PS4 thermal pad instead of thermal paste APU fan noise

[rubez]

The PS4 has known problems with fan noise.

Some run quiet, some are VERY loud. I had the latter, so I opened it up and found the thermal paste job on the chip was abysmal - half of the chip was not touched at all by the paste - it still had that brand new mirror finish shine! (it wasn't even in the middle, where it would be most effective, it was down one half)

So, I reapplied it, and the fan noise diminished greatly. But now it is starting to creep up after a few months. The way the PS4 heatsink goes onto the chip is inefficient. There is no clamp, the entire board is layed on top of it, and screwed down with a very flexible bracket on top of all this supposed to apply pressure. Lot of room for inconsistencies and inefficiency.

Anyway. I think a thermal pad would do a much better job in this case at providing a better seal. Considering half of my chip had no thermal paste at all, at least it never blew up, just fan maxed out... surely a thermal pad would be better than that.

Arctic do 0.5mm, 1.0mm and 1.5mm thick pads.

What thickness is best? do the thickest pads provide the best or worst heat transfer?

Given the wonky set up, no real clamp, and the need for a decent seal between heatsink and chip, I am thinking a thicker pad may be better? (normally I would have guessed thinner is better, but what do I know!)

Any thoughts?

Thanks.

 

[Mark_1970]

The PS4 has known problems with fan noise.

Some run quiet, some are VERY loud. I had the latter, so I opened it up and found the thermal paste job on the chip was abysmal - half of the chip was not touched at all by the paste - it still had that brand new mirror finish shine! (it wasn't even in the middle, where it would be most effective, it was down one half)

So, I reapplied it, and the fan noise diminished greatly. But now it is starting to creep up after a few months. The way the PS4 heatsink goes onto the chip is inefficient. There is no clamp, the entire board is layed on top of it, and screwed down with a very flexible bracket on top of all this supposed to apply pressure. Lot of room for inconsistencies and inefficiency.

Anyway. I think a thermal pad would do a much better job in this case at providing a better seal. Considering half of my chip had no thermal paste at all, at least it never blew up, just fan maxed out... surely a thermal pad would be better than that.

Arctic do 0.5mm, 1.0mm and 1.5mm thick pads.

What thickness is best? do the thickest pads provide the best or worst heat transfer?

Given the wonky set up, no real clamp, and the need for a decent seal between heatsink and chip, I am thinking a thicker pad may be better? (normally I would have guessed thinner is better, but what do I know!)

Any thoughts?

Thanks.

Thickness does not determine the heat transfer, smaller thickness pads will work slightly better but it really comes down to the material used in the pads 17W/mK is the highest rating pads i know of for transfer. they used paste and so should you, use pad and this may lift the plate/heatsink not allowing it to touch other components using the heatsink. The heatsink actually touching the chip with paste to fill minor imperfections is far better, the type of paste can play here though, silver being best, but if silver touches anything live it will short as silver paste conducts electricity ,others can be bought that are non conductive but are not as good for transfer Those 17W/mK pads are very pricey too. As you had paste, the gap to fill with pad thickness is none really, if you go with a pad, the thinnest would be best. Another point is, pads are also either elastic or not , how much they can squash to suit the gap? example of pads........... https://www.pccasegear.com/category/207_335

 

[rubez]

I know thermal paste is by far better, but I actually think the main problem here with the PS4, is that there in no clamp. Even applying the paste is a bit of hit and miss, as you can't be sure the heatsink has sandwiched it well enough, as you are laying an entire motherboard on top if it, not just a heatsink, so you can't even see if it has spread well.

With a pad, you could stick it on the chip, and be sure you are covering it well.

I know paste is preferred by far, but could a pad be used instead in theory?

Like I said, before only half one of the chip had paste on it, so a pad covering the chip entirely must be better than this?

The Arctic pads are 6.0 W/mK. Not sure how good this is...

 

[Mark_1970]

I know thermal paste is by far better, but I actually think the main problem here with the PS4, is that there in no clamp. Even applying the paste is a bit of hit and miss, as you can't be sure the heatsink has sandwiched it well enough, as you are laying an entire motherboard on top if it, not just a heatsink, so you can't even see if it has spread well.

With a pad, you could stick it on the chip, and be sure you are covering it well.

I know paste is preferred by far, but could a pad be used instead in theory?

Like I said, before only half one of the chip had paste on it, so a pad covering the chip entirely must be better than this?

this is why sometimes its better to just put dobs of paste on the chip and let the heatsink spread it as it mounts down rather than the pre-spread out thin method

 

[Mark_1970]

I know thermal paste is by far better, but I actually think the main problem here with the PS4, is that there in no clamp. Even applying the paste is a bit of hit and miss, as you can't be sure the heatsink has sandwiched it well enough, as you are laying an entire motherboard on top if it, not just a heatsink, so you can't even see if it has spread well.

With a pad, you could stick it on the chip, and be sure you are covering it well.

I know paste is preferred by far, but could a pad be used instead in theory?

Like I said, before only half one of the chip had paste on it, so a pad covering the chip entirely must be better than this?

The Arctic pads are 6.0 W/mK. Not sure how good this is...

6W/mK is fine for memory,vrm,/chipsets but not so much for apu/cpu/gpu
Everywhere i have researched say pads cannot be used on processing chips (thermal interface material tests) , after extensive tests, your call though

 

[RobCrezz]

Thermal pad likely wouldnt give enough heat transfer performance for the APU I dont think, its usually only used for low power parts.

I would suggest using some kind of copper shim to add tightness to the heatsink clamp.

 

[rubez]

I done the pea method. I didn't spread it myself. I was just saying the way the PS4 is, you can't be sure if you get good contact.

The PS4 shuts itself down if it gets too hot, it has never done that, when with the dodgy factory thermal paste job when the fan used to blow on max a lot.

Are there any good pads for APU? (I am in UK, not US)

Pretty sure I did a decent job when I reapplied the paste, certainly better than the factory job, but now the fan is getting louder, what does this tell us? Maybe the paste is drying out due to bad contact with the heatsink?

 

[RobCrezz]

Something like this would be great (make sure you get the right size)
http://www.banggood.com/Laptop-GPU-CPU-Copper-Heat-Sink-Pad-Shim-15x15mm-6-Size-p-956385.html?currency=GBP&createTmp=1&utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping&utm_content=saul&utm_campaign=Electronic-xie-uk&gclid=Cj0KEQiA-NqyBRC905irsrLr-LUBEiQAWJFYTkVip0gDLBbhYujtgFUf6AUjkHfuvgRO2xx0k1lkNREaAseB8P8HAQ

 

[rubez]

Thermal pad likely wouldnt give enough heat transfer performance for the APU I dont think, its usually only used for low power parts.

I would suggest using some kind of copper shim to add tightness to the heatsink clamp.

What about the fact that the APU no no thermal paste down one half and the PS4 still worked ok (albeit with loud fans)

Are you saying a thermal pad over the entire chip would provide worse performance than thermal paste down half of the chip?

The shim is a good idea. I have wondered about this. It wouldn't provide too much pressure and snap something though?

Then again you have no way of knowing if the shim has slipped out of place when you close the motherboard on top if it... especially if there is paste sandwiched between it, making it slippy.

 

[RobCrezz]

Thermal pad likely wouldnt give enough heat transfer performance for the APU I dont think, its usually only used for low power parts.

I would suggest using some kind of copper shim to add tightness to the heatsink clamp.

What about the fact that the APU no no thermal paste down one half and the PS4 still worked ok (albeit with loud fans)

Are you saying a thermal pad over the entire chip would provide worse performance than thermal paste down half of the chip?

Did you see my suggestion of using a shim? Thats a much better option if possible as you can get a much better clamp and still use paste.

Thermal pads have only really worked on low power stuff, I wouldnt use one on an APU.

 

[Mark_1970]

I done the pea method. I didn't spread it myself. I was just saying the way the PS4 is, you can't be sure if you get good contact.

The PS4 shuts itself down if it gets too hot, it has never done that, when with the dodgy factory thermal paste job when the fan used to blow on max a lot.

Are there any good pads for APU? (I am in UK, not US)

Pretty sure I did a decent job when I reapplied the paste, certainly better than the factory job, but now the fan is getting louder, what does this tell us? Maybe the paste is drying out due to bad contact with the heatsink?

It's sony/playstations altogether when it comes to build quality, only made to last till the next gets released, ie cheap fan solutions 😛 . sounds like the heatsink needs aligning to the chip and pre sprung a little as well as it sits a little crooked and never makes great contact. A realignment and good paste would be best fix. The heatsink must of been slightly warped when it was built. you could try 17WmK pad and least this would contact all but the thermal properties of that is not rated good enough, Your call

Personally i would of sent it back on rma before opening and avoiding warranty. but all too late now

 

[RobCrezz]

The shim is a good idea. I have wondered about this. It wouldn't provide too much pressure and snap something though?

No, shouldnt do, as by the sounds of things its not clamping correctly anyway, plus you just simply stop tightening when you have enough clamping force, just like fitting any cooler.

I would use small amounts of thermal paste both sides of the shim.

 

[rubez]

A user on Overclooker board says the chip is 19x18.5mm

Do you a 20x20x0.8mm shim is ok?

Would 0.8mm be thick enough, and is 20mm small enough to fit inside that bracket thing that surrounds the APU? (and what if the shim comes in contact with the metal bracket)

 

[RobCrezz]

20x20 should be fine. I would guess 0.8 would be enough, but its hard for me to say, as only you can see how much of a gap is left?

 

[rubez]

Can't see at all. The way it is manufactured... you have the close the motherboard over on top of the APU, like shutting a door.

0.8mm must be much better than no shim, I guess it would do. If you look at the picture, there is a screw hole nearby, so don't want to create too much tension.

It wont matter if the shim comes in contact with that bracket thing then?

 

[Mark_1970]

A user on Overclooker board says the chip is 19x18.5mm

Do you a 20x20x0.8mm shim is ok?

Would 0.8mm be thick enough, and is 20mm small enough to fit inside that bracket thing that surrounds the APU? (and what if the shim comes in contact with the metal bracket)

see the memory chips close by, lift the apu heatsink with a shim or pad then this also lifts gaps to them also, meaning pads on them will need thicker ones too. you re-did the paste before did you change the pads then as pads squish in and reusing the old they dont always make good contact again, this can cause them to overheat and system crash

 

[RobCrezz]

weirdly people have already been doing this to solve overheating on their PS3s...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Qu5_GMyX1Y

Looks like someone else had the exact same idea for the ps4 also

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php/758144-Arctic-Silver-5-PS4

 

[rubez]

I left the pads stuck to where they were when I opened it. They were shoddily cut by someone with scissors, all crooked and different shapes and sizes and plopped onto the memory. I didn't touch them.

Many people have reapplied thermal paste on their PS4s. I have seen a few of them in my situation, where it worked brilliantly for a while, then the fan slowly gets louder over time...

 

[rubez]

You can see by the imprints on the pads, that some of them weren't even in the middle enough (the 2 on the very left)

Mines were like this (not my picture)

 

[Mark_1970]

So a shim, good paste, thicker quality pads on memory (to adjust for shim lift) and your good to go. there is also a non conductive sticky tape they use around gpu's to protect resistors from arcing, use some of that if your worried too

 

[Mark_1970]

You can see by the imprints on the pads, that some of them weren't even in the middle enough (the 2 on the very left)

Mines were like this (not my picture)

one missing? as i said after removing factory pads seal on heatsink surface they may not contact 2nd time used as they are now squashed

 

[rubez]

You can see the pads are big enough if they are place right in the middle, but some of them are not... look at the imprints on the 2 left pads compared to the rest.

 

[Mark_1970]

I left the pads stuck to where they were when I opened it. They were shoddily cut by someone with scissors, all crooked and different shapes and sizes and plopped onto the memory. I didn't touch them.

Many people have reapplied thermal paste on their PS4s. I have seen a few of them in my situation, where it worked brilliantly for a while, then the fan slowly gets louder over time...

Fans getter louder can sometimes say shoddy failing loud fan and gets worse fan and needs replacement fan

 

[rubez]

The problem definitely isn't failing fan.

 

[Mark_1970]

You can see the pads are big enough if they are place right in the middle, but some of them are not... look at the imprints on the 2 left pads compared to the rest.

Like i said you break seal, pull apart you replace pads standard, same with graphics cards in laptops, pc gpu's . skid that is where people go wrong too. you need the good contact across the lot first time, every time using a thorough approach

So a shim, good paste, thicker quality pads on memory (to adjust for shim lift) and your good to go. there is also a non conductive sticky tape they use around gpu's to protect resistors from arcing, use some of that if your worried too

Like you said fans ran loud before but since you opened it, now shuts down, was you thorough? anyway we gave you the info, go apply some properly