Question NVME SSD question and storage strategy ideas

[progrockfrog]

I was explaining to a friend yesterday about HDD vs. SSD and then he mentioned his laptop had NVME SSD on it. That threw me for a loop, and I looked it up. I currently have two HP SSD P500 external drives. Am I correct in assuming the main advantage in having NVME as opposed to the SSD ones I have is that there is a speed factor? Does having NVME help with the lifespan of the storage device?

I also have some old regular USB sticks from 10 years ago, and I got some new ones recently 2.0 and 3.0 (pack of 10 each at 32gb). While I do have movies on HDD external drives, backing up all the movies is not my main objective. I might have 10 movies out of those that are hard to find and I could just back those up. The quality is the greatest, so figure 1gb per movie at most. Those would the biggest files that would need to be transferred and stored.

After that, I have hundreds of GBs of photos, document files (mostly .pdf), and audio files which I would initially want backed up until I whittle away the ones I don't need and can remove the duplicates.

The concern I have would be longevity and recovery. The two SSD drives I bought I had in mind to use for simply running Windows or a Linux operating system, and then any files downloaded would then be transferred to back up space (the new USB sticks). I understand USB sticks are less reliable than SSD drives, but since USB sticks are cheap I am going with the game plan to put categorized duplicates on multiple USB sticks so if one goes bad I always have another with the same files. Also, if I accidentally delete files they are on another device. We are talking about lots and lots of small 3mb to 100mb files scattered all over desktop computers, laptops, and tablets as well as cell phones from a half dozen people.

If that makes sense (or please say, "Why not ___?), then what do I do when I get 10gb to 20gb of files that don't need to be sorted anymore and just stored?

Would a NVME SSD drive be a better solution than the SSD drives I already have? I noticed that SanDisk for example has these NVME SSD drives. I also saw cheaper ones (ORICO M.2 Enclosure 4TB 10Gbps M Key NVMe Enclosure Aluminum Portable External Hard Drive Enclosure with USB C to C Cable) for only $17.99.

That to me is awfully cheap compared to the SanDisk ones. Do people really put all their eggs into one basked and get 4TB drives? Maybe I'm old school, but my thinking is to get more of these 32GB drives and spread the storage around. Security is another factor. if I want to share my music, I don't want to give a friend the only storage device that also has my medical and banking information. I could dabble in the bitlocker stuff, but then don't you have to carry around a recovery key to get into it if there is a problem?

I'll stop here for now. What do people recommend when going about storage taking into account longevity and recovery? Figure price as the third factor after I get some idea of what the "experts" do.

 

[Rokinamerica]

Sata SSD's top out in the mid 500's for read and write while NVMe's (PCIe interface) are significantly faster. Longevity for either relies on what you are buying. Some have very high lifespans while cheap ones usually do not.

The Orico you wrote about is most likely just the enclosure (no link was provided, so I have to assume) so you would need to still get a drive.

I trust flash drives barely more than SD Cards, meaning nothing critical is stored only on them. I used internal and external SSD's (including a NVMe in an enclosure similar to the one you wrote (mine is Sabrent) for multi copies of backup.

 

[Lutfij]

An NVMe is an SSD if you did your homework. I think you're asking what the difference between a 2.5" SSD and an M.2 NVMe SSD is. Correct? Then the difference apart from the obvious form factor is the speed at which an NVMe drive can operate due to the slot it's connected to.

If you hook up an NVMe drive to a USB port, then your speeds will be as high as the USB port will go(which will be your limiting factor).

To clarify, SSD's shouldn't be used as storage as they will nuke anything that's on it if they decide to go home unannounced(die) and recovery of said data is (near)impossible.

 

[alceryes]

The answer will really depend on how important the data is that you want to save.

Would it be a, "sucks, but no big deal," type of data loss, an "ouch, but I can manage it," type of data loss, or a, "I'm done. Here's my phone. I'm going to live as a hermit for the rest of my life," type of data loss?

For backups, data integrity, retention, and cost are usually the top priorities. Access speed is a distant fourth. A simple solution would be to get a NAS with two big spindle drives that are mirrored. I just picked up a 10TB enterprise-class (refurbished) spindle drive for under $100.
If you didn't want to spend on a NAS, a simple USB 3.0+ external HDD enclosure and two large spindle drives would work, especially if the most critical data doesn't change or get added to much (think old family photos and videos). Every month back up your data to one of two drives alternating between them. The enclosure I have allows me to very easily swap the drives inside.
Another good solution, if you have decent upload bandwidth, is an online backup/storage solution. Many of them are dirt cheap per GB. Some even have one-time pricing where you pay once and have that amount of storage for life.

In short, you've got a lot of different options, depending on your budget, amount of, and importance of the data being backed up.

 

[progrockfrog]

The Orico you wrote about is most likely just the enclosure (no link was provided, so I have to assume) so you would need to still get a drive.

Ok, I saw the 4TB mentioned and just assumed it meant drive size, but would it make a difference if it were 2TB instead?

It wasn't clear to me which option you would go with? Do you prefer SSD or not worry and just use USB flash drives if you have multiple backups as I outlined earlier? And would getting a NVME be wise for storage longevity or is it only a speed issue?

 

[progrockfrog]

An NVMe is an SSD if you did your homework. I think you're asking what the difference between a 2.5" SSD and an M.2 NVMe SSD is. Correct? Then the difference apart from the obvious form factor is the speed at which an NVMe drive can operate due to the slot it's connected to.

If you hook up an NVMe drive to a USB port, then your speeds will be as high as the USB port will go(which will be your limiting factor).

To clarify, SSD's shouldn't be used as storage as they will nuke anything that's on it if they decide to go home unannounced(die) and recovery of said data is (near)impossible.

I don't think I stated an NVMe drive wasn't an SSD, I was referring to an SSD that I saw online stating it wasn't an NVMe. When you talk about which USB port it will connect to, are you referring to 2.0 and 3.0? Are there others that NVMe would work on that a regular SSD wouldn't? (I don't know what the 2.5" refers to, but unless there are other commonly used ones assume I am talking about 2.5")

Then, the third thing is I really don't understand what you mean by nuking. Why would people want to get a 4TB SSD drive to not store things? What would they use instead?

I am guessing, some kind of data server which is also backed up? Is this some argument for the cloud over portable small devices? I am curious what the experts would do. How many of what to do what?

 

[progrockfrog]

The answer will really depend on how important the data is that you want to save.

Would it be a, "sucks, but no big deal," type of data loss, an "ouch, but I can manage it," type of data loss, or a, "I'm done. Here's my phone. I'm going to live as a hermit for the rest of my life," type of data loss?

For backups, data integrity, retention, and cost are usually the top priorities. Access speed is a distant fourth. A simple solution would be to get a NAS with two big spindle drives that are mirrored. I just picked up a 10TB enterprise-class (refurbished) spindle drive for under $100.
If you didn't want to spend on a NAS, a simple USB 3.0+ external HDD enclosure and two large spindle drives would work, especially if the most critical data doesn't change or get added to much (think old family photos and videos). Every month back up your data to one of two drives alternating between them. The enclosure I have allows me to very easily swap the drives inside.
Another good solution, if you have decent upload bandwidth, is an online backup/storage solution. Many of them are dirt cheap per GB. Some even have one-time pricing where you pay once and have that amount of storage for life.

In short, you've got a lot of different options, depending on your budget, amount of, and importance of the data being backed up.

You apparently know much more about this than I do. I am going to have to do some more researching to understand spindles, and I am not sure I am clear on the HDD reference. My understanding was to upgrade to SSD, and I assumed the next logical upgrade might be NVMe SSD.

 

[USAFRet]

You apparently know much more about this than I do. I am going to have to do some more researching to understand spindles, and I am not sure I am clear on the HDD reference. My understanding was to upgrade to SSD, and I assumed the next logical upgrade might be NVMe SSD.

Drives....

HDD - Old school spinning drive. Has been around since before the rurn of the century.
SSD - Solid State Drive. No moving parts.

Now...SSD can be further divided into different types.

SATA III. Typical SATA interface, also used by the old school HDD.
Examples might be a Corsair MX500 or Samsung 860/870EVO

NVME. New school. Devices look somewhat similar to a stick of RAM.
Much much faster. And different performance levels. PCIe 3.0/4.0/5.0. But for a LOT of uses, there is no user facing difference beyond artifical benchmark numbers.
Examples would be a Samsung 970 EVO or WD SN850.

 

[progrockfrog]

Other than learning about NVMe yesterday, I have read the same things mentioned in @USAFRet 's reply.

Another member posted, "A simple solution would be to get a NAS with two big spindle drives that are mirrored. I just picked up a 10TB enterprise-class (refurbished) spindle drive for under $100."

Taking the definitions given, why choose NAS over an NVMe SSD drive? If this was merely cost, what is the average cost difference? I purchased the HP SSD drives I got because they were only $20 each. And then when I got the USB sticks earlier this year, I figured the cost difference was due to file size because 64 GB USB sticks were significantly more expensive than the 32 ones.

So, let's start there.

Question #1 Group
Ideally, how much space do people carry around? If I want to carry around a bunch of 32gb flash drives and have the "oh well, I have another one at home and the same data is either on another 32gb flash drive or alternative backup B (where B could be SSD, NVMe SSD, or NAS, etc....) attitude, then would I run into problems? For example, are there devices to hook up USB devices that would be incompatible someway? This could influence the amount of space people carry around. Manufacturers may make certain products that require higher end technology. Is this in the ballpark of your average laptop/tablet user? Add cell phone if is equal to you (I only use my cell phone for calling and quick photos I snag and put on storage devices, not programming or emailing, etc...)

Question #2 Group
Depending on the answers given in Question #1 Group, is the spindle solution the way to go? What is the lifespan of that? When I went to buy a new computer, the computer guy there immediately said to get rid of the HDD I have and get an SSD instead (~2021). I still have the HDD and it's one of the things I am using as a multiple layer backup plan. In other words, I know it could go at any minute and there are other hard drives which have the same data.

Question #3 Group
After the customs are sorted, and the types have been considered, the next thing is to compare costs. I have been wary of refurbished products, but if the cost is significantly lower, would getting two of the same be a better solution than one new one even if two are a bit more expensive than a new one? This way, if one goes bad you have a duplicate on the other.

 

[USAFRet]

Other than learning about NVMe yesterday, I have read the same things mentioned in @USAFRet 's reply.

Another member posted, "A simple solution would be to get a NAS with two big spindle drives that are mirrored. I just picked up a 10TB enterprise-class (refurbished) spindle drive for under $100."

Taking the definitions given, why choose NAS over an NVMe SSD drive? If this was merely cost, what is the average cost difference? I purchased the HP SSD drives I got because they were only $20 each. And then when I got the USB sticks earlier this year, I figured the cost difference was due to file size because 64 GB USB sticks were significantly more expensive than the 32 ones.

So, let's start there.

Question #1 Group
Ideally, how much space do people carry around? If I want to carry around a bunch of 32gb flash drives and have the "oh well, I have another one at home and the same data is either on another 32gb flash drive or alternative backup B (where B could be SSD, NVMe SSD, or NAS, etc....) attitude, then would I run into problems? For example, are there devices to hook up USB devices that would be incompatible someway? This could influence the amount of space people carry around. Manufacturers may make certain products that require higher end technology. Is this in the ballpark of your average laptop/tablet user? Add cell phone if is equal to you (I only use my cell phone for calling and quick photos I snag and put on storage devices, not programming or emailing, etc...)

Question #2 Group
Depending on the answers given in Question #1 Group, is the spindle solution the way to go? What is the lifespan of that? When I went to buy a new computer, the computer guy there immediately said to get rid of the HDD I have and get an SSD instead (~2021). I still have the HDD and it's one of the things I am using as a multiple layer backup plan. In other words, I know it could go at any minute and there are other hard drives which have the same data.

Question #3 Group
After the customs are sorted, and the types have been considered, the next thing is to compare costs. I have been wary of refurbished products, but if the cost is significantly lower, would getting two of the same be a better solution than one new one even if two are a bit more expensive than a new one? This way, if one goes bad you have a duplicate on the other.

You're mistaking what a NAS is, vs what an NVMe is.

My current main system has 6x internal SSD, 2 of them NVMe. Each 1TB, so 6TB total.
My NAS has 12x drives. Various sizes, totaling a bit over 100TB. This drive space is accessible from any system in the house.

 

[progrockfrog]

Ok, I will now type less and listen/look more. 🕵️‍♂️

AI Gemini is confirming what I am being told and have read in past years. A spindle drive has a shorter lifespan than non-spindle drives. Why have NAS?

What is the benefit of that over NVMe?

 

[USAFRet]

A spindle drive has a shorter lifespan than non-spindle drives.

bzzzzttt. Wrong.

Why have NAS?

What is the benefit of that over NVMe?

Again, a NAS (Network Attached Storage) has little or nothing to do with what type of drives are involved.
It is simply a small 'server', connected to my router and accessible from all the systems/tablets/phones in my house.
My NAS has 12x drives. 11x HDD, and 1x (the system drive) a SATA III SSD.



If I had LARGE pockets, my 100TB+ NAS might be all solid state.
Since my pocketbook is not unlimited....spinning HDD.

 

[progrockfrog]

Ok, by the looks of this, any flavor of an NAS is not needed now.

I am looking for a portable storage device that will NEVER EVER need to be hooked up in any way shape or form to a network. It will be things like a photo album of wedding photos, graduation photos, vacation memories, "performances" (.pgn my favorite), books in .pdf form you could read on a bus, train, plane, or boat, other media (similar to books but in video formats), programming languages, (.py, .cpp, .js, database stuff), etc....

I am thinking NAS is not needed until I hunker down.

SSD or NVMe SSD would give me what I need. Then, comes the cost issue. What kind of market values out there are there? Is SanDisk the way to go? I called them last year, and they explicitly advised me to get an SSD over the USB stick multi-pronged approach.

 

[USAFRet]

Ok, by the looks of this, any flavor of an NAS is not needed now.

I am looking for a portable storage device that will NEVER EVER need to be hooked up in any way shape or form to a network. It will be things like a photo album of wedding photos, graduation photos, vacation memories, "performances" (.pgn my favorite), books in .pdf form you could read on a bus, train, plane, or boat, other media (similar to books but in video formats), programming languages, (.py, .cpp, .js, database stuff), etc....

I am thinking NAS is not needed until I hunker down.

SSD or NVMe SSD would give me what I need. Then, comes the cost issue. What kind of market values out there are there? Is SanDisk the way to go? I called them last year, and they explicitly advised me to get an SSD over the USB stick multi-pronged approach.

For portable carrying around....
A 1TB SSD drive.
Such as these:
https://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-1TB-Extreme-Portable-SDSSDE61-1T00-G25/dp/B08GTYFC37

https://www.amazon.com/SAMSUNG-Portable-SSD-1TB-MU-PC1T0T/dp/B0874XN4D8

SATA III or NVMe is mostly irrelevant.

 

[progrockfrog]

Thank you for replying faster than I can edit my clerical errors. 😄

So.....

1. If I got a 1tb external hard drive, is that better than two 500gb drives?
2. I think the SanDisk one you linked is NVMe. Does it matter? That is one of the main queries I have. I already have 2 of the HP ones, and they aren't NVMe. Are you suggesting forgetting them for reliable storage and getting an NVMe instead?
3. Another thing I have been wondering is on cell phones and tablets, there have been many problems with the charger port. The connection breaks off physically. So, even if you have a device that would last 10 years, what if that charger/connection port breaks? Is that a simple fix, or do you need to pay big bucks for someone to replace it? (That's a big reason why I get scared when I see "TB". I would prefer to keep things at the GB level. At least then I can transfer files and start anew.)

 

[Bob.B]

I was explaining to a friend yesterday about HDD vs. SSD and then he mentioned his laptop had NVME SSD on it. That threw me for a loop, and I looked it up. I currently have two HP SSD P500 external drives. Am I correct in assuming the main advantage in having NVME as opposed to the SSD ones I have is that there is a speed factor? Does having NVME help with the lifespan of the storage device?

I also have some old regular USB sticks from 10 years ago, and I got some new ones recently 2.0 and 3.0 (pack of 10 each at 32gb). While I do have movies on HDD external drives, backing up all the movies is not my main objective. I might have 10 movies out of those that are hard to find and I could just back those up. The quality is the greatest, so figure 1gb per movie at most. Those would the biggest files that would need to be transferred and stored.

After that, I have hundreds of GBs of photos, document files (mostly .pdf), and audio files which I would initially want backed up until I whittle away the ones I don't need and can remove the duplicates.

The concern I have would be longevity and recovery. The two SSD drives I bought I had in mind to use for simply running Windows or a Linux operating system, and then any files downloaded would then be transferred to back up space (the new USB sticks). I understand USB sticks are less reliable than SSD drives, but since USB sticks are cheap I am going with the game plan to put categorized duplicates on multiple USB sticks so if one goes bad I always have another with the same files. Also, if I accidentally delete files they are on another device. We are talking about lots and lots of small 3mb to 100mb files scattered all over desktop computers, laptops, and tablets as well as cell phones from a half dozen people.

If that makes sense (or please say, "Why not ___?), then what do I do when I get 10gb to 20gb of files that don't need to be sorted anymore and just stored?

Would a NVME SSD drive be a better solution than the SSD drives I already have? I noticed that SanDisk for example has these NVME SSD drives. I also saw cheaper ones (ORICO M.2 Enclosure 4TB 10Gbps M Key NVMe Enclosure Aluminum Portable External Hard Drive Enclosure with USB C to C Cable) for only $17.99.

That to me is awfully cheap compared to the SanDisk ones. Do people really put all their eggs into one basked and get 4TB drives? Maybe I'm old school, but my thinking is to get more of these 32GB drives and spread the storage around. Security is another factor. if I want to share my music, I don't want to give a friend the only storage device that also has my medical and banking information. I could dabble in the bitlocker stuff, but then don't you have to carry around a recovery key to get into it if there is a problem?

I'll stop here for now. What do people recommend when going about storage taking into account longevity and recovery? Figure price as the third factor after I get some idea of what the "experts" do.

If you compare the perf diff between a sata ssd and a nvme ssd connected via usb3 gen 1 I think you will find zip.

Life span diff.....zip.

 

[progrockfrog]

I am sorry, I am too confused. Today, there was an important game in women's chess I need to analyze and look into. The results of a second was expected, but you can see the final outcome tomorrow (EST time) between one and two where two gladiator ladies will clash in tiebreaks at https://lichess.org/broadcast/fide-womens-world-cup-2025--finals/tiebreak-4/2GtbvGhJ#boards

Will it be the young Divya Deshmukh or the elder more experienced Koneru Humpy?

So, let's put this discussion on hold. I will come back later to continue please.

I will look into "perf diff", "usb3gen1" and then how all that relates to "zip".

 

[progrockfrog]