Power Outlet Grounding?

[Guest]

I just recently fixed the cord on my power strip because the ground post thing was gone, did this so the surge suppression would work and I can hook up a PC to it. I then tested it with a tester and the outlet itself did not have a ground connection. (I tested the tester it with a 100% known grounded outlet) My dad explained to me that our ground wire is connected to our neutral at some point in the breaker box and at the electric pole outside.

My question is, Can we then, in theory just connect the neutral and the ground with a jumper or will that energize the ground post in the plug when a load is applied? My dad will help me with anything I need to do as I am only 13 (yes it complies with the ToS)

BOM does not permit children under the age of 13 to become members, post home pages or web sites on our service.

and I don't particularly like messing with lethal voltage.

 

[VincentP]

Earth should not be connected to neutral. This is really dangerous.
Appliances connect the casing to earth so that in the event of a short the appliance is grounded.
The neutral wire in mains power is live because of other connected appliances.
Connecting the two makes any appliance with a ground pin potentially live.
If you have a residual current device installed, joining these two would cause it to trip.

 

[Guest]

Earth should not be connected to neutral. This is really dangerous.
Appliances connect the casing to earth so that in the event of a short the appliance is grounded.
The neutral wire in mains power is live because of other connected appliances.
Connecting the two makes any appliance with a ground pin potentially live.
If you have a residual current device installed, joining these two would cause it to trip.

Ahhhhhh. Let me go talk to him again. I might have not understood something correctly.
This is what he said- We live in an older house and we can't run a ground wire or pull new wire. If we install a GFCI breaker on my circuit, would that help with anything? Can a true isolated circuit share a neutral with another circuit?

 

[USAFRet]

I just recently fixed the cord on my power strip

Buy a new power strip.

 

[Guest]

I just recently fixed the cord on my power strip

Buy a new power strip.

That is actually how I fixed it. I just explained it different.

 

[VincentP]

It doesn't really matter how old you are. If you aren't a licensed electrician you shouldn't be working on mains power.
If the earth on your power socket is not earthed, that would be illegal in most developed countries.
Any modern home should have RCD protection on all power circuits as well, and this can easily be added if it is not there.
This would need an electrician to look at it.
For your power board, by all means pull it apart and see how it works but don't use it again. Buy a new one.
This simply isn't worth risking your life.

 

[Guest]

It doesn't really matter how old you are. If you aren't a licensed electrician you shouldn't be working on mains power.
If the earth on your power socket is not earthed, that would be illegal in most developed countries.
Any modern home should have RCD protection on all power circuits as well, and this can easily be added if it is not there.
This would need an electrician to look at it.
For your power board, by all means pull it apart and see how it works but don't use it again. Buy a new one.
This simply isn't worth risking your life.

My Dad doesn't work on mains power. He has a Good friend who is licensed for major mains work, we have 2 breakers on our main line into the house. 1 goes from the actual power pole to our Generator box. the second one turns off main power to the breaker box. In the winter, since we have a Huge generator/welder we disconnect from the power grid during an outage and just power our whole house. We had that installed by a licensed electrician. If we do any minor mains work, we cut both switches and check for voltage before doing any work. We have only done mains work a handful of times and all of them we called the electrician friend who told us EXACTLY what to do and he also walked us through it. The point is...We should probably install and RCD on each circuit right?

 

[VincentP]

It doesn't really matter how old you are. If you aren't a licensed electrician you shouldn't be working on mains power.
If the earth on your power socket is not earthed, that would be illegal in most developed countries.
Any modern home should have RCD protection on all power circuits as well, and this can easily be added if it is not there.
This would need an electrician to look at it.
For your power board, by all means pull it apart and see how it works but don't use it again. Buy a new one.
This simply isn't worth risking your life.

My Dad doesn't work on mains power. He has a Good friend who is licensed for major mains work, we have 2 breakers on our main line into the house. 1 goes from the actual power pole to our Generator box. the second one turns off main power to the breaker box. In the winter, since we have a Huge generator/welder we disconnect from the power grid during an outage and just power our whole house. We had that installed by a licensed electrician. If we do any minor mains work, we cut both switches and check for voltage before doing any work. We have only done mains work a handful of times and all of them we called the electrician friend who told us EXACTLY what to do and he also walked us through it. The point is...We should probably install and RCD on each circuit right?

In your breaker box there will be a circuit breaker for each circuit.
The current rating of this breaker is to protect the wiring on the circuit, that would typically be 16A here in Australia.
If your mains power is only 120V, I guess the wire would be thicker with a higher current rating.
Newer style breakers have RCD protection as well. These will be larger than the old style breakers. They trip on too much current being drawn, but they will also trip if the current on active and neutral is not equal (i.e. going somewhere else). This second feature is what will stop you from being electrocuted. These should be on all power circuits in the house. A circuit used for a welder or a big motor is different as it would trip an RCD just in normal use. This can ahppen with your stove or over too, so these circuits won't have an RCD.

The power coming in from the street will be a neutral plus an active for each phase. Each ordinary power circuit is powered off a single phase. Equipment like a welder could be 3 phase. A generator can be single phase or 3 phase.

The earth should be on your property. This isn't connected to any of what I have described above. It is literally a spike in the ground with a wire attached to it, which then goes to every earth pin in the house. Your surge protected power board works by sending power down the earth if there is a surge rather than this being passed through your electrical equipment. The better boards also filter out interference and noise which can help protect sensitive equipment like computers.

 

[Outlander_04]

Earth should not be connected to neutral. This is really dangerous.
Appliances connect the casing to earth so that in the event of a short the appliance is grounded.
The neutral wire in mains power is live because of other connected appliances.
Connecting the two makes any appliance with a ground pin potentially live.
If you have a residual current device installed, joining these two would cause it to trip.

Many countries use exactly this system where the earth and neutral are connected . Only the phase is isolated .

The grounding includes a resistor . Only works in AC set ups .

And it is SAFER

[ unless you are dumb enough to work on a pc that is plugged in and live ]

 

[VincentP]

Earth should not be connected to neutral. This is really dangerous.
Appliances connect the casing to earth so that in the event of a short the appliance is grounded.
The neutral wire in mains power is live because of other connected appliances.
Connecting the two makes any appliance with a ground pin potentially live.
If you have a residual current device installed, joining these two would cause it to trip.

Many countries use exactly this system where the earth and neutral are connected . Only the phase is isolated .

The grounding includes a resistor . Only works in AC set ups .

And it is SAFER

[ unless you are dumb enough to work on a pc that is plugged in and live ]

Do you have a link to support what you are saying, because it sounds like you have no idea what you are talking about?
Neutral is connected to ground outside of your house wiring, not to the ground wire of a circuit.
To connect neutral to ground in a power strip as described effectively makes ground live.
This is very dangerous.

Here is an explanation of the connection between neutral and ground:
Different systems are used to minimize the voltage difference between neutral and local earth ground. In some systems, the neutral and earth join together at the service intake (TN-C-S); in others, they run completely separately back to the transformer neutral terminal (TN-S), and in others they are kept completely separate with the house earth having its own rod and the neutral connected to earth within the distribution network (TT). In a few cases, they are combined in house wiring (TN-C), but the dangers of broken neutrals (see below) and the cost of the special cables needed to mitigate this mean that it is rarely done nowadays.

 

[Outlander_04]

Earth should not be connected to neutral. This is really dangerous.
Appliances connect the casing to earth so that in the event of a short the appliance is grounded.
The neutral wire in mains power is live because of other connected appliances.
Connecting the two makes any appliance with a ground pin potentially live.
If you have a residual current device installed, joining these two would cause it to trip.

Many countries use exactly this system where the earth and neutral are connected . Only the phase is isolated .

The grounding includes a resistor . Only works in AC set ups .

And it is SAFER

[ unless you are dumb enough to work on a pc that is plugged in and live ]

Do you have a link to support what you are saying, because it sounds like you have no idea what you are talking about?
Neutral is connected to ground outside of your house wiring, not to the ground wire of a circuit.
To connect neutral to ground in a power strip as described effectively makes ground live.
This is very dangerous.

Here is an explanation of the connection between neutral and ground:
Different systems are used to minimize the voltage difference between neutral and local earth ground. In some systems, the neutral and earth join together at the service intake (TN-C-S); in others, they run completely separately back to the transformer neutral terminal (TN-S), and in others they are kept completely separate with the house earth having its own rod and the neutral connected to earth within the distribution network (TT). In a few cases, they are combined in house wiring (TN-C), but the dangers of broken neutrals (see below) and the cost of the special cables needed to mitigate this mean that it is rarely done nowadays.

I totally agree with you the OP should not be wiring his own house or power board . And he definitely should not be connecting neutral and earth in a board

Most older houses [ that do not use an RCD or similar device] just have neutral and earth connected outside the meter . You are correct in in all the other information you have given
But some countries use a completely separated system that does not connect earth and neutral , but this is not as safe in most circumstances