[SOLVED] Mini ITX with short low profile graphic card

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Foobrother

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Apr 19, 2020
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Hi all,

I'm looking for some advises.
I would like to fully rebuild my mini-itx machine which is getting really old. Since I don't rebuild my machines often I tend to make strong specs which can keep up for a few years to run most of the apps/games.
My mini-itx case is a Lian Li PC-Q07B. I really like its design/look and would like to keep it. Here are the specs:
Code: 
- Case Type: Mini Tower
- Dimensions: (W)193mm x (H)290mm x (D)208mm
- Front bezel Material: Aluminum
- Side Panel: Aluminum
- Body Material: Aluminum
- 5.25" drive bay (External): 1
- 3.5" drive bay (External): None
- HDD bay: 1x 2.5" + 1x 3.5"
- Expansion Slot: 1
- Motherboard Support: Mini-ITX (170mm x 170mm)
- System Fan (Front): None
- System Fan (Top): None
- System Fan (Rear): None
- I/O Ports: USB2.0 x 2
- Maximum Compatibility: VGA Card length: 180mm / PSU length: 140mm / CPU cooler height: 70mm

The big advantage of this case is that you can fit a standard PSU (preferably modular to avoid having cables everywhere).

Here is what I have in mind:
  • Intel chipset with i7 or i9
  • Probably nvme m.2 SSD for Windows 10 and a 2.5" one (1TB) for various local storage (or another nvme m.2 if I have second slot and similar price).
  • Graphic card (has to be 18cm/7inches long max and with a single slot)
  • 16GB+ of RAM
- In terms of budget I don't have one. But I think if will be limited by the hardware we can fit in the case!
  • I'll have a couple 3 external HDDs connected in USB3 which I use mainly for backups
  • I'll have a single screen connected on HDMI Display Port
  • I'll have an USB3 Hub connected to it too

I think the main challenge is to find a powerful graphic card which fits into the this case (has to be 18cm/7inches long max and with a single slot).

Thanks in advance.
 
Solution
Vic 40
Foobrother said:
This Phanteks case is indeed more in my taste: not wide, not deep and tall. Basically like a normal ATX case but not as deep. This model is quite tall for me (it's more than twice taller then my current case). But I've check their other models and found that one which small (47cm instead of 65cm): https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product...-evolv-shift-mini-itx-tower-case-ph-es217e_bk
If you know other cases similar to this one, I'm interested. But this one is the best so far.
Click to expand...
Was realy looking for this one, overlooked the "X" with the other one. What about his case?
https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product/fQVG3C/silverstone-lucid-ld03-mini-itx-tower-case-sst-ld03b

Still looking at Intel would this maybe...
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tennis2 said:
You're going to have to ditch the case or mod it to accept a dual slot GPU. Single slot GPUs are VERY low end these days.

What country are you shopping in and what's your budget?
Click to expand...
That's what I'm worried about. I found the ZOTAC GTX 1050ti but it's a 2016 card (quite weak).
It would be for UK and in terms of budget I would say around £1500 (~$1900).
 
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Vic 40 said:
Alot of problems just to keep a case. Can get that you like it,but seems for what you want it just doesn't have the right expansion options.

Whether the ZOTAC GTX 1050ti works for you depends on what you want to do with it.
Click to expand...
Well, as I said since I don't rebuild my machines often I tend to make strong specs which can keep up for a few years to run most of the apps/games.
Not sure it will be the case with the ZOTAC GTX 1050ti 🙄
 
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Love those ITX builds.
Over the years, I have built using lian li PC-Q02, Q07 and Q08.
The only one which can handle a two slot discrete graphics card is the
PC-Q08.
Yes, it is a bit larger, but otherwise the specs are similar.
Full size ATX psu, dvd drive and very good ventilation with a 140mm intake fan.
I use one now for a backup pc.

The Q07 does have two slots, but you need to mod the back to make room for the card outputs.
There are some nice forum posts where this was done.

Still, I do not think it is a great idea for anything high powered since the case depends on convection for cooling; no fans.

Probably the best you can do with the case is to use a processor with integrated graphics.
Even the ryzen 3400G graphics is only about 1/4 as capable as the GTX1050ti.
The upcoming intel 10/11th gen chips with xe integrated graphics might be a possibility.
 
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I went pretty darn small on the case since that seems to be your interest. The SG13 is actually just a hair SMALLER than your PC-Q07

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 3.8 GHz 12-Core Processor (£394.25 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken X42 Rev 2 98.17 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (£94.98 @ Box Limited)
Motherboard: Gigabyte X570 I AORUS PRO WIFI Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard (£261.40 @ Alza)
Memory: Crucial Ballistix 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3600 Memory (£183.99 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: ADATA XPG SX8200 Pro 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£138.97 @ CCL Computers)
Storage: Seagate BarraCuda 4 TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive (£86.97 @ Currys PC World Business)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce RTX 2070 8 GB GAMING Video Card (£481.39 @ Amazon UK)
Case: Silverstone SG13 Mini ITX Tower Case (£51.86 @ SmartTeck.co.uk)
Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (£89.99 @ CCL Computers)
Total: £1783.80
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-04-19 23:40 BST+0100
 
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Foobrother said:
It would be for UK and in terms of budget I would say around £1500 (~$1900).
Click to expand...
@tennis2,

That is quite a big bump over the budget.

AMD gives alot for the money so a Ryzen 3700X would cost alot less and would still give good performance.

@Foobrother,

what do you think about his case?
Phanteks ENTHOO EVOLV SHIFT X Mini ITX Tower Case (PH-ES217XE_BK) - PCPartPicker

If you wanted Intel would you for an i7 probably get an i7 9700K in which maybe will have to stretch it's legs to keep up in newer games in the future with 8 cores/no hyper threading then again it can be overclocked.

Like in this build as illustration,

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: Intel Core i7-9700K 3.6 GHz 8-Core Processor (£333.00 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Liquid Freezer II 240 56.3 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (£69.23 @ SmartTeck.co.uk)
Motherboard: ASRock Z390M-ITX/ac Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard (£155.47 @ Scan.co.uk)
Memory: Patriot Viper Steel 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (£75.72 @ CCL Computers)
Storage: Crucial MX500 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£107.58 @ Aria PC)
Storage: Kingston A2000 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£98.68 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: Asus Radeon RX 5700 XT 8 GB TUF Gaming X3 OC Video Card (£326.57 @ Amazon UK)
Case: Lian Li PC-Q39GWX Mini ITX Desktop Case (£193.67 @ More Computers)
Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (£89.99 @ CCL Computers)
Total: £1449.91
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-04-20 17:59 BST+0100

Maybe too much storage for you and a pretty expensive case, but just have a look. Compare the 9700K and the Ryzen 3700X in some reviews. Think the Ryzen will probably go a longer way.
 
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Heh, oops, I read it as "budget = £1500 - £1900" not "£1500 / $1900.

The Ryzen 3700X certainly pulls my build closer to the given budget (only a 7% overshoot)

For super small builds, blower-style GPUs are preferable since they exhaust the waste heat directly out of the case. I was looking for a RX5700/XT, but (probably due to COVID) they aren't in stock. Figured the RTX2070 at least provides ray tracing support, since that seems to be a feature that's here to stay.

I think it comes down to how small the OP truly wants this build to end up being. I was trying to match the size of the existing case.
 
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Vic 40 said:
what do you think about his case?
Phanteks ENTHOO EVOLV SHIFT X Mini ITX Tower Case (PH-ES217XE_BK) - PCPartPicker

If you wanted Intel would you for an i7 probably get an i7 9700K in which maybe will have to stretch it's legs to keep up in newer games in the future with 8 cores/no hyper threading then again it can be overclocked.

Like in this build as illustration,

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: Intel Core i7-9700K 3.6 GHz 8-Core Processor (£333.00 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Liquid Freezer II 240 56.3 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (£69.23 @ SmartTeck.co.uk)
Motherboard: ASRock Z390M-ITX/ac Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard (£155.47 @ Scan.co.uk)
Memory: Patriot Viper Steel 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (£75.72 @ CCL Computers)
Storage: Crucial MX500 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£107.58 @ Aria PC)
Storage: Kingston A2000 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£98.68 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: Asus Radeon RX 5700 XT 8 GB TUF Gaming X3 OC Video Card (£326.57 @ Amazon UK)
Case: Lian Li PC-Q39GWX Mini ITX Desktop Case (£193.67 @ More Computers)
Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (£89.99 @ CCL Computers)
Total: £1449.91
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-04-20 17:59 BST+0100

Maybe too much storage for you and a pretty expensive case, but just have a look. Compare the 9700K and the Ryzen 3700X in some reviews. Think the Ryzen will probably go a longer way.
Click to expand...
This Phanteks case is indeed more in my taste: not wide, not deep and tall. Basically like a normal ATX case but not as deep. This model is quite tall for me (it's more than twice taller then my current case). But I've check their other models and found that one which small (47cm instead of 65cm): https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product...-evolv-shift-mini-itx-tower-case-ph-es217e_bk
If you know other cases similar to this one, I'm interested. But this one is the best so far.

Regarding the chipset I've had Intels for years. Never had any issue. But it seems that AMDs Ryzen are very good as well these days and cheaper. I don't mind changing if most of the gamers are using them now (and looking at PCPartPicker it seems the case).

Regarding the budget as long as the config is homogeneous (it won't be handicapped by a cheaper component select just to keep cost within the budget) I don't mind being £100-£200 over.

Finally I don't mind waiting a few weeks before buying the components since prices went up over the last few weeks :-(
 
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Foobrother said:
This Phanteks case is indeed more in my taste: not wide, not deep and tall. Basically like a normal ATX case but not as deep. This model is quite tall for me (it's more than twice taller then my current case). But I've check their other models and found that one which small (47cm instead of 65cm): https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product...-evolv-shift-mini-itx-tower-case-ph-es217e_bk
If you know other cases similar to this one, I'm interested. But this one is the best so far.
Click to expand...
Was realy looking for this one, overlooked the "X" with the other one. What about his case?
https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product/fQVG3C/silverstone-lucid-ld03-mini-itx-tower-case-sst-ld03b

Still looking at Intel would this maybe be nice for a build,

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: Intel Core i9-9900 3.1 GHz 8-Core Processor (£408.73 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Liquid Freezer II 120 56.3 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (£54.99 @ AWD-IT)
Motherboard: ASRock Z390M-ITX/ac Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard (£155.47 @ Scan.co.uk)
Memory: Patriot Viper Steel 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (£93.40 @ Alza)
Storage: Crucial MX500 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£107.58 @ Aria PC)
Storage: Kingston A2000 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£152.98 @ Laptops Direct)
Video Card: Zotac GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER 8 GB MINI Video Card (£509.99 @ Box Limited)
Case: Phanteks ENTHOO EVOLV SHIFT Mini ITX Tower Case (£89.99 @ Currys PC World)
Power Supply: Corsair SF 600 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply (£134.24 @ Amazon UK)
Total: £1707.37
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-04-21 19:33 BST+0100

Just used the non "K" cpu since already capable of a turbo of 5ghz and in such a small case is that tdp of 65watts a good thing. Overclocking a "K" model might get you 5.1 ghz on a good chip on a good motherboard with really good cooling.

Can of course look at the Ryzen 3700X as well,a good cpu. To compare,

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 3.6 GHz 8-Core Processor (£263.19 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Liquid Freezer II 120 56.3 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (£54.99 @ AWD-IT)
Motherboard: Gigabyte B450 I AORUS PRO WIFI Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard (£110.99 @ Box Limited)
Memory: Crucial Ballistix 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 Memory (£92.99 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Crucial MX500 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£107.58 @ Aria PC)
Storage: Kingston A2000 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£152.98 @ Laptops Direct)
Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce RTX 2080 SUPER 8 GB WINDFORCE OC Video Card (£697.97 @ CCL Computers)
Case: Phanteks ENTHOO EVOLV SHIFT Mini ITX Tower Case (£89.99 @ Currys PC World)
Power Supply: Corsair SF 600 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply (£134.24 @ Amazon UK)
Total: £1704.92
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-04-21 20:12 BST+0100
has a better gpu in.
 
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Solution
Thanks for your help so far! Especially @Vic 40 👍

With the above advises I compiled this list:
PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 3.6 GHz 8-Core Processor (£262.97 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken M22 Liquid CPU Cooler (£74.98 @ Amazon UK)
Motherboard: Gigabyte X570 I AORUS PRO WIFI Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard (£211.97 @ Laptops Direct)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V Series 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (£154.22 @ Newegg UK)
Storage: ADATA XPG SX8200 Pro 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£138.97 @ CCL Computers)
Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce RTX 2080 SUPER 8 GB WINDFORCE OC Video Card (£697.97 @ CCL Computers)
Case: Phanteks ENTHOO EVOLV SHIFT Mini ITX Tower Case (£89.99 @ Currys PC World)
Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS SGX 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply (£124.99 @ CCL Computers)
Total: £1756.06
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-04-23 22:37 BST+0100

I have picked the CPU Cooler NZXT Kraken M22 Liquid CPU Cooler as it seems quite popular and I like its design but I don't know much on these (1st time I buy one). Is it a good choice or too much for this CPU/system?

For the PSU I picked a SeaSonic over a Corsair since my existing one is a SeaSonic, very silent and never had any issue with it. It's also cheaper than the equivalent from Corsair.

But in the comments of the following build, using the Phanteks case, I found this which worries me:
The PCIe riser cable does not reliably support PCIe 4! So your card may or may not work at any given time with the default BIOS settings. I've bought a very old video card to be able to boot into the bios to set the PCIe speed of the graphics card back to Gen 3. Chipset/NVMe are still running PCIe 4 though.
Click to expand...
https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/b/8ZnH99

This is getting a bit too technical for me. But basically if I understand well, this case PCie riser cable will prevent your graphic card to work if your motherboards BIOS is setup to run on the PCIe 4 profile/config. Which is a bit annoying if you have recent motherboard & graphic card?!
Also it seems that changing the cable is pretty expensive :-(
Any advise on that one?
 
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Hi all,

I'm re-opening this thread as, for various reasons, I've not yet built this PC!
And since our last conversation (back in April 2020) the GPU market has changed a lot with super limited availability :-(
Correct me if I'm wrong but:
  • Since the RTX 3000 have been released it's hard to find new RTX 2000 cards
  • The new RTX 3000 are even harder to find!
  • And only the RTX 3070 would be compatible since the PSU from the NZXT H1 is 650W
I also looked at the AMD RX 6000. Same problem and only the 6800 would be compatible in terms of PSU requirements.
I would love to get a much more performant RTX 3000 or RX 6000, but it looks complicated.

Here is the config I would like to build (within an NZXT H1):
CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 3.6 GHz 8-Core Processor (£284.99 @ Amazon UK)
Motherboard: Gigabyte X570 I AORUS PRO WIFI Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard (£194.93 @ Technextday)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16 Memory (£127.49 @ Currys PC World)
Storage: Samsung 860 Evo 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£99.99 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: ADATA XPG SX8200 Pro 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£112.62 @ More Computers)
Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce RTX 3070 8 GB EAGLE Video Card (£612.95 @ Overclockers.co.uk)
Total: £1432.97
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

I have 2 additional questions:
  • Since the PCIE Riser in the NZXT H1 is for Gen 3.0, and the motherboard & GPU are Gen 4.0, could someone confirm if this specific motherboard will be able to automatically switch to Gen 3.0? I read from the NZXT FAQ page that most motherboard could do it automatically. Otherwise I will need to get a PCIE 3.0 GPU to be able to change the BIOS settings. Or buy a Gen 4.0 riser. Both solutions aren't cheap.
  • Since it might take some time to get a GPU (everything is out of stock these days) and I'm not going to pay twice the recommended price, I guess I'm stuck since you can't use an AMD PC without a graphics card ?! :-(
What would you guys do ?
Thanks in advance!
 
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Pcie 2/3/4 are all forwards and backwards compatible.
And, there is minimal difference in performance today between pcie2 and 3.
I think you have no worries there.

You could buy a temporary minimal graphics card to let you do normal desktop work and view hd movies. Fast action gaming will have to wait for your graphics card upgrade.

As an alternative, consider a i5-10600K which comes with HD630 graphics.
I have used that to run a 4k monitor refreshing at 60hz.
Gaming depends most on the graphics card, and not so much on the cpu.

The i5-10600K is a good budget gamer, likely to be a bit stronger and cheaper than the 3700x.
Here is a review:
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-core-i5-10600k-cpu-review/5

On storage, I would opt for a 2tb m.2 pcie ssd for everything.
It should cost no more. Intel 660P for example:
https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product...2tb-m2-2280-solid-state-drive-ssdpeknw020t8x1
2tb m.2 pcie samsung 970 evo plus is about the top performer:
https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product...b-m2-2280-nvme-solid-state-drive-mz-v7s2t0bam
 
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Thanks for this information!

Switching to an Intel CPU might indeed be a wiser solution 🤔
Any advise in terms of compatible motherboard? I'll need to do some research as I didn't think there would actually be a cheaper Intel CPU more performance than the AMD I picked 😋
I think AMD prices have gone crazy lately!

Regarding the PCIE riser version I was referring to this statement from NZXT (see text in blue):
Is my PCIe Gen 4.0 motherboard and GPU still compatible with the H1?
These components would still be compatible with a minor tweak to your BIOS settings. For most motherboards, this is done automatically. If you don't get a display from your GPU then you would need to change your PCIe slot speed within the BIOS to PCIe Gen 3.0 manually. This can be done for most Intel builds, as most Intel CPUs have integrated graphics that will allow you to access your BIOS without a GPU. For AMD builds, you would need to use a PCIe Gen 3.0 GPU in order to access the BIOS to make this adjustment if your AMD CPU lacks integrated graphics.
Click to expand...
https://support.nzxt.com/hc/en-us/articles/360053782914-NZXT-H1-MINI-ITX-FAQ
From what you say, I understand there shouldn't be any issue with the motherboard. Anyway, if I switch to Intel there won't be any BIOS display issue 😏

Regarding the SSDs I didn't really that you can now get 2TBs for the price of 1TB!
But the Samsung 970 evo+ might still be a bit expensive. Also it can be handy to have 2 different drives in case of corruption. You don't lose everything. Will see.

But in terms of GPU you recon it's worth waiting for an RTX 3000 or RX 6000? It would be a bit stupid to now buy an RTX 2000?
 
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I really doubt that you would have any issue with pcie 3/4 on a amd motherboard.
I do not recall anyone posting such an issue.

On Intel, a processor with a f suffix can usually cost a bit less. But, I would always go with the K suffix and the availability of integrated graphics. If you should ever suspect a graphics issue, or need to do a bios update, having the integrated available is immensely helpful.

MSRP for the 3000 series is wonderful. But through shortages and price gouging, MSRP or even close to it is not possible today.
RX6000 and RTX2000 series are also impacted. Seems to be the mining craze that is driving the shortages.
When that will end, I don't know.
Worth can only be determined by YOU.
 
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