[SOLVED] PSU fried a few hours ago & I'm worried it will happen again ?

[Kirbyarm]

Hey experts and enthusiasts. Okay so, there's a bit of a story that needs to be told here to really understand the situation and concerns. Basically it goes like this, I got this new system with a 9900K and everything brand new except a GPU about 3 years ago. I continued using my 1080 Ti since it felt more than adequate for my needs and the sheer price increase in 20xx series cards just wasn't justifiable for me to purchase at the time.

After a week or so of use, I noticed the PSU (750W seasonic 80+ gold) was making a little bit of a clicking noise, likely each time it decided to power its own fan. It wasn't jarring, but it was inconvenient enough to be distracting and so I decided to swap it out with the previous system's PSU, which is a 650W seasonic 80+ gold certified unit. It worked fine for well over 2 years up until now.. but last week I decided to upgrade the GPU finally with the market finally normalizing a bit. I got a 3080 Ti. It took dual 8-pin connectors and my friends and online hardware power draw calculators were saying 650W was fine for the card so I figured it would be fine to just plug and play. I only played Minecraft and some unity steam game for a couple of days and they worked okay for the most part.

So today (or technically late last night since it's now the AM here), I decided to stop messing around in games I have currently been into and to test a variety of games that would actually demonstrate the strength of the new GPU. Valheim had some good results, then I installed Just Cause 3. I was flying around the biggest city and getting quite impressive performance, but needed to test some gunplay in a military base and started flying toward one 9km out via helicopter. During this flight my computer just completely shut off. The power button was unresponsive, yet the USB devices like the anker HUB and two external HDDs had their LED lights still on, and toggling the physical PSU power switch would cause some of the LED lights inside the system to blink sometimes.

Gutted the old system to retrieve the 750W PSU, which means I can no longer use it as a server or backup obviously. Gutted the new system, since I couldn't access the CPU connector without removing the CPU cooler block anyway, so I figured I'd just re-apply thermal paste and re-seat everything with the 750W PSU. Got it assembled, fired it up. It all worked and everything seems to be fine. Ran a 3DMark benchmark as per friend's instruction and the results seem to be in line with what a 3080 Ti should be getting with my 9900K, and it didn't shut down during the test or anything.

...But now I'm terrified to open any games or run any more torture tests. Do y'all think I have reason to be concerned here? Would you recommend I should do anything else?

 

[Aeacus]

Do y'all think I have reason to be concerned here?

3080 Ti, despite being "only" 350W GPU, will spike it's transient power consumption, easy 2 times of what it is rated for.

GamersNexus made a nice video about it:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnRyyCsuHFQ


Btw, Nvidia suggests 750W PSU for 3080 Ti as minimum, not 650W.
Nvidia: https://www.nvidia.com/en-eu/geforce/graphics-cards/30-series/rtx-3080-3080ti/

which is a 650W seasonic 80+ gold

A good PSU, but can have issues. Namely:

Older Seasonic Focus revisions (made before 2018) had transient sensitivity issues. Some new SKUs are not affected because they were released later (Seasonic Focus GM/GX/PX refreshes, Phanteks AMP, NZXT C/E etc.).

And:

Seasonic PRIME based units experience shutdowns with RTX3080/3090 (and possibly RX6900 XT) GPUs, especially ones with unlocked power limit like FE and ASUS Strix. It is recommended, if going with such units, to overprovision wattage, 1kW for RTX3080 and 1.2kW for RTX3090.

I take that both of your Seasonic units are pre-2018? Since if so, don't stress your system or you could pop your 2nd Seasonic unit as well.

Would you recommend I should do anything else?

Buy a new PSU. I'd suggest Seasonic PRIME series, in 1000W range. Since what you effectively have, when GPU is pushed, is ~700W power consumption GPU. Add the rest of the system to it at ~200W and 1000W (1KW) PSU will do.

 

[Lafong]

I'm not quite following this.

If I understand, you think the 650 watt PSU had a major problem, so you replaced it with a 750 watt PSU you bought a few years ago but had used for only a week or so.

You then say:

"It all worked and everything seems to be fine. Ran a 3DMark benchmark as per friend's instruction and the results seem to be in line with what a 3080 Ti should be getting with my 9900K, and it didn't shut down during the test or anything."

Why are you terrified?

 

[Kirbyarm]

@Aeacus
Thanks for the response, and the advice. I think I may just order a 1KW unit as you recommend.

Though I have to ask, when these overlimit spikes happen, is the PSU supposed to completely fry and become unusable or just shut the system off? Wondering because my friends and I have been discussing the theory that it might just be a really old heavily used PSU and the new card just finally pushed it over the edge after nearly 7 years of good 24/7 ish service. Do you think there's any credibility to this theory? Also the SeaSonic is a Focus I believe, does this mean it's of the newer SKUs? Am I understanding that right or did I misread?

@Lafong
Terrified because I just had to spend three hours swapping out a PSU since one fried while flying around in a (rather outdated) game and concerned it could happen again. Plus i cut my finger nice and good on the sound card PCB during the process, I'm certainly not very experienced, calm-handed or skillful at doing hardware changes myself, but I'm trying my best. Got a good self confidence boost this time though, since I managed the entire swap without a second PC to google any issues i might've had and didn't require my manual since I knew what was supposed to go where and it all worked first try. First time I didn't use external assistance of some kind. So that's something I guess. But yeah, pretty terrified of this crippling the only backup PSU as well, though it's admittedly better and newer.

 

[Lafong]

Terrified because I just had to spend three hours swapping out a PSU since one fried while flying around in a (rather outdated) game and concerned it could happen again............... But yeah, pretty terrified of this crippling the only backup PSU as well, though it's admittedly better and newer.

I take that to mean you are somewhat nervous about your "fix it" capabilities.

OK, I can understand that.

Would installing some other power supply lower your fear, using the same "fix it" capabilities?

If yes, do that.

If no, I guess you will have to see what happens with the current power supply.

One way or another, you are going to have to try it. If you feel the current power supply is a problem, then change it.

 

[Kirbyarm]

That's according to my Newegg order history, the exact 750W unit I got. So if it's a GX and 'unaffected' by those issue does that mean it doesn't have the transient power sensitivity issues?

Order Date: 3/15/2019

 

[Kirbyarm]

@Lafong
Yeah, I can understand that. Thing is I'm far less experienced than a lot of the people here with these kinds of things and I would trust them a lot more than myself on whether or not one should feel it's the right call to get a different or new unit in this situation or things of that nature. My apologies, I can get pretty confused.

 

[Lafong]

@Lafong
Yeah, I can understand that. Thing is I'm far less experienced than a lot of the people here with these kinds of things and I would trust them a lot more than myself on whether or not one should feel it's the right call to get a different or new unit in this situation or things of that nature. My apologies, I can get pretty confused.

I had assumed you being terrified was more about your own lack of experience in repair than about the PSU itself.

Apparently, that is not so. You are mostly worried about the PSU.

If you are semi confident in your ability to install a new PSU, do that.

If you would remain terrified with a new PSU because you would be afraid you had not installed it properly, then I guess you have to rely on someone else to install it.

 

[Kirbyarm]

@Lafong
Yeah, I think that is a correct analysis. Not really too disturbed about having to do the hardware changes, although I am a bit on the clumsier side with that. It's mostly the 2nd PSU also suddenly being rendered completely unusable and broken. I'd rather have some kind of assurance that the unit should just power off safely when it gets overloaded and after demonstrating that it is a problem with my current setup, give me time to prepare and research the next unit to replace it with. You know what I mean? I'm still not sure exactly which.

 

[Lafong]

@Lafong
Not really too disturbed about having to do the hardware changes................It's mostly the 2nd PSU also suddenly being rendered completely unusable and broken.............. I'd rather have some kind of assurance that the unit should just power off safely when it gets overloaded and after demonstrating that it is a problem with my current setup, give me time to prepare and research the next unit to replace it with.

Is it your intent to always have a spare PSU?

Any PSU can become completely unusable at any time, without warning.

I would not go very far out on a limb about "assurance that the unit should just power off safely when it gets overloaded".

Key word being "assurance". With what degree of certainty? How could you ever be assured of that?

If you are afraid of being caught without a decent working power supply, then buy a decent spare and hope you never have to use it.

For all we know, your current PSU is perfectly fine as far as I can see. What reason, if any, do you have to believe it is not?

 

[Kirbyarm]

@Lafong
For what reason, it's mostly the first response I got in this topic about the conflicting differences of SeaSonic units, that some are reporting issues (pre-2018 models) while others, including allegedly, my 750W GX Focus, are going to be just fine for the 3080 Ti.

I usually always love to have a spare system on hand to act as a server but the spare PSU is always nice since they're what I feel are the mostly likely component to fail from the little experience I do have owning computers and usually compatible from newer to older systems, unlike things like socket specific CPUs and the like.

I'm not so much looking for assurance that "my PSU will never die". I'm more or less hoping that the PSU is capable or at the very least, supposed to just shut down in the event of a transient or overloaded current spike instead of just instantly fry and be permanently broken. The latter means I have to panic buy a PSU right now while the former means I can observe if it's a problem and have time to address and research a replacement. I am not familiar enough with these devices to fully comprehend from the messages in this topic so far can confirm the former or latter of this 750W unit.

 

[Lafong]

From post 2:

"Older Seasonic Focus revisions (made before 2018) had transient sensitivity issues. Some new SKUs are not affected because they were released later (Seasonic Focus GM/GX/PX refreshes, Phanteks AMP, NZXT C/E etc.). "

Does that mean that all Focus GX don't have that issue? Or does it mean that only "refreshes" of Focus GX don't have that issue?

I don't know when Focus GX first appeared.

In post 6, you specify that you bought a Focus GX on 3/15/19.

I guess you have to decide whether the first paragraph is accurate and relevant and if so decide if your March 2019 purchase is exempt from the issues stated in the first paragraph.


I have no idea how you could do that unless you can confirm it was not "made before 2018". Plead with Seasonic customer service?

Which is less annoying: buying a new PSU, possibly unnecessarily....or worry you have made a mistake?

 

[Kirbyarm]

Right, I have been wrestling with the relevance and accuracy of all the messages here, yes. Having difficulties drawing my own conclusions from my inexperience, which is largely why I came here - for experienced folks who are willing to help shed some light since I can be a bit dull at connecting the dots.

That's a sound suggestion, perhaps contacting them can reveal it's manufactured date.

As for which is less annoying... that really depends. Do you know if it's supposed to brick or shut down?

 

[Lafong]

You might Google your way into GX reviews to see if you can find out if ALL GX or only SOME GX have that issue.

I have no idea if it is supposed to brick or shut down, but I personally would not be mollified by any supposed answer to that question. Damage to other components happens, but it's not the most common outcome....which likely doesn't relieve your anxiety. "But, what if........"

Since you sorta kinda wouldn't mind having a spare PSU, maybe the least annoying tactic would be to buy another PSU unless doing so would be a budget calamity.

 

[Kirbyarm]

Of course. Buying a PSU is 100% going to happen, I'm just wondering how rushed I need to be on it. It is understandable that people couldn't possibly know if it will fry or just trip the volt protection thing the above video mentioned, but I was hopeful someone experienced with similar situations could estimate a probability or confirm that the PSU does indeed have some sort of shut down protection versus complete self destruction. But yes, research is happening and ongoing, I've been on top of it for several hours now and I really appreciate your help and any additional help I can get with this. Thanks!

 

[Aeacus]

is the PSU supposed to completely fry and become unusable or just shut the system off?

PSU should turn itself and the rest of the PC off, since PSU's OPP (Over Power Protection) kicks in.

Now, Seasonic units are built for quality and while it is sad that PSU got fried when you overloaded it with your RTX 3080 Ti, it actually did really well, especially considering it's long service life. Lesser PSUs often fry other components as well, when they go sky high. MoBos and GPUs get fried on daily basis due to owners cheaping out on their PSUs. Heck, low quality PSU can even fry everything it is connected to, when it pops. Resulting entire loss of a PC.

Since PSU powers everything, it is the most important component inside the PC.

That's according to my Newegg order history, the exact 750W unit I got. So if it's a GX and 'unaffected' by those issue does that mean it doesn't have the transient power sensitivity issues?

Order Date: 3/15/2019

I don't know when Focus GX first appeared.

That unit, Seasonic Focus GX-750, is part of the refresh series and it should not have the sensitivity to transient spikes.

Seasonic first released their Focus lineup as Focus and Focus+, back in 2017. In 2019, Seasonic made it's OneSeasonic initiative, by renaming and refreshing their entire lineup,
further reading: https://seasonic.com/oneseasonic

With this refresh, PSU model names got changed, among other things. Seasonic Focus+ 550 (80+ Platinum) is now known as Seasonic Focus PX-550. Or Seasonic PRIME Ultra 650 (80+ Titanium) is now known as Seasonic PRIME TX-650. I like this change, makes model names far shorter and easier to understand.

Thanks for the response, and the advice. I think I may just order a 1KW unit as you recommend.

Going with 1kW unit is a safe bet, since while your current GX-750 should be safe, there is always the issue of GPU transient power spikes, that will go way high, past of what 750W unit can deliver, kicking in OPP again and shutting down your PC. <- Even when hardware (including PSU) survives, you can face OS/data corruption due to this sudden power off.

Of course. Buying a PSU is 100% going to happen, I'm just wondering how rushed I need to be on it.

If i were in your situation, i'd be using the RTX 3080 Ti build with web browsing and light gaming. Any pushing of the GPU may result in power off. And once new, 1kW unit has arrived, you can put the GX-750 back to your server build.

I have no idea if it is supposed to brick or shut down

If you have no clue how PSUs work, then why you're even in this PSU discussion? 🤔

 

[Roland Of Gilead]

Transients power spikes result in the OCP (Over Current Protection) triggering and restarting the machine.

The 3080ti has a TGP of about 350w, AIB have even higher TGP and unrestricted power. The power spikes can go to 600w alone for the GPU, add in a CPU (maybe OC) and you see why @Aeacus suggestion of 1kw PSU makes sense.

 

[Kirbyarm]

@Aeacus
That is some really sensible advice. Thank you so much for bringing light to it for me in a way that I can understand. I especially appreciate the what you would do in my situation bit, that alleviates a lot running around in circles in my head trying to think of how I should handle this and that is a clear and concise resolve.

While I do have some very basic idea of how PSUs work. i.e. they deliver power to components and handle the electricity needs of the computer, I don't have much knowledge at all in the way of how electrical current works or specific internal component quality or amperages or oscillations or pretty much the vast majority of anything Steve tried to explain to me in that video (and yes I did watch it when you posted it, from start to finish and tried to understand as much as I could) - being said, I did not know anything about the OPP until this very topic and that is why I persisted on inquiring the specific nature of it and if my unit should have that or if this one's just gonna fry straight away as well. Thanks for clarifying and being straightforward.

We don't even know for 100% certainty if it was a spike that caused the PSU to fry come to think of it. It was working fine for a couple of days after all and on a particularly terribly unoptimized Unity game that was making it run very hot with very high fan RPM. I really think age was a big part of it and I am thinking it's a war hero of a PSU to not have killed anything else in its passing.

Thanks again for everything!

@keith12
Thank you for the re-affirmation. I will look into 1 - 1.2KW PSU options over the next week or two.

Any recommended quality or reputable brands/models to suggest for said PSU are most welcome.

 

[Roland Of Gilead]

Well, if money was no object, then maybe something like an EVGA Supernova T2 1600, or Corsair AX1600i. Way overkill, but plenty for RTX4xxx series high end cards (if you upgrade), as their power spikes are likely to be even higher than the 3xxx by series. And by a lot!!

On the other hand an EVGA Supernova T2 1000w, or Corsair RMX1000 would be fine.

The transient power spikes are huge, but what's equally important is the transient response of the PSU. This is down to the quality of the internal components. These units are sufficient for that.

 

[Aeacus]

Any recommended quality or reputable brands/models to suggest for said PSU are most welcome.

Besides the listed Corsair and EVGA units, Seasonic also offers 1000+W units, e.g their flagship PRIME TX series,
specs: https://seasonic.com/prime-tx
TX-750 review: https://tech-legend.com/reviews/seasonic-prime-tx-750-titanium/

Slightly lower efficiency PRIMEs (80+ Platinum) are also good choice,
specs: https://seasonic.com/prime-px

And of course, there are also 80+ Gold PRIMEs,
specs: https://seasonic.com/prime-gx

All three of my PCs are also powered by Seasonic, while i have two PRIME TX PSUs (full specs with pics in my sig).

Interesting fact about Seasonic PRIME series <- this PSU lineup, regardless the efficiency, has 12 years of warranty. No other PSU OEM/brand offers more than 10 years of warranty. E.g with Corsair or EVGA flagship units, you'll only get 10 years of warranty.

 

[Kirbyarm]

@keith12
I wouldn't say money is no object for me, but I also don't want to cheap out on this component at all. If I were going twin SLI 3090s or similar I'd be more open to 1.4kW+ suggestions, but I doubt I'll ever dual wield GPUs, heh.

Is this an RMX1000 or an oddly similarly named RM1000x? Corsair Unit on Amazon

Bit confused on the naming for some of these units. Got a friend suggesting the HX 1000W units as well.

@Aeacus
The Seasonic units looks pretty solid, definitely considering the TX and PX 1000W units. Thanks for the suggestions. It's great to see another fan of Seasonic.

Are all the above in this post adequate to handle an average 3080 Ti tier system?

 

[Karadjgne]

Question. Those original psu mentions about the 850w Seasonic Gold, and 650w Seasonic Gold are how old? Neither I'd think will be over 5 years old, therefore should still be covered by manufacturer warranty at a minimum.

Seasonic had issues with the original focus series and 30 series cards because the OCP on the 12v rail wasn't very forgiving, which you'd think would be a really good thing, but the transient load spikes with the 30 series cards were tripping Seasonic OCP like bandits and causing instant shutdowns. Perfectly normal and expected behavior, yet quite aggravating when a pc normally pulling 500-600w was suddenly shutting down, with a 750w psu.

Seasonic has addressed that in the new Focus series. But why you didn't/haven't RMA'd the 2 psus, that's my question.

 

[Kirbyarm]

@Karadjgne
The 650W is around 7 years old I believe, and it saw nearly 24/7 usage for service before it kicked the bucket. The second unit, the 750W is still fully operational and I do believe you are right that it is still eligible for its warranty, however I don't see why I would RMA a perfectly functional PSU. Even if this PSU did have a problem with the 3080 Ti system, I could only RMA it for most likely a repair or replacement as far as I know so it would only be useful to get a PSU back into the server build in the best case scenario. I simply need a higher wattage PSU to handle the latest power hungry components it seems.

 

[Aeacus]

The 650W is around 7 years old I believe

I wonder, what's the model (or part number) of your 650W unit? 🤔

Since it can't be Focus series, because those got 1st released 5 years ago.
It could be S12G, G-series, X-series or SSP-650RT. Though, latter is OEM/industrial unit and i don't think you have the latter.

And if to RMA something, then the 650W unit that actually did pop.

Are all the above in this post adequate to handle an average 3080 Ti tier system?

Yes.

Got a friend suggesting the HX 1000W units as well.

While good, do note that Corsair HX-series came out in 2017, so, the platform is 5+ years old. 80+ Platinum that is. But if you're looking at HX 1000W 80+ White or HX 1050W 80+ Silver than these two are even older. 80+ White came out in 2008 and 80+ Silver came out in 2011.
80+ Platinum has 10 years warranty. Older HX 1kW units have less warranty.

Essentially same goes to Corsair AXi series as well, seeing 1st release back in 2012. AX1500i came in 2014. Latest and beefiest AXi, 1600W unit, saw release in 2018 (all AXi series PSUs have 10 years of warranty),
review: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/corsair-ax1600i/

Is this an RMX1000 or an oddly similarly named RM1000x? Corsair Unit on Amazon

Both are same. Unit came out in 2015 and has 7 years of warranty (5 years less than Seasonic PRIME series, at 12 years),
review: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/corsair-rm1000x/

And here's the review of EVGA Supernova 1600 T2, also suggested here (10 years of warranty with this one),
link: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/evga-supernova-t2-1600/

 

[Kirbyarm]

@Aeacus

Surprised Newegg still has record of it. I was at a loss of where I purchased it from. Luckily it was Newegg. Order Date: 5/22/2014, so 7 years was a young estimate haha.. Definitely didn't think it was a Focus as I recall learning of that naming scheme when I got the 750W. Didn't really look into it.

I don't think the 650W still has warranty coverage, but since I need an upgrade anyway, I'd rather not get it replaced. I'd say I got my money's worth out of this one, I'm happy with that.

Hang on, you're saying the RMX 1000W is a 7 year old unit? I skimmed down the amazon page and could swear I saw it was a 2021 model. You did say it was part of post #21's PSU's that would befit a 3080 Ti system, so I suppose the RMX is worth considering still. I've taken note of the other details for the other lineups, going to look into the Supernova now as well. Thanks a lot!

Edit: Also one of the images of the RMX unit on the above linked Amazon page seems to indicate it has a 10 year warranty from Corsair. And a couple more flavor images of the amazon page, because why not.