Discussion Power supply / PSU models - What to buy, what to avoid - And PSU discussion thread

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Aeacus

Illustrious
Herald
Just another reason why I have never been a fan of Adata. They are a cheapo, scandalous, fly by night type outfit if you ask me. I have never purchased any Adata product, and despite the fact that Tom's hardware tries very hard to force their recommendations for Adata storage devices down our throats, I never will. I trust them even less than Team, but maybe just a little more than OLoY, whom I also would never buy anything from.
+1 to that.

I once bought Adata USB flash drive (2GB in size) and that died less than year in use and i didn't use mine that much either. Learned my lesson and now, only USB flash drives i buy are Kingston. Still have my old Kingston Data Traveler 2.0 (8GB) in working conditions but after 8 or so years, i retired it due to the small capacity. Now, i'm using Kingston HyperX Savage (128GB) as my USB flash drive.
And personally i doubt i will be buying any Kingston products for myself either. My A400 was a gift to begin with.

I am still waiting on a warranty replacement for my Kingston A400 to arrive.

The drive died on Thanksgiving when it was less than a year old and kingston was closed on black friday so it took awhile till they responded to my rma request. The rest of the process was slow and involved me paying shipping to send the SSD to them. Needless to say, I'm not a big fan of kingston anymore.

As least they didn't flag me for the broken warranty sticker.

Meanwhile my brothers ancient system has a small Crucial BX200 drive. No problems whatsoever, even though its a budget crucial model tyat is 4 times as old as my a400. Then there is 2 intel 660ps and an MX500 in the laptops around the house. Have not had issues with any.
Kingston with it's SSDs is like Be Quiet! with it's PSUs, you need to know which ones are good. E.g i have Kingston HyperX 3K (240GB) SSD which has served me reliably for 4 years now. But with SSDs, you're better off with Samsung or Crucial drive rather than trying to find which Kingston SSD is the good one.
Though, Kingston USB flash drives, SD/microSD memory cards and RAM are very solid with good performance. I have several those Kingston products in use and i have 0 issues with them. In some sense, Kingston is like MSI, where Kingston it excels in flash drives, memory cards and RAMs but does poorly on SSDs. MSI excels in MoBos, GPUs and monitors production but their PSUs were complete crap.

Speaking of MSI (and getting back to the topic), i know that their PSUs were complete failure but what i don't know, who was the OEM of MSI PSUs? I even haven't seen any of the MSI PSUs. Anyone willing to give some backstory about MSI PSUs?
 

NightHawkRMX

Illustrious
I once bought Adata USB flash drive (2GB in size) and that died less than year in use and i didn't use mine that much either.
I had a PNY 128gb USB drive die within 3 months. Warranty process was seamless tho.
Speaking of MSI (and getting back to the topic), i know that their PSUs were complete failure but what i don't know, who was the OEM of MSI PSUs? I even haven't seen any of the MSI PSUs. Anyone willing to give some backstory about MSI PSUs?
I haven't heard of them, not even in MSI prebuilts. Odd.

One brand that makes PSUs that i never realized was reddragon.
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/2695/9506/products/GC-PS003_4_450x450.jpg?v=1558423148
I have only ever seen one mentioned on one post here. There isn't much info out there on them.

An what Jon said in that post mentioning the Redragon PSU was not very positive. A very old design and just fine design all around. But that was just one model.
 

NightHawkRMX

Illustrious
The CX and CXm units are ok as a budget option, but I do not recommend pairing them with gaming cards. The newer 2017 models of CX and CXm are better than the older ones, but still not what we'd call terrific. Even so, in a real financial pinch, or if there are simply no other good models available to you, then the GRAY label Corsair CX and CXM units are passable.
I feel you are being a little more negative towards Corsair CX grey units.

The 550w is the sweet spot, yet I fail to find a review of a Corsair CX550, only the inferior CX550m.

However, the CX450 and 550w is often very cheap in comparison to comparable units and i find myself often recommending it.

For one thing, it actually qualifies to be 80+ silver efficient, but is marketed as bronze. Based on toms CX450 testing, the 80+ silver efficiency is likely on 230w with the CX550.
http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?16610-Corsair-CX-and-CX-M-quot-cheat-sheet-quot

Also, it is not group regulated, which is better than its competitors.
Fully DC-DC and Haswell ready.
It is not Double Forward based unlike its CX550m brother.

Looking at the Corsair CX450 review by TH, they hardily had anything bad to say about it.
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/corsair-cx450-psu,5678.html
They said
  • Single PCIe connector limits expansion
  • Not as quiet as the CWT-made CX450
  • Short distance between peripheral connectors
Single PCIe connector doesn't really matter for this PSU. Any GPU requiring more than a single 8 pin probably requires more than 450w anyhow.
Not being quiet is a valid complaint to be concidered in judgement, but not really a problem with how well this PSU can power a system.
A short distance between peripheral connectors is somewhat irrelevent to performance of a PSU. Plus, MOLEX connectores are basically not used anymore, so this isn't really an issue for the vast, vast majority of systems.

The capacitors are not very good brands at all, but this doesn't seem to be much of an issue as i don't really hear anything about failures and the overall performance is good despite these caps.

Overall its seems to punch above its weight class and outperform even pricier PSUs. Far better than the Corsair VS aswell.
 
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Darkbreeze

Titan
Moderator
I have never heard of, or seen, an MSI power supply. I don't think they exist and if they do, they had to have been extremely few, for an extremely short period of time and in an extremely limited regionally available supply.

Kingston, Sandisk, Samsung and Crucial/Micron are all trustworthy for the most part when it comes to flash drives and SD cards. I'll buy SSDs from three of those four, none of which starts with a K.

PNY is the white label with black lettering version of generic when it comes to memory and storage hardware. If supermarkets in the old days had sold computer hardware, you'd have found PNY products on the section that looked like this:




Some will argue, but I don't care. PNY is a bargain basement company and the products they offer are good as OEM parts in some cases or in a serious pinch if it's all you can get locally, which sometimes it IS, but I would never seek them out and I'd make every effort to find something else before settling on so much as an 8GB flash drive or 4GB stick of SODIMM.

I certainly wouldn't buy or use their SSDs unless I needed one for something I was selling off as cheap as possible.
 

Darkbreeze

Titan
Moderator
I feel you are being a little more negative towards Corsair CX grey units.

The 550w is the sweet spot, yet I fail to find a review of a Corsair CX550, only the inferior CX550m.

However, the CX450 and 550w is often very cheap in comparison to comparable units and i find myself often recommending it.

For one thing, it actually qualifies to be 80+ silver efficient, but is marketed as bronze. Based on toms CX450 testing, the 80+ silver efficiency is likely on 230w with the CX550.
http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?16610-Corsair-CX-and-CX-M-quot-cheat-sheet-quot

Also, it is not group regulated, which is better than its competitors.
Fully DC-DC and Haswell ready.
It is not Double Forward based unlike its CX550m brother.

Looking at the Corsair CX450 review by TH, they hardily had anything bad to say about it.
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/corsair-cx450-psu,5678.html
They said
  • Single PCIe connector limits expansion
  • Not as quiet as the CWT-made CX450
  • Short distance between peripheral connectors
Single PCIe connector doesn't really matter for this PSU. Any GPU requiring more than a single 8 pin probably requires more than 450w anyhow.
Not being quiet is a valid complaint to be concidered in judgement, but not really a problem with how well this PSU can power a system.
A short distance between peripheral connectors is somewhat irrelevent to performance of a PSU. Plus, MOLEX connectores are basically not used anymore, so this isn't really an issue for the vast, vast majority of systems.

The capacitors are not very good brands at all, but this doesn't seem to be much of an issue as i don't really hear anything about failures and the overall performance is good despite these caps.

Overall its seems to punch above its weight class and outperform even pricier PSUs. Far better than the Corsair VS aswell.
Yes, they are ok. No, they are not great.
 

Aeacus

Illustrious
Herald
I have never heard of, or seen, an MSI power supply. I don't think they exist and if they do, they had to have been extremely few, for an extremely short period of time and in an extremely limited regionally available supply.
Did some Google-Fu and found a review of MSI TurboStream 600W PSU (basically rebadged Solytech SL-8600EPS),
link: https://www.hardwaresecrets.com/msi-turbostream-600-w-power-supply-review/

And this forum topic via WBM where OklahomaWolf clears things up about MSI PSUs. There's some backstory in there about the Solytech as well,
link: https://web.archive.org/web/20110829024152/http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/t265961.html

Apparently, there were available in USA but with very strange warranty with 16 months from MFG date, not from purchase date. o_O
 

PCNewbieBilly

Reputable
Jun 5, 2016
20
1
4,525
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Hello, guys.

I am an amateur when it comes to building a PC. I plan to build one in the future. I have got a list of all the parts that I plan to buy except PSU. I am not sure about what PSU I should get. I don't want to spend too much for the one with high power that I don't really need. Any recommended and affordable PSU based on the parts below would be appreciated.

Motherboard: Z370 GAMING M5
CUP: Intel Core i7-8700K
RAM: G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 32GB (Desktop Memory Model F4-2666C19Q-32GVR)
CPU Cooler: NH-D15S
Graphic Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 1080 SC GAMING ACX 3.0
SSD: Kingston 240GB
Chassis (Case): AeroCool Cylon (Mid Tower Case)
Power Supply: ?????

I don't know if I plan to overclock and/or add another GPU in the future. I just want to know what PSU I should get for the parts I have in mind so far. Thank you. :)
 
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Aeacus

Illustrious
Herald
Hello, guys.

I am an amateur when it comes to building a PC. I plan to build one in the future. I have got a list of all the parts that I plan to buy except PSU. I am not sure about what PSU I should get. I don't want to spend too much for the one with high power that I don't really need. Any recommended and affordable PSU based on the parts below would be appreciated.

Motherboard: Z370 GAMING M5
CUP: Intel Core i7-8700K
RAM: G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 32GB (Desktop Memory Model F4-2666C19Q-32GVR)
CPU Cooler: NH-D15S
Graphic Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 1080 SC GAMING ACX 3.0
SSD: Kingston 240GB
Chassis (Case): AeroCool Cylon (Mid Tower Case)
Power Supply: ?????

I don't know if I plan to overclock and/or add another GPU in the future. I just want to know what PSU I should get for the parts I have in mind so far. Thank you. :)
Your question would merit it's own topic since this topic here is discussion about PSUs, not for answering which PSU to get.

But to answer your question shortly: any 600W range good quality PSU will do fine. E.g Seasonic Focus+ 650 or any Seasonic PRIME 650. Or when Seasonic units in your store have new names, the look towards: Focus GX-650, Focus PX-650, PRIME GX-650, PRIME PX-650 or PRIME TX-650.

Also, your build needs refining since you can get better performance with same/less money. But this isn't the topic where to discuss it.
 

NightHawkRMX

Illustrious
I would go with a solid 650w PSU just to leave some wiggle room for overclocking or upgrades.
I would prefer to go 80+ gold or higher for a decent build, even though quality is not related to 80+.

Something like:
Seasonic FOCUS GX650/PX650
Corsair TX/RM/RMX 650w
EVGA G3/G2 650w
Antec Earthwatts Gold PRO 650w or Antec High Current Gamer 650w

If in the US here are the my picks at different prices. I wouldn't suggest any of the sub $75 units i see currently on PCpartPicker currently.

$75 - EVGA GQ650w - https://pcpartpicker.com/product/kz7CmG/evga-power-supply-210gq0650
$100 - Antec Earthwatts Gold PRO 650w (Seasonic FOCUS Gold 650w) - https://pcpartpicker.com/product/B9CD4D/antec-earthwatts-gold-pro-650w-80-gold-certified-semi-modular-atx-power-supply-ea650g-pro
$120 - Corsair RMx 750w - https://pcpartpicker.com/product/79tQzy/corsair-rmx-2018-750w-80-gold-certified-fully-modular-atx-power-supply-cp-9020179-na

I would really go with the RMx since they are incredably good units, but all are pretty good.
 

NightHawkRMX

Illustrious
I think the Antec High Current Gamer Extreme should be added to this thread as recommended, in addition to the standard HCG models.
I cut some out of what Antec said, but heres a few thing
  • 100% Modular
  • 80 PLUS® GOLD certified-Up to 92% efficient
  • Full-bridge LLC design with a synchronous rectification based on a DC-DC topology
  • 10-year warranty
  • Fluid dynamic fan mode
  • Zero RPM Fan mode
  • Protections: OCP, OVP, UVP, SCP, OPP, OTP, SIP, NLO
  • 100% Japanese capacitors
  • Full power at up to 50c
850w 80+ gold for $115 seems very good for a money.
Probably not as good of a deal as that Riotoro Enigma 850w 80+ Gold Semi modular unit that my friend snagged up for like $85 recently. A whole hell of a lot better than the TT SMART 600w he has now that i will probably buy off of him since I'm an idiot.
 

Karadjgne

Titan
Herald
And yet what I find a little odd is that PNY is also the major vendor for nvidia Quadro cards, which are by no means anything close to cheap. And do have a certain reputation in a business setting to uphold.

As far as Evga goes, until someone like Aris says otherwise, I'm going to consider anything new as being the same as the G5, a second rate FSP platform, or possibly worse, since the G5 is supposedly top of the G series.
 

NightHawkRMX

Illustrious
And yet what I find a little odd is that PNY is also the major vendor for nvidia Quadro cards, which are by no means anything close to cheap. And do have a certain reputation in a business setting to uphold.
PNY makes a lot of video cards, mainly OEMs.

My old GTX1050 2gb was a PNY model that looked identical to a pallet version.



I thought this card had issues but learnt that it didnt. Actually a pretty reliable card, but they voided my warranty for a sticker.
 

Karadjgne

Titan
Herald
Heh, should talk to Jon about warranty void stickers, he's had numerous reviews on psus where they stuck those idiotic stickers in places that made absolutely no sense whatsoever. Like over screws holding a side plate to the bottom, which wouldn't require removal in the slightest when removing the fan top plate and having full access to the guts. Or on the side plate itself.

You clean a gpu, and a flimsy fan blade snaps. Guess what, that's user abuse and rma is denied, not a warranty issue. Forcing removal of the shroud to replace the fan. Doesn't even matter if you go to a repair facility, break that sticker and warranty is void anyways. You are bent no matter which way you turn. Stupid idea just to let ppl off the hook.
 
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NightHawkRMX

Illustrious
My Corsair CX550m has the sticker in a place you can take the fan out and access all of the guts without removing that screw.

I cannot confirm nor deny removing the fan to clean it and enjoying the look at the guts of my PSU.
 

PCNewbieBilly

Reputable
Jun 5, 2016
20
1
4,525
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Your question would merit it's own topic since this topic here is discussion about PSUs, not for answering which PSU to get.

But to answer your question shortly: any 600W range good quality PSU will do fine. E.g Seasonic Focus+ 650 or any Seasonic PRIME 650. Or when Seasonic units in your store have new names, the look towards: Focus GX-650, Focus PX-650, PRIME GX-650, PRIME PX-650 or PRIME TX-650.

Also, your build needs refining since you can get better performance with same/less money. But this isn't the topic where to discuss it.

Thank you, Aeacus, for replying and letting me know. Also, is there a thread/discussion I can go to to ask about my build's refining or I should just create a post about it and ask?
 

Mezoxin

Upstanding
Nov 3, 2019
461
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would a bad PSU cause this type of crash to desktop while playing games


or a bad psu crash would only result in a system reset ?
 

Darkbreeze

Titan
Moderator
And yet what I find a little odd is that PNY is also the major vendor for nvidia Quadro cards, which are by no means anything close to cheap. And do have a certain reputation in a business setting to uphold.

As far as Evga goes, until someone like Aris says otherwise, I'm going to consider anything new as being the same as the G5, a second rate FSP platform, or possibly worse, since the G5 is supposedly top of the G series.
Different story there. I should have explicitly stated that my rant against them was not in relation to those cards. In that area, they have been making those for Nvidia for a long time and is likely their primary bread and butter. The rest of what they do seems more like a second, or third, thought. Certainly they CAN make higher quality products, they just don't. They make OEM level stuff and unlike with automobiles most of the OEM computer hardware is not high quality like OEM automotive. It's more like house brand level.
 

Aeacus

Illustrious
Herald
would a bad PSU cause this type of crash to desktop while playing games


or a bad psu crash would only result in a system reset ?
If the issue would be with PSU, either the PC reboots since power is cut to it's components or PSU goes sky high and possibly taking other components with it.

Game(s) crashing to the desktop isn't PSU's issue. For example, i too have a game that crashes to the desktop but my build is powered by Seasonic PRIME 650 (80+ Titanium) PSU. For my own case, i know that the issue is with the game itself.

Did read the topic and as far as i can tell, OP has issue with his GPU and/or it's drivers. Moreover due to the fact that OP's troubles began when he bought a new GPU. Interesting thing is that OP used Asus RX 580 with 500W unit problem free. But for some reason, he bought Sapphire RX 580.
My questions would be: did the old GPU die? If not, is he running Crossfire? Was the Sapphire RX 580 brand new or used? Is his Win legit or pirated? Is his games legit or pirated? He has OC'd his GPU, might want to downclock/remove OC and try again.
 
Reactions: Mezoxin

Darkbreeze

Titan
Moderator
PSU can cause pretty much ANY problem you can experience, regardless of the hardware involved. If a thing can happen because of any given hardware component being faulty or not working correctly, then that same thing can happen with a faulty power supply because a faulty or weak power supply can cause ANY hardware component to not work correctly and can therefore mimic the failure of that hardware component even if it isn't actually faulty.

Keyword being "can". It doesn't mean it will, or that it IS, in any given situation, the problem, but it sure as heck CAN be almost without exception as far as symptoms are concerned.
 
Reactions: Mezoxin

Karadjgne

Titan
Herald
CTD is most commonly a script error, either causing a driver error or being caused by scripting conflicts or driver conflicts. The single most common program I can think of that this happens to is Skyrim, as soon as you start adding mods. You get one script saying something goes here, and another saying the same thing, so end up with a conflict, and most likely a freeze or CTD. With 170 mods, I have to be quite careful as to which is added, which is removed, load order, conflicts etc or possibly suffer constant CTD.

Games can and do comprise of many different scripts, all of which are tied to drivers of some sort in one way or another. Can be audio, Lan, cpu, gpu or OS.

From everything I've read up on this, it's an OS issue with build 1903 and the Adrenaline drivers (Win10CE driver conflicts, really?) related to higher performance Rx models. The older Asus model was by all accounts pretty reference, Sapphire are almost never as they like to push the OC.
TDR fix. That's the most common workaround that seems to work, but doesn't always. It doesn't fix the exact issue, that's on Sapphire/amd to figure out what Microsoft has done, it happened Alot to nvidia after CE was initially released.
 

woot

Distinguished
Jun 2, 2009
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i had a coolermaster masterwatt 750 in my old rig, it would make a weird gargling/snorting noise once in a while, particularly when i put load on the system.
 

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