Question from the CHK Pre-release.

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Howdy folks. Back from Saturday's pre-release sealed deck tournament
in London, where I made myself a nice GBw deck (where the two friends
with whom I play, and are far more experienced in this sort of thing
than I, would have made a UR and a UBw deck from the same cards). Won
one, lost one, then had to leave due to time constraints. Arriving at
9am and having played only two rounds by 4pm wasn't the highest
effeciency I could have expected.

Enough blurb, now; after reflecting on the proceedings, I do actually
have a rules question about a scenario that came up, but I didn't
think to ask the judges about at the time:

I have in play a Matsu-Tribe Decoy, enchanted by Serpent Skin, and
Shisato, Whispering Hunter (amids about three other snakes, which
aren't relevant to the question).

Matsu-Tribe Decoy 2G
Creature - Snake Warrior
2G: Target creature blocks Matsu-Tribe Decoy this turn if able.
Whenever Matsu-Tribe Decoy deals combat damage to a creature, tap that
creature and it doesn't untap during its controller's next untap step.
1/3

Serpent Skin 2G
Enchant Creature
You may play Serpent Skin any time you could play an instant.
Enchanted creature gets +1/+1.
G : Regenerate enchanted creature.

Shisato, Whispering Hunter 3G
Legendary Creature - Snake Warrior
At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice a Snake.
Whenever Shisato, Whispering Hunter deals combat damage to a player,
that player skips his or her next untap step.
2/2

The question is this:

If, while attacking, I use the Decoy's ability to take my opponent's
creatures out of the way (regenerating the Decoy, of course), and my
opponent is struck by Shisato, do the creatures to whom the Decoy did
damage skip _two_ untaps, one from Shisato, and one from the Decoy
itself?

Cheers,

Matt Chaplain.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Matt Chaplain, worshipped by llamas the world over, wrote...
> Howdy folks. Back from Saturday's pre-release sealed deck tournament
> in London, where I made myself a nice GBw deck (where the two friends
> with whom I play, and are far more experienced in this sort of thing
> than I, would have made a UR and a UBw deck from the same cards). Won
> one, lost one, then had to leave due to time constraints. Arriving at
> 9am and having played only two rounds by 4pm wasn't the highest
> effeciency I could have expected.
>
> Enough blurb, now; after reflecting on the proceedings, I do actually
> have a rules question about a scenario that came up, but I didn't
> think to ask the judges about at the time:
>
> I have in play a Matsu-Tribe Decoy, enchanted by Serpent Skin, and
> Shisato, Whispering Hunter (amids about three other snakes, which
> aren't relevant to the question).
>
> Matsu-Tribe Decoy 2G
> Creature - Snake Warrior
> 2G: Target creature blocks Matsu-Tribe Decoy this turn if able.
> Whenever Matsu-Tribe Decoy deals combat damage to a creature, tap that
> creature and it doesn't untap during its controller's next untap step.
> 1/3
>
> Serpent Skin 2G
> Enchant Creature
> You may play Serpent Skin any time you could play an instant.
> Enchanted creature gets +1/+1.
> G : Regenerate enchanted creature.
>
> Shisato, Whispering Hunter 3G
> Legendary Creature - Snake Warrior
> At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice a Snake.
> Whenever Shisato, Whispering Hunter deals combat damage to a player,
> that player skips his or her next untap step.
> 2/2
>
> The question is this:
>
> If, while attacking, I use the Decoy's ability to take my opponent's
> creatures out of the way (regenerating the Decoy, of course), and my
> opponent is struck by Shisato, do the creatures to whom the Decoy did
> damage skip _two_ untaps, one from Shisato, and one from the Decoy
> itself?

Your opponent skips their next untap step, which means that the "next
untap step" that Decoy refers to doesn't happen when you would normally
expect it to. So those critters will still not untap during the next
untap step of your opponent's that actually takes place. Net result:
they do indeed skip untapping twice.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

On 20 Sep 2004 06:20:38 -0700, Matt Chaplain wrote:

>If, while attacking, I use the Decoy's ability to take my opponent's
>creatures out of the way (regenerating the Decoy, of course), and my
>opponent is struck by Shisato, do the creatures to whom the Decoy did
>damage skip _two_ untaps, one from Shisato, and one from the Decoy
>itself?

Shisato makes a player skip the whole untap step. Since the decoy's
"doesn't untap" effect just refers to the player's "next untap step"
(instead of "next turn" or something like that), it will happen during
the next untap step that player actually gets.

So yes, this combination will freeze the creatures that received combat
damage from Matsu-Tribe Decoy for two turns.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

On 20 Sep 2004 06:20:38 -0700, Matt Chaplain <matthew.chaplain@gmail.com> wrote:
>I have in play a Matsu-Tribe Decoy, enchanted by Serpent Skin, and
>Shisato, Whispering Hunter (amids about three other snakes, which
>aren't relevant to the question).
>
>Matsu-Tribe Decoy 2G Creature - Snake Warrior
>1/3 2G: Target creature blocks ~ this turn if able. / Whenever ~ deals combat
> damage to a creature, tap that creature and it doesn't untap during its
> controller's next untap step.
>Serpent Skin 2G Enchant Creature
> You may play ~ any time you could play an instant. / Enchanted creature gets
> +1/+1. / G: Regenerate enchanted creature.
>Shisato, Whispering Hunter 3G Legendary Creature - Snake Warrior
>2/2 At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice a Snake. / Whenever ~ deals
> combat damage to a player, that player skips his or her next untap step.
>
>The question is this:
>
>If, while attacking, I use the Decoy's ability to take my opponent's
>creatures out of the way (regenerating the Decoy, of course), and my
>opponent is struck by Shisato, do the creatures to whom the Decoy did
>damage skip _two_ untaps, one from Shisato, and one from the Decoy itself?

They only skip untapping -during- one untap step. Their controller -also-
skips an entire untap step, meaning there's no chance during that step for
anything to untap, because that step has no 'during' in the first place. So
first your opponent skips an untap step, and the Decoy effects wait around
unused; after that on your opponent's next turn, they have a normal untap
step (assuming no more Shisato trickery) but during that step the
Decoy-affected creatures he controls don't untap.

Dave
--
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