New Gaming System

[azzinoth]

Hello.

For a week or so I was putting this together. Nothing is decided yet... All the comments/suggestions are welcome

APPROXIMATE PURCHASE DATE: 14 days to 1 month BUDGET RANGE: 800-900 EUR (1000$+)

SYSTEM USAGE FROM MOST TO LEAST IMPORTANT: Gaming, Gaming Surfing, programming, watching movies, CAD and graphic tools (PC will be shared with my brother...)

PARTS NOT REQUIRED: Mouse, keyboard, speakers, monitor, other I/O stuff,...

PREFERRED WEBSITE(S) FOR PARTS: www.mimovrste.com and www.elektronika.si

Both sites are in my native language (slovenian), so I will paste links to components from newegg.com

OVERCLOCKING: Yes SLI OR CROSSFIRE: Yes, Crossfire in a month or two after getting the main build

MONITOR RESOLUTION: 1600x1200

LIST OF COMPONENTS (+links)

Case:
Thermaltake WingRS 200 VJ70001N2Z Black SECC ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811133075

PSU:
I need a good suggestion on that,... I dunno how much power I will need (besides a lot, 750 Watts ++)

MOTHERBOARD: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128343 or http://www.mimovrste.com/artikel/2380043525/maticna-plosca-gigabyte-ga-x48-dq6-775 <<< In native lanuage just look the specifications (can't find this mobo on newegg.com)
Whic one will be better for OC-ing??

CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E8500 Wolfdale 3.16GHz
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115036

RAM: CORSAIR DOMINATOR 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145214&Tpk=TWIN2X4096-8500C5D
Someone have something better to recommend?

GPU: SAPPHIRE 100259-1GL Radeon HD 4870 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102801
Any better 4870 for OC???

HD: Western Digital Caviar Green WD10EADS 1TB 32MB
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136317

Awaiting your replies

 

[drippyfausett]

Well for the PSU stick with Corsair, Seasonic, Pc power or check this website http://www.eggxpert.com/forums/thread/323050.aspx and stick with the top two tiers and you should be fine. Im not too sure on the wattage but I think a high quality 750W would do.

Also if you can and it isn't too much more look for the Caviar Black hdd http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136284 it would be a better choice.

 

[azzinoth]

Here are fixed links for motherboards
MOTHERBOARD: GIGABYTE GA-EP45-DQ6 or GIGABYTE GA-X48-DQ6 <<< In native lanuage just look the specifications (can't find this mobo on newegg.com)
Whic one will be better for OC-ing??

Thx for reply and PSU/HD suggestion

 

[MykC]

If you want to save some money drop to DDR2 800. DDR2 1066 shows no benefit undergaming. Lower timing 4-4-4-12 vs 5-5-5-18 is what will affect your frames.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/memory/display/core2duo-memory-guide.html Is there a difference between DDR 800 and 1066?

You may want to consider the Q8200 or the Q9400 processors as an alternative to the E8500. While the E8500 will no doubt shine in single threaded benchmarks, in the real world there isn't any game that will be less playable on the Q8200. However, the Q8200 will show a good performance edge on current and future multithreaded games.

My experience for OCing video cards is that the gains are marginal and about 10% regardless of brand (unless its a really low end brand that already runs hot). Anything with a decent cooler should overclock the same.

600Ws is enough to run two 4870's in crossfire but anything above 650W is the safe zone. The brands mentioned above are a good start but looking for Active PFC, Modular cabling, Energy efficency rating, number of 12V rails will also determine the price and quality of the PSU.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-radeon-power,2122.html How Power Does Your GPU need? Jan 2009
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article28-page1.html More PSU information in detail

 

[gkay09]

Here are fixed links for motherboards
MOTHERBOARD: GIGABYTE GA-EP45-DQ6 or GIGABYTE GA-X48-DQ6 <<< In native lanuage just look the specifications (can't find this mobo on newegg.com)
Whic one will be better for OC-ing??

Thx for reply and PSU/HD suggestion

I wouldnt go with either of the above motherboards...

Get this Gigabyte...
GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
3x Winner of Customer Choice Award - Intel Motherboards
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128358

Reason - Check this article...
http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=3508

 

[4745454b]

If your going to be overclocking, why are you buying the fastest Intel dual core? Buy a slower one and overclock it. Save the $$$, thats why people overclock. I'm not sure why are you looking to run CF. If your resolution is 16x12, you don't need it. The 4870/GTX260/280 can handle 19x12 with AA, 16x12 is even easier. Get a good single card and be done with it.

Here is what I'd do. Grab a 8200 or better so that you have four cores instead of 2. Overclock it to make up for the lower speed. Buy a 4870 1GB or the GTX260 216. Throw these and four gigs of ram on a good name brand P45 chipset board and your pretty much done. The only other thing to worry about is power. Antec, PCP&C, SeaSonic, Corsair, etc are the way to go. Buy one of their current gen lines and your set.

 

[azzinoth]

Give me some more replys, I am taking all of your suggestions in consideration. But I am at work and so I cannot writte a long reply now

 

[rav3n]

I would suggest you use crucial ballistix tracer for the ram. They are very reliable and you get a bit of bling for your money. (they have blueish/green leds along the ram connecter and red and green leds on the top) As for the psu go with a 700w model from ocz (my personal choice) corsair or pc power & cooling. I also would suggest you go with a low end quad core instead of the dual core you first said. The quad core is a bit more future proof and will overclock better for you.

 

[geofelt]

If you are planning on crossfire in a month or two, then it would be much better to get a better single card up front.
You will save on the psu, mobo, and case cooling.
Look at a 4870X2, or GTX285. They will run any game out there well.
How good does your gaming need to be?
http://www.guru3d.com/index.php?page=vga_charts

Look for a quality psu in the 600w range. Corsair, PC P&C, seasonic, and Antec are good.
How much power you need is mostly determined by your vga card/s.

The case you picked is cheap, but does not have adequate cooling for a gaming PC. Look at the Antec 300:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129042

E8400 is fine, particularly for most games. E8500 is decent value also.
If you want a quad, look at an i7 build for about $150 more.

Don't pay more for ram faster than ddr2-800. The C2D cpu's are not sensitive to ram speeds. 4gb (2x2gb) is good.

Get an oem cpu cooler. It will keep your cpu cooler, and run quieter. If you overclock, it will help.
Xigmatek makes good cheap ones.

 

[sonac]

I have created a database of reviews of all recent hardware that came out in the last few years. I think it is very useful when building a new PC. Please visit it HERE

 

[sonac]

I would like to argue with your hard disk choice. WD Green are very economic (energy consumption), but also quite slow. Rather buy a faster one like Samsung SpinPoint F1...or just go with a faster model from WD.

 

[azzinoth]

Yey, finally end of my shift... (had to take extra 5 hours ).

My answers to you guys:
@4745454b: Well since I get paid every month... the next investment will be a fine 24" (maybe more..) screen So I will need good graphic output Also E8500 its not the fastest c2d, its E8600. I could also go with E8400, but I deicided for E8500 since can be pushed far beyond 4Ghz.

@geofelt: I would like that very much But from what I have read 4870 1 GB is still best buy performance/money.
Also thank you for case info, I will spend some more for better case

For now I stick with dual cores, I am still a bit sceptical about quads. But since I can still put one QX9xxx in the mobo, I will try to fry E8500.

Here is a bit refined build:
Case: Antec 300
PSU: CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006
MoBo: Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P
CPU: E8500 + my old customized Thermaltake Sonic Tower cooler (with 3 RPM controllable fans for massive airburst ) http://www.specialtech.co.uk/spshop/customer/product.php?productid=3569&cat=0&page=
RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820220335 or http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231192
GPU: Still some random 4870 1GB (maybe shall I take 4890???)
HD: WD Black Caviar 1TB

Thx for all the help, pls help me on

 

[rav3n]

I still recomend you go for a quad core. Better value for money and they overclocked very well to. As for the graphics, go for a nvidia gtx model. Much better then ati

 

[4745454b]

The difference between the 8500 and 8600 isn't much I'm sure. I'm also sure that a good quad overclocked will be just as nice. Again, why buy a chip that starts over 3GHz if you can buy a slightly slower one that has more cores? Let me see if I can make this a bit clearer.

The 8500 is a dual core CPU with 6MBs of L2 cache that starts at 3.16GHz. (9.5 CPU multiplier.) If you want 4GHz you need to bump the FSB up to 421MHz. Assuming your cooling is good, this is doable.

The Q8300 is a quad core CPU with 4MBs of L2 cache that starts at 2.5GHz. (7.5 CPU multiplier.) If you want 4GHz you need to bump the FSB up to 533MHz. This is a lot harder to do. Bumping the FSB up to 450 however will give you a nearly 3.4GHz chip. This is on the edge of easy depending on your motherboard and CPU. Yes its 600MHz slower then 4GHz, but you have an extra two cores so I doubt its going to feel any slower. Again, this is something you should consider, buying the 8500/8600 isn't a horrible mistake. This also assuming USA pricing, YMMV. Same with Rav3n's flame bait "much better then ATI" comment. Depending on your local pricing, this might be very incorrect.

 

[geofelt]

At a clock rate of 3.0 or better, the vga card is much more important for gaming than the cpu.
At that level, overclocking is good for bragging, but it will not net you as much increase
in FPS as a better vga card will. Today, very few games can make use of more than two cores.
Flight simulator X and supreme commander are exceptions. It is not a trivial matter to code multi threaded programs,
and game vendors will not sell too many games that require quads to run.
I don't see this changing in the next couple of years.

Net: a faster duo for the increased clock speed.

 

[rav3n]

I only said nvidia is better then ati because the gtx series is much better then the bulk of ati cards. That said you can still get a decent ati card for a good price. I guess what i should have said first off was shop around. Don't settle on one card until you see what else is on offer. You can generally get something better for a little bit extra. You just have to find it.

 

[azzinoth]

So you say I shold go for for something like this Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Yorkfield 2.83GHz LGA 775 95W Quad-Core , get SLI compatible mobo and get for GeForce 2xx (250 and 260 excluded)? Will not that quad become very hot with OC-ing? Is Q8200 or Q8300 even worth having (looking on aspect that 4 cores have 4MB cache... dual cores have 6MB... seems better for me)? Also I am well aware that dual cores are more than enough for at least 75% of today games/aplications. Now I really dunno if investing in quad would pay out the money invested.

More comments please I appreaciate al the help/suggestions and taking them in consideration

 

[rav3n]

Yep, that would be a good processor. most people that overclock upgrade their cpu cooler instead of using the stock air cooler. As has been said before quad cores are more future proof then dual cores and generally perform better. its worth the investment believe me you will see this for yourself if you get one. You can get an sli compatible mobo, but generally a single high card performs just as good if not better then 2 in sli. SlI is more of a status and braging thing. You should go for a gtx 260 model. It will handle all current games at high settings at a respectible resolution(with the exception of crysis)

 

[azzinoth]

I am so jeaolus, since I can't buy stuff from newegg.com, stuff is to cheap... at my place everything newegg price x 1.25 -.-

Anyway so if I am getting for a Quad, does anyone have in mind any specific OCing mobo (nVidia oriented( SLI preffered)). So let me hear your suggestions

 

[geofelt]

I am so jeaolus, since I can't buy stuff from newegg.com, stuff is to cheap... at my place everything newegg price x 1.25 -.-

Anyway so if I am getting for a Quad, does anyone have in mind any specific OCing mobo (nVidia oriented( SLI preffered)). So let me hear your suggestions

If you want a quad, you must consider an i7 920.
It is faster, clock for clock, has hyperthreading which gives you 8 dispatchable tasks, and overclocks easily.
It costs less than a similarly clocked Qxxx, but the X58 mobo and ram will cost you $100-$150 more.

 

[4745454b]

On this forum we tend to avoid the Nvidia chipsets. They simply aren't as good as the Intel ones. Double check that you want/need SLI, perhaps CF will do?

 

[azzinoth]

Well I would gladly buy i7... but then I have to wait for at least 1 month to increase my budget. Also methinks it would be better to wait for better i7 mobos & faster CPUs, but maybe I am wrong..

@4745454b: Ye, I am trying to do that, but nVidia fanboys Keep saying I shall buy nVidia card... I have chosen CF board (Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P)...so I want to pick CF GPU too Any bright news about 4890 1GB? Also I wanna hear from ATI fanboys: xxxxxxx manufacturers 48x0 1GB r0x/is well OCable/.../

Also I decided to buy another pair of RAM (8GB total, Vista Ultimate 64 for now and later I will try Win7).

CPU will be E8500 since doesn't heat as much as his Quad bros, it will be replaced in next winter with some better cooling

I would also like to ask for your opinions about this board: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-p45-core,2110-2.html

Maybe someone is her respectful owner, so comment from such persons are welcome or from anyone who have some experience with this board.

Thank you all again

 

[4745454b]

I tend to avoid fanboyism. Buy the best card you can, don't worry about who made the GPU. People who tell you to buy X card from Y company are idiots because you could have got more power if you bought Z. Frankly I wouldn't worry about SLI or CF, you tend to get better performance by just upgrading to a newer better card. (tend to, not always.)

Read some reviews, make up your own mind. Don't do something simply because someone tells you its made by AMvidia.

 

[azzinoth]

Well let me turn the QQ a bit.

What card will give the most out 'power' for lets say 300$? Still preferable is ATI, since GA board supports CF... but can also be nVidia, the main aspect is that is well OCable

 

[4745454b]

Both the GTX260 and 4870 are under $300. If you can swing $330+ you can get the GTX280. I think the 4870x2 is above $400. (all prices USA prices of course, no idea about your location.) I consider the GTX260 216 and the 4870 1GB to be more or less equals. Buy them for the bundle of the fact one works in a multi setup with your motherboard. Side by side, I doubt you'd be able to feel the difference.