No Standoffs inside a 2 y.o. Dual Xeon Workstation. Hazardous?

[LukeL]

Two years ago I built my first Dual Xeon workstation (Fractal Design Arc XL FD-CA-ARC-XL-BL-W + Z10PE-D8 WS). I followed the manuals during installation as best I could, and everything has worked great for over two years. I do extensive 3D rendering, with both CPU's firing at 100% 24/7 for weeks at a time. No problems.

This week I started to build a new workstation, with a Supermicro motherboard (cheaper + plus support for V4 Xeons) and a different Fractal Design case (previous case no longer in stock).

While reading the new motherboard's manual, Lo and Behold - they mention the installation of Standoffs! What are these I wonder? My previous case manual made no mention of them, nor did my Z10PE-D8 WS installation manual. I never installed any.

I do a Google search to find out if they're necessary. Horror stories galore. Fire, smoke, broken parts, cats and dogs living together, its bad.

By contrast, I've had extensive use for over two years without a problem.

Now I'm wondering a couple things:

- Primarily: Should I take everything apart and put in the standoffs? "If it ain't broke..."

- Why hasn't everything exploded yet? Fractal Design lists one of the specifications of this case as "Thick rubber grommets on all holes on the motherboard plate". Perhaps this has provided insulation? As I feel around behind the motherboard with my finger, I notice that there is a small gap between the board and the case, but definitely less than what I feel with standoffs on my other machine.

- Why didn't the Z10PE-D8 WS manual (link - Page 2-3) make any mention of standoffs? Was it designed so that they aren't needed?

I'll note that both Fractal Design cases came with generic hardware boxes that contained "M/B standoffs" - but neither of the instruction manuals make any mention of them. The parts in the box really gave a vibe of "Here are all the parts you might possibly need, but many you probably won't.

For that matter, the Fractal Design "User Manuals" are really just a basic feature listing transcribed in ten different languages rather than the ever more important description of what all the cords / cables inside are for - which is what I really need.

Thoughts? Advice?

Thanks,
LL

 

[James Mason]

Which specific case?
Most cases come with Standoffs preinstalled, and the case manual will detail their installation and removal, because standoffs are installed on the case, and every case looks different so it's not the motherboard's job to really tell you how to install them, but your motherboard was all "BTW make sure they're installed."

If you know anything about building computers, like by researching how to build a computer, they should all mention what standoffs are and that they should be installed already or how to install the.

 

[LukeL]

Hi James,

I've already included a link to the case's page in the first line of my post (Click 'Fractal Design Case'); I've edited the page to make it more clear. The specific model number is Arc XL FD-CA-ARC-XL-BL-W.

As mentioned, the documentation that came with the case made no mention of standoffs, and since nothing was mentioned in the motherboard's manual either, I simply didn't use the standoffs that were included with the case - just as I didn't use any of the HDD tray screws, rubber spacers, cable ties, and PSU screws, that weren't included.

-- Luke

 

[King Dranzer]

Standoffs were preinstalled in your old case and probably you missed the page in the manual with info on standoffs or it was a no-good manual with incomplete info. Well without standoffs it is not possible to align the motherboard properly and running it for 2years without any problem is not-possible. Most probably standoffs were already installed in there.

 

[King Dranzer]

One question did your motherboard IO shield get aligned properly with motherboard ports(of your old PC)

 

[James Mason]

Most likely the stand offs are already installed, or there wouldn't really be anything for you to screw your motherboard into.

 

[LukeL]

One question did your motherboard IO shield get aligned properly with motherboard ports(of your old PC)

The Z10PE-D8_WS didn't mention the IO shield during the installation section either, so when I installed the motherboard, I thought it was something that I'd simply pop on after getting it in place - but once everything else was installed, I tried to pop it on from the outside and I wasn't able do. At that point I figured it was something that I should have been done beforehand.

But again, not mentioned in the motherboard manual. *sigh*

Here's the official Fractal Design user manual. It's remarkably bland. Only three actual pages of English content aside from the index.. No mention of standoffs.
http://support.fractal-design.com/support/solutions/articles/142823-arc-xl-product-manual

@ James - everything screwed in really nicely. I might have used the wrong screws though; the ones I chose had heads that were exactly the same size as the round circles marked out around the screw holes on the motherboard. Since the sizes were virtually identical, I figured that those were the ones to use.

 

[King Dranzer]

Remember first thing that goes in is the IO back plate.

Can you send us some pics of the setup. That would help.

As you plan on building new PC now check the below steps.

1.Check the standoffs in the case.
2.Mount IO back plate.
3.Install CPU and CPU cooler outside the case(if it is an air cooled one) or install CPU outside and install water cooler inside the case.
4.Align the motherboard to IO back plate and screw it down to standoffs.
5.If using water cooler install it now.
6.Install the PSU(get modular PSU if possible)
7.Do the wiring.
8.Install SSD, HDD.
9.Install GPU.
10.Run the PC.

 

[King Dranzer]

One question did your motherboard IO shield get aligned properly with motherboard ports(of your old PC)

The Z10PE-D8_WS didn't mention the IO shield during the installation section either, so when I installed the motherboard, I thought it was something that I'd simply pop on after getting it in place - but once everything else was installed, I tried to pop it on from the outside and I wasn't able do. At that point I figured it was something that I should have been done beforehand.

But again, not mentioned in the motherboard manual. *sigh*

Here's the official Fractal Design user manual. It's remarkably bland. Only three actual pages of English content aside from the index.. No mention of standoffs.
http://support.fractal-design.com/support/solutions/articles/142823-arc-xl-product-manual

@ James - everything screwed in really nicely. I might have used the wrong screws though; the ones I chose had heads that were exactly the same size as the round circles marked out around the screw holes on the motherboard. Since the sizes were virtually identical, I figured that those were the ones to use.

They make of the best cases available in the market when it comes to quality. I think they should work on their Manuals as well. There is very less info compared to what other brands provide like Corsair, NZXT and Phanteks.

 

[LukeL]

The newer build is already up & running, and I'm less concerned about that one in general. My primary focus is on safety, and whether there is a time bomb of a fire hazard with the 2 y.o. build.

And yes, the graphics card looks a bit funky. The workstation was primarily built as headless render/simulation node, and when it only fit in 85% of the way initially, we figured it had to do with a case/motherboard compatibility issue (as I had read of in some situations). With a little bit of metal clipping and card modding, we got it to seat in nice and cleanly, though it doesn't look aesthetically pleasing.

 

[James Mason]

Eh, it could be a fire hazzard if the stands aren't there. And sure it may be a hassle to take the mobo out, but isn't it more of a hassle to kill 2 CPUs, a GPU, and mobo if things go wrong?

 

[King Dranzer]

The newer build is already up & running, and I'm less concerned about that one in general. My primary focus is on safety, and whether there is a time bomb of a fire hazard with the 2 y.o. build.

And yes, the graphics card looks a bit funky. The workstation was primarily built as headless render/simulation node, and when it only fit in 85% of the way initially, we figured it had to do with a case/motherboard compatibility issue (as I had read of in some situations). With a little bit of metal clipping and card modding, we got it to seat in nice and cleanly, though it doesn't look aesthetically pleasing.

Trust me ASUS will pay you a huge amount if they see this. You unknowingly proved that their board even survived insane installation like that for two years without causing any problem. Even the ASUS testing officials wouldn't have taken the board through hell ride like that expect to have it working.

Spend some time and install the standoffs and motherboard properly. Don't forget to install the IO shield first. You are extremely lucky that nothing happened to your PC in this long run.

 

[LukeL]

Thank you everyone for your insight and advice. I emailed Fractal Design's tech support, and they echoed everything you two have said in the last couple posts. In their words: "I would buy a lottery ticket if I were you."

I'll be going A to Z on this tomorrow morning & will have standoffs in place by noon.

Thanks again,
Luke

 

[LukeL]

The standoffs are in & everything is reconnected, but some new issues have arisen:

- Every time I boot up, everything powers on but it doesn't post. After about 20 seconds of waiting, the system powers off, powers back on, posts, and boots up.

- 50% of the time that it successfully boots up, I'm not getting a picture. One time I got a picture, things felt normal, then everything froze and the computer became unresponsive. I couldn't remote access into it from an adjoining workstation, so the whole system went out. Another time things were normal until (what I assume to be) the blue screen of death emerging slow but steady, block by block from the top left of the monitor.

- The fans/radiators are all working well, with temperatures at 25 - 30 C while the system is running, so it doesn't appear to be a power shutoff.

For the latter issues, I'm wondering if there's a crimp in a power cable. With the mobo now taking up a bit more space in the case, the cables have to bend in slightly different spots. Or there's a plug that has an issue - wiggling it's way loose - but I've gone through and tightened each one twice - ensuring that they're all plugged in firmly to the mobo & power supply.

Not sure about the posting though; never had that issues with this system before.