[SOLVED] MSI Z97 Gaming 3 overclocking bug?

[MaxTehLegend]

so recently I have delidded my CPU and applied liquid metal which dropped my temps dramatically and so decided to go for a higher overclock as I was held back before by temperature limits.

for around 2 years i've had my i7 4770K run absolutely flawlessly with no issues whatsoever @1.25VID (1.264v Vcore peak voltage under load) playing games with a 980Ti, and even my TITAN X running games absolutely fine. But recently after deciding I wanted to delid for the heck of it and ran into issues when trying to oc above 4.6GHz. after stress testing on Intel Burn test run 30 times, AIDA64 stress CPU & FPU, Prime95 v26.6 Small FFT's, and around 7 runs on Cinebench R15 I have found a completely stable overclock @4.6GHz, 1.336v (peak voltage), 1.900v VCCIN.

When I tried to OC above 4.7GHz no matter what voltage I threw at it, it couldn't sustain stability even @1.5v. I didn't touch my ring ratio when trying to oc higher, but i was able to hit 4.5GHz on the ring @1.35v. It's just way too strange for my CPU to be the issue to suddenly hit a wall like this so I cant see my CPU being the issue. I have stress tested my RAM and my RAM is completely fine. My BIOS on the Z97 Gaming 3 is updated to the latest being v2.10. My temps are well in check and my CPU cooler is the NZXT Kraken X62 280mm AIO. Can someone solve this issue for me? its driving me nuts.

 

[ShadyHamster]

I would try lowering your memory speeds back to 1600mhz then try pushing the CPU further.
With higher memory clocks you may need to start increasing the SA, Analog and Digital IO voltages.

 

[MaxTehLegend]

I would try lowering your memory speeds back to 1600mhz then try pushing the CPU further.
With higher memory clocks you may need to start increasing the SA, Analog and Digital IO voltages.

I've increased my SA voltage, Analog and Digital IO voltage to 1.3v on each (with CPU IOA/IOD Voltage Boost set to +50mV.) and increased my RAM voltage to 1.770v in the bios. I've left XMP Profile 1 (2400MHz 11-13-14-32) on as I would rather keep my RAM speeds @2400MHz @4.6GHz then having to slow down my ram for an extra 100MHz on the core to me I couldn't see that as worth it.

There's a few options in my BIOS that I'm not sure on what I should set them to like my DigitALL Power settings such as CPU Phase Control. I have just left it Disabled. For CPU Vdroop Offset Control from what i've researched online its suppose to drop my voltage under load? I haven't seen it do absolutely anything even at gentle +12.5% so i've just left it to enthusiastic +100.

for CPU Over voltage protection and CPU under voltage protection i've left them to 600mV.
for CPU Over Current Protection I've left it at 140%.
for Phase Over Current Protection I've left it Disabled.
CPU Switching Frequency: Auto.
CPU VRM Over Temperature Protection: Disabled.
CPU VRM Over Temperature Shutdown: Disabled.
Digital Compensation: x1.2.
Imon Overwrite: Auto.
Transient Boost: Enabled.

And in CPU Specifications I've set my long duration power limit and short duration power limit to 4096, CPU Current limit to 1023, and VR Iout Slope to 1023. I've disabled Internal VR OVP OCP Protection and left enabled internal VR Efficiency Management and changed internal VR switching frequency to +6%. I've set my VCCIN voltage to 2.240V and enabled SVID Communication. Are these settings good and should I change some of them?

 

[ShadyHamster]

Well it seems like you know what you are doing, them settings look fine, most of them i don't really touch when overclocking unless i really need to.
1.3v on them sub voltages is a little to high, 1.25v is considered safe for testing and 1.15v is considered safe for 24/7 use.
Overclocking both the CPU and Memory at the same time is usually not a good idea, start with the CPU and find it's limits then do the Memory, that's how it's usually done.
You might be hitting a wall with that 4.7Ghz OC, but again, it could be the Memory OC holding it back.

Here's a graph of voltages:
https://imgur.com/a/vS6WMHj
I can't remember where i found the image, it's been so long, it could of been a guide from der8auer but i could be wrong.

 

[MaxTehLegend]

Well it seems like you know what you are doing, them settings look fine, most of them i don't really touch when overclocking unless i really need to.
1.3v on them sub voltages is a little to high, 1.25v is considered safe for testing and 1.15v is considered safe for 24/7 use.
Overclocking both the CPU and Memory at the same time is usually not a good idea, start with the CPU and find it's limits then do the Memory, that's how it's usually done.
You might be hitting a wall with that 4.7Ghz OC, but again, it could be the Memory OC holding it back.

Here's a graph of voltages:
https://imgur.com/a/vS6WMHj
I can't remember where i found the image, it's been so long, it could of been a guide from der8auer but i could be wrong.

Thanks for this, it's nice to have a baseline for maximum recommended voltages

 

[MaxTehLegend]

okay. so I think I'm getting close. I was able to get my 4770K @4.7GHz 1.424v vcore, 2.050v VCCIN to do 33 runs on Intel Burn Test without crashing and with it crashing on the 34'th run. This is where it starts to get weird. At this point, no matter what voltage I set it to, vcore or VCCIN it will always bluescreen and will bluescreen QUICKER on IBT and Cinebench R15 no matter what vcore i set it to.

My temperatures stay below 95c which isn't bad considering intel burn test does make your CPU run hot.

Above 1.45v vcore i have to use other stress testing programs as it will thermal throttle. I've used Cinebench R15 which is good for testing stability quickly and around the 5th-6th run with my CPU @4.7GHz 1.424v vcore 2.050v VCCIN it will bluescreen. Not sure if this helps but my bluescreen message is always "CLOCK_WATCHDOG_TIMEOUT".

I'm still going to be messing around with my BIOS settings some more to see if i can achieve a stable OC @4.7GHz. These are the settings I've changed in my BIOS.

 

[MaxTehLegend]

okay so I think I figured it out. I've managed to get my 4770K stable @4.7GHz 1.464v vcore, 2.300v VCCIN. I'm able to do 15 Cinebench R15 runs (5 set to realtime) without crashing. During these runs my hottest core was 83c. The VCCIN definitely helped as when I had it set to 2.250v VCCIN it would crash on the 6th run, Also enabling Internal VR Efficiency Management, leaving Imon Overwrite on Auto, Enabling Transient Boost, lowering IO Digital Voltage to 1.208V, and I'm not too sure if increasing my ring voltage to 1.200v helped but I did anyway while keeping my ring ratio to Auto (x39) helped me achieve a stable OC @4.7GHz. Will report back if i experience any crashes during anything, Prime95 v26.6 blend, and small FFT's, and a couple of games.

 

[ShadyHamster]

Sounds like an awful amount of trouble for an extra 100mhz, doesn't seem worth it to me with all the extra volts and heat.

 

[MaxTehLegend]

Sounds like an awful amount of trouble for an extra 100mhz, doesn't seem worth it to me with all the extra volts and heat.

after some research I've come to think that it is actually my motherboard. I found this post 2 years ago with the guy stating that he was able to achieve 4.6GHz with his old motherboard, the Z87 Hero (which has an 8+2 power phases and overall a better motherboard than mine in every way ontop of overclocking) to a Z97 Hero which he was able to achieve 4.8GHz at the same voltage he was previously at with his old motherboard @4.6GHz: http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/answers/id-2206750/overclocking-z97-motherboard-intel-4790k.html
and someone on a different thread stating that "Budget boards usually have fewer power phases and therefore harder to get the last 0.1-0.2GHz out of them.":http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/answers/id-1751722/deciding-z87-motherboard-overclock-4670k.html

I guess you don't know until you try ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I'm probably at some point soon get a new motherboard and see if it helps yielding higher overclocks than my current board. In the end I still won't lose anything from trying when getting a new motherboard as my current board doesn't support lane splitting which means with my NVMe SSD installed it not only limits my GPU to run at gen3 x8 but my NVMe SSD is also limited to gen2 x2. So getting a higher end motherboard that supports lane splitting, with better overclockability isn't such a bad upgrade afterall since it will help with my other components not being limited in any way as I can run both my NVMe SSD @gen3 x4 and my GPU @gen3 x16. Will update once I get a new motherboard.