Path for upgrading - CPU or GPU or .....

[cannon_dt]

Hi,
I need the help of all the experts around here with some advice.....
My rig:
Mobo : M4A785TD-V EVO
CPU : AMD PHENOM II X2 B50 BE oc'ed to X4 (with lots of help from here!!)
GPU : AMD RADEON 6670
I run xubuntu 15.04 Linux OS

So I jumped on the steam sale band wagon and got myself ARK Survival evolved game. I know, I know - I must have been dreaming but I have always wanted it and it being on sale did not help the cause. Needless to add it is barely playable - I dialled down all settings to LOW and the game at least does not crash anymore but it is BAAAAAD !!

Obviously I know its both my CPU and GPU. So I wanted to seek your help here to see my best upgrade path - gtx 750 TI is within budget but I dont know if that alone would do. So what should I do to future proof this rig with minimum cash outflow (obvious!!!).... CPU or GPU or what??????

Please help....

Thanks,
Ananth

 

[ikaz]

well that is your problem you really need to upgrade both though basically you would need to upgrade your CPU/MB/RAM to switch to intel system. What you should do is post how much your will to spend and the country your in that way people can suggest the best upgrade path.

 

[william p]

Definitely GPU. Especially if you have DDR3 GPU memory now. GTX750Ti will be a big upgrade. If your PSU already has a 6 pin PCIe cable then try for aGTX950. Be sure you have 6GB RAM if you have 32 bit OS. 8GB with 64 bit OS. As long as your resolution is under 1080P it should work for you.

 

[cannon_dt]

I forgot to mention that I got 12 GB RAM - I recently put in 8 GB RAM, added to my existing 4 I dont think there is any problem there.
I am in India. And I dont have a tight budget though but I also should mention that I am not looking for hard core performance - so basically a budget or mid range path that would not be too expensive but would still be fairly future proof. Can we zero in on a budget after some recommendations - if this is not fair, I will probably state that 10-15 K would be preferable....I dont even know if it is possible 🙁

 

[cannon_dt]

Definitely GPU. Especially if you have DDR3 GPU memory now. GTX750Ti will be a big upgrade. If your PSU already has a 6 pin PCIe cable then try for aGTX950. Be sure you have 6GB RAM if you have 32 bit OS. 8GB with 64 bit OS. As long as your resolution is under 1080P it should work for you.

I am pretty sure the 6670 is DDR5. And I dont know if I have the PCIe cable, let me check on that... is this the GPU you are referring to - http://www.amazon.in/ZOTAC-GTX950-128BIT-PCI-E-ZT-90603-10M/dp/B013P30MVK/ref=sr_1_2?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1466961772&sr=1-2&keywords=gtx+950

 

[william p]

Find out if your motherboard has EUFI or Legacy BIOS and get a video card that supports it. This varies from manufacturer to manufacturer. But yes that's one of them.
Sometimes EUFI can be disabled in BIOS. ASUS should be able to tell you.
I upgraded from a 6770 DDR5 to GTX750Ti and it was like night and day. But then again when I went to R9-285 the same thing.
The 750Ti is the best card that runs off of the PCIe slot. There are a few GTX950 (ASUS) that can do that also.
Once you have a PCIe power cable there are more options. See the GPU Hierarchy Chart for cards comparable to the GTX950. You might get a faster AMD for the price of the 750.
But check each card for PCIe requirements. The GTX960, and R9-285/R9-380 are where 8 pin connectors start and a bigger PSU will be needed.
There are a lot of older cards that need the 6 pin cable and won't run with the GTX750. My HD6770 was one of them. Some R7 were rebadged HD cards. So use the chart to compare performance.

 

[cannon_dt]

Find out if your motherboard has EUFI or Legacy BIOS and get a video crad that supports it. This varies from manufacturer to manufacturer. But yes that's one of them.
Sometimes EUFI can be disabled in BIOS. ASUS should be able to tell you.
I upgraded from a 6770 DDR5 to GTX750Ti and it was like night and day. But then again when I went to R9-285 the same thing.
The 750Ti is the best card that runs off of the PCIe slot. There are a few GTX950 (ASUS) that can do that also.
Once you have a PCIe power cable there are more options. See the GPU Hierarchy Chart for cards comparable to the GTX950. You might get a faster AMD for the price of the 750.
But check each card for PCIe requirements. The GTX960, and R9-285/R9-380 are where 8 pin connectors start and a bigger PSU will be needed.
There are a lot of older cards that need the 6 pin cable and won't run with the GTX750. My HD6770 was one of them. Some R7 were rebadged HD cards. So use the chart to compare performance.

OK, some of the stuff you said are way above my understanding. But I get the gist. Can you give me a link for this Hierarchy chart or is it simple googling? I will get the answers to your questions and report back as soon as I can...

Peace

 

[william p]

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gpu-hierarchy,4388.html
Here's the link.
Older motherboards have an older type of BIOS. LGA775 is when the change started so they can be either way. My R9-285 has a dual BIOS switch to run both ways but entry level cards don't have that. MSI GTX750Ti is EUFI, PNY GTX750TI is Legacy. Zotac I don't know.

 

[cannon_dt]

I made a mistake in my original post - my CPU is AMD Phenom II X2 550 Black Edition with 4 cores unlocked and overclocked.

@william p, what about CPU? Would only a GPU change be enough to get ARK running?

 

[william p]

It should be Ok especially with an unlock/overclock. If you do upgrade the cpu later the money spent on the video card, and even PSU won't be wasted it can move forward. If you can go one step higher on the GPU like GTX950 you will enjoy your old computer more and not have to buy again when you upgrade later. But it depends on whether you need to buy a bigger PSU or not.
I've haven't owned AMD since Socket 7 days so I don't know the upgrade paths available to you on CPU.

 

[cannon_dt]

It should be Ok especially with an unlock/overclock. If you do upgrade the cpu later the money spent on the video card, and even PSU won't be wasted it can move forward. If you can go one step higher on the GPU like GTX950 you will enjoy your old computer more and not have to buy again when you upgrade later. But it depends on whether you need to buy a bigger PSU or not.
I've haven't owned AMD since Socket 7 days so I don't know the upgrade paths available to you on CPU.

I opened up the machine and I found that I have a CM Thunder 450 W PSU. So does that meet the needs of the cards you mentioned? In thislink, http://www.coolermaster.com/powersupply/thunder/thunder-450w/ - it says it has 1 PCIe 6+2 pin, is that sufficient?

Also I am unable to find an answer on the UEFI/Legacy question for my M4A785TD-V EVo mobo, can you please help me out there?

Thanks,
Ananth

 

[cannon_dt]

It should be Ok especially with an unlock/overclock. If you do upgrade the cpu later the money spent on the video card, and even PSU won't be wasted it can move forward. If you can go one step higher on the GPU like GTX950 you will enjoy your old computer more and not have to buy again when you upgrade later. But it depends on whether you need to buy a bigger PSU or not.
I've haven't owned AMD since Socket 7 days so I don't know the upgrade paths available to you on CPU.

I have another basic question that might be extraordinarily silly, kindly bear with me - this whole UEFI vs Legacy boot - is that a feature of the mobo or the installed OS or both? I am not able to find any documentation about m4a785td-v evo and UEFI, so what am I missing? And since I run linux I am unable to use this - http://tipsandtricksforum.com/thread-248.html

 

[maxalge]

It should be Ok especially with an unlock/overclock. If you do upgrade the cpu later the money spent on the video card, and even PSU won't be wasted it can move forward. If you can go one step higher on the GPU like GTX950 you will enjoy your old computer more and not have to buy again when you upgrade later. But it depends on whether you need to buy a bigger PSU or not.
I've haven't owned AMD since Socket 7 days so I don't know the upgrade paths available to you on CPU.

I have another basic question that might be extraordinarily silly, kindly bear with me - this whole UEFI vs Legacy boot - is that a feature of the mobo or the installed OS or both? I am not able to find any documentation about m4a785td-v evo and UEFI, so what am I missing? And since I run linux I am unable to use this - http://tipsandtricksforum.com/thread-248.html

ark is a crappy running game


a new gpu alone would not make it playable for you

you would need a whole new build with an i5 + something like a gtx 970 to run high settings 1080p with half decent fps

 

[cannon_dt]

It should be Ok especially with an unlock/overclock. If you do upgrade the cpu later the money spent on the video card, and even PSU won't be wasted it can move forward. If you can go one step higher on the GPU like GTX950 you will enjoy your old computer more and not have to buy again when you upgrade later. But it depends on whether you need to buy a bigger PSU or not.
I've haven't owned AMD since Socket 7 days so I don't know the upgrade paths available to you on CPU.

I have another basic question that might be extraordinarily silly, kindly bear with me - this whole UEFI vs Legacy boot - is that a feature of the mobo or the installed OS or both? I am not able to find any documentation about m4a785td-v evo and UEFI, so what am I missing? And since I run linux I am unable to use this - http://tipsandtricksforum.com/thread-248.html

ark is a crappy running game


a new gpu alone would not make it playable for you

you would need a whole new build with an i5 + something like a gtx 970 to run high settings 1080p with half decent fps

ARK not withstanding, most of my other games too run pretty poorly.... even say, Half Life 2 (which again i got off the steam sale!)... so if I dont change my CPU, would a new GPU help that cause. Like I said I am trying out the path of least resistance here and william's suggestion seemed like a good idea

Peace

 

[ikaz]

Well yes going with a 750ti you should see an improvement on most games just depend if it (the game) uses more cpu or GPU processing.

 

[william p]

EUFI is a newer type of motherboard BIOS. if EUFI isn't mentioned then you probably have the older Legacy type. EUFI video cards won't run on it. Some EUFI BIOS have a Legacy setting to run older components. Some video cards have a switch for this but not at the level your considering.
The 450W PSU probably has a 6 pin PCIe cable. This will expand your GPU choices to GTX950, or R7-360 level. If it's a 6+2 cable then GTX960, R9-380 becomes possible. But that might be a stretch for a 450 W PSU. You didn't say what resolution you play at. The 750 Ti is reaching it's limit at 1080P. with that PSU the GTX950 would be better. The 750Tis big advantage is not needing a PCIe power cable. if you already have that then move up 1 step for very little cost.

 

[cannon_dt]

EUFI is a newer type of motherboard BIOS. if EUFI isn't mentioned then you probably have the older Legacy type. EUFI video cards won't run on it. Some EUFI BIOS have a Legacy setting to run older components. Some video cards have a switch for this but not at the level your considering.
The 450W PSU probably has a 6 pin PCIe cable. This will expand your GPU choices to GTX950, or R7-360 level. If it's a 6+2 cable then GTX960, R9-380 becomes possible. But that might be a stretch for a 450 W PSU. You didn't say what resolution you play at. The 750 Ti is reaching it's limit at 1080P. with that PSU the GTX950 would be better. The 750Tis big advantage is not needing a PCIe power cable. if you already have that then move up 1 step for very little cost.

Great, like you said the GTX950 and 750Ti have no appreciable difference in costs. So now how would I know if the 950 is compatible with my legacy mobo. I am pretty sure its not UEFI, so would the graphic card work?

@ikaz, @maxalge, @william p
Also what are the options towards a CPU upgrade? Just wanted to weigh all the options.

 

[ikaz]

The problem is the cost of a CPU "upgrade" would be better spend on getting a stronger GPU, basically you have the choice of upgrading the GPU or switching to Intel based system but would still need to upgrade your GPU.

 

[maxalge]

The problem is the cost of a CPU "upgrade" would be better spend on getting a stronger GPU, basically you have the choice of upgrading the GPU or switching to Intel based system but would still need to upgrade your GPU.

any decent card will still run like poop on ark because of his weak processor

 

[ikaz]

Ark aside he noted his other games also run slow which it not surprising on a 6670, still a GPU upgrade he should be able to play games (older maybe) at higher FPS with a 750 ti and his old CPU vs moving to an i3/i5 + his old 6670 not to mention much larger cost to which platforms. Long term needs a full system upgrade but he can upgrade his GPU play games now and save up to switch to Intel or Zen down the line.

 

[cannon_dt]

@maxalge
Understood. ARK = poop as long as I have my AMD processor

@ikaz
Your path seems to be the most viable for now like @william p suggested.

Now I am stuck with the follwing:
https://www.amazon.in/gp/product/B00SIOF8R0/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=AVZW9QZ9BO8BU
https://www.amazon.in/gp/product/B00IFZ547Q/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3CPBSNCH1CMI8
Obviously the GTX960 is twice the price of the 750 TI. Here are my questions:
1. In the long term is it better to invest now in a 750 ti for now and then upgrade later on (again) to something like an RX 480 (hopefully I can get someone to get this for me from the US)
2. Will my mobo support both? From https://pcpartpicker.com/products/video-card/?compatible_with=asus-motherboard-m4a785tdvevo#c=208 it looks like it is all supported but I am worried about the UEFI/Legacy thingie that @william p mentioned. So can you please help me out with that?

Thanks a lot guys for all your input - it is certainly lending more clarity towards this goal of mine. Please do bear with me a little longer till I get to the finish line

Peace
Ananth

 

[ikaz]

I tried looking around but I don't see any information if ether of those cards require UEFI may have to contact/email them to see or risk it and return the card if it doesn't work. If your planing to upgrade your complete system in the next 6 to 12 months then I would go with the 750 ti. If your thinking 12 months+ go with the 960 thought make sure you have a good PSU if your not sure you may want to go with the 750 or even GTX950 since it uses less power than 960 (but since the prices seem to be the same I would get 960 over the 950).

 

[cannon_dt]

I tried looking around but I don't see any information if ether of those cards require UEFI may have to contact/email them to see or risk it and return the card if it doesn't work. If your planing to upgrade your complete system in the next 6 to 12 months then I would go with the 750 ti. If your thinking 12 months+ go with the 960 thought make sure you have a good PSU if your not sure you may want to go with the 750 or even GTX950 since it uses less power than 960 (but since the prices seem to be the same I would get 960 over the 950).

I thought my CM Thunder 450 W is good enough for the 960. All these parameters are driving me mad 😀
I will try and contact someone, though I am unsure if anyone at amazon would help? Let me hit the product page.....

Also is https://pcpartpicker.com/products/video-card/?compatible_with=asus-motherboard-m4a785tdvevo not reliable? It states that most gpus are compatible with my mobo, dont know how to interpret that 🙁

 

[cannon_dt]

I am so tired of looking around - nowhere can I find any information on this whole UEFI / Legacy thing for these GPUs. Why is this so difficult? Is it easier to go in the reverse and find GPUs that actually support legacy and pick one from that? 🙁

 

[maxalge]

I am so tired of looking around - nowhere can I find any information on this whole UEFI / Legacy thing for these GPUs. Why is this so difficult? Is it easier to go in the reverse and find GPUs that actually support legacy and pick one from that? 🙁

look for cards that have bios switches


they are a thing =)