all day in a warehouse with all of it's weight, crap battery, tiny buttons, and esoteric interfaces, and tell me that you would not die for a tablet with an easy interface, USB scanner (attached to the case?), and connected to some form of database back end! It would be a life saver! and no more expensive than the LRT in the first place. The problem is that their infrastructure is all Windows based with SBS, or other server products, so Apple and Android products are simply not an option. Having a domain-able device, where you can lock down all the settings for business use, while having real connectivity (that Apple cannot provide) is something business wants... the rest of us consumer shmucks are merely an afterthought with the ARM version.
I just realized this is a prediction made by Ballmer. For crying out loud Steve... stop it! You had it wrong with the iPhone, with Android, Zune, WP7 and so on. What ever makes you think you'll get Surface right?!?!?
There are a number of points in this discussion that I would like to comment on: 1. The PC is dead.
This is false. The PC is NOT dead. And will never be dead. There will always be a market for custom built, high performance machines. There's no way in hell you'll ever be able to achieve the same performance on a tablet as on a regular PC. Sure, you'll get the PC performance from 10 years ago and that may be good enough for some. But not for all. 2. Previous tablets failed because technology was not ready.
No. They failed purely on price. I always thought they're really cool, even if there were obvious usability problems. But... the price always turned me down badly. If Surface (x86) is 1500+ I'm already turned down. There's no way I would pay that much for a device that we all know it's gonna be slow in 1 year, dreadful in 3 and obsolete in 5 (if it lasts that much). 3. Android & iOS are not good enough.
Having owned both on tablets, and having used ALL versions of both Android and iOS, I would say the progress on both sides is staggering. It may look slower on iOS but that's just because they don't change the UI. And it may look bigger on Android but that's because they originally started on the wrong path. Whatever "not there" you might have, they're going to build it. And my money are on iOS on this area because they are scared shit of M$. Google on the other hand simply cannot fail. Most of their income is from advertisement so they need a better droid just to distribute more ads to the world. It's not because they sell the OS or the devices (not at a profit anyway). They make it good because they like to make it good. 4. You have to pay for apps.
Not really. You can get most apps for free with ads (so... yes, you pay because you have the ads). And there are so many free apps out there... On the other hand... for Windows... you don't pay for the applications? Oups... perhaps you should not brag about this...? 5. Business need domains. And security. And management.
You would have thought BlackBerry would have done a lot better in the enterprise. After all they had all that. Business needed all this 10 years ago. Since then there was Google, Amazon, Apple. The enterprise IS changing. At a rapid pace. It will take time, but eventually they will all move to the cloud in order to reduce infrastructure costs. And that's what's really scary for M$. Their cloud efforts were meaningless until recently. And, because they insist in using their own ill adapted technology in everything they do, they are still messing their cloud efforts.
[citation][nom]RealityClash[/nom]For those people who complain about the idea of Windows 8 on a desktop, imagine pairing it with Leap Motion (Which looks to be getting released not long after W8) and think of some of the amazing stuff you'd be able to do, especially when using multiple monitors...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_d6KuiuteIA[/citation]
It's still waving your arms around (for hours), and how does this system know if you want to use motion or you're just doing something unrelated in front of your computer?
I wouldn't even want to play FPS games on this.
Face it, the mouse is as "perfect" as a pencil, it can't be improved much. This motion Minority Report stuff looks cool, but after a few days it's just going to be a pain in the ass (and front delts).
[citation][nom]internetlad[/nom]The big thing is the functionality. You're not paying for a stripped down, angry birds playing iOS platform[/citation]
You are wrong here. ARM version WILL look much like iOS in terms of functionality. Proper Win8 tablet will be much more expensive and will not be in direct competition with iPad and such.
[citation][nom]devanhorn[/nom]Being a graphics designer and digital photo geek the RT is a no-go. The Pro with i5 however is very intriguing. I feel a lot of creative’s will jump on this platform. The standard USB connection and 16:9 format is just what they want in something you can hold in one hand at ~1.5 pounds and use in the field. That is where you will see PhotoShop, Illustrator, Sketchbook Pro, AutoCad, etc. and the capability to do "real" work with a tablet and not just play around. Companies might just drool over this since it is MS OS and melds with 99% of corporate IT support.I commend MS for pushing the envelope. I actually though Apple would have done this first with the retinal display, but they let us sorts down. If this works half as well as they expect I see a lot of companies getting into power-tablets, which can only be a good thing for all users.[/citation]
those apps will not run well on a tablet...
photoshop on a micro screen?
autocad on a tablet??? rofl
illustrator on a tiny screen??? rofl
sounds like desparation to be seen as a creative in a coffee shop rather than as a tool for getting a job done