Microsoft Says Secret Data Requests Are Now The Norm, Sues U.S. Government

Status
Not open for further replies.

KenZen2B

Distinguished
Oct 27, 2009
116
0
18,710
16
So here is a simple where to solve the problem of gag orders for secret data requests.

1. Secret data requests with gag orders should only be used for anti-terrorism cases. Gag orders shall have a life time of 180 days.

2. All other data requests should first go to the companies holding the data and make the data read only for a period of 180 days, after which the read only protection of the data is turned off. Within the 180 days, the government should go to the owner of the data with court orders for turn over of requested data.
 

Rooknoir

Commendable
Apr 2, 2016
4
0
1,510
0
Hmm. I see a pretty major possible issues regarding this bit, but it likely has no bearing on either of us:

In a situation where a person being investigated has the means and motive to flee the country if they suspected they were being investigated of a crime

In a situation where a company or organization could easily destroy related data that is not specifically in the data request

I agree with the time constraint, but that should be able to be extended with the permission of a federal judge depending on the investigation. Narrowing it down to specifically 'anti-terrorism' will either create loopholes through precedent or be too restrictive for what is needed.
 

firefoxx04

Distinguished
Jan 23, 2009
1,371
0
19,660
144
If requests for terrorism were truly FOR TERRORISM then I think we would be fine with companies handing things over, the problem is that there is no way to know for sure and agents can simply claim the data is required for counter terrorism operations.

Those that are willing to sacrifice privacy for freedom deserve neither. Not sure who really said that but its true.
 

Rooknoir

Commendable
Apr 2, 2016
4
0
1,510
0


"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." Is the quote. Using it in response to this situation, I would say, is alarmist.
 

manleysteele

Reputable
Jun 21, 2015
286
0
4,810
14
There is a process for legally obtaining a secret warrant which the FBI understands very well. If they are attempting to circumvent this process by utilizing gag orders, that's not just wrong. It is unconstitutional and therefore illegal.
 

clonazepam

Distinguished
Jul 10, 2010
2,625
0
21,160
119
In the meantime...

July: Hello from Microsoft. This is your monthly letter to inform you there were no data requests from govt agencies for the month of June.
August: ...
September: ...
October: ...
November: Hello from Microsoft. This is your monthly letter to inform you there were no data requests from govt agencies for the month of October.
 

Roy_5_

Commendable
Feb 17, 2016
4
0
1,510
0
You shouldn't expect anything stored in the cloud to be private, heck even locally on Windows your data is not private if you are connected to the Internet. Anyone who thinks they have privacy now days is nieve.
 

RedJaron

Splendid
Moderator

Like Hell we shouldn't. It's one thing to realize there are thieves in the world and your belongings are at risk to being stolen. It's quite another to expect the government to break their own rules and take your stuff without probable cause because they think "just in case" is a good idea. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but to just say "c'est la vie" and not at least attempt to hold them to the rules is not only lazy, it's dangerous. I'm a citizen, not a subject, dammit, which was the entire point of a little kerfuffle about 240 years ago.
 

Jim90

Honorable
Feb 3, 2013
362
2
10,965
54
"little kerfuffle about 240 years ago." - that was then, this is now. Policies, constitutions, laws, guidelines, etc must be allowed to evolve - where required and justified - to reflect the current situation.
If there's a significant issue e.g. terrorism, then, should we not all work together to provide those bodies set up specifically to counter these issues to work most effectively?
If it's a matter of universal mistrust in these bodies, then clearly we all, as a whole, still have a lot of evolving to do for we should never, ever find ourselves in that position.
 

rawoysters

Distinguished
Jun 12, 2009
175
0
18,690
3
"So here is a simple where to solve the problem of gag orders for secret data requests.

1. Secret data requests with gag orders should only be used for anti-terrorism cases. Gag orders shall have a life time of 180 days".

Yea, trust the government to decide what is terror related. That is what we got with the patriot act and everybody knows how that turned out.
 

junkeymonkey

Polypheme
BANNED
all these laws sure helped them poor folks out in san Bernardino. I bet if a congressman was there it would of been stopped wile it was still in planning

seems all these laws just protect is the top elite 10% ..

now like gun laws lets think I want to attack I got 2 choices building ''A'' pink o' anti gun folks doing there little sing along or building ''B'' true red blooded americans god fearing folks packing heat that know how and don't mind using it . what do I choose ??? hmmmmm..... don't think building ''B''

any way I need to put mine and my family's life on facebook and jump in my new wifi with gps car then send e-mails on windows 10 one-drive .. I mean come on ,you all do it to your self and let them get away with it ...

you think all this tech is so great when all you do is fall in to there trap and the sad thing is you now are guilty until you prove your innocent ..God bless America

bottom line is if they were not collecting and storing your data in the first place there would be no issue here at all , right ???

 

CRamseyer

Reputable
Jan 25, 2015
409
0
4,790
3
QNAP, Thecus, Synology and others all provide cloud-like services in NAS products you keep locked up in the office. Your employees have a log in just like in the office. I wrote about this a few years ago. Is anyone surprised that the feds think they can search through your data on demand?
 

whassup

Reputable
May 21, 2015
200
0
4,760
27
Just NO to Microsoft. For security purposes government had every Authority to inspect data of people which concerns to that nation. Microsoft themselves can steal data from there Windows 10 users and now they wanted to protect their customers’ privacy from Government ?? What fcking logic in it ??
 

turkey3_scratch

Polypheme
Herald
Microsoft says the government can currently just take any data out of their cloud? Not possible unless Microsoft allows them to. I've run a server before, and the government surely could not access my HDD data. Then again they never requested any of it, but the only way for the government to get the data is for the server company to send it over.
 

junkeymonkey

Polypheme
BANNED
''government surely could not access my HDD data''

how naive .. they got there hackers and if your fingered your done for and slip in right under your nose if they wanted to ... and the sad thing is unlike a street hacker they got all this talked about above to guard them or force companys like Microsoft to insure they get that backdoor [with a gag order] lol...

I guess you could never go on line then they cant get in
 

turkey3_scratch

Polypheme
Herald


Yeah, and the Illuminati controls the government, too. People are far too afraid of the government always.
 

Chris Droste

Honorable
May 29, 2013
275
0
10,810
14
I'm really conflicted with all this. MS wants to collect our stuff automatically and regularly so long as they give us "free" Windows 10...then wants to Stop the gov't from secretly requesting and taking data from their cloud services. and just 15 years ago...? this would be unthinkable to see MS as the 'good guy' protecting our privacy rights.

At least, for now, I'm glad that a monster the size of MS is fighting for privacy rights and i agree with them.

What really disgusts me in all of this though is some of these comments reveal just how little some of you actually care that this is happening; and it does, in fact, go back to the Famous Benjamin Franklin Quote; "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." It personally hurts me when i have friends and family still believe in the mentality of "you have nothing to hide you have nothing to worry about" which is fundamentally wrong, each individual, on a case by case basis, for that specific instance taking place; should ALWAYS have the right to make the choice to allow or deny a search request, unless a lawful warrant was obtained and the original creator/owner of the data/premises/object was notified prior to search and seizure. Our founding fathers were not idiots when they put that into the original Bill of Rights, but we sure the hell are for allowing it's desecration.
 


^^That right there. The terrorists were posting allegiance message to Jihad on Facebook and our counter-terrorism and FBI forces didn't even pay attention to her social media history before letting her in? (And yes, the FBI said there was no evidence of anything imminently dangerous after the fact as a cover-up).

And we're supposed to expect our government, the Feds specifically, to be trustworthy and competent with anything. Anyone who believes that is one of their useful idiots.
 

RedJaron

Splendid
Moderator

This isn't a proper comparison. A user agrees to let MS collect that data by using MS software, and MS notifies the user they are going to collect it. Not only do the feds not have such an agreement with citizens, they are also required to alert people when they are being investigated. There are provisions to that of course, but the feds are trying to skirt around it in very grey methods.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

ASK THE COMMUNITY

TRENDING THREADS