News New PSU Standard Adds 600W Connector for Next-Gen GPUs

[Admin]

ATX12VO 2.0 PSUs for energy-efficient PCs gain support for 12VHPWR connector that delivers up to 600W.

New PSU Standard Adds 600W Connector for Next-Gen GPUs : Read more

 

[escksu]

Lol, this is called creating a connector that is not needed and fixing a problem which doesnt exist.

What is the fix thats really needed? Revamp the bulky ATX connector. Its time for mainboards to ditch the bulky connector. Just change it to use PCIE 6pin connector. Regulators on the mainboard will change it to the correct voltage required by respective components

 

[hotaru.hino]

What is the fix thats really needed? Revamp the bulky ATX connector. Its time for mainboards to ditch the bulky connector. Just change it to use PCIE 6pin connector. Regulators on the mainboard will change it to the correct voltage required by respective components

You do realize this is what the 12VO spec is doing right? Well sans the PCIe 6-pin connector part.

Also I believe the article is talking about the new PCIe auxillary power connector.

 

[Pytheus]

Fairly soon, we'll have to run an independent supply from our breaker box just for the the PC alone.

 

[sivaseemakurthi]

Power distributors to lay dedicated powerline to customers using RTX 7090ti to prevent voltage drops

 

[escksu]

You do realize this is what the 12VO spec is doing right? Well sans the PCIe 6-pin connector part.

Also I believe the article is talking about the new PCIe auxillary power connector.

Yes, I am aware of the 12VO, but the main issue is that 12VO and ATX are 2 separate standards. Due to this, most boards will still be using ATX instead of 12VO, even in the foreseeable future. It doesn't make much sense for manufacturers to make boards for both standards.

 

[randomizer]

We could go back to making GPUs more power efficient. Or... we could bake high power consumption into a new spec!

 

[jacob249358]

making a GPU that is twice the performance at twice the tdp is not an advancement. We are reaching the point where people will consider a different GPU because of their electrical bill.

 

[watzupken]

Lol, this is called creating a connector that is not needed and fixing a problem which doesnt exist.

What is the fix thats really needed? Revamp the bulky ATX connector. Its time for mainboards to ditch the bulky connector. Just change it to use PCIE 6pin connector. Regulators on the mainboard will change it to the correct voltage required by respective components

I agree with you. The connector that really needs to be replaced is left as is. This 20/24 pin standard have been around for decades…

Anyway, this new 600W standard essentially means that there is no future for PSUs that are rated for less than 1KW. Not that we won’t find sub 1KW PSUs, but they maybe relegated to mid or lower end PSUs.

 

[spongiemaster]

Fairly soon, we'll have to run an independent supply from our breaker box just for the the PC alone.

Only if you're shopping in the halo department, and no one is requiring you to do that.

 

[spongiemaster]

We could go back to making GPUs more power efficient. Or... we could bake high power consumption into a new spec!

The just announced GH100 has a 300W higher TDP than the GA100 yet is significantly more efficient than the GA100. There is a performance aspect to efficiency. Higher power usage does not automatically mean worse efficiency. What you're seeking is lower power usage not efficiency.

 

[InvalidError]

Yes, I am aware of the 12VO, but the main issue is that 12VO and ATX are 2 separate standards. Due to this, most boards will still be using ATX instead of 12VO, even in the foreseeable future. It doesn't make much sense for manufacturers to make boards for both standards.

Well, the only way to ditch 3.3V and 5V on the ATX connector is to effectively ditch the ATX connector altogether. Deprecating 3.3V and 5V pins would mean you'd still be carrying the bulky 20+4 connector where more than 50% of the pins are now obsolete, huge waste of space and clunky to handle.

As far as I am concerned, the only major failure with 12VO is not having enough power on the 12VO connector to eliminate the need for an EPS12 connector in systems not intended for use with CPUs beyond 200W. Two extra 12V pins would have got that comfortably covered.

Everything will eventually need updated connectors to fit in the 12VO world so intermediate DC-DC converters on motherboards along with the associated costs and board space for legacy voltages can be eliminated so overall system efficiency can be further improved.

 

[digitalgriffin]

I can see it now:
Dell and Gigabyte responding to a customer: "Yes your system is slowing down 1 second after you power up your 4090 we sold you with your system. It was supposed to do that. So see your system is normal, it didn't crash" (Not mentioning it's a 500 Watt supply never intended for that)

 

[DRagor]

Wait a sec. Do I get it right that we will soon have two major formats of PSUs: Atx 3.0 and ATX12VO? That are similar but not compatible with each other?

 

[InvalidError]

Wait a sec. Do I get it right that we will soon have two major formats of PSUs: Atx 3.0 and ATX12VO? That are similar but not compatible with each other?

12VO is basically ATX with a smaller new connector that omits the legacy rails. It will likely become the new standard for new systems 4-5 years from now as global power efficiency requirements get tighter. It is actually quite impressive that ATX remained mostly unchanged for 20 years. I'd say it is long overdue to retirement so a fresh standard can uniformly raise minimum expectations.

For people who want backward/forward compatibility, I'm sure companies will make adapters to accommodate both directions. The simplest way would be 12VO PSUs with an optional external power distribution hub for legacy builds, which is fundamentally what some fancy modern ATX PSUs do today to reduce the number of wires coming directly from the PSU.

 

[hotaru.hino]

Another thing of note that I picked up on an article elsewhere is that system builders may be doing their own 12VO thing, if they haven't started using the spec Intel's trying to push. For instance, this Dell Inspiron 3880 does not use a 20/24-pin ATX connector. It looks like it's using a proprietary 8-pin thing

And a reason Intel wants to push ATX 12VO is to standardize all of this. Of course, whether or not system builders actually adhere to the standard is another thing, but you can't blame someone for not trying.

 

[InvalidError]

Of course, whether or not system builders actually adhere to the standard is another thing, but you can't blame someone for not trying.

Thing to keep in mind is that 12VO was created in part to meet the new more stringent PC power efficiency standard that have become law in California and a few other states. Any SI that wants to sell basic "low expandability" home and office PCs there are basically required to go 12VO if they want to avoid the extra hassle of having their systems' energy efficiency independently certified. For higher-end systems, there are all sorts of exemptions that make it a non-issue at least for now.

I expect 12VO to gain momentum as higher efficiency standards become law in more places worldwide.

 

[hotaru.hino]

Thing to keep in mind is that 12VO was created in part to meet the new more stringent PC power efficiency standard that have become law in California and a few other states. Any SI that wants to sell basic "low expandability" home and office PCs there are basically required to go 12VO if they want to avoid the extra hassle of having their systems' energy efficiency independently certified. For higher-end systems, there are all sorts of exemptions that make it a non-issue at least for now.

I expect 12VO to gain momentum as higher efficiency standards become law in more places worldwide.

The OEMs may have been doing energy efficiency as well, but the point I was trying to make is Intel wants everyone under the same banner, but that doesn't mean the OEMs will as long as they meet the other requirements.

 

[2Be_or_Not2Be]

I've seen a few 12VO, but more corporate machines. I'd love to see MSI/Asus/ASRock/Gigabyte start to offer boards with it for consumers/enthusiasts. At this point, I have no need for the legacy rails. Most peripheral devices that might have needed it, I can usually access through a USB adapter.

 

[InvalidError]

The OEMs may have been doing energy efficiency as well, but the point I was trying to make is Intel wants everyone under the same banner, but that doesn't mean the OEMs will as long as they meet the other requirements.

OEMs will follow the path of least resistance. If 12VO gives them a defacto pass on certification, that saves them a lot of unnecessary headaches.

I'd love to see MSI/Asus/ASRock/Gigabyte start to offer boards with it for consumers/enthusiasts.

Most of them do have a small selection of 12VO boards. This is a chicken-and-egg type situations where motherboard manufacturers have limited incentive to make 12VO boards while there are so few 12VO PSUs out there and PSU manufacturers have little incentive to make 12VO PSUs while there are almost no 12VO motherboards out there.

At some point though, SATA, PCIe, NVMe, etc. will get a 12VO refresh and that is when the legacy house cleaning will happen.

 

[escksu]

Well, the only way to ditch 3.3V and 5V on the ATX connector is to effectively ditch the ATX connector altogether. Deprecating 3.3V and 5V pins would mean you'd still be carrying the bulky 20+4 connector where more than 50% of the pins are now obsolete, huge waste of space and clunky to handle.

As far as I am concerned, the only major failure with 12VO is not having enough power on the 12VO connector to eliminate the need for an EPS12 connector in systems not intended for use with CPUs beyond 200W. Two extra 12V pins would have got that comfortably covered.

Everything will eventually need updated connectors to fit in the 12VO world so intermediate DC-DC converters on motherboards along with the associated costs and board space for legacy voltages can be eliminated so overall system efficiency can be further improved.

Yes, fully agreed. I would really want them to ditch the bulky 24pin ATX connector. Thats why I don't see the point of having both ATX 3.0 and 12VO as separate standards.

Although I do like 12VO, it has backward compatiblity problem with ATX 2.0. It is the 12VSB pin. Current ATX2.0 only has 5V standby instead of 12V, so you can't use exisiting PSU on a 12VO board. Its not a deal breaker if boards could be designed to work with both 12VSB and 5VSB (regulators thats works with both 5V and 12V inputs are widely available).

Some pple might ask whats the big deal with the ATX 24pin connector? IF you have been using a mini-ITX casing, you won't like the ATX connector and its cables...ITs bulky and hard to hide or even route the cable.

 

[InvalidError]

Although I do like 12VO, it has backward compatiblity problem with ATX 2.0. It is the 12VSB pin.

Trivial issue, same fix as the lack of 3.3V and 5V for backward compatibility: have a DC-DC converter convert 12VSB to 5VSB, same thing the other way around to use ATX2.3/3.x with 12VO.