[SOLVED] New ground up build for 3080, Intel vs AMD for longevity

[FinalJenemba]

Hi all, just looking to get some opinions on my upcoming build. My 3770k and GTX 970 have served me well for years but its time. I only do a build every 6-7 years so I like to get the best I can when I do so its pretty future proof. Will be primarily a gaming/standard computer shenanigans machine. Mainly trying to decide between the new 10850K or a 3900xt. Basically with me wanting this machine to last me as long as I do is the slight gaming advantage of the Intel worth loosing PCI-E 4.0 support and the extra heat stress? Im not a pro gamer, I use a 1440p 75hz display and may upgrade to a 4k at some point but don't really need high refresh. Running a 3080 would I even notice the FPS difference between the two platforms? Thanks!

 

[InvalidError]

If you can wait 4-6 more months, then you can have it all with either Zen 3 or Rocket Lake: Zen 3 should close whatever performance gaps remain with Intel and Rocket Lake should bring PCIe 4 to desktop Intel-Land.

Right now, for less than 100Hz refresh, both Intel and AMD are perfectly fine. At high refresh rates (120+Hz), Intel often pulls 10-20% ahead of Zen 2.

 

[FinalJenemba]

If you can wait 4-6 more months, then you can have it all with either Zen 3 or Rocket Lake: Zen 3 should close whatever performance gaps remain with Intel and Rocket Lake should bring PCIe 4 to desktop Intel-Land.

Right now, for less than 100Hz refresh, both Intel and AMD are perfectly fine. At high refresh rates (120+Hz), Intel often pulls 10-20% ahead of Zen 2.

Nah I’ve already waited awhile for the 3000 series. And I want it ready for all the new titles coming out like Cyberpunk. I’ll probably just go Ryzen, do we know if Zen 3 is going to require a new motherboard? I’ll def never go past 120hz so worrying about that 10-20% is prob unnecessary.

 

[apw100]

Definitely go with the Ryzen. PCI-E 3.0 is already becoming a bottleneck so you will be out of luck in three or four years when you want to upgrade your GPU and SSD.
According to AMD, Zen 3 desktop CPUs will be released this year and will still use the AM4 socket, no need to upgrade the mobo.
I’m planning to build a new workstation for 3D graphics and virtual production and it seems to me that November will be a good month to do so. AMD will should release Zen 3 around that time and their Big Navi GPUs should put some competitive pressure on Nvidia. I require CUDA and OptiX support, so AMD cards aren’t an option, but I’m hoping that NVidia will respond to Big Navi with either a price cut (unlikely) or the rumored 20GB 3080 and 16GB 3070.

 

[InvalidError]

do we know if Zen 3 is going to require a new motherboard?

500-series motherboards are the only ones guaranteed to get Zen 3 support, anything older is not officially supported by AMD. AMD initially refused to allow backward/forward compatibility of older boards with Zen 3 CPUs but after angry mobs protested, it decided to offer non-official support for motherboard manufacturers who decide to go ahead with it such as MSI who marketed their 400 MAX series boards as ready to support 3rd-gen and would be in legal hot water otherwise.

 

[Some_Guy_87]

Nah I’ve already waited awhile for the 3000 series. And I want it ready for all the new titles coming out like Cyberpunk. I’ll probably just go Ryzen, do we know if Zen 3 is going to require a new motherboard? I’ll def never go past 120hz so worrying about that 10-20% is prob unnecessary.

Zen3 will still be compatible with the AM4 Sockets. However, this will likely change with Zen4, so I don't think that will have much value as your buying behavior would never let you end up with a Zen4 if you buy now . There are rumors that the single core performance will get a 20% increase with Zen3, which would be a pretty nice boost - but as always it's hard to say how much truth there is to it. I'm in the same boat as you and still a bit torn honestly. If they happen to release their Zen3's just before Cyberpunk we might regret buying now, but waiting for it might lead to out of stock CPUs when we decide to buy the earlier gen then...

In any case, if it has to be from this gen and you are using it purely for gaming it will probably be a gamble of which noone can answer at the moment if it will be worth it. Intel will give you more performance in games, even if the difference isn't too big, but I can see your point with PCIe 4.0 as well - at the moment there's no real benefit to it, and it's hard to say if there will be until you buy your next mainboard. I don't think either will turn out to be a mistake that you deeply regret 4 years from now though.

 

[RodroX]

Since intel hasn't confirmed (yet) if pcie 4.0 will be working for socket 1200 mobos in the next 11gen CPU (motherboards are ready but CPUs are not for now), I would really wait a bit or, as you explained if you are done waiting and wana keep your rig for 5~7 years then get a B550 or X570 mobo and go with AMD (I would really skip the XT series, they are really not worth it).
You will be able to upgrade to Zen 3 later On if you need more horse power.

If you don't mind changing platofrm earlier than 6~7 years, then the 10600K/10700K will be more than enough for 1440p or 4K as long as the GPU can keep it up.

Until reviewers can get thier hands on the RTX 3080 and 3090 it will be imposible to know if pcie 4.0 may or not be need it, or whats the impact of not having it.

 

[TerryLaze]

Basically with me wanting this machine to last me as long as I do is the slight gaming advantage of the Intel worth loosing PCI-E 4.0 support and the extra heat stress?

There is no extra heat stress, short boost duration is 56 seconds which no cooler will have the slightest issue with and long duration is often times lower than ryzen.

View: https://youtu.be/X_wtoCBahhM?t=494


Since the 3080 is going to be a lot faster than the 2080ti and intel has an advantage already even with the 2080ti you should at least wait for reviews of the new GPUs, if it turns out that intel's advantage goes from roughly 10% to 20 or more it will be something to consider.

Also being able to overclock the intel system to an all core of ~5Ghz sometime in the future might extend its life farther than the 3900 which will never exceed an all core of around 4.1-4.2

With direct storage API and nvidia having a similar tech on these new cards pci 4 might be a non issue,moving compressed data should reduce the bandwidth demands immensely.

 

[mdd1963]

Whatever FPS your 970 was capable of at 1080P/medium, the 3080 will likely be even faster at 4k....and certainly will be faster at 1440P/High or Ultra. At the higher res/quality settings, CPU differences are normally less, but, we'll know much more when the 3080 is actually compared with both a 3800X and a 10700K, for example.. (There is already much fanboy ranting speculation 'on both sides' about PCI-e 3.0 vs. 4.0 making 'no difference' vs. 'little difference' to a 'huge difference'....but, until cards deliver and are compared on both platforms, it's all just semi-informed speculation, at best. )

 

[FinalJenemba]

Thanks for the input so far guys! Starting to sound like it's really not gonna make a huge impact either way for how I play honestly. I think im probably going to do a AMD build with a 3700X and a good X570 board like a Crosshair. Then I can get the PCI-E 4 SSD's now and have a good long term setup, with the ability to pop in a Zen 3 CPU later if I feel like I need it.

 

[InvalidError]

If you don't mind changing platofrm earlier than 6~7 years, then the 10600K/10700K will be more than enough for 1440p or 4K as long as the GPU can keep it up.

There is no shortage of people still running Sandy and Ivy Bridge rigs today, so I'd bet tons of people who have Ryzen 1600--3600 or i5 9400+ today will still be using those 5-7 years from now, especially if we have another 5+ years mainstream stagnation at 16 cores.

 

[TerryLaze]

especially if we have another 5+ years mainstream stagnation at 16 cores.

From this point forward it would be about TDP/clocks stagnating, having a CPU with more cores but having to run them at lower clocks is of very limited usefulness to normal people,just look at xeon-phi while pretty great for research they are almost completely useless to normal people.
And unless we go to 16k VR very soon, or something else that will change usage dramatically, even 16 cores will be huge overkill for most normal people.

 

[alexbirdie]

Thanks for the input so far guys! Starting to sound like it's really not gonna make a huge impact either way for how I play honestly. I think im probably going to do a AMD build with a 3700X and a good X570 board like a Crosshair. Then I can get the PCI-E 4 SSD's now and have a good long term setup, with the ability to pop in a Zen 3 CPU later if I feel like I need it.

Good decision. Even with 3070 you will be more than happy. I do have asus crosshair viii hero and 3950x and playing in 1440p with an 2080 super with 144hz-monitor. But for playing your 3700x will be enough, and as you said, you can upgrade to a newer CPU, when ever you want.

I am curious for the first tests of the new 30xx-cards and the comparsion with 20xx, and although no need for it, a 3080 would be very nice to have for me ( and my son, because he does have the identical system like me) . I am looking forward to the reviews.