Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)
(This message was inspiried by a few things said in the YANI: changing
character classes thread)
I played for about three years before reading any spoilers, and I had
read the guidebook. (Not the Beginner's Guide- the guidebook that comes
with the game). So I'm a good example of one who had played unspoiled
for awhile, and I think I can speak for them. I also played the old
hack before finding out about nethack.
As far as I got before reading any spoilers was Medusa's level (but
not past the water), had never gotten past level 2 or 3 of the quest,
had never conquered Fort Ludios, and had never gotten past the second
Sokoban level. Only once had I ever found Fort Ludios. Only once or
twice encountered an alter besides the one at minetown. (These are just
markers to give you an idea of how far I had gotten and how often, not
directly about possibility of winning unspoiled).
OK
Things I did not know what they did or did not know any use for:
free action
sustain ability (thought it made stuff like invisibility, see
invisibile or blindness last longer)- "ring of fixed attributes" might
be a better name?
cancellation
coranthaum
dexterity (I thought it was for shooting/throwing things)
any musical instruments (except the horns that ID themselves)
bells
dwarvish, orcish cloaks, mummy wrappings (knew nothing of magic
protection)
any potions of water
donating to priests
create familiar spell (not that I ever got good enough in spells to
cast it)
fedora (thought it must have some use)
towels (didn't think of wearing a towel)
lenses (besides protecting against raven pecking)
good uses of getting blind or confused
There are LOTS of things I had never thought of trying before reading
the spoilers:
polymorphing objects
dipping stuff into holy water (I think the only thing I ever tried
dipping was a potion of oil into an oil lamp to try to refill it)
price IDing (I had caught onto ?oID being the cheapest, but the prices
seemed to change enough that I didn't think any other price IDing was
possible)
engrave IDing with wands
shooting wands at myself (for speed monster or teleport)
dipping a unicorn horn into potions
that pets would step on cursed objects if there was food there
helping a pet or other monster out of a trap
Never figured out how to convert an alter
OK, those things I could've thought of and probably would have
eventually if I hadn't spoiled myself, but here are some things I likely
would never have figured out:
using a pit and a boulder to get rid of the iron ball
praying on an alter to change plain water into holy water
why a bag of holding would explode when I put an unIDed wand into it
greasing a bag or a cloak
wearing a mummy wrapping to make myself visible, or why a potion of
invisibility was sometimes permanent (I would just quit if I stayed
invisibile much longer than it usually wore off)
repairing armor and weapons with confused scrolls of enchant
weapon/armor
that reflection could affect floating eyes or Medusa (you can still
see them)
Faulty methods I usually used when not spoiled:
always left my pet behind unless I started with a polymorph wand to
turn it into something tougher
thought gaining levels fast as possible was good (how could you know
otherwise without being spoiled?)
thought throwing hand weapons did significant damage
never picked up: tinning kits, gems (unless I was an archeologist),
mattocks (pickaxes weigh less- didn't think of using them as weapons),
T-shirts
thought it was a bigger penatly for monks eating meat or using weapons
didn't think there was any penalty for being a murderer or killing
peaceful monsters
didn't know that spellcasting made you hungry (I'd starve every healer
if I lived long enough to starve)
The Late game:
would take a long time to figure out how to get into the wizard's
tower unless the portal happened to be in your way- even if you map the
whole level that doesn't include going into corners or the few spaces at
each dead end. Even when I won in wizard mode soon after getting
spoiled I couldn't figure out how to get to the wizard so I wished for
the Book of the Dead.
If an unspoiled player had never played Zork then it would be near
impossible to figure out how to open the vibrating square and very hard
to figure out the bad effects of carrying or wearing the Amulet
it would also be quite hard to figure out how to get to the next level
from the plane of earth- finding the portal is hard enough, but an
unspoiled player who's there for the first time doesn't even know what
he's looking for
Estimated time it would take me to win the game unspoiled (if ever):
about 7-9 years
Chances of not giving up on the game before then:
approximately 1 in 976 trillion
As far as I'm concerned, the game as it is now is not meant to be
played unspoiled for more than 2-3 years. It's good to play awhile and
try to figure out some things before getting spoiled but to me it seems
your supposed to get spoiled.
Asher
Things I still can't figure out:
what wisdom does when intelligence is your spellcasting attribute
what happens when a magic trap makes your pack shake violently or makes
you long for a distant homeland
--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
(This message was inspiried by a few things said in the YANI: changing
character classes thread)
I played for about three years before reading any spoilers, and I had
read the guidebook. (Not the Beginner's Guide- the guidebook that comes
with the game). So I'm a good example of one who had played unspoiled
for awhile, and I think I can speak for them. I also played the old
hack before finding out about nethack.
As far as I got before reading any spoilers was Medusa's level (but
not past the water), had never gotten past level 2 or 3 of the quest,
had never conquered Fort Ludios, and had never gotten past the second
Sokoban level. Only once had I ever found Fort Ludios. Only once or
twice encountered an alter besides the one at minetown. (These are just
markers to give you an idea of how far I had gotten and how often, not
directly about possibility of winning unspoiled).
OK
Things I did not know what they did or did not know any use for:
free action
sustain ability (thought it made stuff like invisibility, see
invisibile or blindness last longer)- "ring of fixed attributes" might
be a better name?
cancellation
coranthaum
dexterity (I thought it was for shooting/throwing things)
any musical instruments (except the horns that ID themselves)
bells
dwarvish, orcish cloaks, mummy wrappings (knew nothing of magic
protection)
any potions of water
donating to priests
create familiar spell (not that I ever got good enough in spells to
cast it)
fedora (thought it must have some use)
towels (didn't think of wearing a towel)
lenses (besides protecting against raven pecking)
good uses of getting blind or confused
There are LOTS of things I had never thought of trying before reading
the spoilers:
polymorphing objects
dipping stuff into holy water (I think the only thing I ever tried
dipping was a potion of oil into an oil lamp to try to refill it)
price IDing (I had caught onto ?oID being the cheapest, but the prices
seemed to change enough that I didn't think any other price IDing was
possible)
engrave IDing with wands
shooting wands at myself (for speed monster or teleport)
dipping a unicorn horn into potions
that pets would step on cursed objects if there was food there
helping a pet or other monster out of a trap
Never figured out how to convert an alter
OK, those things I could've thought of and probably would have
eventually if I hadn't spoiled myself, but here are some things I likely
would never have figured out:
using a pit and a boulder to get rid of the iron ball
praying on an alter to change plain water into holy water
why a bag of holding would explode when I put an unIDed wand into it
greasing a bag or a cloak
wearing a mummy wrapping to make myself visible, or why a potion of
invisibility was sometimes permanent (I would just quit if I stayed
invisibile much longer than it usually wore off)
repairing armor and weapons with confused scrolls of enchant
weapon/armor
that reflection could affect floating eyes or Medusa (you can still
see them)
Faulty methods I usually used when not spoiled:
always left my pet behind unless I started with a polymorph wand to
turn it into something tougher
thought gaining levels fast as possible was good (how could you know
otherwise without being spoiled?)
thought throwing hand weapons did significant damage
never picked up: tinning kits, gems (unless I was an archeologist),
mattocks (pickaxes weigh less- didn't think of using them as weapons),
T-shirts
thought it was a bigger penatly for monks eating meat or using weapons
didn't think there was any penalty for being a murderer or killing
peaceful monsters
didn't know that spellcasting made you hungry (I'd starve every healer
if I lived long enough to starve)
The Late game:
would take a long time to figure out how to get into the wizard's
tower unless the portal happened to be in your way- even if you map the
whole level that doesn't include going into corners or the few spaces at
each dead end. Even when I won in wizard mode soon after getting
spoiled I couldn't figure out how to get to the wizard so I wished for
the Book of the Dead.
If an unspoiled player had never played Zork then it would be near
impossible to figure out how to open the vibrating square and very hard
to figure out the bad effects of carrying or wearing the Amulet
it would also be quite hard to figure out how to get to the next level
from the plane of earth- finding the portal is hard enough, but an
unspoiled player who's there for the first time doesn't even know what
he's looking for
Estimated time it would take me to win the game unspoiled (if ever):
about 7-9 years
Chances of not giving up on the game before then:
approximately 1 in 976 trillion
As far as I'm concerned, the game as it is now is not meant to be
played unspoiled for more than 2-3 years. It's good to play awhile and
try to figure out some things before getting spoiled but to me it seems
your supposed to get spoiled.
Asher
Things I still can't figure out:
what wisdom does when intelligence is your spellcasting attribute
what happens when a magic trap makes your pack shake violently or makes
you long for a distant homeland
--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
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