Nezumi Shortfang question

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Hello, All!

I've got a quick question about the following card:
Nezumi Shortfang
1B
Creature - Rat Rogue
1/1
1B, T: Target opponent discards a card. Then if that player has no cards
in hand, flip Nezumi Shortfang.
-----
Stabwhisker the Odious
Legendary Creature - Rat Shaman
3/3
At the beginning of each opponent's upkeep, that player loses 1 life for
each card fewer than three in his or her hand.
One of the tricks I come up with is that you can activate the
non-flipped version and make it flip even if your opponent has no cards
in hand (unlike Nezumi Graverobber, which pretty much requires exactly
one card in a graveyard to flip).
After all, the target opponent is still a valid target, the effect is
carried out to the maximum possible extent (discarding as much as
possible - zero cards in this case), and the "if" is satisfied (no cards
in hand).

Is the above reasoning correct?

Regards,
Arkady.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

"Arkady Zilberberg" <arkadyz1@yahoo.com> writes:
> I've got a quick question about the following card:
> Nezumi Shortfang
> 1B
> Creature - Rat Rogue
> 1/1
> 1B, T: Target opponent discards a card. Then if that player has no cards
> in hand, flip Nezumi Shortfang.
> -----
> Stabwhisker the Odious
> Legendary Creature - Rat Shaman
> 3/3
> At the beginning of each opponent's upkeep, that player loses 1 life for
> each card fewer than three in his or her hand.
>
> One of the tricks I come up with is that you can activate the
> non-flipped version and make it flip even if your opponent has no cards
> in hand (unlike Nezumi Graverobber, which pretty much requires exactly
> one card in a graveyard to flip).
> After all, the target opponent is still a valid target, the effect is
> carried out to the maximum possible extent (discarding as much as
> possible - zero cards in this case), and the "if" is satisfied (no cards
> in hand).
>
> Is the above reasoning correct?

Yes. The requirement is not "target opponent with at least one card in
hand", and so your reasoning works just fine.

It's important to note that the flipping is not a triggered ability
here... If your opponent has no cards in hand, you still need to
activate the ability in order for it to flip; it doesn't just flip on
its own. (This seems to be a relatively common misconception, or at
least I heard it at the prerelease, so I thought I'd mention it.)

--
Peter C.
"I have discovered a strange level of sleep deprivation in which I do
not randomly fall asleep and yet am completely incapable of
intelligent thought..." -- Jessi

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

On Fri, 1 Oct 2004 09:47:01 -0400, Arkady Zilberberg <arkadyz1@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I've got a quick question about the following card:
>Nezumi Shortfang >1B >Creature - Rat Rogue
>1/1 1B,Tap: Target opponent discards a card. Then if that player has no cards
>in hand, flip ~.
>-----
>Stabwhisker the Odious >Legendary Creature - Rat Shaman
>3/3 At the beginning of each opponent's upkeep, that player loses 1 life for
>each card fewer than three in his or her hand.

>One of the tricks I come up with is that you can activate the
>non-flipped version and make it flip even if your opponent has no cards
>in hand (unlike Nezumi Graverobber, which pretty much requires exactly
>one card in a graveyard to flip).

Correct. This is because...

>After all, the target opponent is still a valid target, the effect is
>carried out to the maximum possible extent (discarding as much as
>possible - zero cards in this case), and the "if" is satisfied (no cards
>in hand).

....right. It doesn't "target a card in opponent's hand" or anything like that.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Arkady Zilberberg sez:

<<
>Hello, All!
>
> I've got a quick question about the following card:
>Nezumi Shortfang
>1B
>Creature - Rat Rogue
>1/1
>1B, T: Target opponent discards a card. Then if that player has no cards
>in hand, flip Nezumi Shortfang.
>-----
>Stabwhisker the Odious
>Legendary Creature - Rat Shaman
>3/3
>At the beginning of each opponent's upkeep, that player loses 1 life for
>each card fewer than three in his or her hand.
>
>One of the tricks I come up with is that you can activate the
>non-flipped version and make it flip even if your opponent has no cards
>in hand (unlike Nezumi Graverobber, which pretty much requires exactly
>one card in a graveyard to flip).
>After all, the target opponent is still a valid target, the effect is
>carried out to the maximum possible extent (discarding as much as
>possible - zero cards in this case), and the "if" is satisfied (no cards
>in hand).
>
>Is the above reasoning correct?
>
>>

Looks like. The Shortfang doesn't say "Target opponent with at least one card
in hand..." It just says "Target opponent". So you can target an opponent with
no cards in hand, and the Shortfang would flip.


----
If [Michael Moore] makes a mistake in [F 9/11], it's not that he's careless
with the facts ... It's that he suggests Bush is the cause of our problems,
when, in fact, Bush is just the result.
--The Libertarian Lessons of Fahrenheit 9/11