Question about Breadboxing

[magishine]

Hello everyone,

I have a question about breadboxing. I've read threads of people saying it's worth it and a lot of people saying it's not worth it. What do you guys think?

If I decide to breadbox my build before I put it in the case I had another question. Most guides recommend putting the CPU cooler on while breadboxing. I'm using a Kraken X61 for cooling. Not sure that would be best. Should I try to boot it up without the CPU cooler on? or should I just not breadbox and go for full install. Thanks for your help

 

[JackNaylorPE]

Think you mean "bread boarding" . Well recognized as a trouble shooting procedure it refers to pretty much a full assembly. Mounting a large air cooler , while not really bread boarding as it's the only step being performed, is just about always done outside the case cuz once MoBo in have no maneuvering room.. Mounting a CPU water block for a custom loop, I'd do outside the case... mounting a CLC I'd do inside the case as installing the MoBo w/ the rad hanging off would be a real PITA.

Not sure if you are asking if installing it or using it (Kraken) would be best. Installing is answered above, using I would say no... the Noctua NH-D15 air cooler or the Swiftech H240 X2 (or H220 X2) are better choices. Start at the 22:55 mark

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYKdKVxbnp8

KrakenX61 edges the Noc air cooler by 1C but needs to be about 5 times louder to do that. But the Swiftech beats the Kraken by 5C while being only half as loud.

The Swiftech, as you might expect costs more (~ $30) but it's has significantly better thermals, half as loud, uses copper rads, no mixed metals which cause galvanic corrosion, it can be expanded to add a water block for you GFX card. It also looks a whole lot better.

 

[magishine]

Think you mean "bread boarding" . Well recognized as a trouble shooting procedure it refers to preetty much a full assemble. Mounting an large air cooler , while not really bread boarding, is just about always done outside the case. Mounting a CPOU water block I'd do outside the case... mounting a CLC Id do inside the case as installing the MoBo w/ the rad hanging off would be a real PITA.

Yeah I meant bread boarding. Sorry. Still new to the terminology

Since my water cooling unit is a CLC, is it recommended to turn the machine on to post to make sure it will work without the CLC hooked up? Basically the processor would be exposed to air but I'd only run it long enough to make sure it boots

 

[JQB45]

Never turn a Computer on with the CPU cooler not installed.

 

[sykozis]

If you're going to power the system on at all, you need to have a cooler affixed to the CPU.

Here's something to consider. Just because it boots and functions properly prior to assembly inside a case, does not guarantee that it will boot and function properly once inside the case. It only takes pressing the power button 1 time for electronic devices to fail.

Btw: All watercooling systems are closed loop systems. The difference is whether you're using an AIO (all-in-one) or a custom loop. An open loop watercooling system would make a huge mess....

 

[USAFRet]

Don't turn it on without some sort of cooler attached to the CPU.

 

[JQB45]

My personal opinion is to assemble everything once in the case and start it up once its fully installed and you've double checked everything. To me assembling it once outside the case, only to take it apart and then put it into the case means you have two chances to mess something up, vs one. And it takes far less time to build a computer once.

 

[magishine]

Thanks guys. I'll just put it all together inside the case and hope for the best. I've read people generally have good luck but I'm a firm believer in Murphy's Law and like to take precautions wherever possible. I kinda guessed with my liquid cooling system that it would be best to build inside the case. I'll probably still assemble it outside the case but I won't test anything until it's all hooked up. Thanks again guys

 

[JackNaylorPE]

Caveat ... as I said above, installing an air cooler inside the case is a very challenging task. Trying to get ya fingers in and around in the tight space to plug in fans and retrieve install fan clips can be nigh on impossible, especially in mid tower and smaller cases.

Not recommending this procedure, especially for novices but I'd also add since it was mentioned that I have many times started up a PC to BIOS with no cooler of any kind when doing water cooling builds. Just detached and plugged in stock cooler fan (to fool the BIOS and get it to load) and let it hang there. With no load and the short duration (once I see BIOS screen, I shut down) CPU temps were never a concern. Again, not recommended for 1st time builders and not recommended when OC applied and not recommended for any significant duration.

Approach I use is:

1. Install everything that "won't get in the way" ... PSU, Pump(s) storage, etc ... this generally won't include radiators as MoBo tough to get in and out w/ rads in place.

2. Boot up system "on air" with stock coolers on CPU and GFX cards .... install OS, make sure everything works and nothing has to be RMAd

3. Take out MoBo / CPU / Stock Cooler / GFX Cards and install rads

4. Install WBs on GFX cards

5. Install MoBo / CPU / GFX cards and connect all cables as required. Boot to BIOS screen and shut down after confirming operational.

6. Install CPU Water Block... boot again to BIOS (reason i added this troubeshooting a users build, found out that he had over tightened the clamping mechanism and one or more CPU socket pins lost contact w/ CPU.... backing off screws just a bit solved issue.

7. Install / Test WC system:

a) all tubing / fittings ... took about 4 - 5 days on last build with rigid acrylic tubing
b) fill / static bleed system ... 2 hours
c) dynamic bleed and leak test system ... pump only on ... 24 hours duration, open bleed valves fill as necessary after 1, 2, 4, 8 and 24 hours.

8. Boot and test system ... start working on OCs.

If not obvious by now, when ya spend as much as a week installing and testing the WC system, there is significant value in doing the quick test to see if BIOS loads. Cause after a week of effort ... no fun draining the system, uninstalling all the water cooling stuff to figure out where the problem is, fixing it and then re-installing everything.

Obviously, a CLC is a very different animal and no need to go that route with one ... I would keep a spare tube of TIM around tho in case it does have to come out and breadboard to find the problem.

 

[Jeff Kaos]

I've built a lot of systems professionally and I usually installed the CPU, RAM and CPU cooler first and then put the whole thing into the case. If you're using a third party cooler I can't think of any other way to do it since most of time you need to attach a bracket to the back of the motherboard in order to mount the cooler. I also like to put RAM in before installing the board because it's easier. And you don't have to worry about pushing down too hard and possibly cracking the board. I've never had that happened but I heard of some coworkers doing it. I also like to put the PSU in the case before the mobo. I've dropped a PSU onto a board twice and damaged the board both times. One of them I was able to fix it but the other one lost a transistor.

It's also a good idea to put the mobo and cooler in and before actually tightening it down so you can see how the drives fit. I've had to pull boards out because something on it, usually the cooler, RAM or a transistor, blocked the drive.

 

[USAFRet]

It's also a good idea to put the mobo and cooler in and before actually tightening it down so you can see how the drives fit. I've had to pull boards out because something on it, usually the cooler, RAM or a transistor, blocked the drive.

Often, with different cases, its a matter of trial and error to see which part should go in before which other part.

"Oh wait, I have to take this out to get the cable to route around there."

 

[JackNaylorPE]

As long as you install the cooler after the CPU, it should work

One way around the "install Cooler before MoBo goes in" methos is to have a 10 year old helping you ... sum1 whose hands fit between the cooler fins and everything else around it to grab that dropped hold town screw, bracket doo-hickey, plug-in phillips driver head, fan holder-on thingies.

Sorry for the "highly 'technical" terminology.