[SOLVED] RIP 3090?

[thepersonwithaface45]

After the AMD press conference, it's $1000 for a 6900xt which rivals the 3090 at less power and smaller form factor.
It's $650 for a card that rivals the 3080.

You think nvidia is gonna release TI versions or super versions at an acceptable price that can compete with this?
I did not expect this at all.
The thing that worries me is going for an AMD card with an intel processor after they mentioned how having an AMD processor will benefit you with their smart tech.

 

[JasonNs_]

The thing that worries me is going for an AMD card with an intel processor after they mentioned how having an AMD processor will benefit you with their smart tech.

It might be true, it might not, but i guess its advertising just to buy their CPUs.

 

[Pytheus]

No, the SKUs from what I read on the ti/super versions of the 3080 and 3070 were canceled. They're having supply issues as it is. Any release of a ti/super version is far off in the next year. By then AMD may have counter product.

 

[alceryes]

We'll have to wait and see. Kudos to AMD for keeping the 6800XT performance on the down low. I was expecting the 6800XT to compete with the RTX 3070, not RTX 3080. I want independent gaming reviews (and a lot of them) before I'll be convinced either way.

 

[xravenxdota]

Few thing.sWait for individual review and never buy first gen.They are usually beta cards.Good example is RTX 20xx series.It was over priced and struggled in rtx games.Same with amd's 1xxx zen cpu's, had memory issues.I am not in the market for a new gpu as my 1070 ti cost me 211 usd but if i were to buy a new one.I would wait.

 

[mjbn1977]

The AMD marketing slogan "the fasted AMD gaming graphics card ever developed" (which by the way, is the dumbest possible slogan, if they wouldn't have been the fastest AMD gaming cards ever developed, what would have been the point anyway??) indicates, that AMD is themselves not sure if the can call their cards the fastest gaming cards ever developed. Even so, they presentation kinda left me impressed in regards to rasterization performance. But it also left me with a lot of question marks in regard to Ray Tracing, DLSS competition etc. AMD avoided to show any real numbers in this department, what makes me guess, that they can't compete with Ampere cards in Raytracing games, especially if used in combination of DLSS. Leaks show that they about on the level of a RTX 2080Ti when it comes to Raytracing. And no DLSS alternative at this point.

So, no, the RTX 3090 is not dead, but maybe slightly too expensive. But not worth it if you don't plan to use any raytracing.

Also, its rumored that we are getting a RTX 3070Ti (GA102-150, 7424 Cuda Cores, 10 GB G6X 320bit), and a RTX 3080 Ti (GA102-250, 9984 Cuda Cores, 12 GB G6X 384bit) rather soon. This will be for part to better compete with AMD and in part of the fact that they probably have a lot of chips which should have become RTX 3090, but missing a few cores, but are still better than RTX 3080 chips (same with the chips for the RTX 3070). I don't think they actually yield a lot fo RTX 3090 chips right now.

My guess would be that we would get the RTX 3080Ti for somewhere $900 to 950. and the RTX 3070Ti for $550.

Either way, in the end of the day Nvidia and AMD are now on very similar performance levels and that means: COMPETITION IS BACK.....AND this is a GOOD thing for all of us!!!! Right now you can't really go wrong either way....

 

[Nero1024]

Nope. RTX 3090 is only card capable of 8k gaming, not to mention AMD cards don't have hardware Ray Tracing and/or DLSS

 

[Zerk2012]

The 3090 was made more to replace the Titan as a work card.

Edit that's why the big price increase over the 3080 for just a little gaming performance gains.

 

[Joseph_138]

Wait until reputable reviewers get their hands on them and do actual comparisons before spending any money. There were people releasing videos on YT comparing RTX 30 performance to existing cards in games testing before Linus, Gamers Nexus, and Jayz2Cents had cards in hand. There are videos now comparing Big Navi game performance before anyone with any reputation in the field has even seen more than a photograph of one. How are these guys doing performance testing before the big name reviewers even have cards to test?

 

[CooLWoLF]

Nope. RTX 3090 is only card capable of 8k gaming, not to mention AMD cards don't have hardware Ray Tracing and/or DLSS

1) DLSS is specifically an Nvidia tech, so an AMD product would never have it by default. AMD is working on their own version of a DLSS feature, which was mentioned today.

2) AMD is now capable of hardware ray tracing. Its a major feature of RDNA2.

 

[digitalgriffin]

After the AMD press conference, it's $1000 for a 6900xt which rivals the 3090 at less power and smaller form factor.
It's $650 for a card that rivals the 3080.

You think nvidia is gonna release TI versions or super versions at an acceptable price that can compete with this?
I did not expect this at all.
The thing that worries me is going for an AMD card with an intel processor after they mentioned how having an AMD processor will benefit you with their smart tech.

Ti's will be out in six months without a doubt. 3080ti will get 12gigs memory on a cut down 3090 die.

That said AMD by no means has all the trump cards here. The 3080 and 3090 has vastly superior ray tracing and dlss. The 3090 has lots of vram which is of boon to lots of 3d textures in rendering software and video editing. (Basically content creation)

Even the 6900 cant be considered a serious contender for ray tracing.

AMD glossed over ray tracing and super res for a reason. I think a $600 and $800 proce point much more compelling.

When nvidia releases the ti versions i think this will become reality pricing wise.

 

[digitalgriffin]

1) DLSS is specifically an Nvidia tech, so an AMD product would never have it by default. AMD is working on their own version of a DLSS feature, which was mentioned today.

2) AMD is now capable of hardware ray tracing. Its a major feature of RDNA2.

1) Most of us know this. Its like saying "ill have a coke" when generically referring to soda. Its become a generic name for ai upsampling tech.

2) RT on the AMD hardware isnt much better than turing. This makes it unusable in my book.

I can almost guarantee navi 3 will go a chiplette type approach with a dedicated rt chip. These ops can run in parallel.

 

[renz496]

personally i'm more interested what kind of performance we are going to get for the mainstream (sub $300) for this generation. also with nvidia they are the type that can sell their product even if they were end up being more expensive than competitor. cards like 3090 are still cheaper for semi pro use rather that out right buying nvidia A100 or A6000. 3090 have no FP64 support but it might end up being popular for AI researcher since it has all it's AI feature left intact by nvidia and also have 24GB of memory. for gamer it might be meh but i believe it will find it's own niche. for years several workstation maker already offering nvidia titan in their build instead of actual tesla card.

 

[sizzling]

Ti's will be out in six months without a doubt. 3080ti will get 12gigs memory on a cut down 3090 die.

I think historically the Ti releases July-Sep the following year. If they keep to form it would be more than 6 months away although better competition may accelerate things. The only other thing is the difference between the 3080 and 3090 in games is much smaller than prior x80 and Titan cards so have NVidia really left enough room to slot in another card? To stop devaluing the 3090 I would not be surprised if we just see a 3080 with more VRAM instead of a cut down 3090.

 

[mjbn1977]

I think historically the Ti releases July-Sep the following year. If they keep to form it would be more than 6 months away although better competition may accelerate things. The only other thing is the difference between the 3080 and 3090 in games is much smaller than prior x80 and Titan cards so have NVidia really left enough room to slot in another card? To stop devaluing the 3090 I would not be surprised if we just see a 3080 with more VRAM instead of a cut down 3090.

Ok, here again the most current rumors in regards what a 3080Ti might look like. Actually its a combination of more cuda cores than 3080 (or less than 3090) more VRAM and bigger memory bandwith: a RTX 3080 Ti (GA102-250, 9984 Cuda Cores, 12 GB G6X 384bit). Also, I am pretty sure we will see this very soon....January??

Also, there are rumors that Nvidia is planning to move Ampere to the 7nm TSMC process for the super models. But I don't think this will happen soon, probably in August/September 2021. Even so I don't think it will change that much. Probably a little bit better efficiency for Nvidia, but TSMC 7nm and Samsung 8nm are very similar in density, TSMC 7nm definitely the better one of the two, but don't expect miracles. I think we will see a 3070Ti with 10GB GDR6X and more cuda cores and the above mentioned RTX 3080Ti in a couple of month or so. It's basically the Nvidia adjustment/answer to AMDs release. AMD was able to adjust final core clocks and pricing after Nvidias Ampere launch in order to launch products that slightly outperform Ampere in AMD picked benchmarks. They had the advantage that they new exactly what Nvidia had. So, its just fair that Nvidia is now doing the same thing to adjust. Someone had to launch their new generation first after all.

Anyway, competition is on....that's cool. Now AMD and Nvidia fanboys can pick their favorite brand and both have an awesome high end card! WIN-WIN. And non-fanboys have many cool options....

 

[mjbn1977]

Now I am already excited for the next generation cards in 2 years or so. Both camps, including Intel as the new player, know that the competition is capable to come up with pretty advance stuff....so they will probably outdo themselves in terms of improvements on the next gen. Or at least not try to cut to many corners!

 

[digitalgriffin]

I think historically the Ti releases July-Sep the following year. If they keep to form it would be more than 6 months away although better competition may accelerate things. The only other thing is the difference between the 3080 and 3090 in games is much smaller than prior x80 and Titan cards so have NVidia really left enough room to slot in another card? To stop devaluing the 3090 I would not be surprised if we just see a 3080 with more VRAM instead of a cut down 3090.

The 3080 cant handle more vram unless you go 20 megs and there isnt much if any uplift with this.

 

[sizzling]

The 3080 cant handle more vram unless you go 20 megs and there isnt much if any uplift with this.

Agree but it does wonders for marketing. You have only got to see some comments on this forum with people being sucked into believing you need 16GB+.

 

[digitalgriffin]

Agree but it does wonders for marketing. You have only got to see some comments on this forum with people being sucked into believing you need 16GB+.

Not by the time reviews hit. 20 GB Its great for content creators. This is a niche case and all those double memory models were canceled it was confirmed by AIB's. NVIDIAs plan was to sell the initial cards cheap the increase the margins on the double memory cards. They cant do this now with AMD breathing down their back.

I think 12GB gddr6x and a cutdown g102 is cheaper than 20gb gddr6x with no real uplift.

 

[sizzling]

Ok, here again the most current rumors in regards what a 3080Ti might look like. Actually its a combination of more cuda cores than 3080 (or less than 3090) more VRAM and bigger memory bandwith: a RTX 3080 Ti (GA102-250, 9984 Cuda Cores, 12 GB G6X 384bit). Also, I am pretty sure we will see this very soon....January??

Also, there are rumors that Nvidia is planning to move Ampere to the 7nm TSMC process for the super models. But I don't think this will happen soon, probably in August/September 2021. Even so I don't think it will change that much. Probably a little bit better efficiency for Nvidia, but TSMC 7nm and Samsung 8nm are very similar in density, TSMC 7nm definitely the better one of the two, but don't expect miracles. I think we will see a 3070Ti with 10GB GDR6X and more cuda cores and the above mentioned RTX 3080Ti in a couple of month or so. It's basically the Nvidia adjustment/answer to AMDs release. AMD was able to adjust final core clocks and pricing after Nvidias Ampere launch in order to launch products that slightly outperform Ampere in AMD picked benchmarks. They had the advantage that they new exactly what Nvidia had. So, its just fair that Nvidia is now doing the same thing to adjust. Someone had to launch their new generation first after all.

Anyway, competition is on....that's cool. Now AMD and Nvidia fanboys can pick their favorite brand and both have an awesome high end card! WIN-WIN. And non-fanboys have many cool options....

The rumours are already the higher GB version of the 3070 & 3080 were cancelled due to supply chain issues. I’d be surprised if we saw another top tier gpu in Q1 next year because of this. You could be right but if they can’t get supply to an acceptable level for the current models I would feel more models will have a negative PR impact.

I am really pleased AMD are fighting at or very close to the best gpu level, they exceeded my expectations. The competition is great for us. To me it is so obvious the NVidia pricing is because they had inside knowledge on how competitive Big Navi is.

 

[mjbn1977]

The rumours are already the higher GB version of the 3070 & 3080 were cancelled due to supply chain issues. I’d be surprised if we saw another top tier gpu in Q1 next year because of this. You could be right but if they can’t get supply to an acceptable level for the current models I would feel more models will have a negative PR impact.

I am really pleased AMD are fighting at or very close to the best gpu level, they exceeded my expectations. The competition is great for us. To me it is so obvious the NVidia pricing is because they had inside knowledge on how competitive Big Navi is.

No, the cancelled versions are the 16GB RTX 3070 and the 20GB RTX 3080. The rumors I mentioned are the latest rumors with new chips, GA102-250 (which 12GB GDDR6X @ 384bit) for 3080Ti and GA102-150 (with 10GB GDDR6X @ 320bi for RTX 3070Ti. These new rumored versions are basically what Nvidia plans instead of the now cancelled 16GB and 20GB version which would have only the VRAM doubled at same memory interface rate. The new versions have each more cuda cores, not quite as much more ram, but both have bigger memory interfaces compared to the non-Ti models.

 

[mjbn1977]

The 3080 cant handle more vram unless you go 20 megs and there isnt much if any uplift with this.

no, wrong. It can if they change the memory interface width. And that is exactly what they are planning to do. The GA102-250 chip is rumored to use the same 384-bit interface as the RTX 3090 but with only half the VRAM. And 12GB is possible with a 384-bit.

 

[mjbn1977]

Agree but it does wonders for marketing. You have only got to see some comments on this forum with people being sucked into believing you need 16GB+.

Well, see it like this.....Nvidia can't really lower the price on the RTX 3090 at this point. So, what to do in order to compete better against the 6900XT? You bring the RTX 3080Ti at a lower or similar price point. It will be about 3% faster than the 3080, but offers 2 more GB GDDR6X at an even higher band with (well, its not 16GB, but 12 are most likely enough at this bandwith). Since its a different SKU number they can increase the price without offending past RTX 3080 buyers and past RTX 3090 buyers and have better competitor for the 6900XT....

I am sure there are a lot of chips in manufacturing that are not good enough for 3090 but too good for 3080....so...they squeezing in the new chip for the 3080Ti with the 9984 Cuda cores. Seems like the RTX 3090 yields are still pretty bad.

 

[digitalgriffin]

no, wrong. It can if they change the memory interface width. And that is exactly what they are planning to do. The GA102-250 chip is rumored to use the same 384-bit interface as the RTX 3090 but with only half the VRAM. And 12GB is possible with a 384-bit.

I think you misunderstood. Without activating more cores which will essentially make it a 3090, you cant reach 12GB. (I think it had to do with the tpc count being tied to bus width. But i could be wrong about this.) In its current form the best you can do is 20GB which doesnt make sense.

 

[mjbn1977]

I think you misunderstood. Without activating more cores which will essentially make it a 3090, you cant reach 12GB. (I think it had to do with the tpc count being tied to bus width. But i could be wrong about this.) In its current form the best you can do is 20GB which doesnt make sense.

Here is the quote from the leak or rumor:
"
Kopite7kimi, a leaker better known for revealing details on GeForce RTX Ampere series months in advance is now reporting on a new SKU that would fill the (already narrow) gap between GeForce RTX 3080 and RTX 3090 SKUs.
The graphics card would allegedly feature 9984 CUDA cores, 1280 cores more than RTX 3080. Kopite reports that the GPU variant on this SKU is likely the GA102-250. The memory configuration would also change to a 384-bit bus (compared to 320-bit on RTX 3080). A wider bus means that the card will likely feature a capacity of either 12 GB or 24 GB (same as RTX 3090).
.........According to his information, NVIDIA is also allegedly planning to release a GA102-150 model featuring 7424 CUDA cores, possibly codenamed RTX 3070 Ti."