Question Problems with rebooting, a lot of things checked already.

Jul 10, 2019
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SOLVED: PC case was causing some grounding/shorting, breadboarding the setup fixed the issue.

Hello.



Since few weeks I have a problem with constantly rebooting PC. I am writing the post, because I feel like I already checked almost everything that can be checked to troubleshoot this.



First things first: Reboots happen very randomly (sometimes 5 within an hour, sometimes 1 every 5 hours). I dont have BSOD, in windows logs i only have errors 41 (unexpected closure of system).



Thing I already checked:



  • PSU is fine i replaced old one with new one, reboots still happen
  • Ram should be fine, I had some reboots during memtest86 but they felt like the ones I am having all the time, when I finally managed to get pc going for a little longer, memory passed all tests few times.
  • GPU is not the cause I think, I did the memtest with GPU removed, there were still reboots, I also stress tested it with furmark, went fine for 30 minutes, and then i finished the test myself.
  • Motherboard is not the issue as well I recently managed to buy new one, exact same one, the system still reboots randomly.
  • I swapped and/or removed HDD and SSD’s, reboots still happened.
  • All temps are FINE (AC’d room, reboots happen both at idle, and on full stress)
So the last thing i suspect might be the CPU? How can i Troubleshoot this, It’s the only part I cannot swap at the moment.

I was reading a lot of forums and threads, but I feel like i did everything already and the reboots still happen. The system is old, sure, but it worked fine for a lot of time, this only started happening recently.


Specs:

Windows 10 Edu

mobo: asus p8h61-m le (bios v4601, latest)

cpu: i7 2600 @ 3,4Ghz

ram: 2x 4GB Goodram DDR3 1333Mhz

psu: Seasonic Focus Gold Plus 80 450W


I am running out of options here.


Thanks
 
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PC Tailor

Distinguished
Herald
Looks like you've covered quite a few things.

How long / how many passes did you run memtest for?
Have you tried completely removing the front panel from the motherboard, shorting the power pins to boot and seeing if the issue repeats?
For CPU, you could use Intel Processor Diagnostic tool - but it's not a guaranteed result.
 
Jul 10, 2019
7
1
15
0
Looks like you've covered quite a few things.

How long / how many passes did you run memtest for?
Have you tried completely removing the front panel from the motherboard, shorting the power pins to boot and seeing if the issue repeats?
For CPU, you could use Intel Processor Diagnostic tool - but it's not a guaranteed result.
8 passes from beginning to the end. Few more considering reboots, but there were never any errors (always checked the logs).

Intel diagnostic tool showed no problems whatsoever.

I will try to remove the front panel completely and power on like you suggested, and give my results.
 

PC Tailor

Distinguished
Herald
Error 41 can quite often be related to graphics or audio drivers, just drivers in general, try Using DDU for the GPU drivers and reinstalling your audio drivers
-https://www.guru3d.com/files-details/display-driver-uninstaller-download.html
-https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/P8H61M_LE/HelpDesk_Download/
Where have you encountered this?

Kernel Error 41 is just a generic unexpected power loss error, you would get the same error appear simply from pressing the reset button on your PC. Error 41 doesn't indicate anything about a problem, just a symptom, all it means is whatever the problem is, it caused the PC to shutdown without following a proper shutdown procedure.
 

PC Tailor

Distinguished
Herald
No overclocks, everything runs at base frequencies/voltages. If by safe mode, you mean Windows' safe mode, then yes. It happens there too.
If you haven't already, I'd reduce down to 1 RAM module in different slots, then repeat for the other RAM module. I know memtest passed, but the restarts MAY be indicative of a RAM issue, and memtest doesn't always catch everything.

Did you say you completely changed all storage drives and the issue still occurred?

I know you've already covered some of these, but it's just sanity checking:
SoftwareStill occurs in Safe modeProbably not software
PSUSwapped PSU, still occurs, good quality PSU.Probably not PSU
GPURemoved GPU, shutdowns still occuredProbably not GPU
MBSwapped MB, still occursProbably not MB
StorageSwapped all storage, still occursProbably not storage

Really you're left with RAM, and CPU at that stage. Being as they've only been software tested.
My bets would be on RAM still.
 
Jul 10, 2019
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I read some about RAM issues, so I tested the ram like you said: different slots, one stick, then other stick, repeated for another slot etc. Still had crashes on all of those configurations. Latest bios is indeed installed. Do you think i should try to replace RAM with new one to test it? Is there any other way to test this like with memtest?

And yeah, issue started to occur few weeks ago, and is mostly random (high load, low load, sometimes few in a row, sometimes long without any incident). My usual routine when using PC is gaming/browsing web.
 

Satan-IR

Honorable
You have covered a lot of ground with troubleshooting for that sort of issue, being random shut offs.

This might seem a bit far-fetched, you said your room is "AC'd".

What kind of AC unit is this? A split AC or other type? And are you aware of how the electricity line to the AC is wired? Is it possible that the outlet that feeds your PSU and PC is on the same line as the AC unit?

Some AC units require a sudden and high ampere current to start the motor/compressor and all that. If by any chance that AC unit is one of those and is on the same line it might starve the PSU the moment it starts and you have reboots. Have you noticed the reboots happening at those times?
 
Jul 10, 2019
7
1
15
0
You have covered a lot of ground with troubleshooting for that sort of issue, being random shut offs.

This might seem a bit far-fetched, you said your room is "AC'd".

What kind of AC unit is this? A split AC or other type? And are you aware of how the electricity line to the AC is wired? Is it possible that the outlet that feeds your PSU and PC is on the same line as the AC unit?

Some AC units require a sudden and high ampere current to start the motor/compressor and all that. If by any chance that AC unit is one of those and is on the same line it might starve the PSU the moment it starts and you have reboots. Have you noticed the reboots happening at those times?
I tested the system in my work, it was behaving exactly the same (random reboots). Other electronics work fine at my place. I mentioned the AC just to give the idea of how temps are at my room (cool and stable). Also the AC is on other line (probably because of the reason you mentioned).
 

Satan-IR

Honorable
I tested the system in my work, it was behaving exactly the same (random reboots). Other electronics work fine at my place. I mentioned the AC just to give the idea of how temps are at my room (cool and stable). Also the AC is on other line (probably because of the reason you mentioned).
Yes I figured you mentioned the AC to give an idea of stable ambient temp. and component temps. As I said it was a bit far-fetched and I thought I'd ask anyway.

PC behaving the same on another circuit in another place pretty much cancels the probability of problems with your house/room wiring and outlets and such.

Another thing I can think of is you said you have replaced old PSU with a new one. Have you tried clearing CMOS after changing PSU? I know it boots and works and then reboots randomly but it won't hurt to try that.
 
Jul 10, 2019
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I cleared CMOS few times during testing voltages, just to make sure I dont fry anything up. I am waiting for brand new RAM sticks to come, and then I will do the testing with breadboarding like @Quanticriver mentioned. I will reply here if it helps or not. Thanks for the suggestions so far.

Edit: so far 3 days without any reboot, looks like it was the case causing some shorting... I will try this setup for a little longer, and then edit my main post and stuff for future readers.

Wanna thank everyone again for tips and solutions
 
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