Review MSI RTX 4090 Suprim Liquid X Review: Super Soaker

[Admin]

The MSI RTX 4090 Suprim Liquid X pairs a 240mm all-in-one liquid cooling configuration with Nvidia's new Ada Lovelace GPU. Performance still ranks at the top of the charts, but the card fails to put any meaningful distance between itself and the Founders Edition.

MSI RTX 4090 Suprim Liquid X Review: Super Soaker : Read more

 

[PiranhaTech]

I'm surprised this isn't the default configuration.

 

[Ltsmba]

$150 extra for essentially 0 performance gain over the FE 4090. So it takes up a little less space in the case, and looks a little more sleek. I'd probably pay $50 extra for that, but definitely not $150 (more actually for some people who bought it when MSI raised the price even higher temporarily).

I thought the point of a water cooled card was to push the limits of what the GPU could do, but it seems its more of a limitation of how much power you can put into the 4090, not how hot its getting.

Water cooling on these things kinda seems completely overkill, unless i'm missing something, which I might be.
Even if I am missing something, I feel bad for anyone who paid a premium for this card and is getting no boost over the FE 4090...

 

[Phaaze88]

It's technically still a 4-slotter, just split in half, with the 2 halves connected by 470mm long tubes. Depending on how you look at it, it's actually larger than some air cooled models...
Msi seems to have slipped up on the contact pressure, because both Kitguru and Paul's HW show the memory being rather warm...

Water cooling on these things kinda seems completely overkill, unless i'm missing something, which I might be.

The cards are hard voltage limited by Nvidia. Previously, they were power limited.
Without DIY voltage modding, there isn't much on the table. So AIB models don't offer much more than aesthetics compared to the FE.

 

[Ltsmba]

That's good to know that it's a voltage limit rather than a power limit.
I guess even so, it ends up being the same result, no benefit to buying a more expensive AIB model.
It's looking more and more clear why EVGA bailed

 

[A Stoner]

While performance wise it might not be a gain, if it reduces actual temperatures, then you will be bleeding less heat into your computer room. Not sure if that is the case here, but I am currently running the same watts on my old newer computer than my older old computer and the newer one causes far less heat buildup in the room. The reason is that the CPU and GPU run at much lower top temperatures than the older ones. I think my CPU tops out at 75 water cooled and the GPU at 92. The older one is 100 CPU water cooled or air cooled and 105 GPU.

 

[JarredWaltonGPU]

It's technically still a 4-slotter, just split in half, with the 2 halves connected by 470mm long tubes. Depending on how you look at it, it's actually larger than some air cooled models...
MSI seems to have slipped up on the contact pressure, because both Kitguru and Paul's HW show the memory being rather warm.

I thought I included this, but perhaps not. Across the gaming test suite while manually overclocked, I got a maximum GDDR6X temperature of 82C on the MSI card, I think 78C on the Founders Edition, and 72C on the Asus card. Considering how hot 3090, 3080 Ti, and 3080 cards could get on the memory (100-110C), I find 82C temperatures quite nice and am not particularly worried about them. GPU temps do favor the MSI card over the Founders Edition (57.8C MSI compared to 66.9C on the FE), so by that metric MSI "wins." It's just not a particularly important metric IMO, provided the card runs well under 80C GPU and 90C VRAM.

 

[Phaaze88]

I thought I included this, but perhaps not. Across the gaming test suite while manually overclocked, I got a maximum GDDR6X temperature of 82C on the MSI card, I think 78C on the Founders Edition, and 72C on the Asus card. Considering how hot 3090, 3080 Ti, and 3080 cards could get on the memory (100-110C), I find 82C temperatures quite nice and am not particularly worried about them. GPU temps do favor the MSI card over the Founders Edition (57.8C MSI compared to 66.9C on the FE), so by that metric MSI "wins." It's just not a particularly important metric IMO, provided the card runs well under 80C GPU and 90C VRAM.

I'm aware that it's well within spec and not something I'd be worried about either.
It's just, for a liquid cooled model, one would expect improvements across the board compared to air models, but the Suprim Liquid X fails to accomplish this.

I look at this thing and I'm like, "What's the selling points of this thing? What kind of excuses can I come up with to make this a welcome addition to my PC?"
"That's a clean looking gpu shroud." That's it.
I'd personally just get the FE and customize that.

 

[PlaneInTheSky]

AIO liquid cooling doesn't trump large air coolers

Why would it, air coolers today are liquid coolers. There is liquid in those heat pipes.

Air coolers offer liquid cooling in a perfectly optimized closed heatpipe loop that can't leak, there is nothing that can compete with that.

 

[pixelpusher220]

Why would it, air coolers today are liquid coolers. There is liquid in those heat pipes.

Air coolers offer liquid cooling in a perfectly optimized closed heatpipe loop that can't leak, there is nothing that can compete with that.

It's not active flow though is it? It's heat driven, and sure there's a lot of it, but that's still not the same as actively pushing a larger volume of liquid through the same surface area.

 

[JarredWaltonGPU]

Why would it, air coolers today are liquid coolers. There is liquid in those heat pipes.

Air coolers offer liquid cooling in a perfectly optimized closed heatpipe loop that can't leak, there is nothing that can compete with that.

The reason that's a con is because if liquid cooling isn't better, why should you pay extra for it? It's not a question, it's a statement: AIO liquid cooling generally isn't better than a large air cooler, but it does cost more and it involves a lot more moving parts (in the pump). Also, AIO loops can still lose liquid over time, which means that in 5-10 years these AIO cards may not even work properly. I still have an R9 Fury X kicking around and let me tell you, powering that thing up sounds like the pump is going to kick the bucket and that there's a lot of air in the loop now. Air coolers from the same generation don't have that problem. So yes, the fact that an AIO can't clearly beat air cooling is a many pronged problem that I condensed into a simple statement.

 

[Murissokah]

The reason that's a con is because if liquid cooling isn't better, why should you pay extra for it? It's not a question, it's a statement: AIO liquid cooling generally isn't better than a large air cooler, but it does cost more and it involves a lot more moving parts (in the pump). Also, AIO loops can still lose liquid over time, which means that in 5-10 years these AIO cards may not even work properly. I still have an R9 Fury X kicking around and let me tell you, powering that thing up sounds like the pump is going to kick the bucket and that there's a lot of air in the loop now. Air coolers from the same generation don't have that problem. So yes, the fact that an AIO can't clearly beat air cooling is a many pronged problem that I condensed into a simple statement.

It's a more complex solution to solve the same problem, so yes, if it doesn't do it better it's inferior. One could argue over what better means, though. To me, saving 2 slots is much more important than a few percent more performance. Besides, if I can avoid having to look at that humongous chunk of metal and be reminded how much I payed for that lazy design it's worth the 150 already.

 

[DavidLejdar]

"...large case, at which point we have to ask whether the MSI AIO even makes sense."

I picked a mid-tower which can mount i.e. 240mm AIO at the top, and 280mm or 360mm AIO at the front. And yeah, the shorter length wouldn't be much a selling point for me.

On the other hand though, in my case I have e.g. a Gen4 M.2 slot with heatsink at the bottom of the MB, which would be just below the intake fan/s of a four-slot GPU. And if that heatsink in operation, e.g. with a 990 PRO, would have an impact on the cooling of the GPU, then GPU AIO could make sense.

And one step further, a Gen5 M.2 SSD will apparently need some active cooling. And an air cooled (model of) 4090 dissipating heat into the tower, that may not be all great (and bottom mounted intake fans may not help much to cool that SSD above the GPU).

That is a bit speculative at this point of course. Albeit to my defense, a lot of the talk on the internet about these issues turn around stuff such as whether to mount the PSU with the intake-fan upwards (which I don't find to be the best idea). But just meant to expand on the question, with there possibly being some practical arguments for a 4090 AIO solution even with a bit larger mid-tower - if AIO is something an user finds to be acceptable.

 

[pixelpusher220]

It's a more complex solution to solve the same problem, so yes, if it doesn't do it better it's inferior. One could argue over what better means, though. To me, saving 2 slots is much more important than a few percent more performance. Besides, if I can avoid having to look at that humongous chunk of metal and be reminded how much I payed for that lazy design it's worth the 150 already.

Isn't the liquid radiator going to be quieter than air cooled fans?

 

[Amdlova]

Last time I got a WC lost it in six months. A decent air cooler will work even with out a fan. But stop the pump will get hot potatoes.

 

[Amdlova]

Isn't the liquid radiator going to be quieter than air cooled fans?

Not really, some radiator have more air resistance and need high-pressure fans to do the job. "Quieter" it's a premium feature. Brown noctua fans everywhere.

 

[Icepilot]

you will be bleeding less heat into your computer room

Entropy says no. Chips will be cooler, but you'll be producing more heat. It's like opening your refrigerator door to cool the house.

 

[aphex242]

You appear to be confused about the Amazon listings - none of those, as far as I can tell, are sold directly by MSI. The MSI "store page" is simply populated with the products manufactured by MSI. My point is they aren't the ones scalping, nor are they reaping any kind of direct benefit from it. If you look at any of those products at the link, the "sold by" section is who is selling the product. MSI nor Amazon are the sellers. Yes Amazon is facilitating it and profiting of it, but I don't believe MSI is in any way implicated here, despite what you suggested.

 

[JarredWaltonGPU]

You appear to be confused about the Amazon listings - none of those, as far as I can tell, are sold directly by MSI. The MSI "store page" is simply populated with the products manufactured by MSI. My point is they aren't the ones scalping, nor are they reaping any kind of direct benefit from it. If you look at any of those products at the link, the "sold by" section is who is selling the product. MSI nor Amazon are the sellers. Yes Amazon is facilitating it and profiting of it, but I don't believe MSI is in any way implicated here, despite what you suggested.

I've tweaked that paragraph. I didn't realize MSI Store was simply products made by MSI. To me it looked like an online reseller profile, sort of like what you see on eBay when you click on a seller's other items. Amazon does of course profit from this, 100%. Because I'm sure you have to pay a percentage of the sale price to Amazon as a third party seller.

 

[aphex242]

I've tweaked that paragraph. I didn't realize MSI Store was simply products made by MSI. To me it looked like an online reseller profile, sort of like what you see on eBay when you click on a seller's other items. Amazon does of course profit from this, 100%. Because I'm sure you have to pay a percentage of the sale price to Amazon as a third party seller.

For sure - Amazon is culpable in facilitating this. But when I read your article I was immediately enraged that MSI was behind this and thought that was crazy. Hence the comment. Glad you corrected it. Scalping sucks, agreed. Glad it's not a manufacturer doing it. Of course they could be, under a different name. But there's no evidence of that.

 

[JarredWaltonGPU]

For sure - Amazon is culpable in facilitating this. But when I read your article I was immediately enraged that MSI was behind this and thought that was crazy. Hence the comment. Glad you corrected it. Scalping sucks, agreed. Glad it's not a manufacturer doing it. Of course they could be, under a different name. But there's no evidence of that.

I know back in the 3080/3090 launch era, there was an MSI subsidiary caught selling MSI cards on eBay, so it wouldn't be totally out of character. SMDH
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/m...series-gpus-at-scalper-pricing-on-amazon-ebay

 

[aphex242]

I know back in the 3080/3090 launch era, there was an MSI subsidiary caught selling MSI cards on eBay, so it wouldn't be totally out of character. SMDH
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/m...series-gpus-at-scalper-pricing-on-amazon-ebay

Ooof I missed that. Yikes.

 

[MartianM]

For the 170W R7900X & 7950X, they have 2x 71mm^2 compute chiplets. Given a non-trivial amount of power is used by the IO chiplet, this puts the Ryzen 7000 series at about 1 W/mm^2 also, just like the Intel chips…