New build with old parts

[karen2010]

Ive been having rebooting problems with my computer. I have only had it since around September last year (Someone I knew built it for a fee) He told me all the parts are new, but Ive been shown the HDD today and it's from May 2008. Is this normal to use an old one even if it's new and unused?

 

[Deuce65]

Okay instead of asking us (and getting potentially erroneous information since we have no idea what is in your computer) why don't you ask the person who built it?

 

[karen2010]

Okay instead of asking us (and getting potentially erroneous information since we have no idea what is in your computer) why don't you ask the person who built it?

I would but he's in the UK and I have moved to Hong Kong. Ive had problems with it since he built it, and he's had it to look at twice before I moved here and still the same thing is happening. They are also 8 hours behind me.

 

[techgeek]

Did you order the parts and he assembled it? Or did he purchase them and bill you for them along with the assembly fee?

It is unusual to get a computer which was built new in Q3 of 2013 with a HDD that was built in 2008. One thing you could try is download Crystal Disk Info and read the SMART data from the drive. It should have a value for Power On Time. You should be able to roughly tell how many hours you've had it on. If the numbers of hours are grossly higher than what you calculate, then your likely not the first owner of that drive

How big is this drive? It can't be too large (by today's standards) if it was made in 2008.

 

[karen2010]

Did you order the parts and he assembled it? Or did he purchase them and bill you for them along with the assembly fee?

It is unusual to get a computer which was built new in Q3 of 2013 with a HDD that was built in 2008. One thing you could try is download Crystal Disk Info and read the SMART data from the drive. It should have a value for Power On Time. You should be able to roughly tell how many hours you've had it on. If the numbers of hours are grossly higher than what you calculate, then your likely not the first owner of that drive

How big is this drive? It can't be too large (by today's standards) if it was made in 2008.

Thanks for the reply. I gave him the cash, and he went to buy the parts from a shop where he buys most of his stock for the computer business he has set up. I didn't pay masses of cash, and I only asked for a basic build that I could play the Sims game on, he did tell me though that all the parts were new. I'm no good with the insides of computers, but from what I can see on the HDD is Hitachi Ultrastar Dec 2008 and I can see the capacity is 1TB ,Sata 3.0Gb RPM 7200 Does that make sense? LOL

 

[techgeek]

Did you order the parts and he assembled it? Or did he purchase them and bill you for them along with the assembly fee?

It is unusual to get a computer which was built new in Q3 of 2013 with a HDD that was built in 2008. One thing you could try is download Crystal Disk Info and read the SMART data from the drive. It should have a value for Power On Time. You should be able to roughly tell how many hours you've had it on. If the numbers of hours are grossly higher than what you calculate, then your likely not the first owner of that drive

How big is this drive? It can't be too large (by today's standards) if it was made in 2008.

Thanks for the reply. I gave him the cash, and he went to buy the parts from a shop where he buys most of his stock for the computer business he has set up. I didn't pay masses of cash, and I only asked for a basic build that I could play the Sims game on, he did tell me though that all the parts were new. I'm no good with the insides of computers, but from what I can see on the HDD is Hitachi Ultrastar Dec 2008 and I can see the capacity is 1TB ,Sata 3.0Gb RPM 7200 Does that make sense? LOL

Yes that all makes sense. If you can google Crystal Disk Mark, download it and install it. When you run it, it will show the SMART data on the drive. This data should tell you if some error is triggered. More important to what you are trying to find out is the Power On Time. If you can do it, post it here or a screenshot would be even better. Along with that, give a rough estimate of how many hours you think you've used the computer. For instance say 30 hours a week X the number of weeks you had it. Of course this will be highly inaccurate, but if your estimate is much lower than that reported in SMART, then you have reason to believe that the drive is not new.

However since it's only a 1TB drive, maybe the store he bought it from had old stock on that drive and it is in fact new. It's unlikely, but you never know.

 

[karen2010]

Did you order the parts and he assembled it? Or did he purchase them and bill you for them along with the assembly fee?

It is unusual to get a computer which was built new in Q3 of 2013 with a HDD that was built in 2008. One thing you could try is download Crystal Disk Info and read the SMART data from the drive. It should have a value for Power On Time. You should be able to roughly tell how many hours you've had it on. If the numbers of hours are grossly higher than what you calculate, then your likely not the first owner of that drive

How big is this drive? It can't be too large (by today's standards) if it was made in 2008.

Thanks for the reply. I gave him the cash, and he went to buy the parts from a shop where he buys most of his stock for the computer business he has set up. I didn't pay masses of cash, and I only asked for a basic build that I could play the Sims game on, he did tell me though that all the parts were new. I'm no good with the insides of computers, but from what I can see on the HDD is Hitachi Ultrastar Dec 2008 and I can see the capacity is 1TB ,Sata 3.0Gb RPM 7200 Does that make sense? LOL

Yes that all makes sense. If you can google Crystal Disk Mark, download it and install it. When you run it, it will show the SMART data on the drive. This data should tell you if some error is triggered. More important to what you are trying to find out is the Power On Time. If you can do it, post it here or a screenshot would be even better. Along with that, give a rough estimate of how many hours you think you've used the computer. For instance say 30 hours a week X the number of weeks you had it. Of course this will be highly inaccurate, but if your estimate is much lower than that reported in SMART, then you have reason to believe that the drive is not new.

However since it's only a 1TB drive, maybe the store he bought it from had old stock on that drive and it is in fact new. It's unlikely, but you never know.

Ive downloaded it, not a clue what Im doing LOL its doing some kind of test for Read MBs & Write MBs does that sound right? Ive just had a 'High disk Usage' warning for this program :0( is that normal?

You wouldn't believe how long it took me to work out how to do this shot hahaha.

 

[techgeek]

I'm sorry karen, I messed up. I told you in my first post Crystal Disk Info, but in my second (which you followed) I said Crystal Disk Mark. They're made by the same person. Crystal Disk Info gives you the SMART info for your hard drives, Crystal Disk Mark, is a benchmark to tell you how fast your hard drive performs.

So after wasting your time with Disk Mark, could you download Disk Info? Then post the results.

Again really sorry. Some times my fingers type faster than my brain works.

 

[karen2010]

Hi techgeek

So sorry for not getting back sooner... if you can still help, here is the pic from crystaldisk info.

 

[techgeek]

OK, first off your Power On Hours are 1536 which equates to 64 days. Depending on how long you leave it powered up, that isn't out of line with what you'd expect. That's a little over 3 hours a day by my rough calculation. Now if it had been over 5000 hours, then we could definitely say that it was used prior to being in your computer. Looking at the rest of the SMART data, SMART is saying as far as the HDD's firmware is concerned, your hard drive is in good health. Take that with a grain of salt though, I've seen drives that I knew had problems and SMART reported it as good.

I also had a peek at the Crystal Disk Mark scores you posted again and I'm ashamed to say this, but I didn't notice the first time I looked at it. Your scores seem a little low (slow) for an HDD. That said, being slow isn't going to cause a rebooting problem. Normally the Sequential Reads and Writes are around 100MB/s, but solving that issue is an aside from your initial primary problem.

When you say your are having a reboot problem, what does you computer do? Does it spontaneous reboot, or do you get a blue screen (geeks like me call it a BSOD) and then reboot. Many hardware and sometimes even software problems can cause reboots.

 

[karen2010]

OK, first off your Power On Hours are 1536 which equates to 64 days. Depending on how long you leave it powered up, that isn't out of line with what you'd expect. That's a little over 3 hours a day by my rough calculation. Now if it had been over 5000 hours, then we could definitely say that it was used prior to being in your computer. Looking at the rest of the SMART data, says as far as the HDD's firmware, your hard drive is in good health. Take that with a grain of salt though, I've seen drives that I knew had problems and SMART reported it as good.

I also had a peek at the Crystal Disk Mark scores you posted again and I'm ashamed to say this, but I didn't notice the first time I looked at it. Your scores seem a little low (slow) for an HDD. That said, being slow isn't going to cause a rebooting problem. Normally the Sequence Reads and Writes are around 100MB/s, but solving that issue is an aside from your initial primary problem.

When you say your are having a reboot problem, what does you computer do? Does it spontaneous reboot, or do you get a blue screen (geeks like me call it a BSOD) and then reboot. Many hardware and sometimes even software problems can cause reboots.

Hi again,
I actually did a compatibility check with a program that the guy who built it installed for me. That was 'Nero Express'. I uninstalled that and the computer doesnt seem to be closing down :0) I do however have another problem :0( When I play TheSims3 the computer gets quite hot after about 15 mins I have taken pictures of the inside of my computer, could you advise on any other (Better) fans or HDD etc...?

 

[karen2010]

 

[techgeek]

Well lets look at the heat issue first. This certainly can cause reboot issues if its overheating. I can see the CPU heatsink and fan has some build up of dust and cruft. This will insulate the heatsink from the cool air needed to remove the heat.

To clean this use a can of compressed air and blast the dust out of the heatsink and off of the fan blades. Make sure to keep the fan from spinning while you are hitting it with air. If you allow the fan to spin, the compressed air could get the fan spinning so fast that it damages the bearings in the fan which will wreck it. If you have a vacuum, have the nozzle inside the case while you are hitting the dust with the compressed air, that way most of what you dislodge will get sucked up and not resettle in your computer or in your house.

The same could / should be done for your graphics card. The process is much the same, but it's easier if you remove the card from your computer first. This way its easier to direct the blasts of air where you want it. Again make sure the fan doesn't spin while hitting it with air.

As for adding some cooling, from the pictures I see that your case is devoid of any case fans. I can see a fan mount location just behind the motherboard at the back of your case. Since I don't know exactly what case you have, I can't say for sure what size fan(s) are intended for that location. I'll go out on a limb though and say it will most likely fit a 120mm fan. It may also have holes for a 140mm fan. To check yourself, if you have a tape measure or ruler with centimeters on it, measure between the screw holes on any axis (just not diagonally). If there is only one set of screw holes, just measure these, if there are two, measure the closest two (this is for one size of fan) and then the farthest two on the same axis (this is obviously the larger size fan). Alternatively you could also provide me with the name of the case (if you know it) and then I can tell you exactly where your fan mount locations are. I assume that it's warm in Hong Kong, so you should definitely have some case fans providing air flow.

Also from your pictures I can see that you have an AMD APU, which generally use very little power. That said, could you provide me with the name of the power supply, or a better picture of the label on the side of it. Poor quality power supplies are notorious for causing computer instability problems. Also if you could tell me what video card you have, that would be great. With this information I can get an idea of the power required by your system and along with the power supply information, I can determine whether the instability problems are power related.

I would also check into getting software to monitor your temperatures, fans, and voltages. This could give you some idea if you have a low power rail, high temperature on your CPU an / or GPU, or a fan that's spinning slowly. My suggestion would be HWInfo. It's very powerful, but it's not the easiest to configure. It comes in 32 and 64 bit, so download the one that matches your OS. It's also free to for personal use.

After you have addressed some of this, we can also look into checking your RAM for problems. However lets start with the most obvious things first.

 

[karen2010]

Well lets look at the heat issue first. This certainly can cause reboot issues if its overheating. I can see the CPU heatsink and fan has some build up of dust and cruft. This will insulate the heatsink from the cool air needed to remove the heat.

To clean this use a can of compressed air and blast the dust out of the heatsink and off of the fan blades. Make sure to keep the fan from spinning while you are hitting it with air. If you allow the fan to spin, the compressed air could get the fan spinning so fast that it damages the bearings in the fan which will wreck it. If you have a vacuum, have the nozzle inside the case while you are hitting the dust with the compressed air, that way most of what you dislodge will get sucked up and not resettle in your computer or in your house.

The same could / should be done for your graphics card. The process is much the same, but it's easier if you remove the card from your computer first. This way its easier to direct the blasts of air where you want it. Again make sure the fan doesn't spin while hitting it with air.

As for adding some cooling, from the pictures I see that your case is devoid of any case fans. I can see a fan mount location just behind the motherboard at the back of your case. Since I don't know exactly what case you have, I can't say for sure what size fan(s) are intended for that location. I'll go out on a limb though and say it will most likely fit a 120mm fan. It may also have holes for a 140mm fan. To check yourself, if you have a tape measure or ruler with centimeters on it, measure between the screw holes on any axis (just not diagonally). If there is only one set of screw holes, just measure these, if there are two, measure the closest two (this is for one size of fan) and then the farthest two on the same axis (this is obviously the larger size fan). Alternatively you could also provide me with the name of the case (if you know it) and then I can tell you exactly where your fan mount locations are. I assume that it's warm in Hong Kong, so you should definitely have some case fans providing air flow.

Also from your pictures I can see that you have an AMD APU, which generally use very little power. That said, could you provide me with the name of the power supply, or a better picture of the label on the side of it. Poor quality power supplies are notorious for causing computer instability problems. Also if you could tell me what video card you have, that would be great. With this information I can get an idea of the power required by your system and along with the power supply information, I can determine whether the instability problems are power related.

I would also check into getting software to monitor your temperatures, fans, and voltages. This could give you some idea if you have a low power rail, high temperature on your CPU an / or GPU, or a fan that's spinning slowly. My suggestion would be HWInfo. It's very powerful, but it's not the easiest to configure. It comes in 32 and 64 bit, so download the one that matches your OS. It's also free to for personal use.

After you have addressed some of this, we can also look into checking your RAM for problems. However lets start with the most obvious things first.

Hi techgeek
I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out with these problems :0)
I shall take the cover off tomorrow as it's quite late here in Hong Kong. I will take a better picture of the power supply and post it to you on here, I have taken a couple of pictures of the box it came in so that you can tell which case I am talking about.

I've also been watching a lot of tutorials on you tube, someone said that a case that has no holes in the top isnt good. My case doesnt, and that is where the heat is at the top near the fan that has supposed to cool the airflow around the CPU it's just above the graphics card.

I shall be buying some of that compressed air as soon as I find out where to buy it (At times like this, I wish I spoke Cantonese LOL)

Also, sorry for more questions, but when I take out the graphics card, does it just slide out? Do I need to take any special extra care when doing so? I'm a bit scared of taking it out, but I know if I don't, I shall never learn :0)

Thanks again for helping.

Kaz.

 

[techgeek]

Ok, at the very least, I would install a 120mm fan in the rear mount location. It needs to be mounted as an exhaust fan, meaning it blows the air from inside the case out of the case. It appears that the case has in intake fan at the front. If couldn't hurt to add a fan on the side panel as well. That one I'd make as an intake fan and mount it at the location above your graphics card.

As for needing a case with fans at the top, it's not really necessary. As long as you have good air flow in the case. The original ATX specifications had an intake at the front and an exhaust fan at the back. In general, your system shouldn't generate much heat, but if you have stagnant air in the case, it can build up.

As for removing the graphics card, it's relatively easy. You need to remove the screw that holds down the IO shield at the back of the computer. I am including a link to an image of your motherboard. At the back of the PCI-E slot that your card is plugged into you'll see a tab. The image is so you can see it clearly because it is likely hidden underneath your graphics card. This tab needs to be pulled out slightly so the back of the card is released. With the screw removed and while your are pulling the tab away from the card, gently rock the card out of the slot. It will take a little force to get it removed.

Link

Re-inserting is simply a matter of lining up the card with the slot and push it straight down until it bottoms out.

Small steps and you'll be a pro in no time.

 

[karen2010]

Ok, at the very least, I would install a 120mm fan in the rear mount location. It needs to be mounted as an exhaust fan, meaning it blows the air from inside the case out of the case. It appears that the case has in intake fan at the front. If couldn't hurt to add a fan on the side panel as well. That one I'd make as an intake fan and mount it at the location above your graphics card.

As for needing a case with fans at the top, it's not really necessary. As long as you have good air flow in the case. The original ATX specifications had an intake at the front and an exhaust fan at the back. In general, your system shouldn't generate much heat, but if you have stagnant air in the case, it can build up.

As for removing the graphics card, it's relatively easy. You need to remove the screw that holds down the IO shield at the back of the computer. I am including a link to an image of your motherboard. At the back of the PCI-E slot that your card is plugged into you'll see a tab. The image is so you can see it clearly because it is likely hidden underneath your graphics card. This tab needs to be pulled out slightly so the back of the card is released. With the screw removed and while your are pulling the tab away from the card, gently rock the card out of the slot. It will take a little force to get it removed.

Link

Re-inserting is simply a matter of lining up the card with the slot and push it straight down until it bottoms out.

Small steps and you'll be a pro in no time.

Hi, I've taken some more pictures for you to look at, I'm ashamed to say it's very dusty! I didn't notice it until I put the flash on. Hope you can make out the parts OK.

The last 2 pictures, I took out those plastic holders because they are unused, I also thought the less items in there the better the airflow? Behinf those there is a fan which is in the front part of the case below the DVD player. It's really dusty as you can see. I'm not sure how to take the front casing off though. Also I looked at your link (Thanks) but.... LOL What's an IO sheild? & what is a PCI-E slot? Sorry hahaha I don't know any of those abbreviations.

Kaz.

By the way, the picture of the palit.biz fan is attached (I think) to the underside of the graphics card.

 

[techgeek]

First off, lets address the PSU (Power Supply Unit). It is 650W and even though I don't know what exact graphics card you have, I can see from your pictures that it doesn't have any additional power connectors. So the power rating on this supply is more than enough for your system. However the manufacturer (Ace) isn't a well respected manufacturer. According to this link at Tom's here, they are to be avoided:

Link

So you could have a power issue as well.

As for removing the unused drive brackets, you are correct, this will certainly improve airflow in the case. The addition of an exhaust fan at the back should created a nice flow through the case and vent more of the hot air out the back of the case. Another intake fan on the side door should also help get more cool air into the case.

Sorry about the acronyms, IO shield (IO=Input Output) is the metal bracket on the graphics card. Your PCI-E slot is the top blue slot in that link I provided. It's the name of the port that your graphics card is plugged into. The little blue tab that sticks out the back of that slot is what holds the back of the card securely in the slot. PCI-E stands for Peripheral Component Interconnect - Express.

Once we've addressed the airflow and cleaning issues, we can discuss replacement PSU's if your problems persist. Changing out a power supply on your own can be a bit dauntiing, but if you plan it out ahead of time, it doesn't have to be too stressful. We can cross that bridge when or if that time comes.

 

[karen2010]

First off, lets address the PSU (Power Supply Unit). It is 650W and even though I don't know what exact graphics card you have, I can see from your pictures that it doesn't have any additional power connectors. So the power rating on this supply is more than enough for your system. However the manufacturer (Ace) isn't a well respected manufacturer. According to this link at Tom's here, they are to be avoided:

Link

So you could have a power issue as well.

As for removing the unused drive brackets, you are correct, this will certainly improve airflow in the case. The addition of an exhaust fan at the back should created a nice flow through the case and vent more of the hot air out the back of the case. Another intake fan on the side door should also help get more cool air into the case.

Sorry about the acronyms, IO shield (IO=Input Output) is the metal bracket on the graphics card. Your PCI-E slot is the top blue slot in that link I provided. It's the name of the port that your graphics card is plugged into. The little blue tab that sticks out the back of that slot is what holds the back of the card securely in the slot. PCI-E stands for Peripheral Component Interconnect - Express.

Once we've addressed the airflow and cleaning issues, we can discuss replacement PSU's if your problems persist. Changing out a power supply on your own can be a bit dauntiing, but if you plan it out ahead of time, it doesn't have to be too stressful. We can cross that bridge when or if that time comes.

OK so...
Can I buy any other power supply? With any wattage? or will it have to be compatible to my computer?

The same also with the fans? Are there certain ones for my particular computer build? and do they all need to be 120mm? Can you suggest any which would be good for my computer?

I was looking at these ...

http://www.amazon.com/Cooler-Master-Hyper-212-RR-212E-20PK-R2/dp/B005O65JXI/ref=pd_sim_e_3?ie=UTF8&refRID=1MGHNA5KNRKVHY2SWV4J

As for the cleaning, I am going to buy a computer vacuum I think. Do you have any suggestions for any particular brand?

My graphics card by the way is a GeForce GT630 :0)

 

[techgeek]

There are a few brands that can be trusted when it comes to power supplies. Generally anything from Seasonic, most Corsair (but not all), Antec has some good supplies. The supply you have in your system is 650W. However I think you could probably use a 450W supply and have enough power. I have attached a link to a power supply that would serve you well, it's at NewEgg.ca, but it'll give you an idea:

NewEgg Link

Now it's not necessary to get this exact supply, but it'll give you a starting point. Modern systems lean on the 12V supply and I prefer supplies with a single 12V rail. That means that the total amount of current rated for 12V comes from a single point. This makes it easier to connect because you don't have to worry about load balancing between mulitple rails. ATX power supplies are all pretty standard in regards to pinouts for connectors. They have a 20(4) pin main power connector a CPU connector (4 or 8, or a 4+4 pin connector sometimes called EPS connector), PCI-E connectors used to power power hungry graphics cards, SATA power connectors for hard drives, and 4 pin molex used to power old hard drives and optical drives (these are going away).

If you are searching and confused as to what to buy, post links here and I can critique them for you.

As for fans, the link you provided is a heatsink and fan. It is a great heatsink by the way, I recommend this exact heatsink to people who need a good one and have a limited budget. However you are looking for just straight fans for your case, you're looking for 120mm fans. I will provide a few links. They are pretty standard as far as size (120mm), just cost, noise, and volume of air moved, changes.

Corsair Quiet Edition

Corsair Performance Edition

These are two packs (I was recommending one in the back and one on the side panel), one is quiet and moves less air, the other moves more air, but you will hear them. Your motherboard has one available fan header (at the bottom of the board) to power the one fan. The other fan will have to get it's power directly from the power supply, so it won't be controlled by the motherboard which isn't a big deal. You will however need an adapter like this:

Adapter

I'm betting you have something like this to power the fan in the front of your case.

As far as an anti-stat vacuum (I assume that is what you are referring to), they can be quite expensive and not really necessary. Also a vacuum may not have enough suction to get the dust out from deep in the fins on the heatsinks. Compressed air is excellent at blasting it out, the only downside is you have to be sure the fans don't spin while hitting them with air. Something like this would be all you need:

Duster

You can find this under many brand names. Here in Canada you can get it in electronics shops, supermarkets, Walmart, etc. Four cans of the stuff last me a year and I have 5 computers in the house. If you don't go too crazy with it, a can should last you 4 or more cleanings. Depending on how dusty your house gets, 4 to 5 times a year should keep your computer clean. It's also entertaining if you have cats. When my cats hear me use it, they all run for cover.

 

[karen2010]

There are a few brands that can be trusted when it comes to power supplies. Generally anything from Seasonic, most Corsair (but not all), Antec has some good supplies. The supply you have in your system is 650W. However I think you could probably use a 450W supply and have enough power. I have attached a link to a power supply that would serve you well, it's at NewEgg.ca, but it'll give you an idea:

NewEgg Link

Now it's not necessary to get this exact supply, but it'll give you a starting point. Modern systems lean on the 12V supply and I prefer supplies with a single 12V rail. That means that the total amount of current rated for 12V comes from a single point. This makes it easier to connect because you don't have to worry about load balancing between mulitple rails. ATX power supplies are all pretty standard in regards to pinouts for connectors. They have a 20(4) pin main power connector a CPU connector (4 or 8, or a 4+4 pin connector sometimes called EPS connector), PCI-E connectors used to power power hungry graphics cards, SATA power connectors for hard drives, and 4 pin molex used to power old hard drives and optical drives (these are going away).

If you are searching and confused as to what to buy, post links here and I can critique them for you.

As for fans, the link you provided is a heatsink and fan. It is a great heatsink by the way, I recommend this exact heatsink to people who need a good one and have a limited budget. However you are looking for just straight fans for your case, you're looking for 120mm fans. I will provide a few links. They are pretty standard as far as size (120mm), just cost, noise, and volume of air moved, changes.

Corsair Quiet Edition

Corsair Performance Edition

These are two packs (I was recommending one in the back and one on the side panel), one is quiet and moves less air, the other moves more air, but you will hear them. Your motherboard has one available fan header (at the bottom of the board) to power the one fan. The other fan will have to get it's power directly from the power supply, so it won't be controlled by the motherboard which isn't a big deal. You will however need an adapter like this:

Adapter

I'm betting you have something like this to power the fan in the front of your case.

As far as an anti-stat vacuum (I assume that is what you are referring to), they can be quite expensive and not really necessary. Also a vacuum may not have enough suction to get the dust out from deep in the fins on the heatsinks. Compressed air is excellent at blasting it out, the only downside is you have to be sure the fans don't spin while hitting them with air. Something like this would be all you need:

Duster

You can find this under many brand names. Here in Canada you can get it in electronics shops, supermarkets, Walmart, etc. Four cans of the stuff last me a year and I have 5 computers in the house. If you don't go too crazy with it, a can should last you 4 or more cleanings. Depending on how dusty your house gets, 4 to 5 times a year should keep your computer clean. It's also entertaining if you have cats. When my cats hear me use it, they all run for cover.

Hello again

Another couple of question (LOL Sorry)

The power supply, I play The Sims3 so would a larger wattage be better? The game is huge, and with all the expansion packs is (I'm told) very demanding on the system and graphics etc... I thought if I have to add fans and things, I may as well go for a slightly better option rather than standard. What do you think?
I've even toyed with the idea of replacing ALL major parts :0( My hubbys face when I mentioned doing that was a picture hahaha
The fans you have suggested I was actually looking at those particular ones. I'm now stuck though, do I do for quiet? or better performance? Are the high airflow ones REALLY noisy?

I bought this vac for the computer ...

Also, to double check, I've taken pics of the computer to show the areas of where I think you mean I should install those fans (when I decide which to go for) ....

So one is going to positioned at the upper part of the side panel with the holes?
And the other on the round circular part at the top part of the cases back?

Finally..... Does it matter that I have an APU rather than a CPU? and seem as there is heat in that area, would I need to replace the heat sink fan?

I live in a traditional Hong Kong Village apartment right opposite a very busy and dusty lorry park, I also have a dog and she moults a lot.
I thought the data vac would be better than the can because I will need to use it quite often, and unless I get them shipped in, they seem to be pricey here. I've seen them for the equivalent of £10 GBP but thats probably an expat price LOL We usually get charged more than locals for items. I hope I've made the right choice :0(

Kaz

 

[techgeek]

As far as a power supply, the games played to an extent have an affect in power usage, but it's more the hardware the games are played on. The SIMs are pretty light compared to FPS's with the latest and greatest graphics. Games like Crysis 3, Titanfall, Far Cry 3, Metro: Last Light would all push the hardware much further than the SIMs would. Your computer as it is presently should handle 450W, however nothing is stopping you from going higher. Of course going higher is more expensive, but then if you end up building a new system later that's more powerful, then you might not need to buy a new supply. Just be sure to go with something with a good name. Corsair, Seasonic, and some Antec, are good supplies. To calculate power requirements, I use an online calculator. It has drop downs where you tell it your system configuration and it spits out a number based on the published power requirements of each component. The number it gives is a worst case scenario, so for GPU and CPU, they are loaded to 90% in the calculation.

Noise is subjective, some people are more sensitive to it. Some people game with headphones and don't care how loud their systems are. Some people sleep in the room their computers are in and want them as quiet as possible. In your case any new fans are going to be better than just having the one you have. I would get the quiet ones, but it's really up to you. As for location, you will have the one at the back (from your second picture) and one on the side panel. Looking at the picture of the side, it looks as if the holes drilled in the plexi double as ventilation and mount holes. I couldn't see holes dedicated for screwing the fan to the side, so if that's the case, you'll be able to tune the position of the fan to exactly where you want it. I would place it directly above the graphics card. That way cool air will be pushed down to the graphics card. As I mentioned before the one in the back should be an exhaust fan and the one on the side should be an intake fan.

As for the vacuum, it will get most of the dust. However in the most crucial areas such as the CPU heatsink and GPU heatsink, it will leave dust down inside the fins. With the CPU, you may be able to remove the fan from the heatsink and get the bristles of the brush down in between the fins and get most of the dust. The GPU is going to be more difficult.

As for the APU vs CPU question. AMD's APU's are probably the slowest processors for the desktop environment. They are not as fast as either the Athlon FX series from AMD, or pretty much anything Intel has. Unfortunately the APU platform has a unique socket, so you can just pick up a FX and install it, that would require changing the motherboard as well. Now that doesn't mean they aren't good, they're just not as good. I don't know exactly which APU you have, so I can't give you specific numbers on performance. However the SIM's isn't the most demanding game out there on the CPU. What matters the most (to some extent) is the GPU. I had a look at the Wiki for the SIMs 3 and it's expansions and your present card doesn't appear to work for many of the expansions:

Wiki SIMS 3 Requirements

If you were to consider upgrading the graphics card, I would suggest the 650Ti or the newer 750Ti. My daughter has the 650 and it's a great little card. She plays Team Fortress 2 on it and it keeps up quite nicely.

As for the heatsink, you have a stock heatsink. They are engineered to cool "sufficiently" under most "normal" ambient temperatures. However if your apartment gets quite hot, then the APU is going to stay warmer as well. Any heatsink that supports sockets AM2 / AM2+ / AM3 / AM3+ will work on your motherboard. If this is something you are considering you can't beat the Hyper 212 EVO for price / performance ratio. It'll be leaps and bounds better than what you have. I've checked your case dimensions and it's not too tall for your case either. However this may require you to remove your motherboard to install because it has a backplate. I couldn't find the manufacturers website for your case (only retailers) so I can't tell if there is a cutout on the motherboard tray so that you can access the back of your motherboard without removing the motherboard. Some cases come with a cutout, some don't.

I hope that helps. If you have any question about a particular part, post the links in this thread and I'll give you my opinion on it.

 

[karen2010]

As far as a power supply, the games played to an extent have an affect in power usage, but it's more the hardware the games are played on. The SIMs are pretty light compared to FPS's with the latest and greatest graphics. Games like Crysis 3, Titanfall, Far Cry 3, Metro: Last Light would all push the hardware much further than the SIMs would. Your computer as it is presently should handle 450W, however nothing is stopping you from going higher. Of course going higher is more expensive, but then if you end up building a new system later that's more powerful, then you might not need to buy a new supply. Just be sure to go with something with a good name. Corsair, Seasonic, and some Antec, are good supplies. To calculate power requirements, I use an online calculator. It has drop downs where you tell it your system configuration and it spits out a number based on the published power requirements of each component. The number it gives is a worst case scenario, so for GPU and CPU, they are loaded to 90% in the calculation.

Noise is subjective, some people are more sensitive to it. Some people game with headphones and don't care how loud their systems are. Some people sleep in the room their computers are in and want them as quiet as possible. In your case any new fans are going to be better than just having the one you have. I would get the quiet ones, but it's really up to you. As for location, you will have the one at the back (from your second picture) and one on the side panel. Looking at the picture of the side, it looks as if the holes drilled in the plexi double as ventilation and mount holes. I couldn't see holes dedicated for screwing the fan to the side, so if that's the case, you'll be able to tune the position of the fan to exactly where you want it. I would place it directly above the graphics card. That way cool air will be pushed down to the graphics card. As I mentioned before the one in the back should be an exhaust fan and the one on the side should be an intake fan.

As for the vacuum, it will get most of the dust. However in the most crucial areas such as the CPU heatsink and GPU heatsink, it will leave dust down inside the fins. With the CPU, you may be able to remove the fan from the heatsink and get the bristles of the brush down in between the fins and get most of the dust. The GPU is going to be more difficult.

As for the APU vs CPU question. AMD's APU's are probably the slowest processors for the desktop environment. They are not as fast as either the Athlon FX series from AMD, or pretty much anything Intel has. Unfortunately the APU platform has a unique socket, so you can just pick up a FX and install it, that would require changing the motherboard as well. Now that doesn't mean they aren't good, they're just not as good. I don't know exactly which APU you have, so I can't give you specific numbers on performance. However the SIM's isn't the most demanding game out there on the CPU. What matters the most (to some extent) is the GPU. I had a look at the Wiki for the SIMs 3 and it's expansions and your present card doesn't appear to work for many of the expansions:

Wiki SIMS 3 Requirements

If you were to consider upgrading the graphics card, I would suggest the 650Ti or the newer 750Ti. My daughter has the 650 and it's a great little card. She plays Team Fortress 2 on it and it keeps up quite nicely.

As for the heatsink, you have a stock heatsink. They are engineered to cool "sufficiently" under most "normal" ambient temperatures. However if your apartment gets quite hot, then the APU is going to stay warmer as well. Any heatsink that supports sockets AM2 / AM2+ / AM3 / AM3+ will work on your motherboard. If this is something you are considering you can't beat the Hyper 212 EVO for price / performance ratio. It'll be leaps and bounds better than what you have. I've checked your case dimensions and it's not too tall for your case either. However this may require you to remove your motherboard to install because it has a backplate. I couldn't find the manufacturers website for your case (only retailers) so I can't tell if there is a cutout on the motherboard tray so that you can access the back of your motherboard without removing the motherboard. Some cases come with a cutout, some don't.

I hope that helps. If you have any question about a particular part, post the links in this thread and I'll give you my opinion on it.

Hi

So here is what I am thinking of changing, can you tell me if these will be OK with my system please?

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151124

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181040

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133473

(Could I buy the same power supply as above but a 650W instead of the 450W?)


Just seem this on my local expat site, would this be OK?http://hongkong.geoexpat.com/classifieds/showproduct.php/product/884298/title/cooler-master-g-600w-power-supply-new/cat/63

Kaz

 

[techgeek]

You can absolutely get a bigger supply. If you get the 650Ti you'll need a little more power anyway. Not 200W more, but a little more for sure. The 650W supply will handle your system easily and if you do decide to go a little more hardcore, your supply may make the leap to your new system.

The fans are decent, and will move lots of air. If you run the one from the fan header at the bottom of your motherboard, it will control how fast the fan turns based on the temperature of the APU.

As for the graphics card you shouldn't have any trouble running the SIMS on it. If you have a little more money you could consider this one instead:

ASUS 750Ti

It'll be a little faster and it uses a little less power as well. This is just another option, the 650Ti is a great card, the 750 is just a bit newer and a bit better.

I like Cooler Master cases, and some of their cooling products, but they are not the most trusted name in power supplies.

 

[karen2010]

You can absolutely get a bigger supply. If you get the 650Ti you'll need a little more power anyway. Not 200W more, but a little more for sure. The 650W supply will handle your system easily and if you do decide to go a little more hardcore, your supply may make the leap to your new system.

The fans are decent, and will move lots of air. If you run the one from the fan header at the bottom of your motherboard, it will control how fast the fan turns based on the temperature of the APU.

As for the graphics card you shouldn't have any trouble running the SIMS on it. If you have a little more money you could consider this one instead:

ASUS 750Ti

It'll be a little faster and it uses a little less power as well. This is just another option, the 650Ti is a great card, the 750 is just a bit newer and a bit better.

I like Cooler Master cases, and some of their cooling products, but they are not the most trusted name in power supplies.

Hello again and thanks for the reply. Ive changed my mind again LOL. This is what I have in my cart at Newegg.com and I am about to buy it once I've OK'd it with my hubby (he's having a heart attack as we speak) Probably wont buy them all at once if he has anything to do with it LOL So... here is what I have chosen...



SeaSonic SSR-650RM 650W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS GOLD Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply New 4th Gen CPU Certified Haswell Ready

Rosewill RTK-045 45 Piece Premium Computer Tool Kit

Corsair Air Series AF120 Performance Edition CO-9050004-WW 120mm Twin Pack High Airflow Case Fan


ASUS GTX750TI-OC-2GD5 GeForce GTX 750 Ti 2GB 128-Bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 HDCP Ready Video Card

My computer vacuum hasnt arrived yet, so I am still waiting to get my syatem cleaned :0( but will do that ASAP when it arrives.

If all the above is OK for my system, would you be able to help me when the items arrive?

Thanks

Kaz.

Just seen a review of the graphics card, will the power supply I have chosen have a '6 pin plug?' Someone has said to make sure before buying the card.


I've just noticed that Egg.com doesnt ship to Hong Kong. I'm having to look on amazon now to see if they have the same items. I couldnt find the PSU but I did see this one... Is it OK?

SeaSonic 650W Power Supply X650 SS-650KM3

 

[techgeek]

The PSU and graphics card will work fine with what you have. The PSU has 4 6+2 pin PCI-E power connectors, you'll need only one. The reason they say 6+2 instead of 8 is that the extra two pins can be broken away, so you can use it as an 8 pin PCI-E or a 6 pin PCI-E. Most 750TI's don't require the additional power (ie gets all the power from the card slot), but this particular card is factory overclocked and thus requires the additional power. The PSU is partially modular. Some connectors are permanently wired to the main unit. These are the ATX cable (motherboard), 4+4 CPU connector (also motherboard), and 2X 6+2 PCI-E power connector (you'll need one for your new graphics card). You'll have to add the cables for your drives and fans. Modular is nice since you only need to have the cables you need for your system inside the case, no tiewrapping cables back that aren't needed.

As for help, no problem. I do go back to work here soon, so my internet access isn't quite as good in Yemen as it is in Canada, but I will get back to you. Who knows, when you get around to getting all the parts, maybe I'll be back home . I don't think you'll have much trouble installing the fans, they are pretty straight forward. The power supply might seem a little daunting, but as long as you take some pictures of where your old power supply plugs into all the parts of your computer (motherboard, HDD, ODD, etc) then you shouldn't have much problem installing it. The fun comes trying to hide and tidy up the wiring. This is important since a big wad of cables will impede airflow. The graphics card is just really making sure to follow the correct procedure to uninstall the old drivers correctly, so that you don't have any leftovers when you install the new card.

Give me a heads up when you order. One thing about ordering a few pieces at a time, you'll get to test each change on it's own. I would leave the graphics card until you've upgraded the PSU though. Since it's possible that your supply is shaky, it would be better to only be used with your new more reliable power supply.