PATCH: Animal handling

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

I've written a patch to implement an idea I've been toying with for a
while: animal handling. This is a skill (primarily for Rangers) which
allows the player to calm a hostile monster by #chatting to it. It
only works on certain creatures (generally non-magical mammalian
animals) and it allows the player to make a hostile monster peaceful
(not tame).

The chance of success is based on the relative difference in levels
between the player and the monster, and the skill level. A player has
chance of quieting a monster of their own level equal to 10% per level
of skill. The chance of failure is halved for every 4 levels of
difference.

A first level Ranger has this skill at the basic level. This means
they have a reasonable chance of calming jackals and sewer rats before
they are mauled to death. At the moment I think it is a little too
easy. I may tweak some of the numbers a bit.

At the moment calming a monster in this way does not yield any XP.
When I finish my partial-XP patch, I will make it give you a fraction
of the monster's XP, but until then it would be too much open to abuse
by alternating calming and attacking a monster to get XP.

The patch is available at:
http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~malcolmr/nethack
It should not affect save/bones compatibility.

Malcolm
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Now just add a character class, perhaps "Swami",
that is essentially a spellcasting type, but has the
"Animal Handling" ability, targeted at snakes and
perhaps other reptiles as well instead of mammals.

[I wonder if an animal handler could tame, and ride,
a mumak?]

xanthian.

[And while we're creating classes, an "American
Indian" class that can ride bareback, and so ride
pretty much any sufficiently large pet it can tame,
and has bow skills like a Ranger, is screaming to be
patched. Or perhaps it should be a subrace of human,
and have role "Ranger"???]

You and your sasquatch mount "Old Paint" ascend.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

> At the moment calming a monster in this way does not yield any XP.
> When I finish my partial-XP patch, I will make it give you a fraction
> of the monster's XP, but until then it would be too much open to
abuse
> by alternating calming and attacking a monster to get XP.
Easy to fix. just make it so you only get XP the first time you calm
it. Or better yet, if you piss off a monster after calming, it won't
listen to you again.
If you set it to say, 1/4 the XP, pissing it off and killing it should
only give you the other 3/4 of the XP.
a few ideas. you can make dragons peaceful, but if you have any
Dscales, or DSM, don't bother.
carrying or standing on a foo corpse should make it impossible to calm.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Irashtar@gmail.com wrote:
>>At the moment calming a monster in this way does not yield any XP.
>>When I finish my partial-XP patch, I will make it give you a fraction
>>of the monster's XP, but until then it would be too much open to
>
> abuse
>
>>by alternating calming and attacking a monster to get XP.
>
> Easy to fix. just make it so you only get XP the first time you calm
> it. Or better yet, if you piss off a monster after calming, it won't
> listen to you again.
> If you set it to say, 1/4 the XP, pissing it off and killing it should
> only give you the other 3/4 of the XP.
> a few ideas. you can make dragons peaceful, but if you have any
> Dscales, or DSM, don't bother.
> carrying or standing on a foo corpse should make it impossible to calm.
>

Actually, why should you get experience at all? Not every action merits
experience. Taming a monster gives no experience, calming should be the
same. Aren't pacifists defined by actions that don't give experience?
What could be more pacifist than calming enraged beasts?
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Irashtar@gmail.com wrote in message news:<1109241494.558254.80040@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>...
> > At the moment calming a monster in this way does not yield any XP.
> > When I finish my partial-XP patch, I will make it give you a fraction
> > of the monster's XP, but until then it would be too much open to abuse
> > by alternating calming and attacking a monster to get XP.
>
> If you set it to say, 1/4 the XP, pissing it off and killing it should
> only give you the other 3/4 of the XP.

That's exactly what my "partial-XP" patch will allow. However I plan
to release it separately, as it will break save/bones compatibility.

I also intend to add similar fractional XP rewards for other means of
rendering a foe (temporarily) harmless without necessarily killing it,
such as putting it to sleep or confusing it. I want to reward forms of
play which do not necessarily involve killing everything you come
across, to allow more class differentiation. Ultimately I would like
to have a genuine "thief" class which isn't just a warrior/mage in
thief's clothing.

Of course, it has been argued before that giving XP is not necessarily
a reward. There can be times in the game when you want to avoid
getting to much XP. This may well be true, but if it is, then IMHO it
is a problem with the existing game that should be fixed rather than
enshrined.

Malcolm
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Irashtar@gmail.com wrote in message news:<1109241494.558254.80040@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>...
> > At the moment calming a monster in this way does not yield any XP.
> > When I finish my partial-XP patch, I will make it give you a fraction
> > of the monster's XP, but until then it would be too much open to abuse
> > by alternating calming and attacking a monster to get XP.
>
> If you set it to say, 1/4 the XP, pissing it off and killing it should
> only give you the other 3/4 of the XP.

That's exactly what my "partial-XP" patch will allow. However I plan
to release it separately, as it will break save/bones compatibility.

I also intend to add similar fractional XP rewards for other means of
rendering a foe (temporarily) harmless without necessarily killing it,
such as putting it to sleep or confusing it. I want to reward forms of
play which do not necessarily involve killing everything you come
across, to allow more class differentiation. Ultimately I would like
to have a genuine "thief" class which isn't just a warrior/mage in
thief's clothing.

Of course, it has been argued before that giving XP is not necessarily
a reward. There can be times in the game when you want to avoid
getting to much XP. This may well be true, but if it is, then IMHO it
is a problem with the existing game that should be fixed rather than
enshrined.

Malcolm
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Andy Johnson <usenet@take-this.out.swervy.tk> wrote in message news:<cvkv8k$dcg$1@joe.rice.edu>...
>
> Actually, why should you get experience at all? Not every action merits
> experience. Taming a monster gives no experience, calming should be the
> same.

It merits experience because it is an exercise of the character's
skills. And so it provides a character with a way to progress in their
class in a themely fashion. A Ranger should gain experience for doing
Ranger-ly things.

To pick the ultimate nonsense: why should a Healer become a better
Healer by running around killing everything in site?

So it make sense in terms of realism. I think it also make sense in
terms of gameplay, as it will expand the ranges of different styles of
play. Playing a ranger should be different from playing a samurai or a
wizard.

> Aren't pacifists defined by actions that don't give experience?
> What could be more pacifist than calming enraged beasts?

No, pacifists are defined by actions that don't attack things. The
fact that this doesn't give any XP is an artifact of this game. True,
this artifact makes pacifism an interesting challenge for people who
are highly skilled at the game, but I am not afraid to take this
challenge away from them. Firstly, such people are few and far between
and I'd rather make the game more interesting for mere mortals like
myself. And secondly I'm sure these demigods will have no trouble
making up new and more bizarre challenges for themselves to replace
any I remove. Pacifying the entire dungeon, maybe?

Malcolm
 
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