Question Mixed fan positioning in Corsair iCUE 5000x case

[ReveurGAM]

Hi! I've got 5 different fans from 3 manufacturers for my 5000x.

My profile shows my PC setup. For cooling this is what I have with current position:

(1) Noctua 120x25 (rear exhaust)
(3) Corsair stock SP120 RGB elite case fans (2 on top, one in front)
(3) Corsair ML120s (right side)
(2) Noctua NH-14 industrialPPC 3,000 RPM fans (in front with the Corsair between)
(1) Phanteks T30 (TBD)

Given that liquid bearings prefer to be vertical, while mag-levs can be either, I'm wondering if I should put the 3 Corsair iCUEs on the right, the iPPCs and Phanteks on the front, and the 3 ML120s on top? That would give me a definitely positive pressure system, though, so suggestions are welcome! In other words, what would be the ideal arrangement of all 10 fans in my case? I do mild video editing, word processing, browsing, watching videos, research, and casual gaming for the most part.

My CPU cooler is the Noctua NH-U12A, but I have a ThermalRight Peerless Assassin 120 on order, so I'm considering swapping them or at least doing a comparison.

 

[ReveurGAM]

Does anyone have any suggestions?

 

[Phaaze88]

Does anyone have any suggestions?

No responses might be because of the mish-mash of fans, and the number of them. I've re-read a few times thinking, how the heck to give an answer to this.
-A fan's performance curve isn't linear; some do better/worse than others at a given rpm, but you've got 5 different fans in there, instead of them all being the same.
-Your personal fan curves add more variables.
-Air resistance is not the same at the areas fans can be installed.
-10 fans...
You've got to get at it yourself and find out.
I don't have a clue - my OCD would have me testing stuff like mad...

That would give me a definitely positive pressure system...

How do you know that for certain without executing multiple tests and comparing them?
-What areas does dust build up at the most? Or where is it barely present? That requires time to discover where the setup stands. Don't make the same mistakes Linus and crew did in that one video: where they failed to filter all fan intakes, and remove filter for fan exhausts.
-Thermals while video editing, playing games, etc.
-Case design: NZXT's H500 series are negative pressure; trying to work against that has been shown by a couple reviewers(I've seen from Gamers' Nexus and Greg Salazar) to not help cooling. Thermaltake's View 71 has no pressure - or rather, can't support any, as it has too many open seams/gaps; air just leaks out or comes in from everywhere regardless of fan setup. What is the 5000X's stance? It might not be what it appears.

 

[ReveurGAM]

No responses might be because of the mish-mash of fans, and the number of them. I've re-read a few times thinking, how the heck to give an answer to this.
-A fan's performance curve isn't linear; some do better/worse than others at a given rpm, but you've got 5 different fans in there, instead of them all being the same.
-Your personal fan curves add more variables.
-Air resistance is not the same at the areas fans can be installed.
-10 fans...
You've got to get at it yourself and find out.
I don't have a clue - my OCD would have me testing stuff like mad...

Great response! I would go mad trying to figure it out, which is why I asked for advice from those who know more. This case was not made for good airflow. The top and front are blocked by glass panels with a gap of 1"/2.5 cm on either side, and the righthand fans are blocked by both a somewhat fine mesh and a coarse mesh, so all intake points are trying to keep out dust (to a lesser degree on the right). So, yeah, the resistance is the worst there, and not so great for the PSU, which has a useless fine mesh filter that's far enough from the inlets that it does next to nothing for filtration.

I don't know how to correctly define curves - not sure which temperatures warrant a change in the slope.

For placement based on bearings, I think the ML120s need to go on top and the 2 SP120s and Noctua from the cooler (I've put it on top) should go on the right, leaving the other SP120 and the 2 iPPCs in front, and I should either remove the 2 glass panels or replace them with 5000D airflow mesh panels (per Corsair). The problem then is that, with the system already having fairly strong positive pressure, the T30 is going to add more pressure because the A12x25 and 3 ML120s cannot compete with the other 6 fans, but I don't see another option to make it more balanced because hydraulic bearings don't do as well mounted horizontally, while the MLs are fine either way.

How do you know that for certain without executing multiple tests and comparing them?
-What areas does dust build up at the most? Or where is it barely present? That requires time to discover where the setup stands. Don't make the same mistakes Linus and crew did in that one video: where they failed to filter all fan intakes, and remove filter for fan exhausts.
-Thermals while video editing, playing games, etc.
-Case design: NZXT's H500 series are negative pressure; trying to work against that has been shown by a couple reviewers(I've seen from Gamers' Nexus and Greg Salazar) to not help cooling. Thermaltake's View 71 has no pressure - or rather, can't support any, as it has too many open seams/gaps; air just leaks out or comes in from everywhere regardless of fan setup. What is the 5000X's stance? It might not be what it appears.

I know it's positive because of the max airflow and static pressure of the 6 intake fans are greater than the same for the 4 exhaust fans. I suppose I could turn the top one of the front fans around to make it more even...I also did a smoke test before answering you.

Dust builds up primarily on the right face of the CPU cooler and on the mesh and iPPCs on the front. I'm not sure if the dust on the cooler is from having the case open, or if it's accumulated over time. No dust anywhere else, so far, although I can't see the PSU area RN.

I don't know what the 5000x's stance is. Airflow is definitely designed to be positive, given the 6 & 4 locations and where dust is.

Separately, some videos have demonstrated that the intake fan in the top position of the front in a case will be rendered virtually useless by the front position of the top's fan, which will suck out a lot of the cool air that it just brought in.

On a separate note:
I've just finished testing the Noctua NH-U12A (no GC installed) to see whether the two default fans, one stock (L or R), one Phanteks T30 (L or R), or one of each provides the best cooling. It took me a day to complete the testing, partially because of some software and hardware problems, and human error. With a margin of error that isn't as good as the pros (probably by far), when looking at the CPU, CPU package, mobo, VRM Thermistor, the best configurations are the Noctua fan on the left, the T30 on the right, and the case closed. The second best option is the same configuration but with the left glass panel off, which would really be a bad idea given dust and cat fur, not to mention the cat himself. Interestingly, the WORST configuration is JUST the T30 on the left side, which surprised me, but I guess the T30's static pressure is worse for pulling because on the right side it did very well.

While running Armoury Crate, iCUE, Brave with 10 tabs loaded (out of 17), Battle.net and CoD: MW2's Cinematics* menu open, the results for best configuration were the same - but flipped. The open case with mixed fans did best and then the closed case with mixed fans. The worst case was again just the T30 on the left, compared to mixed results for the T30 on the right. Unfortunately, the T30 on the left was the scenario in which all the stats were messed up because Armoury Crate readjusted my fans, so it probably is false.

With only Armoury Crate and iCUE* running, the story was a bit different. The best was a Noctua on the left, the T30 on the right and the panel off the left. The 2nd best was between the original configuration and the Noctua on the left and the T30 on the right with the panel on. The worst was still just the T30 on the left.

*And, of course, all programs that load at startup.

I also learned that Armoury Crate is better at moderating the speeds of the fans using the Fan Xpert 4's auto-tuning, but it does so at the expense of higher temperatures. My Noctua iPPCs dropped from 900-1150 RPMs to into the 300s! What I mean by better is that the range of RPMs is much tighter.

 

[Phaaze88]

Dust builds up primarily on the right face of the CPU cooler and on the mesh and iPPCs on the front. I'm not sure if the dust on the cooler is from having the case open, or if it's accumulated over time. No dust anywhere else, so far, although I can't see the PSU area RN.

Over time.
It gets inside regardless. I don't get hung up over positive/neutral/negative anymore because of it. Just make sure to clean up more than once a year.

I don't know what the 5000x's stance is. Airflow is definitely designed to be positive, given the 6 & 4 locations and where dust is.

Those spaces are all OPTIONAL. Just because it has 5, 10, 15, etc, available slots for fans, does not mean they all should be filled for best/optimal cooling.
If anything, the side vent is not needed for adequate cooling in this case; it's better suited for custom liquid distro plates and reservoirs, IMO.

Separately, some videos have demonstrated that the intake fan in the top position of the front in a case will be rendered virtually useless by the front position of the top's fan, which will suck out a lot of the cool air that it just brought in.

What do you think that action does for the cpu cooler? And the gpu cooler?

On a separate note:
...

The T30 is better suited as a pull fan, not a push one, due to the larger than normal central hub.
If it's used as a rear exhaust, that's push; the fan grille is right behind it.

Can't comment on software for fan control, as I just use bios.

 

[ReveurGAM]

Over time.
It gets inside regardless. I don't get hung up over positive/neutral/negative anymore because of it. Just make sure to clean up more than once a year.

I'm not particularly hung up on it either. With the fans I have, it'd be possible perhaps to get it to neutral, but I don't really care. I haven't seen a video that's convinced me that positive isn't better than neutral. Even with the smoke test, I feel that positive is better (except for dust accumulation being more rapid than neutral) because it's pushing more air out in places that might otherwise become stagnant.

Those spaces are all OPTIONAL. Just because it has 5, 10, 15, etc, available slots for fans, does not mean they all should be filled for best/optimal cooling.
If anything, the side vent is not needed for adequate cooling in this case; it's better suited for custom liquid distro plates and reservoirs, IMO.

Yes, I know. The side vent is designed for intake, so the air would pass over the hot radiator and bring that heat back into the case. I could remove the mesh filter, which would improve airflow, but the same problem exists. If I use it for exhaust, If I put a rad there for exhaust, the shroud that area is covered by has to be removed, so then at least some of the air pulled in at the front would immediately go to the rad, and then I'd have to use the top to drag air in. Not exactly optimal, don't you think?

What do you think that action does for the cpu cooler? And the gpu cooler?

Less fresh air=more heat

The T30 is better suited as a pull fan, not a push one, due to the larger than normal central hub.
If it's used as a rear exhaust, that's push; the fan grille is right behind it.

My testing suggests the opposite for the T30, but I still have to convert my temps to delta to make sure since the testing was conducted over two days with different ambients.

What is the difference between the CPU and the CPU package?

Can't comment on software for fan control, as I just use bios.

No worries, it was just an observation. Again, I have to finish crunching my numbers. Yum yum...?

 

[Phaaze88]

I'm not particularly hung up on it either. With the fans I have, it'd be possible perhaps to get it to neutral, but I don't really care. I haven't seen a video that's convinced me that positive isn't better than neutral. Even with the smoke test, I feel that positive is better (except for dust accumulation being more rapid than neutral) because it's pushing more air out in places that might otherwise become stagnant.

That wasn't specifically aimed at you. Every now and then, there's a thread where it's taken too seriously.
To me, none of them matter because dust will get in regardless, so I changed my focus to make the 'air traffic' as straightforward as possible. I've gone chimney with the O11 Evo, removed the bottom filter, and stacked it on 2x4 blocks.

Yes, I know. The side vent is designed for intake, so the air would pass over the hot radiator and bring that heat back into the case. I could remove the mesh filter, which would improve airflow, but the same problem exists. If I use it for exhaust, If I put a rad there for exhaust, the shroud that area is covered by has to be removed, so then at least some of the air pulled in at the front would immediately go to the rad, and then I'd have to use the top to drag air in. Not exactly optimal, don't you think?

Well, the side vent doesn't specifically have to be for intake - you said so yourself that you can remove the mesh filter, and exhausts don't need to be filtered.

If I were to put a rad - assuming for the cpu - at the side for exhaust, the front would obviously be an intake.
Position the top as exhaust and remove the filter.
Flip the rear fan to intake - scratch that - try both rear intake and no fan and see if it matters if a fan is there, and DIY a filter or purchase one of those aftermarket filters to go there.
It sounds like negative, but whether or not it is, it wouldn't concern me; I managed to make something else work.

What is the difference between the CPU and the CPU package?

Cpu should be an average.
Cpu package is the highest temperature reported. It doesn't specify which core, so it's a good practice to check them all.