News Nvidia Quietly Upgrades RTX 4090 Power Plug to Safer Design

[Admin]

Nvidia has silently upgraded the RTX 4090 with the same prototype 12V-2x6 power connector as the RTX 4070, which should hopefully stop all 4090 connector deaths from here on out.

Nvidia Quietly Upgrades RTX 4090 Power Plug to Safer Design : Read more

 

[Amdlova]

Why it's a user error... keep the old one

 

[ravewulf]

Encounter enough "user errors" that look the same and you'll find that, in reality, it's a design flaw

 

[cyrusfox]

I'll gladly pick up an old one severely discounted or free I mean it is a fire hazard🤣
If it wasn't for the internet I wouldn't know anyone impacted by this.

We have come a long way on electronic safety. I still remember melting wires on USB1 on my old AMD motherboard back in 2000, I plugged in the power jumper incorrectly creating a straight short to ground path... Electric smoke emitted from the wire only, pulled the plug and hooked up the right way (there was no polarized connections back then) and everything was functional, minus one jumper wire.

 

[Christopher1]

Why it's a user error... keep the old one

No, it isn't. Numerous users such as JayzTwoCents on YouTube who are very educated on computers reported having problems with getting the connector fully in the mating one on the card.
In fact one techie on YouTube had to push so hard to get the connector fully seated that he was very concerned that he was going to break the card or connector.

 

[cyrusfox]

In fact one techie on YouTube had to push so hard to get the connector fully seated that he was very concerned that he was going to break the card or connector.

Poor design or not enough tolerance? Reminds me of shaving China made connectors to make them fit/work (Sodimm to dimm adapters).Retaining force is different for every type of connector.

I hate molex!!! Those always felt like breaking the connectors due to the slop in the pins male vs female. Then there is m.2 and apples implementation of its proprietary NVME. Lots of force required on apples first to market gum stick ssd vs modern m.2 30° entry and hardly any force required to enter. Sodimm slots themselves vs pcie entry force. Sodimm & Dimm at least have a satisfying click but require surprising amount of force as well as pin alignment. I have not properly inserted dram in the past.

The issues with the past non-insertion/error though is not device damage, its maybe your computer doesn't boot/single lane memory or the device doesn't show up. This was sensational because it is happening to $2000 PC parts and putting it out of commission for RMA's for up to a month. Iteration and optimization is welcome.

 

[hotaru.hino]

Encounter enough "user errors" that look the same and you'll find that, in reality, it's a design flaw

A design flaw in the sense that there's little in the way to decrease the chances of user error. If receding the sense pins back is all it takes to reduce the chance of user error to practically 0, then the design of the actual connector and pins to do their job (i.e., carry all those amps) wasn't the problem.

But if you want to continue saying it was, then it's design problem my computer stops working if I spill a gallon of water on it.

 

[ravewulf]

A design flaw in the sense that there's little in the way to decrease the chances of user error. If receding the sense pins back is all it takes to reduce the chance of user error to practically 0, then the design of the actual connector and pins to do their job (i.e., carry all those amps) wasn't the problem.

But if you want to continue saying it was, then it's design problem my computer stops working if I spill a gallon of water on it.

You do realize you contradicted your own point? If you have to modify the design to reduce "user errors," then the flaw was with the design

 

[Greg7579]

Great - I'm about to build and was close to ordering the ASUS TUF or Strix 4090. But now I think I will get a Founders Addition and make sure it has the new connector. But I am also ordering a new PSU that has the original 12VHPWR connector. How long will it take for a PSU to get the new 12V-2x6 power connector" I now want a 4090 GPU and a PSU with the 12V-2x6 power connector. How long do I have to wait?

 

[TJ Hooker]

Great - I'm about to build and was close to ordering the ASUS TUF or Strix 4090. But now I think I will get a Founders Addition and make sure it has the new connector. But I am also ordering a new PSU that has the original 12VHPWR connector. How long will it take for a PSU to get the new 12V-2x6 power connector" I now want a 4090 GPU and a PSU with the 12V-2x6 power connector. How long do I have to wait?

As far as I can tell there's no change to the cable connector. It's only the header on the graphics card that was changed for 12V-2X6. So I wouldn't expect PSUs to change.

Edit: there are some additional bits added about making sure the cable plug can handle bending/side load of the cable, and includes appropriate strain relief. But I'm guessing any well-made cable would already be designed with those sorts of things in mind, so that may not necessitate an actual change.

 

[Greg7579]

No, anything with a 12VHPR connector will change to 12V-2x6. That is for certain. It's just a matter of how long it will take. MSI has already said they will soon make the move with their new PSUs. The 12VHPR connector is dead. The new 12V-2x6 has the same number of pins but a different header (socket) and connector (plug). The 4 small pins are still for sideband signals. This new connector will plug in more solidly and without wiggle. It will stay fully plugged in, which was the big problem with melting 12VHPWR connections at both the PSU and GPU end.

 

[TJ Hooker]

No, anything with a 12VHPR connector will change to 12V-2x6. That is for certain. It's just a matter of how long it will take. MSI has already said they will soon make the move with their new PSUs. The 12VHPR connector is dead. The new 12V-2x6 has the same number of pins but a different header (socket) and connector (plug). The 4 small pins are still for sideband signals. This new connector will plug in more solidly and without wiggle. It will stay fully plugged in, which was the big problem with melting 12VHPWR connections at both the PSU and GPU end.

My point is that, as far as I can tell by comparison the PCIe CEM 5.1 vs 5.0 specs, the 12VHPWR cable plug and a 12V-2x6 cable plug are the same (other than the former being marked with a "H+" and the latter a "H++"). PSU makers can release new products marketed with 12V-2x6, but I'm not sure what changes they'd be making to the plug (unless they weren't previously following best practices in terms of strain relief).

If you disagree, please let me know exactly what the differences are, with a source. Keep in mind that the shortened sense pin change only applies to the header as that's where the pins are (the cable plug has the corresponding receptacles, which didn't change).

 

[Greg7579]

TJ, I didn't mean to sound like I was scolding you. It is confusing for sure, and I saw a picture and it was for sure different. Let me find the link. Sometimes the claims are bogus on the internet. LOL. Tom's ran an article a couple of days ago talking about the difference between the 12VHPWR and the new approved (agreed by whatever standard entity that was - I forget) 12V-2x6 connector. There were some differences in the socket and the plug. But I am not an expert. I'm just building a high-end rig very soon and I don't want to be forever chasing the latest and delaying everything 5 times (like I have), but I don't want to buy anything with the 12VHPWR connector. The same article said that NVidia was "quietly" changing the connector on their 4090 right now as they already did on the 4070. It is a different connector. It is not the same. Also, MSI announced that their new PSUs would use the new connector, not the 12VHPWR connector and the new cables. But I could be wrong on this so please correct me....

 

[hotaru.hino]

TJ, I didn't mean to sound like I was scolding you. It is confusing for sure, and I saw a picture and it was for sure different. Let me find the link. Sometimes the claims are bogus on the internet. LOL. Tom's ran an article a couple of days ago talking about the difference between the 12VHPWR and the new approved (agreed by whatever standard entity that was - I forget) 12V-2x6 connector. There were some differences in the socket and the plug. But I am not an expert. I'm just building a high-end rig very soon and I don't want to be forever chasing the latest and delaying everything 5 times (like I have), but I don't want to buy anything with the 12VHPWR connector. The same article said that NVidia was "quietly" changing the connector on their 4090 right now as they already did on the 4070. It is a different connector. It is not the same. Also, MSI announced that their new PSUs would use the new connector, not the 12VHPWR connector and the new cables. But I could be wrong on this so please correct me....

I would argue that "different connector" either means "physically incompatible" or "has things that are functionally different." Like USB-C is a different connector to USB-A, or USB-A 3.0 is a different connector than USB-A 2.0. You can still plug in an older 12VHPwr cable into these things.

While I get the concern and such regarding the older 12VHPwr connector, as long as you're diligent with it, especially if you're connecting it to a 350W+ part, it's more than likely fine. Otherwise, we would have more exploding 4090s and 3090s than not.

I will also still argue that internal connections aren't designed for the average consumer to handle. Like you can easily break an internal USB 3.0 header (which I've done more than a handful of times in some form or fashion), but it's much harder to break the consumer facing connector. I mean heck, look at CPU sockets. LGA is a much more finnicky beast and has a higher risk of being broken should something go wrong than PGA. And yet it's where everyone's at now with higher-end CPU sockets.

 

[Greg7579]

Thanks for that. Come to think of it, it didn't say the two connectors (12VHPWR and the new 12V-2x6) were physically incompatible, but it strongly suggested it. It said the number of pins were the same, but that the socket and plug were different and the pins shorter with a firmer connection that won't wiggle or as likely to separate even while snapped in. To be honest, I don't really know and am a bit confused.

 

[TJ Hooker]

The same article said that NVidia was "quietly" changing the connector on their 4090 right now as they already did on the 4070. It is a different connector. It is not the same.

Yes, the header on the graphics card is changing. That doesn't necessarily mean the cable plug that goes into that header (the one that comes with your power supply) is changing.

Also, MSI announced that their new PSUs would use the new connector, not the 12VHPWR connector and the new cables.

I think the new MSI power supplies (MAG GL lineup) just change the color of part of the connector from black to yellow, to make it more obvious if it's not fully inserted. And change the labeling from 12VHPWR to 12V-2x6.

However, for modular PSUs it is possible they could change the header on the actual power supply to use the new 12V-2x6 with shortened sense pins. I don't think there's any requirement for manufacturers to abide by any particular spec for how their cables mechanically connect to their power supplies (or at least I think that's the case for the older PCIe power connectors). So I wasn't sure the updated connector would applicable there. But that is a change that could be present in new PSUs labelled as 12V-2x6.

 

[TJ Hooker]

Thanks for that. Come to think of it, it didn't say the two connectors (12VHPWR and the new 12V-2x6) were physically incompatible, but it strongly suggested it. It said the number of pins were the same, but that the socket and plug were different and the pins shorter with a firmer connection that won't wiggle or as likely to separate even while snapped in. To be honest, I don't really know and am a bit confused.

12V-2x6 connectors are compatible with previous 12VHPWR connectors.

Edit:
"Nonetheless, the 12V-2x6 power connector has backward compatibility with the 12VHPWR connector."

16-Pin Power Connector Gets A Much-Needed Revision, Meet The New 12V-2x6 Connector

The 12V-2x6 connector could be the savior to the 12VHPWR meltdowns.

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