Pc Workstation for Architectural rendering Vray/3ds max

WillTseng · Feb 3, 2015

Hi there I have absolutely no clue about desktop pcs but want to purchase a custom one. My budget is anywhere between $1000 - $2500 I have a macbook pro 2.3ghz I7 with 16gb ddr3 so I was hoping my pc would be at least better than this.

Also is there a site that I can custom build and get delivered with it already put together ?

Im currently looking at this site but I have no idea if their parts and prices are good.

http://www.centrecom.com.au/buildpc
they have just suggested this build

Intel i7-4790 3.60GHZ Quad-Core 8MB Cach... - SKU: BX80646I74790, QTY: 1
Gigabyte Z97-HD3 LGA1150 ATX Motherboard - SKU: GA-Z97-HD3, QTY: 1
16GB (8GBx2) Kit Kingston Hyper X DDR3-1... - SKU: HX316C10FBK2/16, QTY: 1
Western Digital 1TB Blue 3.5" Internal H... - SKU: WD10EZEX, QTY: 1
NZXT Source 340 Black S/Panel USB 3.0 - SKU: CA-S340W-B1, QTY: 1
eVGA SuperNOVA 650W G1 80+ Gold Fully Mo... - SKU: 120-G1-0650-XR, QTY: 1
PC Assembly Labour - SKU: CUSTOM BUILD, QTY: 1
OCZ Arc 100 240GB Solid State Drive - SKU: ARC100-25SAT3-240G, QTY: 1
Corsair H60SE Liquid CPU Cooler - SKU: CW-9060007-WW, QTY: 1
Leadtek Quadro K620 2GB GDDR3 Graphics C... - SKU: Quadro K620, QTY: 1
Windows 7 Professional OEM 64BIT Service... - SKU: FQC-04649/08289, QTY: 1

Thanks

Bossyfins · Feb 4, 2015

Its pretty bad to be honest. You can build one that has twice the performance of what this offers.

WillTseng · Feb 4, 2015

Ok but where from and what can I buy? They offered this for $1800 AUD excluding delivery

WillTseng · Feb 4, 2015

Is this boxx render pro any good?

bambiboom · Feb 4, 2015

WillTseng :

Gooday WillTseng,

In my view, the current best cost / performance platform for a workstation is a Xeon E5-1600- series v3 on an X99 motherboard, with a Quadro GPU in the case of Autodesk, Adobe, and Dessualt (Solidworks , Catia) visualization applications or a Firepro if it's scientific/ calculation-based. The LGA2011-3 seems the best choice as the memory bandwidth is doubled and there are 40 PCIe lanes to the 28 of LGA1150, but most importantly, you can start with a quad core CPU and later change to an 18-core. With LGA1150, the limit is four cores. If you're using GPU-based rendering, fewer and faster cores are better, but rendering is one of the limited applications that can use every core.

With this is mind, here is a idea for a system that should have have good performance for the cost for your uses;

BambiBoom PixelCannon Cadamodarendergrapharific iWork TurboBlast ExtremeSignature SuperModel 8000 ®©$$™®£™©™_ 1.16.15

1. CPU: Intel Xeon E5-1650 v3 Six-Core Processor 3.5 / 3.8GHz 0GT/s 15MB LGA 2011-v3 CPU> $575
____ http://ark.intel.com/products/82765/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E5-1650-v3-15M-Cache-3_50-GHz
http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?name=E51650V3BX
____ http://www.amazon.com/XEON-E5-1650V3-6C-3-5G-15MB/dp/B00MU045JU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1411580728&sr=8-1&keywords=E5-1650+v3

2. Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO CPU cooler > $31.

3. Motherboard: ASRock X99 Extreme4 LGA 2011-v3 Intel X99 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard > $240
____ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157543&cm_re=asrock_x99_extreme_4-_-13-157-543-_-Product

4. Crucial 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM ECC DDR4 2133 (PC4-17000) Server Memory Model CT2K8G4RFS4213 > $244
____ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148839&cm_re=Crucial_16GB_%282_x_8GB%29_288-Pin_DDR4_SDRAM_ECC_DDR4_2133_%28PC4-17000%29_Server_Memory-_-20-148-839-_-Product

5. GPU: PNY VCQK2200-PB Quadro K2200 4GB 128-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready Workstation Video Card > $459
____ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133559&cm_re=quadro_k2200-_-14-133-559-_-Product

6. Crucial MX100 CT256MX100SSD1 2.5" 256GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) ) > $113 (OS, applications, working files) > $113. (
____ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148820&cm_re=crucial_mx110-_-20-148-820-_-Product

7. WD BLACK SERIES WD1003FZEX 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive> $75 (£57.18 Scan UK) (Files, Backup, System Image)

8. CORSAIR HX Series HX750 750W ATX12V 2.3 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI CrossFire 80 PLUS GOLD Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply New 4th Gen CPU Certified Haswell Ready> $130

9. Samsung SH-224DB/BEBE 24X SATA DVD±RW Internal Drive w/o Software (Black) SH-224DB $17.99

10. LIAN LI PC-A75X No Power Supply ATX Full Tower Case (Black) CA-A75 >$170

10A . Corsair Obsidian 750D Large Tower Case Black with Side Window No PSU > £124.50 Scan UK)
____ http://www.scan.co.uk/products/corsair-obsidian-750d-black-full-tower-case-aluminium-steel-with-side-window-3x140mm-fans-usb-30-e-a

11. Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64-bit w/ SP1 (1-Pack, DVD), OEM MSFQC04649 > $138.99 (£119.70 Scan U.K)

________________________________________________________

TOTAL = $ 2,196 US

I suspect that the cost in AUD will be higher, but this is the kind of system that is appropriate for the applications you mention. The Quadro k2200 (4GB) is excellent for the cost. Even the K620 (2GB) performs well.

I admire the Boxx systems for design, specification, and appear ot be very good quality, but they seem very expensive Plus, if you change from the standard components- too expensive by half. I think you'd have better value with a Dell Precision T5810:

http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?oc=cap5810w7p008&model_id=precision-t5810-workstation&c=us&l=en&s=bsd&cs=04

> and Dell support is very good.

I'll also make a somewhat eccentric suggestion, which is to buy and upgrade a Dell Precision T7500. You can start with a low end CPU and change it to a pair of Xeon X5690 6-core @3.47 / 3.73GHz for 12 cores /24 threads., add an SSD and good workstation GPU. I did a similar project a few weeks ago:

Dell Precision T5500 (2011) Original: Xeon E5620 quad core @ 2.4 / 2.6 GHz > 6GB DDR3 ECC Reg 1066 > Quadro FX 580 (512MB) > Dell PERC 6/i SAS /SATA controller > Seagate Cheetah 15K 146GB > Linksys WMP600N WiFi > Windows 7 Professional 64-bit > Cost= $171
[ Passmark system rating = 1479 / CPU = 4067 / 2D= 520 / 3D= 311 / Mem= 1473 / Disk= 1208]

Dell Precision T5500 > Xeon X5680 six -core @ 3.33 / 3.6GHz, 24GB DDR3 ECC 1333 > Quadro 4000 (2GB ) > Samsung 840 250GB /WD RE4 Enterprise 1TB > M-Audio 192 sound card > Linksys WMP600N PCI WiFi > Windows 7 Professional 64> HP 2711x (1920 X 1440)
[ Passmark system rating = 3339 / CPU = 9347 / 2D= 684 / 3D= 2030 / Mem= 1871 / Disk= 2234]

> and as I had the Quadro 4000, Samsung 840, and WD RE 4 spare, my cash outlay was only about $650. If I had to buy everything it would have been about $1000-1100. And, in the future I can add a 2nd 6-core for about $350. Performance is up to current standards and these systems are beautilfully made and designed like servers for long, full-bore use. I've had 5 Precisions all used and never a failure

Cheers,

BambiBoom

HP z420 (2014) > Xeon E5-1620 quad core @ 3.6 / 3.8GHz > 24GB DDR3 ECC 1600 RAM > Quadro K2200 (4GB) > Intel 730 480GB > Western Digital Black WD1003FZEX 1TB> M-Audio 192 sound card > Linksys AE3000 USB WiFi > 2X Dell Ultrasharp U2715H 2560 X 1440 > Windows 7 Professional 64 >
[ Passmark Rating = 4402 > CPU= 9280 / 2D= 797 / 3D=3480 / Mem= 2558 / Disk= 4498]

WillTseng · Feb 4, 2015

Thanks so much I just read it and will mae some comparisons later bambi I just made a random build just then

Intel Xeon E3-1276 V3 3.6GHz Quad-Core Processor
$499.00 $499.00 Scorptec
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CPU Cooler

Corsair H105 73.0 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler
$159.00 $159.00 CPL Online
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Motherboard

ASRock Z97 PRO4 ATX LGA1150 Motherboard
$145.00 $145.00 CPL Online
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Memory

Corsair Dominator Platinum 16GB (4 x 4GB) DDR3-2133 Memory
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Storage

Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive
$67.00 $67.00 PLE Computers
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Add Additional Storage
Video Card

Asus GeForce GTX 980 4GB Video Card
$775.00 $775.00 CPL Online
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Case

Fractal Design Define R4 (Black Pearl) ATX Mid Tower Case
$129.00 $129.00 PLE Computers
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Power Supply

EVGA 750W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply
$145.00 $145.00 CPL Online
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Optical Drive Choose An Optical Drive
Operating System

Microsoft Windows 7 Professional SP1 (OEM) (64-bit)

What do you think?

WillTseng · Feb 4, 2015

Ive personally read the GTX 980 is very good

bambiboom · Feb 4, 2015

WillTseng :

WillTseng,

The system you've listed would be a good performer. Probably an SSD of about 250GB would be a big boost. Consider a Crucial MX100 and partition it with Windows and programs in one, and working files in the other. I would say the power supply is bit large- 550-600W is plenty and I'd recommend Seasonic for quality. Have their medium or upper quality as well- renderings can run the system full speed for hours.

The Xeon E3 is quite good, but as mentioned earlier, if you can start with LGA2011-3, the memory bandwidth is double, the PCIe lanes go from 28 to 40 and you can later change the CPU for 6,8,18,12,14, and 18 core! The more cores /threads you apply to rendering the faster it goes. The extra PCIe lanes on an X99 board will mean you can use an M.2 SSD- and these are astoundingly fast- 10GB/s rated.LGA2011-3 and X99 could will extend the life of the system two or three years, with higher performance, and end up costing less per year if that makes sense.

If you're modeling in 3ds Max, I would suggest using a GPU that is certified by Autodesk for that use:

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/syscert?siteID=123112&id=18844534&results=1&stype=graphic&product_group=6&release=2015&os=8192&manuf=all&opt=2

I tried a GTX 285 and was never able to get a useable rendering in VRay for Sketchup. On any file over 30MB,it would crash or produce terrible artifacts.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

WillTseng · Feb 4, 2015

Ok I thin ill trust you on this one. I am probably going with your set up is there anything you put in there that is unnecessary?

I want to save some money and I don't know all the functions of the parts you picked.

thanks!

WillTseng · Feb 4, 2015

Also how do i get the parts you listed? and I don't know how to put them together

WillTseng · Feb 4, 2015

I think its all too expensive for me. I still have to buy a display,keyboard mouse etc..

Could you maybe drop the setup to include display,keyboard and mouse

all for $2000-2500 AUD?

WillTseng · Feb 4, 2015

Even $2000 USD would be nice

I don't mind average keyboard and mouse and decent display
I also don't need unnecessary storage etc. Its more just for rendering big projects so fast processor
and also I don't need to watch movies either so maybe the cd slot is unnecessary

thanks

bambiboom · Feb 4, 2015

WillTseng :

WillTseng,

The parts list is somewhat optimized by selecting the best cost to performance components and believe that it is difficult to improve that ratio for the E5-1650 v3 , the Quadro K2200, and the Crucial MX100 SSD. If the budget were leaning more towards performance a n features than economies, the motherboard would be a Supermicro and the graphics card a K4200- but that's going in the wrong cost direction- the choices here are intended to the best performance for the least cost. There are not any parts that are unnecessary,, but a couple that might be substituted- at a lower cost, and there is careful shopping for bargains.

Cost can be saved in a more economical case, but consider the number of drive bays you might use in future, that a larger, more open case is easier to work with and offers better air flow and spaces for fans for cooling, and a higher quality case should be quieter. I recommend steering away from gaming system cases as they are in fact too open- they have large fans close to the outer surfaces with large area grilles and these will be noisier. If you notice, proprietary workstations have shrouds and ducts so that the fans are a bit buried inside to lessen fan noise. Still, you should please yourself with the appearance. I tend towards very plain, non-distracting looking ones, but you might like something with more fizz. t

The power supply could be somewhat reduced- perhaps 620-650W, but I suggest staying with Seasonic or Corsair and not the lowest level product line.

The other aspect of building a system is to shop widely and look for special bargains. At the end of the year, I saw an offer for the Intel 730 480GB for $200 and bought one. I wish I'd bought two- now they're $450.

I meant to mention one other option, suggested only as a comparison of a higher level of quality and forward-looking. This also makes ordering and assembling far simpler If I were building a system it would be based on this:

http://www.supermicro.com/products/system/tower/7038/SYS-7038A-i.cfm

> which is a Supermicro Superworkstation 7038A consisting of a case, a Supermicro X10DAi, dual Xeon LGA-2011-3 motherboard with 16 RAM slots, and 900W power supply- and quite industrial quality case with many drive bays- about $650 in the US. This is attractive as really you only need to plug in the CPU(s), GPU, memory, and drives and the system has outstanding specification and expandability. With dual CPU's and all those PCIe slots, this could be eventually a Personal Supercomputer, with NVIDIA Teslas or IBM Xeon PHI coprocessors, or a pair of Quadro K6000's in SLI and 8 drives- that kind of thing, but could start out relatively simply with a single CPU, The CPU though should be a Xeon E5-2600 series - not 1600 series so as to add a second one later and the 2600 series are quite a bit more expensive fro the same speed. The X10DAi Motherboard is a very high performing and reliable. Again, the idea in mentioning this option is a way to reduce the complexity of ordering and assembling- it's only plugging in several components, plus the potential for very high performance, reliability and expansion over time is very high. I tend to think of computer system in terms of cost per year -including the residual value when it's changed and a more expensive system that lasts two years longer and has a higher residual value may be cheaper in cost per year.

Also, a little detail: I'm not entirely clear on whether you will assemble the system or you'll be having a shop do it, whoever orders the RAM memory should check that the brand and models approved as compatible for that motherboard.

In any event, I wish you luck with the system you end up doing and would enjoying hearing of your progress.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

WillTseng · Feb 5, 2015

Thanks for your help bambi. I think I've decided to go with: Not sure if ill swap to an I7 4970 k 3.6ghz? the k620 seem enough for me

Intel Xeon Quad-Core E3-1231 V3, 3.40GHZ, 8MB Cache, LGA1150 CPU 1 $369.50 x
Motherboard *
Up to 1 per build ASRock (B85M-HDS) - LGA 1150 - Intel B85 - HDMI SATA 6Gb/s - Micro ATX Intel Motherboard 1 $86.00 x
RAM *
Up to 4 per build Crucial 16GB (2X8G) DDR4 2133MHz Desktop DIMM 1 $269.00 x
Storage Devices *
Up to 4 per build Seagate 1TB Barracuda 3.5" Internal Hard Drive ST1000DM003 1 $71.50 x
External Storage
Up to 4 per build
Case *
Up to 1 per build Corsair Obsidian Series 350D With Window 1 $149.00 x
Case accessories
Up to 10 per build
Power Supply
Up to 1 per build eVGA SuperNOVA 650W G1 80+ Gold Fully Modular Power Supply 1 $129.00 x
Optical Drives
Up to 2 per build
AssemblyLabour *
Up to 1 per build PC Assembly Labour 1 $82.50 x
Solid State Drive
Up to 2 per build OCZ Arc 100 240GB Solid State Drive 1 $125.00 x
CPU Cooler
Up to 1 per build Cooler Master Hyper 212X CPU Cooler 1 $45.50 x
SSD Bracket
Up to 2 per build
Monitor
Up to 4 per build 22" BenQ GW2255 LED Monitor VGA DVI VC 1 $149.00 x
Network Adapters
Up to 1 per build
Graphic Card
Up to 2 per build Leadtek Quadro K620 2GB GDDR3 Graphics Card - For Designers/Multimedia Creators 1 $299.00 x
KeyBoard
Up to 4 per build Logitech Wireless MK710 Keyboard and Mouse Combo (920-002510)

WillTseng · Feb 5, 2015

Comes to $2200 AUD from the retailer I'm looking at

bambiboom · Feb 5, 2015

WillTseng :

WillTseng,

The listed components should have a reasonable performance, and I think the Quadro K620 is a good selection.

The i7-4790 does have significantly higher clock speeds- 4.0 / 4.4 GHz I think is about the fastest native (non-overclocked) Intel CPU speeds and if that is in your budget, I think that would be advisable.

One component that might be improved significantly without a very large increase in cost is the motherboard. You might consider using an:

ASUS H97M-PLUS LGA 1150 Intel H97 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard > $102

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813132119&cm_re=ASUS_H97M_Plus-_-13-132-119-_-Product

> which has a higher performance chipset, 4 RAM slots and 32GB support instead of 16GB of the ASRock, good configuration of PCIe slots and much faster disk subsystem that includes an M.2 slot for a very fast PCIe SSD.

Consider the were a Seasonic +Gold 650W power supply

Yes, looks very good. I like that Corsair case as well.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

WillTseng · Feb 5, 2015

Ok thankyou, one last question Ive heard GTX performs a lot better than quadros on many rendering applications but Im scared like you said they would crash, is this true? a gtx 960 is the same price as a k620 but apparently twice as fast?

bambiboom · Feb 6, 2015

WillTseng :

WillTseng,

In order to decide on the best GPU, it is necessary to know if the rendering program is CPU or GPU based. and if it's GPU-based, is it CUDA acclerated. CUDA acclelerated in effect means that the CUDA cores in teh GPU act as coprocessors to the main CPU . th e more CUAD cores the better. Programs by Autodesk and Adobe are examples of CUDA accelerated programs- Solidworks also and the rendering done within these programs can use all the CPY cores and are aadditonally assisted by the CUDA cores. In the case of Vray and IRay, mental ray- what are called "ray tracing" rendering, are more GPU-based.

It's a difficult question and has to be based on the programs used. If you are using both CPU and GPU programs and autoDesk /Adobe then the solution is best on many cores and with a Quadro with many CUDa cores for examples. If the rendering is strictily GPU-based, have a pair of 384-bit, 4GB GTX's- that kind of thing. The other complication is that NVIDIA tends to seperate the calculation density in workstation cards into Quadro and Tesla cards, so if the rendering program is calculation-intensive, and AMD is better! Also, there's the consideration of which GPU is good for 3D modeling if you're doing that and whether fur and particles are involved- complicated.

The best method is to visit the website for each rendering program you are using or are likely to use and visit forums to find out how it works and which GPU's are recommended.

As far as I know, in general, a fast GTX with a lot of CUDA cores are fast at ray tracing rendering- and VRay is an example for this, but I was never able to get a 512-bit GTX 285 to work properly on VRay for Sketchup and that was a dual 4-core 3.2GHz Xeon system. There were either crashes or artifacts and I went back to a Quadro FX 4800. If you're doing animation, that's yet another level of considerations. Also, I think- not absolutely certain- you have ot use a workstation card- Quadro or Firepro to have the drivers necessary to use multiple lighting sources in some rendering programs and also to have 10-bit color depth.

I apologize that this answer is not definitive and in effect asking more questions, but it's important to get right and the situation is complicated by the recent shift towards more GPU and OpenGL rendering.

What are your programs. how big are the 3D models' files, the rendering sizes, and how much rendering are you doing?

Have you determined how- by whom- the new system is to be built?

Cheers,

BambiBoom

WillTseng · Feb 6, 2015

Will be using mostly programs such as auto cad,archicad,vray,3ds max

bambiboom · Feb 6, 2015

WillTseng :

WillTseng,

I apologize for drawing this out, but:

1. What is your maximum budget for the GPU

2. Would you consider used?

Because ArchiCad runs very well on AMD Firepro, but Autodesk applications are better on Quadros, this is bit difficult as either choice requires a higher line card so that choice can accomplish the full range of tasks.

If the budget is sufficient, my recommendation would be to buy a used Firepro W7000. If you'd like to buy new and the budget is modest, I'd say Quadro K620, but here are of course many, many possibilities Because of 3ds Max, my tendency would be not to use GTX, but you could of course, buy a mid-line used one and try it and buy a higher line new one if it worked well for you.

If you try a used one, and have a good buy, the experiment may not cost anything. I bought a slightly used Quadro K2200 for $100 less(-25%) than new and after using it three months could probably sell it for my cost. I thought I'd yearn for a K4200, but the K2200 is so good I may keep the experiment. If you need to stop fussing, and can find a used K2200 within your budget, you might consider it- far exceeded my expectations. There don't appear to have been any used ones on Ebahhhh.au and new ones have sold for about $770 AUD.

You're going in a good direction, almost done. In my view, of all the choices, the GPU is worth the most fussing about.

Good onya, no worries, reckon she'll be right,

BambiBoom

Pc Workstation for Architectural rendering Vray/3ds max

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