Question Need new router and maybe a modem..suggestions?

[ron648]

Hey all. Looking to buy a new router as ours is failing. It's an ASUS AC1750 used for my family in our home. It's been fine and only replacing because we keep losing internet. Modem is fine so I know it's from the router.

A few things I'd like to accomplish with a new router are .......

1. Use a hub (or 2 hubs) with it. I have a lot of things hardwired and 4 ports on a router are not enough.

2. Maybe add a second router for the detached garage. It's only 50' away but signal has to travel thru two brick walls. Signal in garage is there most of the time but goes out occasionally. I know nothing of hooking up two routers.

3. Instead of second router, could I use an ethernet cable ran from router(or hub) in the house, to another hub in the garage? I have an ethernet cable ran already between house and garage. This wouldn't help with wi-fi but I could hardwire the tv and anything else I decide to add at a future date.

Don't want to spend a lot. $100-$150 at most on a router.

As for modem, it works fine. Our ISP told us our speed was upgraded and that we won't benefit from the speed unless we get a new docsis 3.1 modem. I technically don't need it but am thinking of upgrading. We have our own modem and router, we do not rent them from the ISP. ISP said we can rent from them, or buy our own.

Thoughts?

Thanks,
Ron

 

[kanewolf]

Hey all. Looking to buy a new router as ours is failing. It's an ASUS AC1750 used for my family in our home. It's been fine and only replacing because we keep losing internet. Modem is fine so I know it's from the router.

A few things I'd like to accomplish with a new router are .......

1. Use a hub (or 2 hubs) with it. I have a lot of things hardwired and 4 ports on a router are not enough.

2. Maybe add a second router for the detached garage. It's only 50' away but signal has to travel thru two brick walls. Signal in garage is there most of the time but goes out occasionally. I know nothing of hooking up two routers.

3. Instead of second router, could I use an ethernet cable ran from router(or hub) in the house, to another hub in the garage? I have an ethernet cable ran already between house and garage. This wouldn't help with wi-fi but I could hardwire the tv and anything else I decide to add at a future date.

Don't want to spend a lot. $100-$150 at most on a router.

As for modem, it works fine. Our ISP told us our speed was upgraded and that we won't benefit from the speed unless we get a new docsis 3.1 modem. I technically don't need it but am thinking of upgrading. We have our own modem and router, we do not rent them from the ISP. ISP said we can rent from them, or buy our own.

Thoughts?

Thanks,
Ron

A single switch is the best answer for your wired connectivity. The question is if you want to spend the extra money for power over ethernet. POE is very useful for cameras, and WIFI access points. There are some ethernet switches that can be powered by POE. I just replaced my 24 port "core" switch with a 16 port POE switch. If you get a 16 or 24 port switch for your wired connectivity, then you run a single uplink to your router and ALL your wired come back to the switch.

 

[Ralston18]

My thoughts:

1) Use unmanaged switches (vs hubs). Likely you will need only one switch if you use one of the router's LAN ports to connect router and garage switch. 4 port garage switch is likely enough. If not then an 8 port.

2) Two routers are not necessary and can often cause problems if not correctly configured. A switch (especially unmanaged) is very inexpensive.

3) If there is already an Ethernet cable in place between house and garage verify that the cable is indeed Cat 5e or Cat 6a. All copper, UTP, 22-24 AWG, round. Test beforehand.

4) If you purchase your own modem, router, and switches be sure that the modem and router are listed on the ISP's supported product list. And, if possible, modem and router (and switch) should all be from the same man ufacturer. Not technically necessary, for the most part, but will mostly negate any finger pointing between ISP, manufacturers, etc. if there is some problem.

If using an ISP provided modem then all you need is your own router and switch. Gives the ISP one less thing (the modem) to blame on you. Having a ISP provided modem/router is helpful for troubleshooting purposes and may provide at least one or two working wired network ports if there are problems elsewhere within the network.

5) Start with a simple sketch showing the planned network: All devices, locations, etc.. Plan for growth as necessary. Wired and wireless.

 

[ron648]

Thank you for the very detailed info! Have some more questions...

If I wanted to get a better wi-fi signal in garage, how would I go about it? I'm not sure I really need/want it yet, but would like to know my options.

The cable is CAT5e, UTP, copper, 24awg and round. Haven't tested it yet but I will. I ran it myself a few days ago thru a conduit I installed in ground 10 years ago when I ran electrical out to garage.

My ISP told me I could use any modem that is DOCSIS 3.1.

I don't think I really need POE at this point.

Any brands I should look at or stay away from?

 

[kanewolf]

Thank you for the very detailed info! Have some more questions...

If I wanted to get a better wi-fi signal in garage, how would I go about it? I'm not sure I really need/want it yet, but would like to know my options.

The cable is CAT5e, UTP, copper, 24awg and round. Haven't tested it yet but I will. I ran it myself a few days ago thru a conduit I installed in ground 10 years ago when I ran electrical out to garage.

My ISP told me I could use any modem that is DOCSIS 3.1.

I don't think I really need POE at this point.

Any brands I should look at or stay away from?

The best way is an outdoor rated WIFI access point connected via an ethernet cable to your main router. Second best would be a WIFI router configured as an access point connected via an ethernet cable to your main router.

Your ISP should have a webpage with a list of approved modems. You should pick from that list for the speed of service you have (or want).

POE is an expense that can be hard to justify. But, for example, your garage WIFI could be powered by POE and no other wires required.

 

[ron648]

The best way is an outdoor rated WIFI access point connected via an ethernet cable to your main router. Second best would be a WIFI router configured as an access point connected via an ethernet cable to your main router.

Your ISP should have a webpage with a list of approved modems. You should pick from that list for the speed of service you have (or want).

POE is an expense that can be hard to justify. But, for example, your garage WIFI could be powered by POE and no other wires required.

More questions...

Does it need to be 'outdoor'? Garage is climate controlled for most part, if that has anything to do with outdoor rating.

I will see about ISP approved modems. I contacted ISP through live chat and was told any DOCSIS 3.1 modem.

As far as connecting stuff...

If I use a wi-fi access point in garage, will I need to run another CAT5 cable for both the access point and a 4 port switch? Could I hook the switch to the main router and then hook access point to switch in garage? Hope that makes sense.....

 

[kanewolf]

More questions...

Does it need to be 'outdoor'? Garage is climate controlled for most part, if that has anything to do with outdoor rating.

I will see about ISP approved modems. I contacted ISP through live chat and was told any DOCSIS 3.1 modem.

As far as connecting stuff...

If I use a wi-fi access point in garage, will I need to run another CAT5 cable for both the access point and a 4 port switch? Could I hook the switch to the main router and then hook access point to switch in garage? Hope that makes sense.....

Most garages are not climate controlled, they get high humidity and fairly large temperature changes. That is why I recommended outdoor rated. I have an outdoor rated unit in my garage.
No you don't need to run another cable. You can get a POE switch for the garage and allow it to power the AP and provide additional ports. Something like this -- https://www.netgear.com/business/wired/switches/unmanaged/gs305p/

 

[ron648]

Thank you very much for all the help. It is truly appreciated!

 

[dingo07]

Invest in Ubiquity equipment - it's excellent and robust for those on a budget. The only caveat is you need to administer it yourself.
Modem you should get is an Arris SB8200
Router could be the new Unifi Express - it has a WiFi6 access point built in

You connect the SB8200 to the WAN port on the UE. That leaves you one port on the UE to feed a switch of your choice.

 

[kanewolf]

Invest in Ubiquity equipment - it's excellent and robust for those on a budget. The only caveat is you need to administer it yourself.
Modem you should get is an Arris SB8200
Router could be the new Unifi Express - it has a WiFi6 access point built in

You connect the SB8200 to the WAN port on the UE. That leaves you one port on the UE to feed a switch of your choice.

I have a full UniFI network at home. For MOST homes, I would not recommend it, too complicated for many things and missing features that most people want for their home network.

 

[dingo07]

I have a full UniFI network at home. For MOST homes, I would not recommend it, too complicated for many things and missing features that most people want for their home network.

I have to disagree completely with your statement. Who's to say it's too complicated... and what features do you know people want.

A network is simple - a single SSID that's 2.5 and a single that's 5. No reason to make it complicated like you say.

If it's configured properly the user has no idea the items exist, it just works.

BTW I do this for a living - AV Senior Svc Tech for more than 25 years.

 

[kanewolf]

I have to disagree completely with your statement. Who's to say it's too complicated... and what features do you know people want.

A network is simple - a single SSID that's 2.5 and a single that's 5. No reason to make it complicated like you say.

If it's configured properly the user has no idea the items exist, it just works.

BTW I do this for a living - AV Senior Svc Tech for more than 25 years.

The thing that is non-existent in UniFI is parental controls. That IS a feature that many households want.

BTW, the fact that "you do this for a living" is a BIAS, IMO. That is why you don't see UniFI as being too complicated. My experience as a moderator here is that most home users don't want OpenVPN endpoints or WPA2 PMF on or off. They want to plug in a WAN port and maybe a LAN port. Use a phone app to configure a SSID. They probably wouldn't even change the admin password if it wasn't a requirement. I wouldn't recommend any non-tech friend to get UniFI just like I wouldn't recommend MikroTik. I would recommend they get an Asus that is supported by Merlin firmware.

I also have a long duration background in computers and networking. I was a software engineer, and systems engineer for a defense contractor for 35+ years (now retired). At work we designed with Cisco 6513s or Juniper 8216 as core switches. I worked directly with Cisco and Juniper system designers (they LOVE defense contractors).

You and I have a different interpretation of what is important for a home user.

 

[ron648]

So thanks again you guys for your help. What started this thread originally were two different things. The router started failing about once a week. I then received an email from ISP saying we would benefit from a DOCSIS 3.1 Modem. The thing is, we only have 300mbps internet speed. Gaming and streaming has never been an issue for us. My only son has no issues gaming, and we have no issues streaming movies. My own googling attempts tell me that the only thing a DOCSIS 3.1 modem might do is have better security, lower latency, better power usage, and be future proof. Since we don't have a high internet speed, and we don't have any issues with streaming/gaming as is, should I even worry about getting a new modem?

At this point I definitely need a router and switch. Was looking at this router and switch.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0B3SQK74L/ref=ox_sc_saved_image_1smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&th=1

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00A121WN6/ref=ox_sc_saved_image_2?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&th=1

Not against getting a new modem and was actually looking at the ARRIS SB8200 as it is approved by my ISP. The ARRIS modem we have now has worked flawlessly since new around 2017.

 

[bill001g]

Wifi6e prices have come down a lot since I last looked, I guess they moved the big dollar model to wifi7.

That appears to be a good router. Wifi6e if you also have wifi6e end devices should be faster on 6ghz. It likely will have less coverage but should in theory at least be much faster because there is much more total bandwidth.

Most even mid priced routers seem to have all the features now days. I would not actually try to use VPN on that router only a very small number have a CPU that has the AES encryption instructions. Older models only got about 30mbps without AES-ni.

A unmanged switch is a switch. I like ones with metal cases they don't break when the cat pushed them off the table

Your analysis of modems is correct. The ISP may in the longer run force people to docsis 3.1 mostly so they do not have to support multiple protocols and have less models of modem they support. The ISP loads all the firmware updates.

 

[dingo07]

So thanks again you guys for your help. What started this thread originally were two different things. The router started failing about once a week. I then received an email from ISP saying we would benefit from a DOCSIS 3.1 Modem. The thing is, we only have 300mbps internet speed. Gaming and streaming has never been an issue for us. My only son has no issues gaming, and we have no issues streaming movies. My own googling attempts tell me that the only thing a DOCSIS 3.1 modem might do is have better security, lower latency, better power usage, and be future proof. Since we don't have a high internet speed, and we don't have any issues with streaming/gaming as is, should I even worry about getting a new modem?

At this point I definitely need a router and switch. Was looking at this router and switch.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0B3SQK74L/ref=ox_sc_saved_image_1smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&th=1

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00A121WN6/ref=ox_sc_saved_image_2?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&th=1

Not against getting a new modem and was actually looking at the ARRIS SB8200 as it is approved by my ISP. The ARRIS modem we have now has worked flawlessly since new around 2017.

If you can stretch the budget a little I would suggest getting an EERO PRO 6 router. Then you can add others to extend the wifi, even if you don't have an ethernet cable to link them. The 3 pack is worth it.

And I would get the SB8200. Service Providers are always changing plans and you want to be ready to take advantage of faster speeds. They may even offer a 500MB plan for same or not much more than you're paying now, if needed or not.

 

[dingo07]

The thing that is non-existent in UniFI is parental controls. That IS a feature that many households want.

BTW, the fact that "you do this for a living" is a BIAS, IMO. That is why you don't see UniFI as being too complicated. My experience as a moderator here is that most home users don't want OpenVPN endpoints or WPA2 PMF on or off. They want to plug in a WAN port and maybe a LAN port. Use a phone app to configure a SSID. They probably wouldn't even change the admin password if it wasn't a requirement. I wouldn't recommend any non-tech friend to get UniFI just like I wouldn't recommend MikroTik. I would recommend they get an Asus that is supported by Merlin firmware.

I also have a long duration background in computers and networking. I was a software engineer, and systems engineer for a defense contractor for 35+ years (now retired). At work we designed with Cisco 6513s or Juniper 8216 as core switches. I worked directly with Cisco and Juniper system designers (they LOVE defense contractors).

You and I have a different interpretation of what is important for a home user.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I'm in homes every single day - minimum of three a day, solving issues that come up ranging from wifi, "poor internet" (that's a funny one!), projector not turning on, noise in the backyard speakers, remote not working, etc. Our company uses Ruckus and EERO for WiFI because of the robustness and security features they provide at a given price point for our customer base (which is the high end of incomes). Netgate routers and SB8200 modems.

Which makes me UnBiased - because I actually touch multiple manufacturers equipment, and know what performs well and what doesn't, today.

If you keep it at the surface level there's literally nothing to do outside of creating the SSID once the controller is installed. All the advanced features you mention don't even need to be part of the conversation! Plus, there's excellent videos from professionals online you can follow to set up a Unifi network. Crosstalk Solutions is great.

No offense but I live it daily, you're the one interpreting case use. But to be fair, you probably see here on the forum those that don't even know what a modem is or does. And that could be the majority.