• Now's your chance to speak with MSI directly! Join our AMA and get entered to win a RTX 2060 GPU, plus more! Ask your questions here.

    Catch the next Tom's Hardware livestream on May 28 at 2PM Eastern: Catch the show here!

    Need Hardware Help? Include the Info Requested Here.
  • Join our Best PC Builds competition and get on the Tom's Hardware home page. Check it out here.

Question Random PC freezes caused by ntoskrnl.exe?

Liborio

Reputable
Apr 2, 2016
106
0
4,580
0
Hi,

I have had a problem with my PC randomly crashing (especially when gaming) for many, many years since purchased basically. I have posted on many forums including here (https://forums.tomshardware.com/threads/windows-10-pc-freezing-randomly-since-bought-in-2016.3483402/ ) and no one has been able to advise what the issue is. It happened the other day and i used an application called bluescreenview which created a dumpfile and after looking at it on the app, it highlighted in red this file "ntoskrnl.exe". I think this might be the problem after so many years. The only thing that gets me is that ive reinstalled Windows on a new SSD more than once and it still occurs which seems highly unlikely to be a software issue but i cant be too sure? Is anyone able to assist?

View: https://imgur.com/a/lGB5wYo


Any help is much appreciated.
 

Colif

Win 10 Master
Moderator
NTOSKRNL = windows kernel. . It handles all driver requests, power management, and memory management. It sits between Hardware and Applications. It got blamed but its not the cause. 90% of the time it is blamed by bluescreenview as it is what crashed, it was just the victim. If it crashes, windows has no choice but to follow. Essential part of windows.

can you go to c:/windows/minidump
copy any minidump files here to another folder.
from the new folder, upload the copies to a file sharing website and show link here.

I should look in systems more often or I would have seen that post.
 

Liborio

Reputable
Apr 2, 2016
106
0
4,580
0
NTOSKRNL = windows kernel. . It handles all driver requests, power management, and memory management. It sits between Hardware and Applications. It got blamed but its not the cause. 90% of the time it is blamed by bluescreenview as it is what crashed, it was just the victim. If it crashes, windows has no choice but to follow. Essential part of windows.

can you go to c:/windows/minidump
copy any minidump files here to another folder.
from the new folder, upload the copies to a file sharing website and show link here.

I should look in systems more often or I would have seen that post.
Thank you for your reply.

I have uploaded it to SkyDrive: https://1drv.ms/u/s!AozirN8p2aA4jGGik8rnXP23BwqI?e=5tjO5L
 

gardenman

Admirable
Moderator
Hi, I ran the dump file through the debugger and got the following information: https://tristichousparty.htmlpasta.com/

File information:012320-4828-01.dmp (Jan 23 2020 - 04:28:47)
Bugcheck:SYSTEM_SERVICE_EXCEPTION (3B)
Probably caused by:memory_corruption (Process: dwm.exe)
Uptime:0 Day(s), 2 Hour(s), 54 Min(s), and 51 Sec(s)

Comment: The GPU tweaking driver "iomap64.sys" was found on your system. (AI Suite or GPU Tweak 2)

Possible Motherboard page: https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/Z170-PRO-GAMING/
It appears you are using the newest BIOS already, version 3805.

This information can be used by others to help you. I can't help you with this. Someone else will post with more information. Please wait for additional answers. Good luck.
 

Liborio

Reputable
Apr 2, 2016
106
0
4,580
0
Hi, I ran the dump file through the debugger and got the following information: https://tristichousparty.htmlpasta.com/

File information:012320-4828-01.dmp (Jan 23 2020 - 04:28:47)
Bugcheck:SYSTEM_SERVICE_EXCEPTION (3B)
Probably caused by:memory_corruption (Process: dwm.exe)
Uptime:0 Day(s), 2 Hour(s), 54 Min(s), and 51 Sec(s)

Comment: The GPU tweaking driver "iomap64.sys" was found on your system. (AI Suite or GPU Tweak 2)

Possible Motherboard page: https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/Z170-PRO-GAMING/
It appears you are using the newest BIOS already, version 3805.

This information can be used by others to help you. I can't help you with this. Someone else will post with more information. Please wait for additional answers. Good luck.
Thank you for your efforts.

If anyone is able to assist with the findings and advise what could be the cause of my 4 year long freeze issue, it would be much appreciated.
 

Colif

Win 10 Master
Moderator
I guessed what it was before i opened the dump file

although at least this time I have evidence
dxgkrnl!CFlipToken::InitializeCompleted+0x5c

9 out of 1q0 times I see Direct X its the GPU drivers. Fact you have latest also makes it more obvious to me. I don't think highly of those, I seem to be blaming them for almost every bsod this week...
run DDU and uninstall Nvidia drivers, either use older ones from Nvidia or run windows update and let MIcrosoft find them

https://forums.tomshardware.com/faq/how-to-perform-a-clean-install-of-your-video-card-drivers.2402269/
 

Liborio

Reputable
Apr 2, 2016
106
0
4,580
0
I guessed what it was before i opened the dump file

although at least this time I have evidence
dxgkrnl!CFlipToken::InitializeCompleted+0x5c

9 out of 1q0 times I see Direct X its the GPU drivers. Fact you have latest also makes it more obvious to me. I don't think highly of those, I seem to be blaming them for almost every bsod this week...
run DDU and uninstall Nvidia drivers, either use older ones from Nvidia or run windows update and let MIcrosoft find them

https://forums.tomshardware.com/faq/how-to-perform-a-clean-install-of-your-video-card-drivers.2402269/
So just to confirm, you think its my graphics drivers? How could this be if ive done multiple fresh installs of Windows and changed SSD's whilst doing so? Wouldnt that suggest a hardware fault?

Not quite sure, just questioning my theory.
 

Colif

Win 10 Master
Moderator
That one bsod looks like its either the drivers or the GPU itself. Others may have been different, I can only go by what I see..
Try replacing drivers, if it doesn't fix it all, clearly it isn't just the GPU

ffff99003f55ee10 fffff80756a0b45f : 0000000000000000 ffff99003f55efa0 ffff860cb6c24e60 ffff860c00000000 : dxgkrnl!CFlipToken::InitializeCompleted+0x5c
ffff99003f55eea0 fffff80756a0afea : ffff860cb761bc70 ffff860c00000000 ffff860cb761bc70 0000000000000000 : dxgkrnl!CTokenManager::processDxgkAdapterTokens+0x3cf
ffff99003f55f7d0 fffff80756a1a429 : 0000000000000000 ffffb28b016acfe0 ffff860cb6c24e60 fffff80756a0ffe4 : dxgkrnl!CTokenManager::processTokens+0x18a
ffff99003f55f890 fffff80756a0ff1d : 0000000000000000 ffff99003f55fa80 ffff860cb6c24e60 ffff48e679dc5028 : dxgkrnl!CTokenManager::TokenThread+0x79
ffff99003f55f8e0 fffff8074dfd2d15 : ffffb28b030b4080 0000000000000000 0000000000000020 0000000000000000 : dxgkrnl!NtTokenManagerThread+0x1cd
all the references to DIrectX are my clues. this mentions tokens - https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/Windows-hardware/drivers/display/directx-graphics-infrastructure-ddi

i hate those smilies :)
 

Liborio

Reputable
Apr 2, 2016
106
0
4,580
0
That one bsod looks like its either the drivers or the GPU itself. Others may have been different, I can only go by what I see..
Try replacing drivers, if it doesn't fix it all, clearly it isn't just the GPU



all the references to DIrectX are my clues. this mentions tokens - https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/Windows-hardware/drivers/display/directx-graphics-infrastructure-ddi

i hate those smilies :)
So your recommendation to me would be to reinstall drivers again? If so, do i reinstall the same latest drivers from nvidia direclty (as i have now) or Microsoft native drivers or?

If it isnt the GPU, what else could this be?
 

Colif

Win 10 Master
Moderator
I have had a problem with my PC randomly crashing (especially when gaming)
My 1st instinct is to check GPU if PC crashes during games, as that is the item most being used in them.
Have you had same card the entire time you have had the errors?
Have you tried card in another PC to see if it causes same problems.
If it only happens in games, its probably pointless to test PC without the GPU as games look bad in the intel HD graphics. Better off trying a different GPU. (not saying buy a new one)

CPU - i7-6700K
Motherboard - Asus Z170 PRO GAMING
RAM - 16gb G Skill F4-2133C15-8GVR
GPU - MSI 980Ti Sea Hawk Edition
PSU - Seasonic 850W 80PlusBronze ATX

last 2 items maybe old, I took from your last thread.
 
Last edited:

Liborio

Reputable
Apr 2, 2016
106
0
4,580
0
My 1st instinct is to check GPU if PC crashes during games, as that is the item most being used in them.
Have you had same card the entire time you have had the errors?
Have you tried card in another PC to see if it causes same problems.
If it only happens in games, its probably pointless to test PC without the GPU as games look bad in the intel HD graphics. Better off trying a different GPU. (not saying buy a new one)

CPU - i7-6700K
Motherboard - Asus Z170 PRO GAMING
RAM - 16gb G Skill F4-2133C15-8GVR
GPU - MSI 980Ti Sea Hawk Edition
PSU - Seasonic 850W 80PlusBronze ATX

last 2 items maybe old, I took from your last thread.
Correct. Same hardware the whole time (4ish years). I have a feeling it may be a faulty GPU, rather than a software thing. I have run many many test hardware tests on all components but havent picked anything up.

The PC store i bought it from has specialised custom software that digs deep down into hardware testing to pick up hardware faults 10 times better than the free software available on the web so i might giver that a go?
 

Colif

Win 10 Master
Moderator
worth a try. I saw your other thread, only thing they didn't test was the GPU.
Only real tests for GPU are benchmarks. Store could Also swap GPU into a PC they know works and see if it does same thing in Furmark or something.
 

Liborio

Reputable
Apr 2, 2016
106
0
4,580
0
worth a try. I saw your other thread, only thing they didn't test was the GPU.
Only real tests for GPU are benchmarks. Store could Also swap GPU into a PC they know works and see if it does same thing in Furmark or something.
Only problem is that its completely random so its very hard to test. It may only occur once a week or could happen 2 days in a row.....
 

Colif

Win 10 Master
Moderator
I know, but if they test PC and put it under stress its more likely to happen.

I had a problem with my GPU turning off last year that lasted 6 months and I would just start to think it was fixed and it would happen again. You are luckier than me, yours is creating BSOD. Mine wasn't and its so much harder to test for. With BSOD you stand a chance of finding cause.

If you have any more BSOD, please share results as then I have more info.
 

Liborio

Reputable
Apr 2, 2016
106
0
4,580
0
I know, but if they test PC and put it under stress its more likely to happen.

I had a problem with my GPU turning off last year that lasted 6 months and I would just start to think it was fixed and it would happen again. You are luckier than me, yours is creating BSOD. Mine wasn't and its so much harder to test for. With BSOD you stand a chance of finding cause.

If you have any more BSOD, please share results as then I have more info.
Well thats the thing, it isnt a blue screen of death at all. It simply freezes completely and forces me to force restart (holding down power for 5 seconds and turning back on). So it just freezes on whatever was on the screen last and just holds that picture until i force restart it....
 

Colif

Win 10 Master
Moderator
Open system information (search for it)
in the left hand column, click Software Environment
Click Windows Error Reporting

I can see the same screen here. that is one thing the zip file collects
Sort the type so it has Application errors at top, I am looking at Windows errors. although they are related.
it only goes as far back as to when last WIndows version update was installed.
1st crash I can see that as likely GPU was 6th Sept 2019
1st one I know was Nvidia was on 7th December 2019
2nd 5th Jan 2020
3rd 11th Jan 2020
2 of them on 23rd Jan 2020 both mention Nvidia.

they all mention tdr.
TDR is the Timeout, Detection, and Recovery component in Windows. What happens is the Graphics Display driver for the installed graphics card stops responding. When this happens, windows will stop and restart the driver to fix the problem.

The most common reason for this issue is that the graphics device is being overloaded or used beyond its capabilities.

This happens most often when playing graphic intensive games, but can happen with any process that uses a large amount of graphic resources, such as when editing or creating videos.

Some things you can do to avoid these problems:

a. Make sure you are using the latest graphics device driver.
b. Manage your time working with programs that are graphic intensive, exit any other programs that might also use a large amount of resources.
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_8-hardware/i-get-an-error-video-tdr-failure/575fb600-c3e6-4f1e-9fb0-315bd023032f

2 errors also mention iaStorAC.sys which is part of Intel Rapid Storage Technology driver and your version is from May 07 2019 so see if there is a newer version
 

Colif

Win 10 Master
Moderator
I have a 980, I stopped bothering to have newest drivers years ago, the drivers being written now are more likely for newer cards, not ours. I would run ddu and let windows find drivers, they aren't the newest but they work.

what can also happen with tdr is if driver keeps not responding and win 10 tries to start it a number of times, around 9 tries it gives up and swaps to the basic display driver which can't do anything in games and could cause freezes. On my PC it would just turn screen off.
 

Liborio

Reputable
Apr 2, 2016
106
0
4,580
0
I have a 980, I stopped bothering to have newest drivers years ago, the drivers being written now are more likely for newer cards, not ours. I would run ddu and let windows find drivers, they aren't the newest but they work.

what can also happen with tdr is if driver keeps not responding and win 10 tries to start it a number of times, around 9 tries it gives up and swaps to the basic display driver which can't do anything in games and could cause freezes. On my PC it would just turn screen off.
Thank you for all that info. I have uninstalled Intel RST and going to reinstall as there does seem to be an issue with it, as i discovered when opening it.

I will also try to run ddu and uninstall the graphics drivers i have and let Windows find drivers. Which brings me to my question, what do you mean by let Windows find the drivers? Is that through checking for Windows updates? In device manager? How exactly do you let Windows check for drivers rather than going through NVIDIA app?

Thanks for all your help.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY

TRENDING THREADS