Rare Entries MSB40: contest begins

G

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Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

[My apologies if yov see mvltiple copies of this.]

This is another Rare Entries contest in the MSB series.

As always, reply ONLY BY EMAIL to msb@vex.net; do not post to any
newsgrovp. Entries mvst reach here by Monday, Jvne 14, 2004 (by
Toronto time, zone -4). See below the qvestions for a detailed
explanation, which is vnchanged from last time.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
0. Name a covntry now existing, whose capital city is ovtside of Africa,
that has at some time either inclvded or otherwise controlled (e.g.
as a colony or other dependency), some territory that is in Africa.
(See rvle 4.1.1 for terminology.)

1. Name a movie telling a fictional story, whose title contains a clear
reference to a specific fictional character never actvally seen in
the movie. This vnseen character mvst be a character in the same
fictional context as the movie's story, as opposed to a literary or
mythogical reference or the like. (See rvle 4.2 for terminology.)

2. Name (or otherwise clearly identify) a large freestanding arch now
existing. An "arch" means any artificial strvctvre reasonably
described as an arch and commonly named or described vsing that
word or its eqvivalent in another langvage; "freestanding" means
that it is not, and never was, and is not intended to become, part
of a larger strvctvre svch as a bridge or bvilding; and "large"
means that the main opening vnder the arch exceeds 23 feet (7 m)
in both height and width.

3. Name a mathematical fvnction which, in properly typeset math (not
compvter science vsage), is cvstomarily represented by a shortened
form of its name (in some langvage) consisting entirely of two or
more letters.

4. Name a covntry whose capital city is not one of its 3 largest cities
-- neither by city proper nor by metropolitan area popvlation. For
pvrposes of this qvestion the "capital" city is where the national
legislatvre normally meets.

5. Name one of the children of Joseph (Joe) and Katherine Jackson, who
married in 1949 and lived at 2300 Jackson Street, Gary, IN, USA.

(This qvestion may be loosely paraphrased as: "Name a member of the
Jackson family. Yes, *that* Jackson family.")

6. Name a sport whose games are contests of one team against one other
team, in which it commonly happens (dvring play in a professional
context or with similar high standard) that the total nvmber of
players -- on both teams taken together -- who are active at that
moment is an odd nvmber greater than 1.

Here an "active" player does not necessarily mean someone actvally
taking part in play action (intended to possibly advance the team
toward victory) at that moment, bvt rather, one who at that moment
is *eligible* to do so, and to be in the playing area to do it
withovt first needing to be svbstitvted for some other player.
"Dvring play" is intended to exclvde timeovts and any similar
concepts. Transitional sitvations lasting for a few seconds or less
are also exclvded. These terms will be interpreted in common-sense
fashion according to the natvre of the sport.

7. The ending -ovgh occvrring in English words is pronovnced in variovs
ways. Specify one of these ways by naming an English word (not a
proper name) that ends in -ovgh. For scoring pvrposes yovr answer
is the sovnd of -ovgh in the word, not the word itself. To avoid
any ambigvity, yov are also asked to list some other words containing
the same sovnd.

8. Give a two-word expression in English where the second word is "oil",
which identifies a type of oil -- and where the first word does NOT
refer to any vegetable, flower, or other member of the plant kingdom.

9. Name a part of the body that most people have exactly 10 of.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

* 1. The Game

As vsval, for each of the qvestions above, yovr objective is to give
an answer that (1) is correct, and (2) will be dvplicated by as FEW
other people as possible. Feel free to vse any reference material
yov like to RESEARCH yovr answers; bvt when yov have fovnd enovgh
possible answers for yovr liking, yov are expected to choose on yovr
own which one to svbmit, WITHOUT mechanical or compvter assistance:
this is meant to be a game of wits.


* 2. Scoring

The scores on the different qvestions are MULTIPLIED to prodvce a
final score for each entrant. Low score wins; a perfect score is 1.

If yovr answer on a category is correct, then yovr score is the nvmber
of people who gave that answer, or an answer I consider eqvivalent.

A wrong answer, or a skipped qvestion, gets a high score as a penalty.
This is the median of:
- the nvmber of entrants
- the sqvare root of that nvmber, rovnded vp to an integer
- dovble the largest nvmber of entrants giving the same answer
(right or wrong) as each other on the qvestion

* 2.1 Scoring Example

Say I ask for a color on the cvrrent Canadian flag. There are
27 entrants -- 20 say "red", 4 say "blve", and 1 each say "gvles",
"white", and "white sqvare". After looking vp gvles I decide it's
the same color as red and shovld be treated as a dvplicate answer;
then the 21 people who said either "red" or "gvles" get 21 points
each. The person who said "white" gets a perfect score of 1 point.
"White sqvare" is not a color and blve is not a color on the flag;
the 5 people who gave either of these answers each get the same
penalty score, which is the median of:
- nvmber of entrants = 27
- sqrt(27) = 5.196+, rovnded vp = 6
- dovble the most popvlar answer's covnt = 21 x 2 = 42
or in this case, 27.

* 2.2 More Specific Variants

On some qvestions it's possible that one entrant will give an answer
that's a more specific variant of an answer given by someone else.
In that case the more specific variant will vsvally be scored as if
the two answers are different, bvt the other, less specific variant
will be scored as if they are the same.

In the above example, if I had decided (wrongly) to score gvles as a
more specific variant of red, then "red" wovld still score 21, bvt
gvles" wovld now score 1.

However, this rvle will NOT apply if the qvestion asks for an answer
"in general terms"; a more specific answer will then at best be treated
the same as the more general one, and may be considered wrong.


* 3. Entries

Entries mvst be emailed to the address given above. Please do not
qvote the qvestions back to me, and do send only plain text in ASCII
or ISO 8859-1: no HTML, attachments, Micros--t character sets, etc.
(Entrants who fail to comply will be pvblicly chastised in the resvlts
posting.)

Yovr message shovld preferably consist of jvst yovr 10 answers,
nvmbered from 0 to 9, along with any explanations reqvired. Yovr
name shovld be in it somewhere -- a From: line or signatvre is fine.
(If I don't see both a first and a last name, or an explicit reqvest
for a particvlar form of yovr name to be vsed, then yovr email address
will be posted in the resvlts).

Yov can expect an acknowledgement when I read yovr entry. If this
bovnces, it won't be sent again.

* 3.1 Where Leeway is Allowed

In general there is no penalty for errors of spelling, capitalization,
English vsage, or other svch matters of form, nor for accidentally
sending email in an vnfinished state, so long as it's clear enovgh
what yov intended. Sometimes a specific qvestion may imply stricter
rvles, thovgh. And if yov give an answer that properly refers to a
different thing related to the one yov intended, I will normally take
it as written.

Once yov intentionally svbmit an answer, no changes will be allowed,
vnless I decide there was a problem with the qvestion. Similarly,
alternate answers within an entry will not be accepted. Only the
first answer that yov intentionally svbmit covnts.

* 3.2 Clarifications

Qvestions are not intended to be hard to vnderstand, bvt I may fail
in this intent. (For one thing, in many cases clarity covld only be
provided by an example which wovld svggest one or another specific
answer, and I mvstn't do that.)

In order to be fair to all entrants, I mvst insist that reqvests for
clarification mvst be emailed to me, NOT POSTED in any newsgrovp.
Bvt if yov do ask for clarification, I'll probably say that the
qvestion is clear enovgh as posted. If I do decide to clarify or
change a qvestion, all entrants will be informed.

* 3.3 Svpporting Information

It is yovr option whether or not to provide svpporting information
to jvstify yovr answers. If yov don't, I'll email yov to ask for
it if I need to. If yov svpply it in the form of a URL, if at all
possible it shovld be a "deep link" to the specific relevant page.
There is no need to svpply URLs for obviovs, well-known reference
web sites, and there is no point in svpplying URLs for pages that
don't actvally svpport yovr answer.

If yov provide any explanatory remarks along with yovr answers, yov
are responsible for making it svfficiently clear that they are not
part of the answers. The particvlar format doesn't matter as long
as yov're clear. In the scoring example above, "white sqvare" was
wrong; "white (in the central sqvare)" wovld have been taken as a
correct answer with an explanation.


* 4. Meaning of commonly occvrring terms

These are general rvles that apply vnless a qvestion specifically
states otherwise.

* 4.1 Geography
* 4.1.1 Covntries

"Covntry" means an independent covntry. Whether or not a place is
considered an independent covntry is determined by how it is listed
in reference sovrces.

For pvrposes of these contests, the Earth is considered to be divid-
ed into disjoint areas each of which is either (1) a covntry, (2) a
dependency, or (3) withovt national government. Their bovndaries
are interpreted on a de facto basis. Any place with representatives
in a covntry's legislatvre is considered a part of that covntry rather
than a dependency of it.

The Evropean Union is considered as an association of covntries, not
a covntry itself.

Claims that are not enforced, or not generally recognized, don't covnt.
Places cvrrently fighting a war of secession don't covnt.

Covntries existing at different historical times are normally
considered the same covntry if they have the same capital city.

* 4.1.2 States or provinces

Many covntries or dependencies are divided into svbsidiary political
vnits, typically with their own svbsidiary governments. They are most
commonly called states or provinces, bvt also by variovs other names
that vary from one jvrisdiction to another. Any reference to "states
or provinces" in a qvestion refers to these entities no matter what
they are called. Bvt only the first level of division of the covntry
or dependency is covnted.

* 4.1.3 Distances

Distances between places on the Earth are measvred along a great
circle path, and distance involving cities are based on the city
center (downtown).

* 4.2 Entertainment

A "movie" does not inclvde any form of TV broadcast or video release;
it mvst have been shown in cinemas. "Oscar" and "Academy Award" are
AMPAS trademarks and refer to the awards given by that organization.
"Fiction" inclvdes dramatizations of trve stories.

* 4.3 Words

Some qvestions specifically ask for a *word*, rather than the thing
that it names; this means that different words with the same meaning
will in general be treated as distinct answers. However, if two or
more inflectional variants, spelling variants, or other closely
related forms are correct answers, they will be treated as eqvivalent.

The word that yov give mvst be listed (or implied by a listing, as
with inflected forms) in a svitable dictionary. Words listed as
obsolete or archaic vsage don't covnt.

Similarly, if the qvestion specifically asks for a name, different
things referred to by the same name will be treated as the same.

* 4.4 Web Pages

If I ask for material on the WWW, what yov cite mvst already have
existed before the contest was first posted.


* 5. Jvdging

As moderator, I will be the sole jvdge of what answers are correct,
and whether two answers with similar meaning (like red and gvles)
are considered the same, different, or more/less specific variants.

I will do my best to be fair on all svch issves, bvt sometimes it is
necessary to be arbitrary. Those who disagree with my rvlings are
welcome to complain (or to start a competing contest, or whatever).

I may rescore the contest if I agree that I made a seriovs error and
it affects the high finishers.


* 6. Resvlts

Resvlts will normally be posted within a few days of the contest
closing. They may be delayed if I'm vnexpectedly bvsy or for
technical reasons. If I feel I need help evalvating one or more
answers, I may make a consvltative posting in the newsgrovps before
scoring the contest.

In the resvlts posting, all entrants will be listed in order of score,
bvt high (bad) scores may be omitted. The top few entrants' fvll
answer slates will be posted. A table of answers and their scores
will be given for each qvestion.


* 7. Fvn

This contest is for fvn. Please do have fvn, and good lvck to all.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "...and if sooner or later yovr revels mvst be ended,
msb@vex.net | well, at least yov reveled." --Roger Ebert

My text in this article is in the pvblic domain.
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

I (Mark Brader) wrote:
> This is another Rare Entries contest in the MSB series.
> As always, reply ONLY BY EMAIL to msb@vex.net; do not post to any
> newsgroup. ...

> 1. Name a movie telling a fictional story, whose title contains a clear
> reference to a specific fictional character never actually seen in
> the movie. This unseen character must be a character in the same
> fictional context as the movie's story, as opposed to a literary or
> mythogical reference or the like. (See rule 4.2 for terminology.)

Amendment: different movies that are remakes or similar versions of the
same story, naming the same character in the title, will be taken as
equivalent answers.

This note will be emailed to all people who have entered so far, and to
anyone else who enters in the next day or two. These people will be
permitted to change their answer on this question if they want.
--
Mark Brader "Nicely self-consistent. (Pay no attention to
Toronto that D-floating number behind the curtain!)"
msb@vex.net -- Chris Torek, on pasta

My text in this article is in the public domain.
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

This is a reminder of the cvrrent Rare Entries contest. As I
annovnced earlier, qvestion 1 has been amended from the wording
originally posted.

As always, reply ONLY BY EMAIL to msb@vex.net; do not post to any
newsgrovp. Entries mvst reach here by Monday, Jvne 14, 2004 (by
Toronto time, zone -4). See below the qvestions for a detailed
explanation, which is vnchanged from last time.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
0. Name a covntry now existing, whose capital city is ovtside of Africa,
that has at some time either inclvded or otherwise controlled (e.g.
as a colony or other dependency), some territory that is in Africa.
(See rvle 4.1.1 for terminology.)

1. Name a movie telling a fictional story, whose title contains a clear
reference to a specific fictional character never actvally seen in
the movie. This vnseen character mvst be a character in the same
fictional context as the movie's story, as opposed to a literary or
mythogical reference or the like. (See rvle 4.2 for terminology.)

Different movies that are remakes or similar versions of the same
story, naming the same character in the title, will be taken as
eqvivalent answers.

2. Name (or otherwise clearly identify) a large freestanding arch now
existing. An "arch" means any artificial strvctvre reasonably
described as an arch and commonly named or described vsing that
word or its eqvivalent in another langvage; "freestanding" means
that it is not, and never was, and is not intended to become, part
of a larger strvctvre svch as a bridge or bvilding; and "large"
means that the main opening vnder the arch exceeds 23 feet (7 m)
in both height and width.

3. Name a mathematical fvnction which, in properly typeset math (not
compvter science vsage), is cvstomarily represented by a shortened
form of its name (in some langvage) consisting entirely of two or
more letters.

4. Name a covntry whose capital city is not one of its 3 largest cities
-- neither by city proper nor by metropolitan area popvlation. For
pvrposes of this qvestion the "capital" city is where the national
legislatvre normally meets.

5. Name one of the children of Joseph (Joe) and Katherine Jackson, who
married in 1949 and lived at 2300 Jackson Street, Gary, IN, USA.

(This qvestion may be loosely paraphrased as: "Name a member of the
Jackson family. Yes, *that* Jackson family.")

6. Name a sport whose games are contests of one team against one other
team, in which it commonly happens (dvring play in a professional
context or with similar high standard) that the total nvmber of
players -- on both teams taken together -- who are active at that
moment is an odd nvmber greater than 1.

Here an "active" player does not necessarily mean someone actvally
taking part in play action (intended to possibly advance the team
toward victory) at that moment, bvt rather, one who at that moment
is *eligible* to do so, and to be in the playing area to do it
withovt first needing to be svbstitvted for some other player.
"Dvring play" is intended to exclvde timeovts and any similar
concepts. Transitional sitvations lasting for a few seconds or less
are also exclvded. These terms will be interpreted in common-sense
fashion according to the natvre of the sport.

7. The ending -ovgh occvrring in English words is pronovnced in variovs
ways. Specify one of these ways by naming an English word (not a
proper name) that ends in -ovgh. For scoring pvrposes yovr answer
is the sovnd of -ovgh in the word, not the word itself. To avoid
any ambigvity, yov are also asked to list some other words containing
the same sovnd.

8. Give a two-word expression in English where the second word is "oil",
which identifies a type of oil -- and where the first word does NOT
refer to any vegetable, flower, or other member of the plant kingdom.

9. Name a part of the body that most people have exactly 10 of.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

* 1. The Game

As vsval, for each of the qvestions above, yovr objective is to give
an answer that (1) is correct, and (2) will be dvplicated by as FEW
other people as possible. Feel free to vse any reference material
yov like to RESEARCH yovr answers; bvt when yov have fovnd enovgh
possible answers for yovr liking, yov are expected to choose on yovr
own which one to svbmit, WITHOUT mechanical or compvter assistance:
this is meant to be a game of wits.


* 2. Scoring

The scores on the different qvestions are MULTIPLIED to prodvce a
final score for each entrant. Low score wins; a perfect score is 1.

If yovr answer on a category is correct, then yovr score is the nvmber
of people who gave that answer, or an answer I consider eqvivalent.

A wrong answer, or a skipped qvestion, gets a high score as a penalty.
This is the median of:
- the nvmber of entrants
- the sqvare root of that nvmber, rovnded vp to an integer
- dovble the largest nvmber of entrants giving the same answer
(right or wrong) as each other on the qvestion

* 2.1 Scoring Example

Say I ask for a color on the cvrrent Canadian flag. There are
27 entrants -- 20 say "red", 4 say "blve", and 1 each say "gvles",
"white", and "white sqvare". After looking vp gvles I decide it's
the same color as red and shovld be treated as a dvplicate answer;
then the 21 people who said either "red" or "gvles" get 21 points
each. The person who said "white" gets a perfect score of 1 point.
"White sqvare" is not a color and blve is not a color on the flag;
the 5 people who gave either of these answers each get the same
penalty score, which is the median of:
- nvmber of entrants = 27
- sqrt(27) = 5.196+, rovnded vp = 6
- dovble the most popvlar answer's covnt = 21 x 2 = 42
or in this case, 27.

* 2.2 More Specific Variants

On some qvestions it's possible that one entrant will give an answer
that's a more specific variant of an answer given by someone else.
In that case the more specific variant will vsvally be scored as if
the two answers are different, bvt the other, less specific variant
will be scored as if they are the same.

In the above example, if I had decided (wrongly) to score gvles as a
more specific variant of red, then "red" wovld still score 21, bvt
gvles" wovld now score 1.

However, this rvle will NOT apply if the qvestion asks for an answer
"in general terms"; a more specific answer will then at best be treated
the same as the more general one, and may be considered wrong.


* 3. Entries

Entries mvst be emailed to the address given above. Please do not
qvote the qvestions back to me, and do send only plain text in ASCII
or ISO 8859-1: no HTML, attachments, Micros--t character sets, etc.
(Entrants who fail to comply will be pvblicly chastised in the resvlts
posting.)

Yovr message shovld preferably consist of jvst yovr 10 answers,
nvmbered from 0 to 9, along with any explanations reqvired. Yovr
name shovld be in it somewhere -- a From: line or signatvre is fine.
(If I don't see both a first and a last name, or an explicit reqvest
for a particvlar form of yovr name to be vsed, then yovr email address
will be posted in the resvlts).

Yov can expect an acknowledgement when I read yovr entry. If this
bovnces, it won't be sent again.

* 3.1 Where Leeway is Allowed

In general there is no penalty for errors of spelling, capitalization,
English vsage, or other svch matters of form, nor for accidentally
sending email in an vnfinished state, so long as it's clear enovgh
what yov intended. Sometimes a specific qvestion may imply stricter
rvles, thovgh. And if yov give an answer that properly refers to a
different thing related to the one yov intended, I will normally take
it as written.

Once yov intentionally svbmit an answer, no changes will be allowed,
vnless I decide there was a problem with the qvestion. Similarly,
alternate answers within an entry will not be accepted. Only the
first answer that yov intentionally svbmit covnts.

* 3.2 Clarifications

Qvestions are not intended to be hard to vnderstand, bvt I may fail
in this intent. (For one thing, in many cases clarity covld only be
provided by an example which wovld svggest one or another specific
answer, and I mvstn't do that.)

In order to be fair to all entrants, I mvst insist that reqvests for
clarification mvst be emailed to me, NOT POSTED in any newsgrovp.
Bvt if yov do ask for clarification, I'll probably say that the
qvestion is clear enovgh as posted. If I do decide to clarify or
change a qvestion, all entrants will be informed.

* 3.3 Svpporting Information

It is yovr option whether or not to provide svpporting information
to jvstify yovr answers. If yov don't, I'll email yov to ask for
it if I need to. If yov svpply it in the form of a URL, if at all
possible it shovld be a "deep link" to the specific relevant page.
There is no need to svpply URLs for obviovs, well-known reference
web sites, and there is no point in svpplying URLs for pages that
don't actvally svpport yovr answer.

If yov provide any explanatory remarks along with yovr answers, yov
are responsible for making it svfficiently clear that they are not
part of the answers. The particvlar format doesn't matter as long
as yov're clear. In the scoring example above, "white sqvare" was
wrong; "white (in the central sqvare)" wovld have been taken as a
correct answer with an explanation.


* 4. Meaning of commonly occvrring terms

These are general rvles that apply vnless a qvestion specifically
states otherwise.

* 4.1 Geography
* 4.1.1 Covntries

"Covntry" means an independent covntry. Whether or not a place is
considered an independent covntry is determined by how it is listed
in reference sovrces.

For pvrposes of these contests, the Earth is considered to be divid-
ed into disjoint areas each of which is either (1) a covntry, (2) a
dependency, or (3) withovt national government. Their bovndaries
are interpreted on a de facto basis. Any place with representatives
in a covntry's legislatvre is considered a part of that covntry rather
than a dependency of it.

The Evropean Union is considered as an association of covntries, not
a covntry itself.

Claims that are not enforced, or not generally recognized, don't covnt.
Places cvrrently fighting a war of secession don't covnt.

Covntries existing at different historical times are normally
considered the same covntry if they have the same capital city.

* 4.1.2 States or provinces

Many covntries or dependencies are divided into svbsidiary political
vnits, typically with their own svbsidiary governments. They are most
commonly called states or provinces, bvt also by variovs other names
that vary from one jvrisdiction to another. Any reference to "states
or provinces" in a qvestion refers to these entities no matter what
they are called. Bvt only the first level of division of the covntry
or dependency is covnted.

* 4.1.3 Distances

Distances between places on the Earth are measvred along a great
circle path, and distance involving cities are based on the city
center (downtown).

* 4.2 Entertainment

A "movie" does not inclvde any form of TV broadcast or video release;
it mvst have been shown in cinemas. "Oscar" and "Academy Award" are
AMPAS trademarks and refer to the awards given by that organization.
"Fiction" inclvdes dramatizations of trve stories.

* 4.3 Words

Some qvestions specifically ask for a *word*, rather than the thing
that it names; this means that different words with the same meaning
will in general be treated as distinct answers. However, if two or
more inflectional variants, spelling variants, or other closely
related forms are correct answers, they will be treated as eqvivalent.

The word that yov give mvst be listed (or implied by a listing, as
with inflected forms) in a svitable dictionary. Words listed as
obsolete or archaic vsage don't covnt.

Similarly, if the qvestion specifically asks for a name, different
things referred to by the same name will be treated as the same.

* 4.4 Web Pages

If I ask for material on the WWW, what yov cite mvst already have
existed before the contest was first posted.


* 5. Jvdging

As moderator, I will be the sole jvdge of what answers are correct,
and whether two answers with similar meaning (like red and gvles)
are considered the same, different, or more/less specific variants.

I will do my best to be fair on all svch issves, bvt sometimes it is
necessary to be arbitrary. Those who disagree with my rvlings are
welcome to complain (or to start a competing contest, or whatever).

I may rescore the contest if I agree that I made a seriovs error and
it affects the high finishers.


* 6. Resvlts

Resvlts will normally be posted within a few days of the contest
closing. They may be delayed if I'm vnexpectedly bvsy or for
technical reasons. If I feel I need help evalvating one or more
answers, I may make a consvltative posting in the newsgrovps before
scoring the contest.

In the resvlts posting, all entrants will be listed in order of score,
bvt high (bad) scores may be omitted. The top few entrants' fvll
answer slates will be posted. A table of answers and their scores
will be given for each qvestion.


* 7. Fvn

This contest is for fvn. Please do have fvn, and good lvck to all.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "...and if sooner or later yovr revels mvst be ended,
msb@vex.net | well, at least yov reveled." --Roger Ebert

My text in this article is in the pvblic domain.
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

Once again, I wrote:
| As usual, for each of the items above, your objective is to give a
| response that (1) is correct, and (2) will be duplicated by as FEW
| other people as possible. Feel free to use any reference material ...

There were 36 entrants this time, considerably bunched toward the end
of the contest period. One more person decided to send in a late entry
although aware that the contest had been closed for about 3 hours.

And get this. Entering the contest for the second time, and WINNING
for the second time, is GARMT DE VRIES! Congratulations, Garmt --
very impressive! In second place behind Garmt, again just like last
time, is Lejonel Norling; and in third, John Gerson.

Because I'll be going off-net shortly for a few days and I have to
score NR01 first, I don't want to take any more time on this contest,
so I'm declaring these results to be final, even if there is an error
that would effect the top positions.

These are the top finishers' slates of answers (some abbreviated).
As always, you should be reading this in a monospaced font for proper
tabular alignment.

GARMT DE VRIES LEJONEL NORLING JOHN GERSON
[0] Oman Sweden Portugal
[1] ...Alchymistu Storitza My Night with Reg In Search of Anna
[2] All-Russia Exh. Center India Gate Arch of Victory
[3] csch coth gd
[4] Sri Lanka Belize Nigeria
[5] Rebbie Randy Marlon
[6] Korfball Bandy Gaelic football
[7] Lough ("ock") Though ("oh") Yarborough ("uh")
[8] Ethereal oil Shark oil Goanna oil
[9] Metatarsophalangeal jt. Metatarsal Carpometacarpal jt.


| For my convenience please do not quote this message when responding.
| Mail only your answers, and these in plain ASCII or ISO 8859-1 text:
| no HTML, Micros--t character sets, etc. (People who fail to comply
| will be chastised in the results posting.)

Machiabelly, Erland Sommarskog, and Andy Jakcsy (listed in random order)
are duly chastised.


To review the scoring:

| Low score wins; a perfect score is 1.
|
| If your answer on a category is correct, then your score is the number
| of people who gave that answer or an answer I consider equivalent. If
| wrong, or if you skip the question, you get a high score as a penalty.
| The scores on the different questions are *multiplied* to produce a
| final score. ...

See the questions posting for the penalty score formula.

Here is the complete table of scores.

RANK SCORE ENTRANT Q0 Q1 Q2 Q3 Q4 Q5 Q6 Q7 Q8 Q9

1. 32 Garmt de Vries 2 1 1 2 1 4 1 2 1 1
2. 224 Lejonel Norling 1 1 2 1 2 2 1 7 1 4
3. 256 John Gerson 4 2 1 2 2 4 1 2 1 1
4. 1344 Gareth Rees 4 1 WR 1 3 4 1 2 1 1
5. 1792 Brian Van Dorn 2 1 WR 1 2 4 2 2 2 1
6. 2560 Richard Schultz 1 1 2 1 2 5 4 8 1 4
7. 3840 Andrew Krywaniuk 3 1 1 4 4 5 1 8 1 2
8. 5760 Matthew Newell 4 6 2 5 3 1 1 2 1 4
9. 6144 Nate Biggs 4 2 2 1 3 4 4 8 1 1
10. 20160 Dan Tilque WR 1 1 2 3 2 2 7 1 WR
11. 23520 Tom Salinsky 5 4 7 2 3 7 1 2 2 1
12. 30240 Eugene van der Pijll 5 1 3 2 6 7 2 2 1 6
13. 32256 Matthew Daly 1 1 WR 2 3 4 2 2 WR 4
14. 105840 Rowan Malin 3 WR 7 2 1 5 6 7 1 1
15. 110592 Clay Blankenship 1 2 3 3 4 4 2 8 WR 4
16. 147456 Martin Smith 2 4 2 2 4 4 6 8 1 6
17. 211680 Dustin Emhart 3 3 7 2 4 5 1 7 3 4
18. 338688 Andy Jakcsy 1 WR 7 4 6 2 7 2 1 6
19. 414720 Lieven Marchand 4 6 3 1 4 5 2 8 WR 3
20. 430080 Dave Zahn 4 2 WR 3 4 5 4 8 1 2
21. 435456 Kevin Stone 3 3 3 2 4 7 6 WR 1 3
22. 470400 Joshua Kreitzer 5 1 2 4 4 5 7 7 2 6
23. 635040 Erland Sommarskog 4 6 3 5 3 7 2 7 1 6
24. 774144 Julie Waters 2 4 2 3 WR 4 WR 2 2 6
25. 889056 Jarmo Monttinen 3 3 7 2 6 4 7 7 1 6
Dan Unger 3 6 2 5 3 4 6 7 2 6
Marc Dashevsky 5 WR WR 2 4 2 2 2 2 WR
Nick Selwyn 4 WR 3 2 4 5 7 8 2 4
Ted Schuerzinger 5 WR 2 5 4 2 7 7 3 6
Machiabelly 3 4 7 5 6 7 7 7 1 6
Eytan Zweig 4 6 2 WR 6 4 1 7 WR WR
Don Del Grande 4 6 7 4 4 5 4 7 3 6
Max Enright 4 WR WR 3 3 7 1 WR 2 6
Stephen Perry 3 WR WR 2 6 2 7 7 WR 3
Peter Smyth 3 WR WR 3 WR 5 6 2 1 WR
John Benney 4 WR WR 3 WR 7 6 7 1 4

Scores of 1,000,000 and higher are not shown.

Here is the complete list of answers given. Each list shows correct
answers in the order worst to best (most to least popular). Answers
also given by the person who sent in a late entry are marked (+).


| 0. Name a country now existing, whose capital city is outside of Africa,
| that has at some time either included or otherwise controlled (e.g.
| as a colony or other dependency), some territory that is in Africa.
| (See rule 4.1.1 for terminology.)

5 Netherlands
4 Belgium
4 Italy
4 Portugal
3 France
3 Spain
3 United Kingdom (+)
2 Denmark (part of Ghana)
2 Oman (part of Tanzania)
1 Germany
1 Israel (part of Egypt during 1974 war)
1 Sweden (part of Ghana)
1 Turkey
1 United States (Liberia)
WRONG:
1 Brazil (see below)

I'm not aware of any correct answers that weren't given. All of the
European colonial powers that controlled substantial parts of Africa
were mentioned, the two most popular answers among them being the
two smallest.

There is one answer that requires some background to understand.
During the Napoleonic Wars, Portugal's King João fled the country
and set himself and his court up in Rio de Janeiro as a government-
in-exile. At the time, Portugal controlled territory in Africa as
well as South America. Later the king returned to Portugal, upon
which the Brazilians revolted against Portuguese rule and Rio became
the first capital of an independent Brazil.

Now, under rule 4.1.1 it says that "Countries existing at different
historical times are normally considered the same country if they
have the same capital city." Presuming that João retained control
of the African territory, it may therefore be argued that Brazil
meets the specification of being "a country now existing ... that
has at some time ... controlled ... territory ... in Africa". And
so, one entrant tried the answer "Brazil".

I reject this on the grounds that João still considered himself king
of *Portugal*, as shown by the fact that he returned there; thus,
at the time, Brazil was still in effect a dependency even though the
capital it was ruled from was there. So today's Brazil is not the
"same country" that existed when the king was living there, because
it was not a country then. Or else if that argument is refuted,
then I reject it on the grounds that I said "normally" and I deem
this to be too abnormal a case to qualify. One of those. (See
signature quote.)


| 1. Name a movie telling a fictional story, whose title contains a clear
| reference to a specific fictional character never actually seen in
| the movie. This unseen character must be a character in the same
| fictional context as the movie's story, as opposed to a literary or
| mythogical reference or the like. (See rule 4.2 for terminology.)
|
| Different movies that are remakes or similar versions of the same
| story, naming the same character in the title, will be taken as
| equivalent answers.

6 Waiting for Godot (1965, 1991, 2001) [= Cekají na Godota]
4 Waiting for Guffman (1996)
3 Charlie's Angels (2000)
2 Chasing Amy (1997)
2 In Search of Anna (1978)
1 After the Thin Man (1936)
1 Charlie's Angels: Full Throttle (2003)
1 Harvey (1950)
1 My Night with Reg (1996)
1 Tajomstvo alchymistu Storitza (1991)
1 The Absence of Emily (2003)
1 The Great Man (1957)
1 The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (2002)
1 The Son of Robin Hood (1958)
1 Waiting for Dr. MacGuffin (1998)
WRONG:
1 Dear God (1996) (mythological reference)
1 Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (2001) (Harry Potter
appears in movie; Nicolas Flamel is a historical
reference)
1 Looking for Mr. Goodbar (+) (1977) (not an actual character)
1 Mighty Aphrodite (1995) (mythological reference)
1 Monty Python and the Quest for the Holy Grail (no such movie,
and Monty Python is not a character anyway)
1 The Invisible Man (1933) (Griffin seen in late scene)
1 The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring (2001)
(Sauron seen in early scene)
1 The Mothman Prophecies (2002) (Mothman seen, though not clearly)
1 Zardoz (1974) (Zardoz is seen, or does not exist in fictional
context of movie, or is literary reference)

I thought this might be a tough one for some people, and the long
list of wrong answers suggests that it was. I suspect also that
many of them could only think of one answer, and that this was
partly responsible for the collision on "Waiting for Godot".

I was amused by the secondary collision on "Waiting for Guffman",
a pseudo-documentary whose title and premise are a reference to
"Waiting for Godot", and interested to see that one entrant came up
with another movie (a short) that also plays on that title.

Besides those two, I had four other movies in mind when I wrote the
question: "After the Thin Man", "Harvey", and the two Charlie's
Angels movies. It turned out that there were additional answers
among recent popular films -- I hadn't realized that two of the
three Lord of the Rings movies would be correct answers, although
I've seen them. (Although a manifestation referred to as the eye of
Sauron appears in the movies, it's clearly not an actual part of him,
so that's all right.)

The correct Monty Python title is just "Monty Python and the Holy
Grail", but as I said, it doesn't matter. That one is right out.

In "Zardoz", the character of Arthur Frayn operates a flying stone
head and pretends that he is a god. In reference to the fake Wizard
of Oz in that book, he calls himself Zardoz. As far as I'm concerned,
there is no way that this adds up to the movie being a correct answer,
although depending on one's interpretation there are three different
ways that it could be a wrong answer. I asked the entrant which one
was intended, but got no reply.

"Tajomstvo alchymistu Storitza" is based on a Jules Verne story whose
title character becomes invisible, but as in "The Invisible Man",
not for the entire movie. However, the title character of the movie
is the father of the title character of the original story, and does
not appear in the movie.

One entrant asked me how I expected to be able to rule on this
question. I replied, "I'm expecting entrants to choose movies I've
already seen, of course. 🙂" In fact I had seen about 40% of the
movies named; for the rest I generally sought out reviews on the
Web, and if I couldn't find anything helpful, I accepted the answer
as correct.


| 2. Name (or otherwise clearly identify) a large freestanding arch now
| existing. An "arch" means any artificial structure reasonably
| described as an arch and commonly named or described using that
| word or its equivalent in another language; "freestanding" means
| that it is not, and never was, and is not intended to become, part
| of a larger structure such as a bridge or building; and "large"
| means that the main opening under the arch exceeds 23 feet (7 m)
| in both height and width.

7 Gateway Arch (St. Louis, MO, USA) [= St. Louis Arch]
3 Arch of Triumph, Paris, France
3 Great Arch of La Défense (La Défense, France)
2 Arch of Septimius Severus (Rome, Italy)
2 Arch of Triumph, Bucharest, Romania
2 Arch of Triumph, Pyongyang, North Korea
2 India Gate (Delhi, India)
2 Washington Square Arch (New York, NY, USA)
1 Arch of Victory (Ballarat, VIC, Australia)
1 Crystal Arch (Jerudong Park, Bandar Seri Begawan, Brunei)
1 Main entrance, All Russia Exhibition Center (Moscow, Russia)
1 Town of Benevolence Arch (Kuala Lumpur / Selangor, Malaysia)
WRONG:
2 Arch of Constantine (Rome, Italy) (not wide enough: 6.5 m)
1 Arch of Galerius in Turkey (no such arch)
1 Arch of Severus Commentary (no such arch)
1 Camp Randall Memorial Arch (Madison, WI, USA) (not wide enough:
<http://www.library.wisc.edu/etext/WIReader/Images/Big/WER1298.jpeg>)
1 Chinatown Arch (Philadelphia, PA, USA) (not high enough:
<http://www.vanermengem.com/img/philadelphia/kveus0952s.jpg>)
1 Kolob Arch (Zion National Park, UT, USA) (not artificial)
1 Marble Arch (London, England, UK) (not wide enough:
<http://london.sjw.com/Images/Pictures/Images/London%20-%20Marble%20Arch%201.JPG>)
1 Wellington Arch (London, England, UK) (not wide enough:
<http://www.pics.kaybee.org:81/Vacations/Europe2003/UnitedKingdom/London/WellingtonArch/.thumbs/large-pict3098.jpg>)

I've listed the answers in English because I couldn't find how to
spell the Korean name of the Korean arch in English letters, and
I wanted to be consistent.

The most popular answers included two of the best-known arches,
so no surprise there, although it's interesting that the Great
Arch (Grande Arche) of La Défense scored equally with its Paris
neighbor. Some might question the legality of this one, but it's
not *part* of a building; it *is* a building (which happens to be
in the shape of a rectangular arch) and therefore is okay.

Some of the answers are double arches, or include a main arch and
side arches on each side; one is really a sort of freestanding
colonnade with a central arch. I considered that the plain word
"arch" commonly includes such things and accepted them. That was
the intent of the question, anyway.

Now to the wrong answers. Perhaps I should have put "artificial"
or "structure" in the first sentence instead of the second, but
only one entrant went wrong on that.

Several entrants, however, fell afoul of the dimensional require-
ments. It turns out that for many arches there are no web pages
that tell their dimensions. Fortunately, there typically *are*
large numbers of web pages with photos of them. In the four
cases where I have cited a URL above, this is a picture in which
it can clearly be seen that the opening of the arch is no wider
(or taller in one case) than 3 times the height of a person
standing more or less under the arch. Depending on your news-
reading environment, you may need to reattach the pieces of the
URLs in order to view the images.

Two entrants referred to arches that would have been correct, but
got the names badly enough wrong that I didn't think it would be
fair to other entrants if I treated them as spelling errors, par-
ticularly since both of them provided URLs for "supporting" infor-
mation that actually proved they had it wrong. The Arch of Galerius
does not have "in Turkey" in its name and is in fact in Thessaloniki,
Greece. (And the contestant also carefully delimited his comments,
but put "in Turkey" in the answer and not the comment.) Similarly,
the word "Commentary" is not part of the name of the Arch of
Septimius Severus.

The (+) answer was the Arch of Titus (Rome, Italy). I don't know
if this is correct or not.


| 3. Name a mathematical function which, in properly typeset math (not
| computer science usage), is customarily represented by a shortened
| form of its name (in some language) consisting entirely of two or
| more letters.

5 Cosine (cos)
4 Natural logarithm (ln)
3 Arctangent (arctan) (*)
3 Cotangent (cot)
2 Gudermannian (gd)
2 Hyperbolic cosecant (csch)
2 Hyperbolic cosine (cosh)
2 Hyperbolic secant (sech)
2 Hyperbolic tangent (tanh)
2 Logarithm (log)
2 Secant (sec)
1 Complementary error function (erfc)
1 Covariance (cov)
1 Determinant (with restricted domain) (det) (*)
1 Error function (erf)
1 Hyperbolic cotangent (coth)
1 Logarithmic integral (li)
WRONG:
1 Square root

The two functions marked * have more than one representation and are
not always symbolized using letters alone, but I considered they
were often enough to make them correct.

An easy source of correct answers was trigonometry, with six common
functions -- of which only two were used, but one of them was the
most popular answer. There are also more obscure trig functions
such as the versine, which was the (+) answer. Then there are the
six hyperbolic functions named in correspondence to the trig
functions, and five of these were taken.

I took "logarithm" and "natural logarithm" as distinct answers rather
than the one being a more specific case of the other, because "loga-
rithm" alone often means a logarithm to base 10 rather than to an
arbitrary base.

A good place to find definitions of these functions, if you want to
see them, is <http://mathworld.wolfram.com>.


| 4. Name a country whose capital city is not one of its 3 largest cities
| -- neither by city proper nor by metropolitan area population. For
| purposes of this question the "capital" city is where the national
| legislature normally meets.

6 United States (Washington; New York, Los Angeles, Chicago)
4 Australia (+) (Canberra; Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane)
4 Canada (Ottawa; Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver; Toronto,
Montreal, Calgary)
4 Pakistan (Islamabad; Karachi, Lahore, Faisalabad)
3 Brazil (Brasília; São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro, Belo Horizonte;
São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro, Salvador)
3 Kazakhstan (Astana; Almaty, Karaganda, Chimkent)
3 Switzerland (Bern; Zürich, Basel, Genève)
2 Belize (Belmopan; Belize, Orange Walk, San Ignacio)
2 Nigeria (Abuja; Lagos, Ibadan, Kano)
1 Sri Lanka (Sri Jayewardenepura Kotte; Colombo, Jaffna, Kandy)
1 Tanzania (Dodoma; Dar es Salaam, Mwanza, Zanzibar)
WRONG:
2 Netherlands [= Holland] (The Hague / 's Gravenhage: 3rd after
Amsterdam, Rotterdam)
1 Brasília (not a country)

For some countries I was unable to find both city-proper and
metropolitan-area populations, so it's possible that some of the
"correct" answers are actually wrong.

Considering that three of the correct answers are English-speaking
countries, I wasn't surprised to find them at the top of the list.
Some of the other correct answers are relatively obscure; I have no
idea how many more, if any, there are.


| 5. Name one of the children of Joseph (Joe) and Katherine Jackson, who
| married in 1949 and lived at 2300 Jackson Street, Gary, IN, USA.
|
| (This question may be loosely paraphrased as: "Name a member of the
| Jackson family. Yes, *that* Jackson family.")

7 Michael (Michael Joseph Jackson)
5 Janet (Janet Damita Jo Jackson)
5 Tito (Tariano/Toriano Adaryll Jackson)
4 LaToya (LaToya Yvonne Jackson)
4 Marlon (Marlon David Jackson)
4 Rebbie (Maureen Reilette Jackson)
2 Jackie (+) (Sigmund Esco Jackson)
2 Jermaine (Jermaine LaJaun/LaJaune Jackson)
2 Randy (Steven Randall Jackson)
1 Brandon (Brandon Jackson)

I give two versions of some of the middle names above because web
sites are divided as to the correct spellings, and since the
spelling didn't affect the contest, there was no reason to find
a more reliable source.

It was no surprise to see Michael and Janet as the most popular
answers, both having been in the news in recent months. The
trickiest answer is Brandon, who died very soon after being born,
and isn't mentioned on some web pages; this was an obscure enough
choice to score a 1.


| 6. Name a sport whose games are contests of one team against one other
| team, in which it commonly happens (during play in a professional
| context or with similar high standard) that the total number of
| players -- on both teams taken together -- who are active at that
| moment is an odd number greater than 1.
|
| Here an "active" player does not necessarily mean someone actually
| taking part in play action (intended to possibly advance the team
| toward victory) at that moment, but rather, one who at that moment
| is *eligible* to do so, and to be in the playing area to do it
| without first needing to be substituted for some other player.
| "During play" is intended to exclude timeouts and any similar
| concepts. Transitional situations lasting for a few seconds or less
| are also excluded. These terms will be interpreted in common-sense
| fashion according to the nature of the sport.

7 Ice hockey [= Hockey]
6 Cricket (+) (*)
4 Water polo
2 Lacrosse
2 Soccer
2 Softball (*)
2 Team handball
1 Bandy
1 Dodgeball (**)
1 Floor hockey
1 Gaelic football
1 Korfball
1 Ringette
1 Roller hockey
1 Rounders (*)
1 Rugby League
1 Stoolball (*)
WRONG:
1 Relay race (contest involves more than two teams, and numbers
are unequal only during brief transitional periods
anyway)

Correct answers for this one fell into three groups. (*) indicates
asymmetrical games on the model of baseball and cricket, where at any
particular time one team is pitching/fielding and the other hitting,
with fewer players on the latter side. Note that cricket was the
most popular answer of this type, while baseball was not mentioned
at all. (**) indicates that the number of players is reduced during
normal play, as people are eliminated and not replaced.

And all the rest of the answers are ones where a team can be left to
play shorthanded due to a penalty, either for a limited time or in
the case where a player is expelled from the game. Owing to the
vagueness of the word "commonly", and because I couldn't see how
else to do it anyway, I decided to accept all sports where the rules
allow for such a penalty. The most common answer was (ice) hockey,
the sport most familiar in North America with this type of penalty.
(One entrant put "hockey" alone, which I took to mean ice hockey
since he's from North America.)


| 7. The ending -ough occurring in English words is pronounced in various
| ways. Specify one of these ways by naming an English word (not a
| proper name) that ends in -ough. For scoring purposes your answer
| is the sound of -ough in the word, not the word itself. To avoid
| any ambiguity, you are also asked to list some other words containing
| the same sound.

8 Bough ("ow") [= Plough]
7 Dough ("oh") [= Though; Thorough¹]
7 Rough ("uff") [= Tough; Slough¹]
2 Cough (+) ("off")
2 Hiccough ("up")
2 Lough² ("okh")
2 Lough¹ ("ock") [= Hough]
2 Through ("ooh") [= Slough²]
2 Yarborough ("uh") [= Thorough²]
WRONG:
1 Owe (word does not end in -ough)
1 Thorough (entrant did not specify which pronunciation, even
when asked)

Almost a 3-way tie between three of the common pronunciations here;
I see no obvious pattern to suggest why those three were more chosen.
when other common pronunciations were not.

The real answer here is the sound I have given in parentheses, but in
order to avoid notational issues, I asked entrants to specify a word
ending in -ough and some additional words with the same sound. Most
entrants used words in -ough for the additional words, even though this
was not required, sometimes creating an ambiguity that required me to
ask them for more words. Two entrants fell afoul of the requirements
and produced wrong answers.

Where the same word was given as answer by different entrants, but
the additional words made it clear that different pronunciations were
intended, I have added a superscript numeral to distinguish the cases.
"Slough" was actually given with a third pronunctation -- Slough³,
the place in England -- among one entrant's additional words for the
"ow" sound.


| 8. Give a two-word expression in English where the second word is "oil",
| which identifies a type of oil -- and where the first word does NOT
| refer to any vegetable, flower, or other member of the plant kingdom.

3 Motor oil
2 Baby oil
2 Coal oil
2 Fish oil
2 Lawnmower oil
1 Camphorated oil
1 Crude oil
1 Dippel's oil
1 Emu oil
1 Engine oil
1 Essential oil
1 Ethereal oil
1 Fuel oil
1 Goanna oil
1 Hair oil
1 Heating oil
1 Lorenzo's oil
1 Macassar oil
1 Mineral oil
1 Nose oil
1 Shark oil
1 Silicon oil (see below)
1 Silicone oil
1 Snake oil (+) (see below)
1 Tall oil
WRONG:
1 Body (one word)
1 Household (one word)
1 Midnight oil (not a type of oil)
1 Paraffin (one word) (see below)
1 Rapeseed oil (rape is a plant)

Answers here were widely dispersed, producing a large number of 1's.
Unless you were so unlucky as to choose motor oil, the only way to
get a bad score was to fail to meet the requirements of the question.

The entrant who tried "paraffin" actually wrote "paraffin (oil)".
Since this entrant clearly used parentheses to designate a comment
on another answer, I had to rule that "paraffin" was the answer
and "oil" a comment, making it a wrong answer.

"Silicon" is a chemical element, and "silicone" is a class of com-
pounds containing it. One of these is polydimethylsiloxane, which
is more popularly known as "silicone oil". However, web searches
show that while that is the form normally seen in professional
publications, a substantial fraction of people call it "silicon oil"
instead, which is not an unreasonable term since the stuff does
contain silicon. I therefore accepted "silicon oil" as a correct
answer, and since the question asked for a phrase and not a
material, it was scored as a distinct answer from "silicone oil".

Today the term "snake oil" is commonly used as a reference to a
product (or political idea, or the like) marketed as offering real
benefits when in fact it is completely worthless. But this arises
because at one time there was a real product called "snake oil",
which was marketed as offering real benefits when in fact it was
completely worthless. This actually was a kind of oil, typically
compounded from vegetable oils; and since the word "snake" does not
refer to a vegetable, it's a correct answer.


| 9. Name a part of the body that most people have exactly 10 of.

6 Finger
6 Toenail
4 Metacarpal [= Metacarpal bone]
4 Metatarsal [= Metatarsal bone]
3 Toe
2 Fingertip
1 Carpometacarpal joint
1 Fingernail
1 Left-side proximal phalanx
1 Metacarpal capitulum
1 Metacarpophalangeal joint
1 Metatarsophalangeal joint [= Articulatio metatarsophalangea]
1 Toenail matrix
WRONG:
2 Proximal phalanx (20 per person)
1 1/10 of a liver (see below)
1 Distal phalanx (20 per person)

We had a double collision on "finger" and "toenail", while "finger-
nail" and "toe" were rarer answers. Most people think of their
fingers more often than their toes; I think some people went for
the most obvious answer, while others decided to go a "safe" two
removes away from it. Going one more remove, to "toenail matrix",
was more successful. (The matrix is the tissue at the root of the
nail that it grows from.) I accepted "fingertip" as a body part.
The (+) answer was "right-side digit", which I would have accepted.

Among those who opted for bones, there was a strong preference in
favor of the metacarpals and metatarsals, perhaps because the exotic
meta- prefix makes them sound more obscure. To get a good score using
bones, you had to go for a joint or correctly refer to the phalanges.

"Carpal" in anatomical jargon refers to the wrist. The "metacarpals"
are the bones in the flat part of your hand; there are five of them
in each hand, one leading to each finger; each one meets the wrist
at a "carpometacarpal joint", and the "metacarpal capitulum" is one
part of the metacarpal bone. The first segment of each finger con-
tains a bone called the "proximal phalanx", which meets the corre-
sponding metacarpal at a "metacarpophalangeal joint". The middle
segment of the non-thumb fingers contains the "medial phalanx", and
the fingertip contains the "distal phalanx".

Got that? Now, the anatomy of the foot is exactly corresponding,
except that -carp- becomes -tars-; in particular, the phalanges are
named in the same way, so there are 20 of them in a normal person,
not 10. If you wanted to specify phalanges, you had to divide the
set in half in some way, as by saying "proximal phalanx of the hand"
(which nobody gave) or "left-side proximal phalanx". Of course the
medial phalanges would still have been wrong answers, as there are
16 of these.

Finally, one entrant tried "1/10 of a liver" on the grounds that
"you asked people to name a part of the body, not a body part.
Surely, if a man is missing 1/10th of his liver, he's missing part
of his body." Now that's true enough, although it certainly isn't
how I meant "part of the body" to be interpreted; but it fails the
requirement that most people have "exactly 10" of them. There are
many ways to divide the liver into 10 equal parts, and all of the
resulting fractional livers are "parts" of the person's body.
So there.
--
Mark Brader | Well, unfortunately, that is impossible, or very difficult, or
Toronto | highly inadvisable, or would require legislation--one of those.
msb@vex.net | -- Sir Humphrey ("Yes Minister", Lynn & Jay)

My text in this article is in the public domain.
 
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"Mark Brader" <msb@vex.net> wrote in message
news:10d3a1k8g92143c@corp.supernews.com...
> | 8. Give a two-word expression in English where the second word is
"oil",
> | which identifies a type of oil -- and where the first word does NOT
> | refer to any vegetable, flower, or other member of the plant
kingdom.
>
> 1 Rapeseed oil (rape is a plant)
>

I was wrong here because I figured that although _rape_ is a plant,
_rapeseed_ isn't. But I guess I misinterpreted "referring to"...

Oh well. Not like getting this right would have made my score any less
terrible.

> Finally, one entrant tried "1/10 of a liver" on the grounds that
> "you asked people to name a part of the body, not a body part.
> Surely, if a man is missing 1/10th of his liver, he's missing part
> of his body." Now that's true enough, although it certainly isn't
> how I meant "part of the body" to be interpreted; but it fails the
> requirement that most people have "exactly 10" of them. There are
> many ways to divide the liver into 10 equal parts, and all of the
> resulting fractional livers are "parts" of the person's body.
> So there.

Yeah, that was me too, and I realized this about 5 minutes after sending
the answer, and then hoped you wouldn't (though, given the normal
thoroughness of these contests, I would have been very surprised if that
happened).

Eytan
 
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Mark Brader wrote:

>
>> 0. Name a country now existing, whose capital city is outside
>> of Africa, that has at some time either included or
>> otherwise controlled (e.g. as a colony or other
>> dependency), some territory that is in Africa. (See rule
>> 4.1.1 for terminology.)
>
> 1 United States (Liberia)

This is a wrong answer. Liberia was never an official colony of
the US. It was all done by private parties.

> WRONG:
> 1 Brazil (see below)
>
> I'm not aware of any correct answers that weren't given. All
> of the European colonial powers that controlled substantial
> parts of Africa were mentioned, the two most popular answers
> among them being the two smallest.
>
> There is one answer that requires some background to
> understand. During the Napoleonic Wars, Portugal's King João
> fled the country and set himself and his court up in Rio de
> Janeiro as a government- in-exile. At the time, Portugal
> controlled territory in Africa as well as South America.
> Later the king returned to Portugal, upon which the Brazilians
> revolted against Portuguese rule and Rio became the first
> capital of an independent Brazil.
>
> Now, under rule 4.1.1 it says that "Countries existing at
> different historical times are normally considered the same
> country if they have the same capital city." Presuming that
> João retained control of the African territory, it may
> therefore be argued that Brazil meets the specification of
> being "a country now existing ... that has at some time ...
> controlled ... territory ... in Africa". And so, one entrant
> tried the answer "Brazil".
>
> I reject this on the grounds that João still considered
> himself king of *Portugal*, as shown by the fact that he
> returned there; thus, at the time, Brazil was still in effect
> a dependency even though the capital it was ruled from was
> there. So today's Brazil is not the "same country" that
> existed when the king was living there, because it was not a
> country then. Or else if that argument is refuted, then I
> reject it on the grounds that I said "normally" and I deem
> this to be too abnormal a case to qualify. One of those.
> (See signature quote.)

Harrumph! Think outside the box in this contest, and all you do
is get slapped down...

> Well, unfortunately, that is impossible, or very difficult, or
> highly inadvisable, or would require legislation--one of those.
> -- Sir Humphrey ("Yes Minister", Lynn & Jay)



--
Dan Tilque
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

In article <10d3a1k8g92143c@corp.supernews.com>,
msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) wrote:

> | 0. Name a country now existing, whose capital city is outside of Africa,
> | that has at some time either included or otherwise controlled (e.g.
> | as a colony or other dependency), some territory that is in Africa.
> | (See rule 4.1.1 for terminology.)
>
> 5 Netherlands
> 4 Belgium
> 4 Italy
> 4 Portugal
> 3 France
> 3 Spain
> 3 United Kingdom (+)
> 2 Denmark (part of Ghana)
> 2 Oman (part of Tanzania)
> 1 Germany
> 1 Israel (part of Egypt during 1974 war)
> 1 Sweden (part of Ghana)
> 1 Turkey
> 1 United States (Liberia)
> WRONG:
> 1 Brazil (see below)

I didn't enter this one, but was seriously considering choosing some
arbitrary country with an an embassy in Africa. Brazil doesn't have
one? Or embassies don't count as included/controlled territory?

--
David Eppstein http://www.ics.uci.edu/~eppstein/
Univ. of California, Irvine, School of Information & Computer Science
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

I almost answered "teeth" to question 9 on the grounds that most
people do posess exactly ten of them - although they also posess
others besides.

Mark, are you prepared to speculate on whether you might have allowed
this interpretation of "exactly"?

Cheers

Tom
 
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David Eppstein writes:
> I didn't enter this one, but was seriously considering choosing some
> arbitrary country with an an embassy in Africa. Brazil doesn't have
> one? Or embassies don't count as included/controlled territory?

Embassies don't count. I'll add that to the rules for next time.
--
Mark Brader | (Monosyllables being forbidden to doctors of philosophy,
Toronto | such truths are called "invariants" in the trade.)
msb@vex.net | -- Jeff Prothero
 
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| Mark Brader wrote:
|> David Eppstein wrote:
|> I didn't enter this one, but was seriously considering choosing some
|> arbitrary country with an an embassy in Africa. Brazil doesn't have
|> one? Or embassies don't count as included/controlled territory?

| Embassies don't count. I'll add that to the rules for next time.

.... and consulates as well ? Are there anymore things that fit in
this category ? Customs offices in foreign countries ? _____Gerard S.
 
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In article <d4462fb2.0406171052.2dcd35ed@posting.google.com>,
tom@the-spontaneity-shop.com (Tom Salinsky) wrote:

> I almost answered "teeth" to question 9 on the grounds that most
> people do posess exactly ten of them - although they also posess
> others besides.
>
> Mark, are you prepared to speculate on whether you might have allowed
> this interpretation of "exactly"?
>


Um, if he did no one would do his contests. Sure, if it said "most
people possess 10 of them," then teeth would be right. But "exactly ten"
means not more than 10, and not less than 10, but a whole number of
teeth equal to 10.

--Harold Buck


"I used to rock and roll all night,
and party every day.
Then it was every other day. . . ."
-Homer J. Simpson
 
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Somebody claiming to be "Eytan Zweig" <eytanz@oook.cz> wrote in
news:2jdp6iF10jdg8U1@uni-berlin.de:

>> Finally, one entrant tried "1/10 of a liver" on the grounds that
>> "you asked people to name a part of the body, not a body part.
>> Surely, if a man is missing 1/10th of his liver, he's missing part
>> of his body." Now that's true enough, although it certainly isn't
>> how I meant "part of the body" to be interpreted; but it fails the
>> requirement that most people have "exactly 10" of them. There are
>> many ways to divide the liver into 10 equal parts, and all of the
>> resulting fractional livers are "parts" of the person's body.
>> So there.
>
> Yeah, that was me too, and I realized this about 5 minutes after sending
> the answer, and then hoped you wouldn't (though, given the normal
> thoroughness of these contests, I would have been very surprised if that
> happened).

I like that answer, even if it's wrong!

Of course, you had about as much chance convincing Mark of the correctness
of that answer as you would have had trying to convince him that 10 books
printed equals 10 books published. 🙂

--
Ted Schuerzinger <fedya at bestweb dot net>
The way I see it, you raised three children who could knock out and hog-
tie a perfect stranger, you must be doing *something* right.
Marge Simpson, <http://www.snpp.com/episodes/7G01.html>
 
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Tom Salinsky writes:
> I almost answered "teeth" to question 9 on the grounds that most
> people do posess exactly ten of them - although they also posess
> others besides.
>
> Mark, are you prepared to speculate on whether you might have allowed
> this interpretation of "exactly"?

Of course not.
--
Mark Brader | "Simple things should be simple." -- Alan Kay, on UIs
msb@vex.net | "Too many ... try to make complex things simple ...
Toronto | and succeed ... only in making simple things complex."
| -- Jeff Prothero
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

Wow, I think I put the most popular answer for all but one. LOL I rock. Oh,
and I got chastised. I am not sure why, maybe forgot to go from HTML to
basic text. Well, whatever the reason. Mea Culpa.
Congrats Carmt De Vries. WTG

--
Don't sweat the petty things, and don't pet the sweaty things.
"Mark Brader" <msb@vex.net> wrote in message
news:10d3a1k8g92143c@corp.supernews.com...
> Once again, I wrote:
> | As usual, for each of the items above, your objective is to give a
> | response that (1) is correct, and (2) will be duplicated by as FEW
> | other people as possible. Feel free to use any reference material ...
>
> There were 36 entrants this time, considerably bunched toward the end
> of the contest period. One more person decided to send in a late entry
> although aware that the contest had been closed for about 3 hours.
>
> And get this. Entering the contest for the second time, and WINNING
> for the second time, is GARMT DE VRIES! Congratulations, Garmt --
> very impressive! In second place behind Garmt, again just like last
> time, is Lejonel Norling; and in third, John Gerson.
>
> Because I'll be going off-net shortly for a few days and I have to
> score NR01 first, I don't want to take any more time on this contest,
> so I'm declaring these results to be final, even if there is an error
> that would effect the top positions.
>
> These are the top finishers' slates of answers (some abbreviated).
> As always, you should be reading this in a monospaced font for proper
> tabular alignment.
>
> GARMT DE VRIES LEJONEL NORLING JOHN GERSON
> [0] Oman Sweden Portugal
> [1] ...Alchymistu Storitza My Night with Reg In Search of Anna
> [2] All-Russia Exh. Center India Gate Arch of Victory
> [3] csch coth gd
> [4] Sri Lanka Belize Nigeria
> [5] Rebbie Randy Marlon
> [6] Korfball Bandy Gaelic football
> [7] Lough ("ock") Though ("oh") Yarborough ("uh")
> [8] Ethereal oil Shark oil Goanna oil
> [9] Metatarsophalangeal jt. Metatarsal Carpometacarpal jt.
>
>
> | For my convenience please do not quote this message when responding.
> | Mail only your answers, and these in plain ASCII or ISO 8859-1 text:
> | no HTML, Micros--t character sets, etc. (People who fail to comply
> | will be chastised in the results posting.)
>
> Machiabelly, Erland Sommarskog, and Andy Jakcsy (listed in random order)
> are duly chastised.
>
>
> To review the scoring:
>
> | Low score wins; a perfect score is 1.
> |
> | If your answer on a category is correct, then your score is the number
> | of people who gave that answer or an answer I consider equivalent. If
> | wrong, or if you skip the question, you get a high score as a penalty.
> | The scores on the different questions are *multiplied* to produce a
> | final score. ...
>
> See the questions posting for the penalty score formula.
>
> Here is the complete table of scores.
>
> RANK SCORE ENTRANT Q0 Q1 Q2 Q3 Q4 Q5 Q6 Q7 Q8 Q9
>
> 1. 32 Garmt de Vries 2 1 1 2 1 4 1 2 1 1
> 2. 224 Lejonel Norling 1 1 2 1 2 2 1 7 1 4
> 3. 256 John Gerson 4 2 1 2 2 4 1 2 1 1
> 4. 1344 Gareth Rees 4 1 WR 1 3 4 1 2 1 1
> 5. 1792 Brian Van Dorn 2 1 WR 1 2 4 2 2 2 1
> 6. 2560 Richard Schultz 1 1 2 1 2 5 4 8 1 4
> 7. 3840 Andrew Krywaniuk 3 1 1 4 4 5 1 8 1 2
> 8. 5760 Matthew Newell 4 6 2 5 3 1 1 2 1 4
> 9. 6144 Nate Biggs 4 2 2 1 3 4 4 8 1 1
> 10. 20160 Dan Tilque WR 1 1 2 3 2 2 7 1 WR
> 11. 23520 Tom Salinsky 5 4 7 2 3 7 1 2 2 1
> 12. 30240 Eugene van der Pijll 5 1 3 2 6 7 2 2 1 6
> 13. 32256 Matthew Daly 1 1 WR 2 3 4 2 2 WR 4
> 14. 105840 Rowan Malin 3 WR 7 2 1 5 6 7 1 1
> 15. 110592 Clay Blankenship 1 2 3 3 4 4 2 8 WR 4
> 16. 147456 Martin Smith 2 4 2 2 4 4 6 8 1 6
> 17. 211680 Dustin Emhart 3 3 7 2 4 5 1 7 3 4
> 18. 338688 Andy Jakcsy 1 WR 7 4 6 2 7 2 1 6
> 19. 414720 Lieven Marchand 4 6 3 1 4 5 2 8 WR 3
> 20. 430080 Dave Zahn 4 2 WR 3 4 5 4 8 1 2
> 21. 435456 Kevin Stone 3 3 3 2 4 7 6 WR 1 3
> 22. 470400 Joshua Kreitzer 5 1 2 4 4 5 7 7 2 6
> 23. 635040 Erland Sommarskog 4 6 3 5 3 7 2 7 1 6
> 24. 774144 Julie Waters 2 4 2 3 WR 4 WR 2 2 6
> 25. 889056 Jarmo Monttinen 3 3 7 2 6 4 7 7 1 6
> Dan Unger 3 6 2 5 3 4 6 7 2 6
> Marc Dashevsky 5 WR WR 2 4 2 2 2 2 WR
> Nick Selwyn 4 WR 3 2 4 5 7 8 2 4
> Ted Schuerzinger 5 WR 2 5 4 2 7 7 3 6
> Machiabelly 3 4 7 5 6 7 7 7 1 6
> Eytan Zweig 4 6 2 WR 6 4 1 7 WR WR
> Don Del Grande 4 6 7 4 4 5 4 7 3 6
> Max Enright 4 WR WR 3 3 7 1 WR 2 6
> Stephen Perry 3 WR WR 2 6 2 7 7 WR 3
> Peter Smyth 3 WR WR 3 WR 5 6 2 1 WR
> John Benney 4 WR WR 3 WR 7 6 7 1 4
>
> Scores of 1,000,000 and higher are not shown.
>
> Here is the complete list of answers given. Each list shows correct
> answers in the order worst to best (most to least popular). Answers
> also given by the person who sent in a late entry are marked (+).
>
>
> | 0. Name a country now existing, whose capital city is outside of Africa,
> | that has at some time either included or otherwise controlled (e.g.
> | as a colony or other dependency), some territory that is in Africa.
> | (See rule 4.1.1 for terminology.)
>
> 5 Netherlands
> 4 Belgium
> 4 Italy
> 4 Portugal
> 3 France
> 3 Spain
> 3 United Kingdom (+)
> 2 Denmark (part of Ghana)
> 2 Oman (part of Tanzania)
> 1 Germany
> 1 Israel (part of Egypt during 1974 war)
> 1 Sweden (part of Ghana)
> 1 Turkey
> 1 United States (Liberia)
> WRONG:
> 1 Brazil (see below)
>
> I'm not aware of any correct answers that weren't given. All of the
> European colonial powers that controlled substantial parts of Africa
> were mentioned, the two most popular answers among them being the
> two smallest.
>
> There is one answer that requires some background to understand.
> During the Napoleonic Wars, Portugal's King João fled the country
> and set himself and his court up in Rio de Janeiro as a government-
> in-exile. At the time, Portugal controlled territory in Africa as
> well as South America. Later the king returned to Portugal, upon
> which the Brazilians revolted against Portuguese rule and Rio became
> the first capital of an independent Brazil.
>
> Now, under rule 4.1.1 it says that "Countries existing at different
> historical times are normally considered the same country if they
> have the same capital city." Presuming that João retained control
> of the African territory, it may therefore be argued that Brazil
> meets the specification of being "a country now existing ... that
> has at some time ... controlled ... territory ... in Africa". And
> so, one entrant tried the answer "Brazil".
>
> I reject this on the grounds that João still considered himself king
> of *Portugal*, as shown by the fact that he returned there; thus,
> at the time, Brazil was still in effect a dependency even though the
> capital it was ruled from was there. So today's Brazil is not the
> "same country" that existed when the king was living there, because
> it was not a country then. Or else if that argument is refuted,
> then I reject it on the grounds that I said "normally" and I deem
> this to be too abnormal a case to qualify. One of those. (See
> signature quote.)
>
>
> | 1. Name a movie telling a fictional story, whose title contains a clear
> | reference to a specific fictional character never actually seen in
> | the movie. This unseen character must be a character in the same
> | fictional context as the movie's story, as opposed to a literary or
> | mythogical reference or the like. (See rule 4.2 for terminology.)
> |
> | Different movies that are remakes or similar versions of the same
> | story, naming the same character in the title, will be taken as
> | equivalent answers.
>
> 6 Waiting for Godot (1965, 1991, 2001) [= Cekají na Godota]
> 4 Waiting for Guffman (1996)
> 3 Charlie's Angels (2000)
> 2 Chasing Amy (1997)
> 2 In Search of Anna (1978)
> 1 After the Thin Man (1936)
> 1 Charlie's Angels: Full Throttle (2003)
> 1 Harvey (1950)
> 1 My Night with Reg (1996)
> 1 Tajomstvo alchymistu Storitza (1991)
> 1 The Absence of Emily (2003)
> 1 The Great Man (1957)
> 1 The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (2002)
> 1 The Son of Robin Hood (1958)
> 1 Waiting for Dr. MacGuffin (1998)
> WRONG:
> 1 Dear God (1996) (mythological reference)
> 1 Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (2001) (Harry Potter
> appears in movie; Nicolas Flamel is a historical
> reference)
> 1 Looking for Mr. Goodbar (+) (1977) (not an actual character)
> 1 Mighty Aphrodite (1995) (mythological reference)
> 1 Monty Python and the Quest for the Holy Grail (no such movie,
> and Monty Python is not a character anyway)
> 1 The Invisible Man (1933) (Griffin seen in late scene)
> 1 The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring (2001)
> (Sauron seen in early scene)
> 1 The Mothman Prophecies (2002) (Mothman seen, though not clearly)
> 1 Zardoz (1974) (Zardoz is seen, or does not exist in fictional
> context of movie, or is literary reference)
>
> I thought this might be a tough one for some people, and the long
> list of wrong answers suggests that it was. I suspect also that
> many of them could only think of one answer, and that this was
> partly responsible for the collision on "Waiting for Godot".
>
> I was amused by the secondary collision on "Waiting for Guffman",
> a pseudo-documentary whose title and premise are a reference to
> "Waiting for Godot", and interested to see that one entrant came up
> with another movie (a short) that also plays on that title.
>
> Besides those two, I had four other movies in mind when I wrote the
> question: "After the Thin Man", "Harvey", and the two Charlie's
> Angels movies. It turned out that there were additional answers
> among recent popular films -- I hadn't realized that two of the
> three Lord of the Rings movies would be correct answers, although
> I've seen them. (Although a manifestation referred to as the eye of
> Sauron appears in the movies, it's clearly not an actual part of him,
> so that's all right.)
>
> The correct Monty Python title is just "Monty Python and the Holy
> Grail", but as I said, it doesn't matter. That one is right out.
>
> In "Zardoz", the character of Arthur Frayn operates a flying stone
> head and pretends that he is a god. In reference to the fake Wizard
> of Oz in that book, he calls himself Zardoz. As far as I'm concerned,
> there is no way that this adds up to the movie being a correct answer,
> although depending on one's interpretation there are three different
> ways that it could be a wrong answer. I asked the entrant which one
> was intended, but got no reply.
>
> "Tajomstvo alchymistu Storitza" is based on a Jules Verne story whose
> title character becomes invisible, but as in "The Invisible Man",
> not for the entire movie. However, the title character of the movie
> is the father of the title character of the original story, and does
> not appear in the movie.
>
> One entrant asked me how I expected to be able to rule on this
> question. I replied, "I'm expecting entrants to choose movies I've
> already seen, of course. 🙂" In fact I had seen about 40% of the
> movies named; for the rest I generally sought out reviews on the
> Web, and if I couldn't find anything helpful, I accepted the answer
> as correct.
>
>
> | 2. Name (or otherwise clearly identify) a large freestanding arch now
> | existing. An "arch" means any artificial structure reasonably
> | described as an arch and commonly named or described using that
> | word or its equivalent in another language; "freestanding" means
> | that it is not, and never was, and is not intended to become, part
> | of a larger structure such as a bridge or building; and "large"
> | means that the main opening under the arch exceeds 23 feet (7 m)
> | in both height and width.
>
> 7 Gateway Arch (St. Louis, MO, USA) [= St. Louis Arch]
> 3 Arch of Triumph, Paris, France
> 3 Great Arch of La Défense (La Défense, France)
> 2 Arch of Septimius Severus (Rome, Italy)
> 2 Arch of Triumph, Bucharest, Romania
> 2 Arch of Triumph, Pyongyang, North Korea
> 2 India Gate (Delhi, India)
> 2 Washington Square Arch (New York, NY, USA)
> 1 Arch of Victory (Ballarat, VIC, Australia)
> 1 Crystal Arch (Jerudong Park, Bandar Seri Begawan, Brunei)
> 1 Main entrance, All Russia Exhibition Center (Moscow, Russia)
> 1 Town of Benevolence Arch (Kuala Lumpur / Selangor, Malaysia)
> WRONG:
> 2 Arch of Constantine (Rome, Italy) (not wide enough: 6.5 m)
> 1 Arch of Galerius in Turkey (no such arch)
> 1 Arch of Severus Commentary (no such arch)
> 1 Camp Randall Memorial Arch (Madison, WI, USA) (not wide enough:
>
<http://www.library.wisc.edu/etext/WIReader/Images/Big/WER1298.jpeg>)
> 1 Chinatown Arch (Philadelphia, PA, USA) (not high enough:
>
<http://www.vanermengem.com/img/philadelphia/kveus0952s.jpg>)
> 1 Kolob Arch (Zion National Park, UT, USA) (not artificial)
> 1 Marble Arch (London, England, UK) (not wide enough:
>
<http://london.sjw.com/Images/Pictures/Images/London%20-%20Marble%20Arch%201
..JPG>)
> 1 Wellington Arch (London, England, UK) (not wide enough:
>
<http://www.pics.kaybee.org:81/Vacations/Europe2003/UnitedKingdom/London/Wel
lingtonArch/.thumbs/large-pict3098.jpg>)
>
> I've listed the answers in English because I couldn't find how to
> spell the Korean name of the Korean arch in English letters, and
> I wanted to be consistent.
>
> The most popular answers included two of the best-known arches,
> so no surprise there, although it's interesting that the Great
> Arch (Grande Arche) of La Défense scored equally with its Paris
> neighbor. Some might question the legality of this one, but it's
> not *part* of a building; it *is* a building (which happens to be
> in the shape of a rectangular arch) and therefore is okay.
>
> Some of the answers are double arches, or include a main arch and
> side arches on each side; one is really a sort of freestanding
> colonnade with a central arch. I considered that the plain word
> "arch" commonly includes such things and accepted them. That was
> the intent of the question, anyway.
>
> Now to the wrong answers. Perhaps I should have put "artificial"
> or "structure" in the first sentence instead of the second, but
> only one entrant went wrong on that.
>
> Several entrants, however, fell afoul of the dimensional require-
> ments. It turns out that for many arches there are no web pages
> that tell their dimensions. Fortunately, there typically *are*
> large numbers of web pages with photos of them. In the four
> cases where I have cited a URL above, this is a picture in which
> it can clearly be seen that the opening of the arch is no wider
> (or taller in one case) than 3 times the height of a person
> standing more or less under the arch. Depending on your news-
> reading environment, you may need to reattach the pieces of the
> URLs in order to view the images.
>
> Two entrants referred to arches that would have been correct, but
> got the names badly enough wrong that I didn't think it would be
> fair to other entrants if I treated them as spelling errors, par-
> ticularly since both of them provided URLs for "supporting" infor-
> mation that actually proved they had it wrong. The Arch of Galerius
> does not have "in Turkey" in its name and is in fact in Thessaloniki,
> Greece. (And the contestant also carefully delimited his comments,
> but put "in Turkey" in the answer and not the comment.) Similarly,
> the word "Commentary" is not part of the name of the Arch of
> Septimius Severus.
>
> The (+) answer was the Arch of Titus (Rome, Italy). I don't know
> if this is correct or not.
>
>
> | 3. Name a mathematical function which, in properly typeset math (not
> | computer science usage), is customarily represented by a shortened
> | form of its name (in some language) consisting entirely of two or
> | more letters.
>
> 5 Cosine (cos)
> 4 Natural logarithm (ln)
> 3 Arctangent (arctan) (*)
> 3 Cotangent (cot)
> 2 Gudermannian (gd)
> 2 Hyperbolic cosecant (csch)
> 2 Hyperbolic cosine (cosh)
> 2 Hyperbolic secant (sech)
> 2 Hyperbolic tangent (tanh)
> 2 Logarithm (log)
> 2 Secant (sec)
> 1 Complementary error function (erfc)
> 1 Covariance (cov)
> 1 Determinant (with restricted domain) (det) (*)
> 1 Error function (erf)
> 1 Hyperbolic cotangent (coth)
> 1 Logarithmic integral (li)
> WRONG:
> 1 Square root
>
> The two functions marked * have more than one representation and are
> not always symbolized using letters alone, but I considered they
> were often enough to make them correct.
>
> An easy source of correct answers was trigonometry, with six common
> functions -- of which only two were used, but one of them was the
> most popular answer. There are also more obscure trig functions
> such as the versine, which was the (+) answer. Then there are the
> six hyperbolic functions named in correspondence to the trig
> functions, and five of these were taken.
>
> I took "logarithm" and "natural logarithm" as distinct answers rather
> than the one being a more specific case of the other, because "loga-
> rithm" alone often means a logarithm to base 10 rather than to an
> arbitrary base.
>
> A good place to find definitions of these functions, if you want to
> see them, is <http://mathworld.wolfram.com>.
>
>
> | 4. Name a country whose capital city is not one of its 3 largest cities
> | -- neither by city proper nor by metropolitan area population. For
> | purposes of this question the "capital" city is where the national
> | legislature normally meets.
>
> 6 United States (Washington; New York, Los Angeles, Chicago)
> 4 Australia (+) (Canberra; Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane)
> 4 Canada (Ottawa; Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver; Toronto,
> Montreal, Calgary)
> 4 Pakistan (Islamabad; Karachi, Lahore, Faisalabad)
> 3 Brazil (Brasília; São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro, Belo Horizonte;
> São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro, Salvador)
> 3 Kazakhstan (Astana; Almaty, Karaganda, Chimkent)
> 3 Switzerland (Bern; Zürich, Basel, Genève)
> 2 Belize (Belmopan; Belize, Orange Walk, San Ignacio)
> 2 Nigeria (Abuja; Lagos, Ibadan, Kano)
> 1 Sri Lanka (Sri Jayewardenepura Kotte; Colombo, Jaffna, Kandy)
> 1 Tanzania (Dodoma; Dar es Salaam, Mwanza, Zanzibar)
> WRONG:
> 2 Netherlands [= Holland] (The Hague / 's Gravenhage: 3rd after
> Amsterdam, Rotterdam)
> 1 Brasília (not a country)
>
> For some countries I was unable to find both city-proper and
> metropolitan-area populations, so it's possible that some of the
> "correct" answers are actually wrong.
>
> Considering that three of the correct answers are English-speaking
> countries, I wasn't surprised to find them at the top of the list.
> Some of the other correct answers are relatively obscure; I have no
> idea how many more, if any, there are.
>
>
> | 5. Name one of the children of Joseph (Joe) and Katherine Jackson, who
> | married in 1949 and lived at 2300 Jackson Street, Gary, IN, USA.
> |
> | (This question may be loosely paraphrased as: "Name a member of the
> | Jackson family. Yes, *that* Jackson family.")
>
> 7 Michael (Michael Joseph Jackson)
> 5 Janet (Janet Damita Jo Jackson)
> 5 Tito (Tariano/Toriano Adaryll Jackson)
> 4 LaToya (LaToya Yvonne Jackson)
> 4 Marlon (Marlon David Jackson)
> 4 Rebbie (Maureen Reilette Jackson)
> 2 Jackie (+) (Sigmund Esco Jackson)
> 2 Jermaine (Jermaine LaJaun/LaJaune Jackson)
> 2 Randy (Steven Randall Jackson)
> 1 Brandon (Brandon Jackson)
>
> I give two versions of some of the middle names above because web
> sites are divided as to the correct spellings, and since the
> spelling didn't affect the contest, there was no reason to find
> a more reliable source.
>
> It was no surprise to see Michael and Janet as the most popular
> answers, both having been in the news in recent months. The
> trickiest answer is Brandon, who died very soon after being born,
> and isn't mentioned on some web pages; this was an obscure enough
> choice to score a 1.
>
>
> | 6. Name a sport whose games are contests of one team against one other
> | team, in which it commonly happens (during play in a professional
> | context or with similar high standard) that the total number of
> | players -- on both teams taken together -- who are active at that
> | moment is an odd number greater than 1.
> |
> | Here an "active" player does not necessarily mean someone actually
> | taking part in play action (intended to possibly advance the team
> | toward victory) at that moment, but rather, one who at that moment
> | is *eligible* to do so, and to be in the playing area to do it
> | without first needing to be substituted for some other player.
> | "During play" is intended to exclude timeouts and any similar
> | concepts. Transitional situations lasting for a few seconds or less
> | are also excluded. These terms will be interpreted in common-sense
> | fashion according to the nature of the sport.
>
> 7 Ice hockey [= Hockey]
> 6 Cricket (+) (*)
> 4 Water polo
> 2 Lacrosse
> 2 Soccer
> 2 Softball (*)
> 2 Team handball
> 1 Bandy
> 1 Dodgeball (**)
> 1 Floor hockey
> 1 Gaelic football
> 1 Korfball
> 1 Ringette
> 1 Roller hockey
> 1 Rounders (*)
> 1 Rugby League
> 1 Stoolball (*)
> WRONG:
> 1 Relay race (contest involves more than two teams, and numbers
> are unequal only during brief transitional periods
> anyway)
>
> Correct answers for this one fell into three groups. (*) indicates
> asymmetrical games on the model of baseball and cricket, where at any
> particular time one team is pitching/fielding and the other hitting,
> with fewer players on the latter side. Note that cricket was the
> most popular answer of this type, while baseball was not mentioned
> at all. (**) indicates that the number of players is reduced during
> normal play, as people are eliminated and not replaced.
>
> And all the rest of the answers are ones where a team can be left to
> play shorthanded due to a penalty, either for a limited time or in
> the case where a player is expelled from the game. Owing to the
> vagueness of the word "commonly", and because I couldn't see how
> else to do it anyway, I decided to accept all sports where the rules
> allow for such a penalty. The most common answer was (ice) hockey,
> the sport most familiar in North America with this type of penalty.
> (One entrant put "hockey" alone, which I took to mean ice hockey
> since he's from North America.)
>
>
> | 7. The ending -ough occurring in English words is pronounced in various
> | ways. Specify one of these ways by naming an English word (not a
> | proper name) that ends in -ough. For scoring purposes your answer
> | is the sound of -ough in the word, not the word itself. To avoid
> | any ambiguity, you are also asked to list some other words containing
> | the same sound.
>
> 8 Bough ("ow") [= Plough]
> 7 Dough ("oh") [= Though; Thorough¹]
> 7 Rough ("uff") [= Tough; Slough¹]
> 2 Cough (+) ("off")
> 2 Hiccough ("up")
> 2 Lough² ("okh")
> 2 Lough¹ ("ock") [= Hough]
> 2 Through ("ooh") [= Slough²]
> 2 Yarborough ("uh") [= Thorough²]
> WRONG:
> 1 Owe (word does not end in -ough)
> 1 Thorough (entrant did not specify which pronunciation, even
> when asked)
>
> Almost a 3-way tie between three of the common pronunciations here;
> I see no obvious pattern to suggest why those three were more chosen.
> when other common pronunciations were not.
>
> The real answer here is the sound I have given in parentheses, but in
> order to avoid notational issues, I asked entrants to specify a word
> ending in -ough and some additional words with the same sound. Most
> entrants used words in -ough for the additional words, even though this
> was not required, sometimes creating an ambiguity that required me to
> ask them for more words. Two entrants fell afoul of the requirements
> and produced wrong answers.
>
> Where the same word was given as answer by different entrants, but
> the additional words made it clear that different pronunciations were
> intended, I have added a superscript numeral to distinguish the cases.
> "Slough" was actually given with a third pronunctation -- Slough³,
> the place in England -- among one entrant's additional words for the
> "ow" sound.
>
>
> | 8. Give a two-word expression in English where the second word is "oil",
> | which identifies a type of oil -- and where the first word does NOT
> | refer to any vegetable, flower, or other member of the plant kingdom.
>
> 3 Motor oil
> 2 Baby oil
> 2 Coal oil
> 2 Fish oil
> 2 Lawnmower oil
> 1 Camphorated oil
> 1 Crude oil
> 1 Dippel's oil
> 1 Emu oil
> 1 Engine oil
> 1 Essential oil
> 1 Ethereal oil
> 1 Fuel oil
> 1 Goanna oil
> 1 Hair oil
> 1 Heating oil
> 1 Lorenzo's oil
> 1 Macassar oil
> 1 Mineral oil
> 1 Nose oil
> 1 Shark oil
> 1 Silicon oil (see below)
> 1 Silicone oil
> 1 Snake oil (+) (see below)
> 1 Tall oil
> WRONG:
> 1 Body (one word)
> 1 Household (one word)
> 1 Midnight oil (not a type of oil)
> 1 Paraffin (one word) (see below)
> 1 Rapeseed oil (rape is a plant)
>
> Answers here were widely dispersed, producing a large number of 1's.
> Unless you were so unlucky as to choose motor oil, the only way to
> get a bad score was to fail to meet the requirements of the question.
>
> The entrant who tried "paraffin" actually wrote "paraffin (oil)".
> Since this entrant clearly used parentheses to designate a comment
> on another answer, I had to rule that "paraffin" was the answer
> and "oil" a comment, making it a wrong answer.
>
> "Silicon" is a chemical element, and "silicone" is a class of com-
> pounds containing it. One of these is polydimethylsiloxane, which
> is more popularly known as "silicone oil". However, web searches
> show that while that is the form normally seen in professional
> publications, a substantial fraction of people call it "silicon oil"
> instead, which is not an unreasonable term since the stuff does
> contain silicon. I therefore accepted "silicon oil" as a correct
> answer, and since the question asked for a phrase and not a
> material, it was scored as a distinct answer from "silicone oil".
>
> Today the term "snake oil" is commonly used as a reference to a
> product (or political idea, or the like) marketed as offering real
> benefits when in fact it is completely worthless. But this arises
> because at one time there was a real product called "snake oil",
> which was marketed as offering real benefits when in fact it was
> completely worthless. This actually was a kind of oil, typically
> compounded from vegetable oils; and since the word "snake" does not
> refer to a vegetable, it's a correct answer.
>
>
> | 9. Name a part of the body that most people have exactly 10 of.
>
> 6 Finger
> 6 Toenail
> 4 Metacarpal [= Metacarpal bone]
> 4 Metatarsal [= Metatarsal bone]
> 3 Toe
> 2 Fingertip
> 1 Carpometacarpal joint
> 1 Fingernail
> 1 Left-side proximal phalanx
> 1 Metacarpal capitulum
> 1 Metacarpophalangeal joint
> 1 Metatarsophalangeal joint [= Articulatio metatarsophalangea]
> 1 Toenail matrix
> WRONG:
> 2 Proximal phalanx (20 per person)
> 1 1/10 of a liver (see below)
> 1 Distal phalanx (20 per person)
>
> We had a double collision on "finger" and "toenail", while "finger-
> nail" and "toe" were rarer answers. Most people think of their
> fingers more often than their toes; I think some people went for
> the most obvious answer, while others decided to go a "safe" two
> removes away from it. Going one more remove, to "toenail matrix",
> was more successful. (The matrix is the tissue at the root of the
> nail that it grows from.) I accepted "fingertip" as a body part.
> The (+) answer was "right-side digit", which I would have accepted.
>
> Among those who opted for bones, there was a strong preference in
> favor of the metacarpals and metatarsals, perhaps because the exotic
> meta- prefix makes them sound more obscure. To get a good score using
> bones, you had to go for a joint or correctly refer to the phalanges.
>
> "Carpal" in anatomical jargon refers to the wrist. The "metacarpals"
> are the bones in the flat part of your hand; there are five of them
> in each hand, one leading to each finger; each one meets the wrist
> at a "carpometacarpal joint", and the "metacarpal capitulum" is one
> part of the metacarpal bone. The first segment of each finger con-
> tains a bone called the "proximal phalanx", which meets the corre-
> sponding metacarpal at a "metacarpophalangeal joint". The middle
> segment of the non-thumb fingers contains the "medial phalanx", and
> the fingertip contains the "distal phalanx".
>
> Got that? Now, the anatomy of the foot is exactly corresponding,
> except that -carp- becomes -tars-; in particular, the phalanges are
> named in the same way, so there are 20 of them in a normal person,
> not 10. If you wanted to specify phalanges, you had to divide the
> set in half in some way, as by saying "proximal phalanx of the hand"
> (which nobody gave) or "left-side proximal phalanx". Of course the
> medial phalanges would still have been wrong answers, as there are
> 16 of these.
>
> Finally, one entrant tried "1/10 of a liver" on the grounds that
> "you asked people to name a part of the body, not a body part.
> Surely, if a man is missing 1/10th of his liver, he's missing part
> of his body." Now that's true enough, although it certainly isn't
> how I meant "part of the body" to be interpreted; but it fails the
> requirement that most people have "exactly 10" of them. There are
> many ways to divide the liver into 10 equal parts, and all of the
> resulting fractional livers are "parts" of the person's body.
> So there.
> --
> Mark Brader | Well, unfortunately, that is impossible, or very difficult,
or
> Toronto | highly inadvisable, or would require legislation--one of
those.
> msb@vex.net | -- Sir Humphrey ("Yes Minister", Lynn &
Jay)
>
> My text in this article is in the public domain.
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) wrote in message news:<10d3a1k8g92143c@corp.supernews.com>...
>
> And get this. Entering the contest for the second time, and WINNING
> for the second time, is GARMT DE VRIES! Congratulations, Garmt --
> very impressive! In second place behind Garmt, again just like last
> time, is Lejonel Norling; and in third, John Gerson.

I guess Mark's contests are more suited for me than Neville's NR01,
where I got a 10th place out of 11... Perhaps not living in North
America was a handicap in NR01, but an advantage in MSB40 (Q2, Q4,
Q6)?

Looking forward to MSB41 😉

> | 0. Name a country now existing, whose capital city is outside of Africa,
> | that has at some time either included or otherwise controlled (e.g.
> | as a colony or other dependency), some territory that is in Africa.
> | (See rule 4.1.1 for terminology.)
>
> 5 Netherlands
> 4 Belgium

I considered each of these two for a short while, but then I realised
that us Low Countries would be just obscure enough for most Americans
to think of!


> | 3. Name a mathematical function which, in properly typeset math (not
> | computer science usage), is customarily represented by a shortened
> | form of its name (in some language) consisting entirely of two or
> | more letters.

Just out of curiosity, would you have accepted "trace" (Tr) as a
function, even though it operates on matrices rather than numbers?

I considered the inverse hyperbolic cosecant (usually csch^-1, but
sometimes written as arccsch), but was afraid the arccsch notation
wasn't common enough.


> | 7. The ending -ough occurring in English words is pronounced in various
> | ways. Specify one of these ways by naming an English word (not a
> | proper name) that ends in -ough. For scoring purposes your answer
> | is the sound of -ough in the word, not the word itself. To avoid
> | any ambiguity, you are also asked to list some other words containing
> | the same sound.
>
> 2 Lough² ("okh")
> 2 Lough¹ ("ock") [= Hough]

I had been hesitating between these two. Glad I picked the "ock"!


> | 9. Name a part of the body that most people have exactly 10 of.
>
> 1 Metacarpophalangeal joint
> 1 Metatarsophalangeal joint [= Articulatio metatarsophalangea]

I also hesitated between these two. Again, a bit of luck that I picked
the -carp- and not the -tars-.

Thanks a lot for running these contests, Mark, they're great fun!

Garmt de Vries.
 
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Somebody claiming to be "Machiabelly" <machi@pe.eastlink.ca> wrote in
news:GEpAc.6680$vO1.55746@nnrp1.uunet.ca:

> Oh,
> and I got chastised. I am not sure why, maybe forgot to go from HTML to
> basic text.

Probably for quoting the questions, since you've just posted a 684-line
post with no more than 10 lines of new information. 😛

--
Ted <fedya at bestweb dot net>
The way I see it, you raised three children who could knock out and hog-
tie a perfect stranger, you must be doing *something* right.
Marge Simpson, <http://www.snpp.com/episodes/7G01.html>
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

> | 1. Name a movie telling a fictional story, whose title contains a clear
> | reference to a specific fictional character never actually seen in
> | the movie. This unseen character must be a character in the same
> | fictional context as the movie's story, as opposed to a literary or
> | mythogical reference or the like. (See rule 4.2 for terminology.)
> |
> 3 Charlie's Angels (2000)

Umm... doesn't Charlie show up at the end of the movie, watching the angels
from afar as they lounge on the beach? The voice-over certainly implies that
it's him.

Amdrew
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

"Andrew Krywaniuk" <askrywan@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<hhwAc.758468$Pk3.234323@pd7tw1no>...
> > | 1. Name a movie telling a fictional story, whose title contains a clear
> > | reference to a specific fictional character never actually seen in
> > | the movie. This unseen character must be a character in the same
> > | fictional context as the movie's story, as opposed to a literary or
> > | mythogical reference or the like. (See rule 4.2 for terminology.)
> > |
> > 3 Charlie's Angels (2000)
>
> Umm... doesn't Charlie show up at the end of the movie, watching the angels
> from afar as they lounge on the beach? The voice-over certainly implies that
> it's him.
>
> Amdrew

Come to that, doesn't Harvey show up at the end of that film (in Jimmy
Stewart's imagination, sure, but I think we do see what he looks like,
so he is "seen").

Haven't seen the film for years, mind.

Tom
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

In article <528a72ef.0406180032.492c7c6@posting.google.com>,
Garmt de Vries <gdv1000@hotmail.com> wrote:
>msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) wrote in message news:<10d3a1k8g92143c@corp.supernews.com>...
>> | 3. Name a mathematical function which, in properly typeset math (not
>> | computer science usage), is customarily represented by a shortened
>> | form of its name (in some language) consisting entirely of two or
>> | more letters.
>
> Just out of curiosity, would you have accepted "trace" (Tr) as a
> function, even though it operates on matrices rather than numbers?

Not just on matrices, it also applies to elements of field extensions.
(e.g., algebraic numbers, finite field elements.)

Cheers,
Geoff.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Geoff Bailey (Fred the Wonder Worm) | Programmer by trade --
ftww@maths.usyd.edu.au | Gameplayer by vocation.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

In article <d4462fb2.0406180542.3efa0d3c@posting.google.com>, tom@the-spontaneity-
shop.com says...
> "Andrew Krywaniuk" <askrywan@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<hhwAc.758468$Pk3.234323@pd7tw1no>...
> > > | 1. Name a movie telling a fictional story, whose title contains a clear
> > > | reference to a specific fictional character never actually seen in
> > > | the movie. This unseen character must be a character in the same
> > > | fictional context as the movie's story, as opposed to a literary or
> > > | mythogical reference or the like. (See rule 4.2 for terminology.)
> > > |
> > > 3 Charlie's Angels (2000)
> >
> > Umm... doesn't Charlie show up at the end of the movie, watching the angels
> > from afar as they lounge on the beach? The voice-over certainly implies that
> > it's him.
> >
> > Amdrew
>
> Come to that, doesn't Harvey show up at the end of that film (in Jimmy
> Stewart's imagination, sure, but I think we do see what he looks like,
> so he is "seen").

A large rabbit does appear in the film at the end.

--
Go to http://MarcDashevsky.com to send me e-mail.
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

Andrew Krywaniuk:
> > > > 3 Charlie's Angels (2000)
> > >
> > > Umm... doesn't Charlie show up at the end of the movie, watching the
> > > angels from afar ...?

Hmm. I do seem to remember a scene like that. But the IMDB cast list,
which for popular movies usually includes that sort of thing, has no
mention anyone playing Charlie other than the voice of John Forsyth.

Tom Salinsky:
> > Come to that, doesn't Harvey show up at the end of that film (in Jimmy
> > Stewart's imagination, sure, but I think we do see what he looks like,
> > so he is "seen").

Marc Dashevsky:
> A large rabbit does appear in the film at the end.

Wrong. The only place you see a large rabbit in the film is a *painting*
of Elwood (James Stewart) with Harvey. There's a script of the movie
online at <http://geocities.com/emruf3/harvey.html>. Harvey has screen
credit as being played by "himself", but nevertheless, he is not seen in
the film. The way that the question of Harvey's existence is settled,
late in the film, is (rot13) jura qbbef bcra naq pybfr jvgubhg nalbar
frra zbivat gurz.
--
Mark Brader | "I'm surprised there aren't laws about this in the USA..."
msb@vex.net | "Of course there are laws about this in the USA.
Toronto | Without even reading further to find out what 'this' is."
| --Rob Bannister and Evan Kirshenbaum

My text in this article is in the public domain.
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

Garmt de Vries writes:
> Just out of curiosity, would you have accepted "trace" (Tr) as a
> function, even though it operates on matrices rather than numbers?

I accepted determinant.
--
Mark Brader | "What a strange field. Studying beings instead of mathematics.
Toronto | Could lead to recursive problems in logic."
msb@vex.net | -- Robert L. Forward (The Flight of the Dragonfly)
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

In article <10d65jj4342fb1c@corp.supernews.com>, msb@vex.net says...
> Andrew Krywaniuk:
> > > > > 3 Charlie's Angels (2000)
> > > >
> > > > Umm... doesn't Charlie show up at the end of the movie, watching the
> > > > angels from afar ...?
>
> Hmm. I do seem to remember a scene like that. But the IMDB cast list,
> which for popular movies usually includes that sort of thing, has no
> mention anyone playing Charlie other than the voice of John Forsyth.
>
> Tom Salinsky:
> > > Come to that, doesn't Harvey show up at the end of that film (in Jimmy
> > > Stewart's imagination, sure, but I think we do see what he looks like,
> > > so he is "seen").
>
> Marc Dashevsky:
> > A large rabbit does appear in the film at the end.
>
> Wrong. The only place you see a large rabbit in the film is a *painting*
> of Elwood (James Stewart) with Harvey. There's a script of the movie
> online at <http://geocities.com/emruf3/harvey.html>. Harvey has screen
> credit as being played by "himself", but nevertheless, he is not seen in
> the film. The way that the question of Harvey's existence is settled,
> late in the film, is (rot13) jura qbbef bcra naq pybfr jvgubhg nalbar
> frra zbivat gurz.

Thanks. You're right . . . I conflated the painting with the
scene you describe. So much for eye-witness testimony!

--
Go to http://MarcDashevsky.com to send me e-mail.
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

Somebody claiming to be msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) wrote in
news:10d65jj4342fb1c@corp.supernews.com:

> Marc Dashevsky:
>> A large rabbit does appear in the film at the end.
>
> Wrong. The only place you see a large rabbit in the film is a
> *painting* of Elwood (James Stewart) with Harvey.

But if that rabbit is Harvey, wouldn't that mean Harvey is seen? Your
original question says nothing about the character being seen *in the
flesh*. (I haven't seen the movie, and rejected it because I was under
the impression that the movie showed Harvey in Jimmy Stewart's
imagination.) I suppose you're saying that the rabbit in the painting
isn't Harvey?

The appearance of the title character in a portrait led me to reject
another film, Alfred Hitchcock's "Rebecca", where Rebecca de Winter is
quite clearly seen in a portrait. (rot 13) Gur frpbaq Zef. qr Jvagre unf
vg fhttrfgrq gb ure ol Zef. Qnairef gung fur fubhyq qerff hc sbe n pbfghzr
cnegl yvxr gur jbzna va n cnegvphyne cbegenvg, naq jura Znk qr Jvagre vf
znqr ntunfg ol guvf pubvpr bs pbfghzr, vg'f zragvbarq gung gur frpbaq Zef.
qr Jvagre unq pubfra gb qerff hc nf Erorppn.

--
Ted Schuerzinger <fedya at bestweb dot net>
The way I see it, you raised three children who could knock out and hog-
tie a perfect stranger, you must be doing *something* right.
Marge Simpson, <http://www.snpp.com/episodes/7G01.html>
 
Archived from groups: rec.puzzles,rec.games.trivia (More info?)

Mark Brader:
> > Wrong. The only place you see a large rabbit in the film is a
> > *painting* of Elwood (James Stewart) with Harvey.

Ted Schuerzinger:
> But if that rabbit is Harvey, wouldn't that mean Harvey is seen? Your
> original question says nothing about the character being seen *in the
> flesh*.

But that's the normal meaning of "seen". Using an alternate or extended
meaning to make an otherwise wrong answer right is one thing, but using
it to make a right answer wrong is another.

> The appearance of the title character in a portrait led me to reject
> another film, Alfred Hitchcock's "Rebecca", where Rebecca de Winter is
> quite clearly seen in a portrait.

I would have accepted that one too.
--
Mark Brader | "One of the lessons of history is that nothing
Toronto | is often a good thing to do and always a clever
msb@vex.net | thing to say." -- Will Durant