[SOLVED] Ram with zen 3

[Imposted]

Does anyone here have a 5900x? Cause I’m trying to figure out if I should get 3600mhz 32gb, or 4000mhz 16gb

 

[Third-Eye]

If it's the same price, go for 2x16GB 3600. Try to get 3600 CL16-18-18 over 16-19-19. CL 16-16-16 should be Samsung B-die and would be the best, but is much more expensive. Even on Ryzen 5000, the performance difference between 3600 to 4000 currently isn't enough to justify the extra cost if it's only 2x8GB. Fast ram isn't helpful if you need more than 16GB in the future, especially with a high end CPU like the 5900X.

4x8GB is faster than 2x8GB at the same frequency and cas latency with Ryzen CPUs, but there are limitations to the maximum ram speed that is stable for each generation. 2x16GB is best for higher overclocks and less stress on the memory controller than 4x8GB.

 

[Imposted]

If it's the same price, go for 2x16GB 3600. Try to get 3600 CL16-18-18 over 16-19-19. CL 16-16-16 should be Samsung B-die and would be the best, but is much more expensive. Even on Ryzen 5000, the performance difference between 3600 to 4000 currently isn't enough to justify the extra cost if it's only 2x8GB. Fast ram isn't helpful if you need more than 16GB in the future, especially with a high end CPU like the 5900X.

4x8GB is faster than 2x8GB at the same frequency and cas latency with Ryzen CPUs, but there are limitations to the maximum ram speed that is stable for each generation. 2x16GB is best for higher overclocks and less stress on the memory controller than 4x8GB.

cant find any ram with that timing

 

[Third-Eye]

cant find any ram with that timing

Where are you shopping for ram?

 

[Imposted]

Where are you shopping for ram?

Amazon, Newegg, heck even google

 

[Third-Eye]

Amazon, Newegg, heck even google

I got the 2x8GB kits mixed in with 2x16GB when I was looking at for 2x16GB kits, so forget I said 2x16GB CL16-18-18.

2x16GB 3600 CL18 isn't too bad and will likely be around 5-10fps slower than 3600 CL16. I personally would still try to get the 3600 CL16-19-19 kit or push for CL16-16-16. If cost is an issue, you probably won't notice much difference in fps when gaming if you pick the 3600 CL18.

This 2x16GB CL16-16-16 kit uses Samsung B-die if you want to mess with overclocking or tightening the timing for 5-7 more fps. You might be able get it up to 3866 CL18 without much issue, but it's still not going to give much benefit over 3600 CL16 with tighter timings. https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232905

 

[Imposted]

I got the 2x8GB kits mixed in with 2x16GB when I was looking at for 2x16GB kits, so forget I said 2x16GB CL16-18-18.

2x16GB 3600 CL18 isn't too bad and will likely be around 5-10fps slower than 3600 CL16. I personally would still try to get the 3600 CL16-19-19 kit or push for CL16-16-16. If cost is an issue, you probably won't notice much difference in fps when gaming if you pick the 3600 CL18.

This 2x16GB CL16-16-16 kit uses Samsung B-die if you want to mess with overclocking or tightening the timing for 5-7 more fps. You might be able get it up to 3866 CL18 without much issue, but it's still not going to give much benefit over 3600 CL16 with tighter timings. https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232905

is that the one you use? Also over 200 is a bit pricey

 

[Third-Eye]

is that the one you use? Also over 200 is a bit pricey

I'm using two kits of Patriot Viper Steel Series 4000 CL19 2x8GB. I don't recommend them for the average user, because they use lower quality Samsung B-die chips and are on A0 module PCBs. They only have 3866 and 4000 for available XMP settings, so they require memory timing and speed tweaking, but I planned on that when I bought them. So with the memory controller and motherboard limitations with my Ryzen 5 2600, I'm currently limited to a max stable speed and timing of 3000 CL14-14-14-28-44-1T with 4x8GB. I should be able to run my two kits at 3733 CL16 though. I paid $200 for both kit in October/November 2019 when 2x8GB 3200 and 3600 Samsung B-die kits were going for $130-150 each with the same quality chips and PCB.

 

[Imposted]

I'm using two kits of Patriot Viper Steel Series 4000 CL19 2x8GB. I don't recommend them for the average user, because they use lower quality Samsung B-die chips and are on A0 module PCBs. They only have 3866 and 4000 for available XMP settings, so they require memory timing and speed tweaking, but I planned on that when I bought them. So with the memory controller and motherboard limitations with my Ryzen 5 2600, I'm currently limited to a max stable speed and timing of 3000 CL14-14-14-28-44-1T with 4x8GB. I should be able to run my two kits at 3733 CL16 though. I paid $200 for both kit in October/November 2019 when 2x8GB 3200 and 3600 Samsung B-die kits were going for $130-150 each with the same quality chips and PCB.

So which one would you recommend for me, that’s a good value? Cause 200 is a bit pricey

 

[Third-Eye]

So which one would you recommend for me, that’s a good value? Cause 200 is a bit pricey

If it's a matter of price, buy what you know you will need now or buy what you think you will need in the future. You might be fine with 2x8GB 3600 CL16 now, but it's possible you might need more than 16GB of ram for future games you want to play or programs you want to run. If you think you need 32GB now or in the future, grab the 2x16GB 3600 CL16-19-19 ram for around $145-165 if that is within your budget. 3600 CL18-22-22 is going obviously be worse, but it's $30-50 cheaper depending on the kit and sales. You likely wouldn't notice much difference in game fps.

I haven't had a good look yet, but there are probably faster ram kits you can underclock to 3600 CL16 and they may cost about the same or less than the 2x16GB 3600 CL16 kits. I'll have a look at the kits and post back if I find anything good.

 

[DMAN999]

What motherboard are you going to use with the 5950x ?

 

[Imposted]

What motherboard are you going to use with the 5950x ?

Asus tuf x570, also I said 5900x not 5950x

 

[DMAN999]

There are plenty of kits that were tested by Asus that you can choose from for your
Asus TUF Gaming X570-Pro (WI-FI):
https://dlcdnets.asus.com/pub/ASUS/...or_3rd_Gen_AMD_Ryzen_Processors_X570_0722.pdf

 

[DaveTea]

If it's the same price, go for 2x16GB 3600. Try to get 3600 CL16-18-18 over 16-19-19. CL 16-16-16 should be Samsung B-die and would be the best, but is much more expensive. Even on Ryzen 5000, the performance difference between 3600 to 4000 currently isn't enough to justify the extra cost if it's only 2x8GB. Fast ram isn't helpful if you need more than 16GB in the future, especially with a high end CPU like the 5900X.

4x8GB is faster than 2x8GB at the same frequency and cas latency with Ryzen CPUs, but there are limitations to the maximum ram speed that is stable for each generation. 2x16GB is best for higher overclocks and less stress on the memory controller than 4x8GB.

4x8 is only faster than 2x16 on Ryzen 5000. On Ryzen 3000, 2x16 is faster (I know he's talking of a 5900x - which I'm waiting to arrive). There's many tube vids to support this. Low timings are always better, yes, but the price increase is disproprtional to the gains, eg if you pay what could easily be twice the price, you may get just c2 or 3% speed gain, which no-one would ever notice in the real world, but just in a few benchmark figures. Also, Samsung B-Die can be over volted and timings dropped quite aggressively, so, eg a 2x8gb pair of 3600MHz 8-Pack which comes in at 16-16-16-36 at 1.35v, which I've now dropped to 14-14-15-30 at 1.45v on a decent MoBo - I've had it/done it. But I barely noticed any difference in use. Also, once you go over 3600MHz, the F-Clock can change to 2T, which slows things back down, and tuning FCLK can get problematic and time consuming. I've spent many hours with RAM tuning, and in the end, considered it a waste of time.

 

[DaveTea]

If it's a matter of price, buy what you know you will need now or buy what you think you will need in the future. You might be fine with 2x8GB 3600 CL16 now, but it's possible you might need more than 16GB of ram for future games you want to play or programs you want to run. If you think you need 32GB now or in the future, grab the 2x16GB 3600 CL16-19-19 ram for around $145-165 if that is within your budget. 3600 CL18-22-22 is going obviously be worse, but it's $30-50 cheaper depending on the kit and sales. You likely wouldn't notice much difference in game fps.

I haven't had a good look yet, but there are probably faster ram kits you can underclock to 3600 CL16 and they may cost about the same or less than the 2x16GB 3600 CL16 kits. I'll have a look at the kits and post back if I find anything good.

That's exactly what happened to me - I bought 2x8gb 3600MHz of fast B-Die RAM, and was happy with it, until, 6 Months later, I installed MS Flight Simulator 2020, when it became obvious 16gb was not enough. I've now got 32gb, and during the 'game' I see it's regularly using 18gb, just in FS2020! I went from using 2x8gb RAM tuned to 14-14-15-30, to 2x16gb G-Skill at 17-19-19-39 (tunded down to 16-17-19-38, because I could), and apart from FS2020, and looking at RAM benchmarks, I didn't notice a difference - and I was looking.

 

[DaveTea]

I'm using two kits of Patriot Viper Steel Series 4000 CL19 2x8GB. I don't recommend them for the average user, because they use lower quality Samsung B-die chips and are on A0 module PCBs. They only have 3866 and 4000 for available XMP settings, so they require memory timing and speed tweaking, but I planned on that when I bought them. So with the memory controller and motherboard limitations with my Ryzen 5 2600, I'm currently limited to a max stable speed and timing of 3000 CL14-14-14-28-44-1T with 4x8GB. I should be able to run my two kits at 3733 CL16 though. I paid $200 for both kit in October/November 2019 when 2x8GB 3200 and 3600 Samsung B-die kits were going for $130-150 each with the same quality chips and PCB.

Can you explain what you mean by - 'lower quality Samsung B-Die chips'?

 

[Third-Eye]

Can you explain what you mean by - 'lower quality Samsung B-Die chips'?

Manufactures of computer components, such as ram or CPUs, will "bin" them or basically sort them based on how well they meet or exceed the required specifications for a final product. If you find a Samsung B-die kit marketed at 4000 CL17, it could either have higher binned/qaulity ram chips or have an A1 or A2 PCB the ram chips are soldered to and should be better suited to higher overclocks or tighter timings.

A kit with Samsung B-die advertised as 4133 or higher will very likely be using an A1 or A2 PCB. A1 and A2 are better for higher overclocks and tighter timings. If you see cheap sticks of DDR4 4000 with CL19 to CL20+, it will likely be lower binned Samsung B-die or possibly Hynix AFR and be using an A0 PCB. There is no way to actually know for sure what PCB the modules use without looking at it, because the pictures on store pages are not always the same revision of the product.

 

[DaveTea]

Thanks; I thought you were talking about binning, but I wasn't aware that B-Die was binned too.