Discussion Power supply discussion and review list thread

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Darkbreeze

Titan
Moderator
I've seen 100w differences on the exact same card, a year later. And I don't mean same model. I mean SAME CARD using Kill-A-Watt readings and running the exact same benchmark. Only differences, time, sometimes firmware revision and usually driver version. That's without any overclocking or motherboard considerations thrown in.
 


Interesting. :)

Could explain a lot.
 


Starting to look like the CX units are doing what I expected them to do, more of them as time goes on.

Yet people keep recommending them.
 

Onus

Titan
Moderator
I think all but the very best PSUs are not really meant to run flat out (e.g. 90%+) for extended periods of time. An occasional all-day gaming session, sure, which is why I like HardOCP's stress test; but not all the time. What you've shown about cards exceeding their expected power draw just makes this worse; people buy the minimum they need, which gets exceeded as their components need more power and capacitor aging cuts down what their PSUs can reliable produce.
For typical sub-100W business systems and/or sub-200W home PCs, a 450W Corsair CX should be fine. For mining rigs, overclocked and run hard 24/7? Hell no.
 


Well some of us keep trying to tell people that, but there are still those who recommend them for gaming rigs etc.

It gives me a freaking headache every time I see it.

The really amusing thing is the wattage doesn't seem to matter, could be a CX 450 or a CX 750....

It's been like 5 or 6 we have seen here just in the last week alone that I noticed.

Like I suspected once those things start to see some age they will start having issues just like the old ones did.

Reason why I don't really recommend anything from Corsair under the RMX.
 


I don't either, but it's been coming up a lot however lately....

 

Darkbreeze

Titan
Moderator
Do you have some examples that suggest a pattern? In order to expressly condemn the newer CX units in this way, there would need to be a pretty clear pattern, based on many examples, of CX units that are in the ~20-40% more than system demand capacity which are failing early when paired with gaming cards.

We could easily show this with the older models, and we know why. It was due to poor cooling profiles and low end caps. These newer models seem to not have those problems based on the reviews, but those are probably golden samples as well so nothing would surprise me when it comes to CWT built units, which I THINK these are.
 

Aeacus

Glorious
Herald

The 2017 version of CX series is actually made by Great Wall,
review: https://www.tomshardware.co.uk/corsair-cx450-psu,review-34448.html
 

Darkbreeze

Titan
Moderator
Yeah, I had a feeling that wasn't right. I have even less faith in Great Wall than I do CWT, but any of these companies are able to make good platforms if the blueprints are good to start with. Even so, I would still practically always recommend about 200w more than is necessary when picking one of those models, at least. The prices aren't terribly different from 550w to 750w anyhow. Six dollar difference between CX550m and CX750 non-m.

Of course, these shouldn't be recommended unless it's absolutely necessary to fit the budget anyhow, but if it is, I think they are STILL better than 99% of the alternative models available for 45 bucks or less. Occasionally the S12II/M12II units are there if rebates are available, but that's with rebates. If so, then I'd choose one of those over the CX units myself. Otherwise, and maybe even in spite of that, if a rebate is not appetizing these are better than just about anything else out there in the price range.

Personally, I tend to recommend them as placeholders if it's absolutely necessary. It's a lot cheaper to get a better PSU a few months to a year down the road than it is to swallow the downgrade in most other hardware, especially the graphics card.
 


CX750M

http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-3791059/gigabyte-aorus-1080ti-crashing-load.html

Was the only one I could find that stood out.

If I see more I will continue to update this post.

 

Aeacus

Glorious
Herald
Just found out that Seasonic is offering competition to Corsair in the SFX PSU segment with their newest Focus SGX PSU lineup,
specs: https://seasonic.com/focus-sgx

There are two models in the Focus SGX lineup, 450W and 650W unit. In comparison, Corsair offers 450W and 600W SFX units in their SF series.
Oh, couldn't find any reviews about Focus SGX units at the moment though.
 
probably 650w,

i havent build any itx system but I think its too tall for cable management? you will probably need to go full sparta on this.

on a sidenote, i saw an sfx fanless silverstone unit on jonny, I think its useless because the biggest noise source is the cpu cooler and the gpu.
 
Oct 24, 2018
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i just registered to write this here.

you guys are really cancer :D when someone asks you about corsair or coolermaster series someone comes and says "its crap, buy seasonic, txt etc."

guys i have been using crapper PSUs than those corsair and coolermaster.

i never faced any single problem... none, nothing! never faced fps drops, my system has always been on top of the benchmark lists comparing to systems which have same hardwares.

just dont exaggerate the psu, okey it provides power i know but i have never heard coolermaster or corsair etc which you call "crap" psu burned any system...

so spend money to your gpu to get more fps.
 

4745454b

Titan
Moderator
Go on youtube, look up failed PSU. Here is a fun one. There are others.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6snWfd1v7M

We've talked about this before. When suggesting parts to other people, you need to make sure they are quality parts that will do the job. Suggesting someone buy a $20 650W PSU that there is video evidence can die if you try pulling more than 300W from is just rude. If after doing research you want to spend your money on it that's fine. But I assure you over here will will say something about that choice every time you suggest it to someone else. $20 PSUs have no place being hooked up to $500+ GPUs. Period.
 
Oct 24, 2018
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no one offers 20 dollar psu, your link i dont see cooler master or corsair there which you never suggest to anyone... whenever i see a topic someone comes and says crap to coolermasters.

if you need real 500 wattage, buy 700 watt coolermaster for 50 dollar. it can provide at least 500 right? so if you are not going to demand more than it offers, what would be the problem? what is the point to give 150 dollar to evga's seasonics?

for that 100 dollar you may buy gtx1070 instead of gtx1060. thats what i am talking, never buy non-branded psus like i see on youtube via your link.


edit : yeah i saw one coolermaster which is 400w, and there is no 80+ bronze thing, so with simple math it can provide around %70 efficiency you dont need be genius to calculate it.

400 times 70/100 : 280 watt. in video he demands 320 watts. so what?

for 50 dollar you can get %85 efficiency 750 watt coolermaster : 640 max if you use 550 its okay with most cpu's and new graphics cards you never reach 550 watt.

so what is the point? same calculations, you have to make for evga or seasonic also according to their efficiency none of them provides that is written on box.

am i wrong?
 


A 750W PSU for $50 is going to be a system killer unit and complete garbage.

Yes almost all Cooler Master PSUs are junk except their high end ones.

Corsair has good PSU's, the RMX and above are great.

 

Saga Lout

Titan
Moderator


Possibly or possibly not but your approach is too argumentative. Everyone is going to have their own preference on parts and some will support manufacturers you may not approve so cool it and be prepared to accept other folks' opinions.
 

logainofhades

Titan
Moderator
You are wrong. First off, a $20 class PSU. https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817148067. I am sure an Ebay search could find you some more paperweights of higher wattage, in that price range.

Most coolermaster PSU's are low quality. They do have some higher end models, that are good, but their price makes them poor choices. There is almost always a better option, at a similar price point, or a cheaper option of similar, or better quality.

Corsair has a slew of crap units too, but have some decent budget options, notably the newer CX450m-650m, and the new TXM series. I recommend those fairly often, for budget builds, when price demands it. The VS and old CX used low quality caps that tended to die prematurely.

EVGA has some duds as well. Some are HEC built junk. Some were poor FSP designs. Even the B3 has been plagued with quality issues.

You do not need to spend $150 to buy a Seasonic, or EVGA. They both have really good units, for less than $100. Focus bronze/golds and G2/G3 respectively.

Skimping on PSU quality is just a recipe for disaster, and more money spent later. Been there, done that, and learned my lesson, the hard way.


Cheapest 750w CM, that I can find.
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

Power Supply: Cooler Master - MasterWatt 750W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($67.99 @ Amazon)
Total: $67.99
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2018-10-24 09:43 EDT-0400

I would rather pony up the extra $12 for a higher quality, and better warrantied G2 750. The warranty alone is worth the $12.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

Power Supply: EVGA - SuperNOVA G2 750W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($79.99 @ Amazon)
Total: $79.99
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2018-10-24 09:45 EDT-0400

 

DSzymborski

Illustrious
Moderator
To be perfectly frank, if you're judging a PSU's quality by your FPS, you don't actually understand how PSUs work or what makes a good one. It's like a cardiologist judging your heart's health by measuring your height or a mechanic checking a car's brakes by the 0-60 time.
 
Oct 24, 2018
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ie.

i found this one lets check it;

http://www.xigmatek.com/product_detail.php?item=87

i am sure no one here suggest this :)

for that price i cant even buy bronze seasonic, if we cant trust this 80+ bronze,gold, platinium thing why are these on market?

i am going to consume average 300-350 watts peak maybe 550 watts why would i pick bronze seasonic if i am in safe limits with another brand's "gold certificated" psu it wont explode cause will have 750w to be safe. moreover it will drain less energy, for less price according to this certificate thing.

all components gpu, mainboard, cpu has their own tolerance for little voltage changes, so why should i worry about %1-2-3 difference of 12v rail quality?

another sample;

http://www.coolermaster.com/powersupply/gx-series/gx-750w/

is this crap? according to what? no one ever tests it, isnt it providing 12v all day? what is the thing you dont like? i am asking this because from edo ram times at 1997 i have never bought seasonic level high quality(expensive) psus. and never faced any problem. there wouldnt be coolermaster at market if their's are exploding right?
 

The Bronse, Gold, Platinum, ETC, rateings are NOT a measure of Quality, only effieciency. A better measure of quality would be the warranty length. How long is the manufacturer willing to bet that their PSU will last and NOT destroy your system?
 

DSzymborski

Illustrious
Moderator
Yup. Generally speaking, there's some measure of correlation between efficiency and quality, but there are too many manufacturers that eke out a Bronze or a Gold with junky parts on a relatively efficient design for one to use that as the criteria for a power supply. A 1989 Yugo is a lot more fuel efficient than some modern sports cars, but it's not a better car!
 


That's not how it works.....

 

logainofhades

Titan
Moderator
I had a Rosewill PSU that was rated bronze, so I thought it was good, die and take my hardware with it. It was a 600-650w unit, and I wasn't even pushing it that hard. I had a Sempron 145 and an HD 3870 hooked up to it. Later I learned that it was junk quality. There were non bronze units, at the time, that would have been better quality.

Efficiency does not equal quality. There are raidmax units rated gold, that nobody that had a clue about PSU's, would ever use. The rating is for power efficiency and has nothing to do with the long term capability of the PSU. Cheap caps can reach said efficiency, but not for long. Cheap PSU's tend to also lack protections, to keep your hardware safe, should said PSU die.


After doing some browsing around, that PSU is appears to be Andyson built, so quality is already questionable, at best. If you told us your country of origin, we could possibly find you a decent quality PSU. We have a list that includes online stores for many different countries.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/id-1643019/guide-international-users-links-part-stores.html


I used one of those GX Cooler Master's, in a friend's build, thinking it would be good as well. It didn't last very long.
 

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