Router suggestions for 20 Video Streams at 75 Meters

[knowthebird]

I would like help picking a Router, AP.

My goal is:
20 Raspberry Pi Zero Ws
streaming 1080p video at 30 fps over 802.11n
outdoor ranges will be up to 75 yards, clear fields/minimal obstructions

I would like a router that can handle streaming data from all 20 devices at the same time at 75 yards, and ideally would also give me port forwarding options in the interface. I would like to connect a laptop to this router via ethernet to view all video streams simultaneously. Initially this will be on a LAN and will not be streaming over a WAN/internet. Outdoor use, so some weather resistance is desired.

I estimated I will need to be able to maintain total 70-100 Mbps connections at 75 yards. I saw a lot of routers, and I am honestly confused by the options and mixed reviews now. I will list what I was looking at, and maybe you can tell me which is best, or if I should get something else completely.

Ubiquiti BULLET-M2-HP Outdoor 802.11 B/G/N M2HP

OM2P-HS 802.11gn 300mbps HIGH POWER Access Point Router (With 802.3af)

Ubiquiti UAP-AC-M-US Unifi Mesh Access Point

Thanks for any and all help with it.

 

[kanewolf]

First, since the WIFI on a Zero W is "b/g/n" That says 2.4 Ghz and this forum post confirms. You will NEVER stream 20 unique 1080p streams in 2.4Ghz.
So you will need a 3 B+ to use 5Ghz. Even then 20 1080p streams will be difficult.

 

[knowthebird]

First, since the WIFI on a Zero W is "b/g/n" That says 2.4 Ghz and this forum post confirms. You will NEVER stream 20 unique 1080p streams in 2.4Ghz.
So you will need a 3 B+ to use 5Ghz. Even then 20 1080p streams will be difficult.

Couldn't one Pi stream 1080p @ 2.4 Ghz? and if so, why can't I have multiple devices doing the same thing if the router/ap supports the data? I am looking through the post now trying to understand.

 

[kanewolf]

First, since the WIFI on a Zero W is "b/g/n" That says 2.4 Ghz and this forum post confirms. You will NEVER stream 20 unique 1080p streams in 2.4Ghz.
So you will need a 3 B+ to use 5Ghz. Even then 20 1080p streams will be difficult.

Couldn't one Pi stream 1080p @ 2.4 Ghz? and if so, why can't I have multiple devices doing the same thing if the router/ap supports the data? I am looking through the post now trying to understand.

There is only so much time. A wifi device can only receive OR transmit at one time. So lets say that one PI is transmitting at say 8 - 10 Mbit. And lets say you get a link rate of 100Mibt, which is 50Mbit effective because of the transmit OR receive, so that one camera is taking 20% of the total bandwidth. With 75 yards and the small antennas on PIs, you won't get 100Mbit link speed probably. You might get 50Mibt. So now a single 1080p stream is using 50% of the available bandwidth.

 

[bill001g]

It is not a bandwidth issue. It is that wifi is half duplex only 1 device including the router can transmit at 1 time. There is no control between the end devices on who transmits and when. The more devices you have the more chance they transmit at the same time and stomp on each other. This is even more true for things like video that sends data at a fairly continuous rate rather than sending burst of data.

The only reason this works on say a cell phone is that the tower must give the device permission to transmit so it can control devices interfering with each other.

Now if you want to spend the money you can get systems designed for WISP. The motorola canopy system let the central unit control the end stations. There are also systems that use LTE like cell providers do but over the standard non licensed wifi bands

 

[knowthebird]

I am looking at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.11n-2009, and it says "with a significant increase in the maximum net data rate from 54 Mbit/s to 600 Mbit/s". So if I am limited to the 2.4 Ghz range from the Pi, what is the maximum bandwidth per Pi and Total per AP?

 

[knowthebird]

It is not a bandwidth issue. It is that wifi is half duplex only 1 device including the router can transmit at 1 time. There is no control between the end devices on who transmits and when. The more devices you have the more chance they transmit at the same time and stomp on each other. This is even more true for things like video that sends data at a fairly continuous rate rather than sending burst of data.

The only reason this works on say a cell phone is that the tower must give the device permission to transmit so it can control devices interfering with each other.

Ok, I can understand this. Is there a way around it? A stronger AP, Multiple APs? I am open to ways to make it happen

 

[kanewolf]

I am looking at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.11n-2009, and it says "with a significant increase in the maximum net data rate from 54 Mbit/s to 600 Mbit/s". So if I am limited to the 2.4 Ghz range from the Pi, what is the maximum bandwidth per Pi and Total per AP?

Yes a multi-stream "N" can have higher bandwidth. But that is in "laboratory" conditions with a client that can do multiple streams. A PI Zero W is not that client. Take WHATEVER WIFI you have today and test. My guess is you get a link speed of about 50Mbit and you could stream MAYBE two streams.

 

[USAFRet]

20 Video Streams at 75 Meters
streaming 1080p video at 30 fps

I'm curious...what is the use case for this?

 

[knowthebird]

20 Video Streams at 75 Meters
streaming 1080p video at 30 fps

I'm curious...what is the use case for this?

Sports recording

 

[knowthebird]

I am looking at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.11n-2009, and it says "with a significant increase in the maximum net data rate from 54 Mbit/s to 600 Mbit/s". So if I am limited to the 2.4 Ghz range from the Pi, what is the maximum bandwidth per Pi and Total per AP?

Yes a multi-stream "N" can have higher bandwidth. But that is in "laboratory" conditions with a client that can do multiple streams. A PI Zero W is not that client. Take WHATEVER WIFI you have today and test. My guess is you get a link speed of about 50Mbit and you could stream MAYBE two streams.

Ok, So would I be better off looking for a strong AP, or getting multiple APs and assigning different Pis different APs to distribute things and prevent these timing/priority errors I could encounter.

 

[USAFRet]

20 Video Streams at 75 Meters
streaming 1080p video at 30 fps

I'm curious...what is the use case for this?

Sports recording

20 cameras, each playing at 1080p/30fps, recording on one laptop and its drive.

Before going to 20 at once, what did your tests of 2 or 4 show? Can your laptop handle it? How much drive space will that consume, per minute?

 

[knowthebird]

20 Video Streams at 75 Meters
streaming 1080p video at 30 fps

I'm curious...what is the use case for this?

Sports recording

20 cameras, each playing at 1080p/30fps, recording on one laptop and its drive.

Before going to 20 at once, what did your tests of 2 or 4 show? Can your laptop handle it? How much drive space will that consume, per minute?

They will not necessarily be recording on the laptop, but will be being recorded on the PIs. This is one of those things where there are no tests yet on my part. Brainstorming the system now. Not if, but how

 

[kanewolf]

If you are recording on the PIs then you don't have to stream all 20 devices simultaneously. I think you might stream one at a time, and at a sporting event, you would have hundreds of people with personal hotspots AND the venue competing with your WIFI. Less feasible all the time.

 

[failboat]

If you can daisy chain a few together and then use a point-to-point to bring them into the wired network.

are they powered POE?

anything over wifi will likely not be great long term. if you have people there with smart phones. it's likely going to congest it. esp if you are trying to bring wifi to any areas.