[SOLVED] Running over 2 dozen virtual machine off of one machine to multiple screens

[lv2lrn4lf]

I saw a post on this site and like how people answer that individual question, so i had a account to ask my.

I'm simple looking for a recommendation for a system not another way to do it. I have listed out the operation. You don't need the spec to get a good ideal of what going on from reading and what type of intense work load it all is. Just give me a recommendation for a system. that all nothing complicated. People have spoke on ram, processor, storage but not actually system... crazy...

Creating a server, web server, and database server control from one access point. I like to be able to have a hardware machine powerful enough to be able to run:
12 screen streaming and recording happening at the same time
4 server running taking in request and dishing out responses(include the job of the servers also running single message and group message room)
12 browsers to view the result
Running for a total of 12 to 16 hours a day so let just say 24 to make sure we over estimate to be on the safe side
Data storage capacity to handle storage of that much data in a year.
I think something similar but not the same would be liveme. What server do they have configure?
As I research different server, trying to find a good choice for wanting to run serval virtual machine at ones having them display on several screen all can be control by one mouse, screen, and keyboard to where I can move the virtual machine around to any monitor but at the same time each one has it own mouse to program individual if I want. What would you consider is the requirement in what I would need?
I would love to host this with me meaning no over online services. I have two budget, I like to consider the low budget of $500. And would like something not to run up the energy cost since I live with others(if to way to avoid this how much you think it will increase electric bill by?) Also a type of server machine that is compact, don't need a lot of space and easy to expand(many adding on another screen and browser). What system requirements am I looking at? And even know I said four server but that just to keep logic separate, so it'll probable reduce down to one but still consider 4 for over estimate of performance. If you also feel by adding an additional $100 or two or three to better suit this need, please include that but still look at the $500 to.
And I say virtual machine to try to avoid having to buy another desktop machine to expand. I need the virtual machine to be able to record and stream video. ideally the same number of monitor will have a camera to stream and record or have data stream to them to record and stream the video out.
All replies are appreciative!

Little more detail:
This is a start up. I know $500 for all of that is crazy but still like someone to list out what I would need for that tall order. the real start up can just be five screen to display, a machine strong enough to run five virtual machine at the same time smoothly all doing video recording, video streaming, and running a visual application.

Again All replies are appreciative!

 

[CountMike]

You are looking at least at a $2500 computer, $500 is out of question.

 

[USAFRet]

I agree...$500 is completely out of the question.
RAM is a big consideration. Each VM needs its own RAM, minimum 4GB each. More for your 'servers'.
You'll spend most of that $500 budget just on the 64GB RAM you'll need.

This is my system running 4x minimal VM's, and the Win 10 Pro host.
20GB consumed of of 32GB RAM.

 

[Ralston18]

And do not overlook the host environment: ensure that the necessary ventilation and cooling is available.

 

[lv2lrn4lf]

Okay, I read you all loud and clear. Thanks for your replies. What I need to do I can do with one computer, but I like to expand to three and more virtual machine to do the same operations plus run server. $500 isn't much, and what I really want is to be able to do is by a system that I can expand easy with just going to buy the parts little by little as I grow(when the need for another virtual machine ariase). So the real start up is having a machine that run at least 3 to 5 virtual machine and I to expand it.

I look up ram and yes you right, seem like the least I can find for 36gb of ram is around 120-150 dollars and the highest go up pass a thousand.

How the set up i picture it is one powerful machine that do the work, a server machine(or a nas if that would do the trick) that connect to the powerful machine and store data and backup. the powerful machine is connected to four monitor and I can see each virtual machine run in each monitor. Also which virtual machine has it own mouse but capture mine to control when I enter it. Just an ideal of what I'm picturing.

Again, just like a machine that I can expand. SO CAN ANYONE RECOMMEND A MACHINE THAT I CAN START WITH AND EXPAND THAT MACHINE AS I GROW. OR WHAT TYPE OF SETUP AM I REALLY TRYING TO THINK OF? PLEASE IF CAN LEAST OUT THE PRICE, LEAST OUT NAMES OF HARDWARE, OR EVEN A COMPUTER THAT SIMILAR TO WHAT I WANT WITH ROOM TO EXPAND IT TO BE ABLE TO RUN MORE VIRTUAL MACHINE.

Something between $500-$1000 that I can easily expand.

Again All replies are appreciative!

 

[USAFRet]

$500 gets you a machine that will run itself.
$1,000 will get you probably the host + 2VM's, but not great.

GPU's. For 4-5 monitors, you'll probably need at least 2 to start. Depending on what performance you need, this might not be too expensive.

What OS's are you going to be using? If Windows, each VM needs it's own OS license. Any Windows server OS license starts at ~$500.

 

[USAFRet]

Also, what are the requirements of the software you'll be running?
What, exactly, will these servers and VM's be doing?

For instance, if you're going to be doing video rendering, 8GB is pretty minimal. 4 VM's doing that would require 64GB in the host system.

 

[lv2lrn4lf]

USAFRet the ideal is kinda like liveme, where I have several video recording and streaming at the same time and also a server or two to run chat room while displaying the result in those several virtual machine via browsers. liveme have hundreds of people who stream themselves daily which you can view either by a browser or your phone, and at the same time liveme is also recording there video for replay purposes. I like to be able to have several virtual machine that will do the same thing, sending video stream to a browers to view with a chat room. In each virtual machines, just like a desktop, they'll have a camera or another media stream send to them to display that media stream to be recorded and stream out to a browsers over the network. Also have users chat away with each other.

I can see myself being okay with having three out of 12(it should be more but the servers can be combine into one) for starter but still like to have a additional 1 to act as a server or a real server which I saw server machine going low as 150. From my understanding all computers are built with the same component it's just the capability of those component varies from what the users intend to do with it.

With that said... I just like a machine that will give me time on it to do everything I want to do as describe on this post. And one I can expand easily to build more complicated system. I'm a software guy mostly play in that but like to understand hardware and be able to play in that too... but that not as cheap as software is to play in. Also with trying to start something up with this too.

And if that the case for window, even know that what I mostly use I also have Ubuntu in mind too, to run this off of... and honestly do I really need the virtual machine or just one computer who can handle the load of running what those several virtual machine would do which I already describe and even gave an comparison. connect four screen together and set up in each screen(one acting as a server) the operation I want done while having video stream to them to be record and out from them to be stream to a browers via website. In the website you can log in and select a stream to watch and chat in. So also tell me about that too. If Ubuntu can run the software I like to use than that what I'm using.

So again, I like advice on how to do this with how i describe it using both virtual machine with a server machine and how to do it if I just use one computer with a nas for storage.

Even know I gave detail, I'll give more to help get me the answer I need to throw my money on and get started.

Again, any replies are appreciative!

 

[USAFRet]

"and honestly I feel I don't really need the virtual machine just one computer who can handle the load of running what those several virtual machine would do "

Then why the initial question of "Running over 2 dozen virtual machine off of one machine to multiple screens" ?

In any case, $500 will not get you to where you want to be.

You need to determine what system specs your chosen software and load will need.

 

[lv2lrn4lf]

USAFRet Okay so the software that will be running is a browser, video recorder and stream, a software to the run server.

browsers specs:

• Pentium 4 or newer processor that supports SSE2
• 512MB of RAM / 2GB of RAM for the 64-bit version
• 200MB of hard drive space

recording and streaming tool spec:

• DirectX 10.1 compatible GPU
• Windows 7 SP1 or newer

And server no spec depend on how much traffic is coming in and leaving out. A normal up to-date computer can run the server.

What I'm asking here is references to some ideal machine to start out with that isn't expensive and reliable like a honda car. Those spec above isn't important, I plan to buy additional ram and storage to plug into the machine. I just need the machine to start out with. Any ideals on a machine that fit the job almost already out the box ready for me to use. Would it be a good ideal to get a nas to store everything on it, but I really rather get a server machine to process and store the information it get from the work machine which will run virtual machine and spear it out across screens. I need a couple of units to look into. Have any suggestion of machines I can lookup, and of sites to go to for those machines?

 

[USAFRet]

I am still completely unsure of what you're trying to do.
Web server, database server...multiple browsers...streaming, recording...

4, 5, 12 browser windows to show....what?

 

[mdd1963]

I agree...$500 is completely out of the question.
RAM is a big consideration. Each VM needs its own RAM, minimum 4GB each. More for your 'servers'.
You'll spend most of that $500 budget just on the 64GB RAM you'll need.

This is my system running 4x minimal VM's, and the Win 10 Pro host.
20GB consumed of of 32GB RAM.

VIrtual Box does certainly work for tinkering with assorted OS's, but, unless you need functioning audio, HyperV would likely allow slightly better performance than Type2 virtualization solutions such as VB...; when installing the Hyper-V 'role', your existing Win10 Pro install is quickly/painlessly converted into a VM, although few suspect or understand that, as it seems almost as if HyperV is similar to VB in that case, but, HyperV is the standard full blown TYpe 1 Hypervisor bare metal install, with Win10 Pro VM now running the HyperV Manager.... ( Server 2016 under HyperV is remarkably snappy even with a GUI using just 4-8 GB of RAM allocated to the VM)

But, $500 is certainly a virtually impossible stretch if assembling new, but, not impossible if perhaps finding a 4 - 5 year old off-lease dual socket / 6 -8 core Xeon from Dell , HP, or Lenovo with 32 GB of RAM, a few drives, in the clearance section at Newegg or Amazon on sale!

 

[USAFRet]

VIrtual Box does certainly work for tinkering with assorted OS's, but, unless you need functioning audio, HyperV would likely allow slightly better performance than Type2 virtualization solutions such as VB...; when installing the Hyper-V 'role', your existing Win10 Pro install is quickly/painlessly converted into a VM, although few suspect or understand that, as it seems almost as if HyperV is similar to VB in that case, but, HyperV is the standard full blown TYpe 1 Hypervisor bare metal install, with Win10 Pro VM now running the HyperV Manager.... ( Server 2016 under HyperV is remarkably snappy even with a GUI using just 4-8 GB of RAM allocated to the VM)

But, $500 is certainly a virtually impossible stretch if assembling new, but, not impossible if perhaps finding a 4 - 5 year old off-lease dual socket / 6 -8 core Xeon from Dell , HP, or Lenovo with 32 GB of RAM, a few drives, in the clearance section at Newegg or Amazon on sale!

Oh yeah. Hyper-V is probably a little bit better in raw performance.
I've used it a lot. Currently with VB at home, due to the audio. VMWare is another consideration. I use it at work.

But I am still 100% unsure what he's actually wanting to do..

 

[mdd1963]

$500 gets you a machine that will run itself.
$1,000 will get you probably the host + 2VM's, but not great.

GPU's. For 4-5 monitors, you'll probably need at least 2 to start. Depending on what performance you need, this might not be too expensive.

What OS's are you going to be using? If Windows, each VM needs it's own OS license. Any Windows server OS license starts at ~$500.

Running WIn10 virtualized technically runs into desktop infrastructure licensing (VDI,RDP) issues, as a mere OEM/retail license alone for each WIn10 VM is technically not enough for legal compliance....

 

[mdd1963]

"the ideal is kinda like liveme, where I have several video recording and streaming at the same time and also a server or two to run chat room while displaying the result in those several virtual machine via browsers. liveme have hundreds of people who stream themselves daily which you can view either by a browser or your phone, and at the same time liveme is also recording there video for replay purposes. "

Do you have full Gigabit/sec ethernet service,...or better? What you are describing is likely bandwidth intensive...

Sounds like your best bet is an off-lease server, perhaps 4-5 years old, possibly dual socket 6-8 core Xeons, shoot for at least 32 GB of RAM, and preferably 64 GB...

If trying to assemble this new, you might up your budget to the afforementioned $2500-$3000...

 

[lv2lrn4lf]

MDD1963 THANKS FOR THE REPLY!

Running WIn10 virtualized technically runs into desktop infrastructure licensing (VDI,RDP) issues, as a mere OEM/retail license alone for each WIn10 VM is technically not enough for legal compliance....

What about Ubuntu? I also said Ubuntu.

if perhaps finding a 4 - 5 year old off-lease dual socket / 6 -8 core Xeon from Dell , HP, or Lenovo with 32 GB of RAM, a few drives, in the clearance section at Newegg or Amazon on sale!

off-lease server, perhaps 4-5 years old, possibly dual socket 6-8 core Xeons, shoot for at least 32 GB of RAM, and preferably 64 GB.

was you serous about this suggestions? And do you understand everything I have type cause I have no problem explaining some more. What are the newer version of these and these version are they still relative for when I can upgrade to newer system the newer system won't look completely different? And speak more on these system that you mention and others that might be good for my use case if you don't mind.

I was thinking of having a server machine to handle to load of webpages and data manage and storage, and have a strong computer connect to that to handle the multiple virtual machines, and in handling the virtual machines, it also handle all the work that each one would be doing which is describe below in simpler terms. Do you think that would work? What physical hardware server would I need, along with the physical hardware computer to handle the work of 6-12 anywhere at any moment even know we agree to start with 3-4(one acting as a server for help with the physical hardware server control). what the cheapest I can get this at with out giving up performance?

VIrtual Box does certainly work for tinkering with assorted OS's, but, unless you need functioning audio, HyperV would likely allow slightly better performance than Type2 virtualization solutions such as VB...; when installing the Hyper-V 'role', your existing Win10 Pro install is quickly/painlessly converted into a VM, although few suspect or understand that, as it seems almost as if HyperV is similar to VB in that case, but, HyperV is the standard full blown TYpe 1 Hypervisor bare metal install, with Win10 Pro VM now running the HyperV Manager.... ( Server 2016 under HyperV is remarkably snappy even with a GUI using just 4-8 GB of RAM allocated to the VM)

So HyperV is that a one thing or a new of many implantation? Like is HyperV soda and there's a HyerV sprite brand and other similar? or is it one core solid no other options name? I know I could look it up and I will but I'm still asking you... So I went and look it up cause i though it would be stupid to wait for you to answer plus it give me more question with some ideal of what is being spoken on... So hyperV seem to be a sprite and not a soda type name for it coming from Microsoft and when I saw that I felt ill.. but kept reading and read that it is also freeware but this info came from wiki and even know wiki is a good source it still not 100% reliable since anyone can pretty much change it unless they up that security some. So I duckduckgo again and came to Microsoft doc site where it look to show that this hperV thingy can be activated in window 10 so not looking farther I'm guessing it's like one of those things that always been there but if you didn't know anything about it, it might as well not exist like the browser inspector window.

So tell me more about HyperV even if you repeat yourself. And you saying this is what I will use so that why you kept speaking on window license. So what you saying? I can't run Ubuntu on it? And I do need window os to operate it... correct? anything I said incorrect?

USAFRet here what I simply want todo:

with one computer I want to have a live media from a camera or another video media coming from another source, like a wireless camera or phone being steam to the computer, computer records it and stream it out while having a server running that help with a simple chat room function so people watching the stream can communicate with each other.

That's it!!!! From one computer that all I want todo:

receive video media stream from camera or another video media stream source to computer

record the media stream and stream it out to a browser to view it

server help with deliver media stream to browser and help with chat room function as well

simple like liveme or some other program that allow you to view a live video feed at the same time send messages to others who are viewing the live feed.

that's it! So many other companies, apps, other programs are doing these simple functionality, it's everywhere! A simple live video feed being recorded that others can view from a browser via website and communicate with others who are also viewing the same live feed.

Now I'll like to duplicate this about 6-12 times and have it happening at ones or it can happen up to any giving time. which is where virtual machines comes in at. Using them to sort, organize, and control everything from.
And yes it is a Web server(to server webpage and video stream), database server(to save and server recorder video, also back up system and everything else), multiple browsers(to view the result and also make sure everything is okay and to see exactly what the viewers will see and not from the background point of view), streaming(to stream what is being recorded), recording(to play later or delete)

 

[USAFRet]

Here ya go:

1. Cameras and the "server"
https://www.amazon.com/ANNKE-Security-Channel-Weatherproof-Playback/dp/B00L3W2QJ2
8 cameras, DVR, web server for external access. Each camera individually accessible.
$230

2. Chat room.
wix.com (or any other free/cheap hosting provider), and build a site, for free, that can have one or more individual chatrooms. That is a standard widget there.
$0

 

[lv2lrn4lf]

64 GB of ram, and the os can be ubuntu so I should not have any problem with legal issues there. seem like HyperV on windows can run ubuntu too. So is there any legal issues to worry about still using a window consumer os for it's hpyerV access to run a couple of unbuntu virtual machine? 4-5 years old, possibly dual socket 6-8 core Xeons, shoot for at least 32 GB of RAM, and preferably 64 GB.

Okay so I see the pattern here that the big concern to you all who answers is ram(preferably 64GB), and the CPU(preferably dual socket 6-8 core xeons), cause with just these two you can speed of a machine performance and process speed. I tried looking up the 6-8core xeons but they can range from $300 to over a $1000! So I see why you say find a 6-8 year old one.

Now can anyone suggest a machine I can start out with which I might have to open it up to put the 6-8core process and additional ram? A computer/server that is good to both start out with and can do the job as long as i provide enough ram and a 6-8core processor.

USAFRet I see you! No not what I want... actually you already answer part of the question pointing out the need for alot of ram will be needed. But what is a good off the shelf physical system computer/server to house 32-64gb ram you speak of and 6-8core processor?

And I plan to write the software for chat, website, and server logic and no need to concern yourself with the camera. someone else providing that.

Thanks for all those who replied!

 

[USAFRet]

Still unsure of your use case.

OK, question:

All these camera outputs and browsers - Who will be accessing them, and how?
Is this for your house, an internet cafe, a business monitoring system, something else?

Multiple VM's may be the answer. Or maybe not at all.
You're too wrapped up in hardware, when we do not know what it is for.

Ignore the "VM", or browser specs, or all that other junk.
Give us a clear view of what you want to do, and we can probably guide you into some setup that might work.

 

[lv2lrn4lf]

What I want to do I can do with a simple laptop:

setup a web server to run and serve up a website

website let you watch one live videos stream.

One live video feed is coming in, onto the laptop screen, it is recorded and stream out at the same time.

someone go to website look at video live feed and can chat away with others, server handle this too.

I can do all of this with one simple latop!

Now I want to do it 6-12times with out having to get 6-12computers to do it and have to go between that many or configure all of them to be control by one mouse but still got to go between them to manga them... oh you know what would be a good ideal! If I can just create a bunch of virtual machine to run ubuntu and do the same operation in each one from one machine and also have a server machine connected to it to handle datastorage and web server. Just give me a good machine I can easily configure add the amount of ram and even more if I need too, easily to expand to add the 6-8core processor.

A new question would be what machine can I use to run multiple virtual machine at ones and can manage them all from one machine. I know I need alot of ram and a strong cpu with some core preferable between 6-8cores but I'm stick on what machine to start with that can handle mutiple vms running at the same time. I know there is no one system for all things but just something nice to start with and can do the task of running multiples vms. I'm also interested in server machine and would like to connect one to this powerful machine to handle task like data-storage and retrieval. I like recommendation for two machines of what I describe in this second question.

 

[hang-the-9]

What I want to do I can do with a simple laptop:

setup a web server to run and serve up a website

website let you watch one live videos stream.

One live video feed is coming in, onto the laptop screen, it is recorded and stream out at the same time.

someone go to website look at video live feed and can chat away with others, server handle this too.

I can do all of this with one simple latop!

Now I want to do it 6-12times with out having to get 6-12computers to do it and have to go between that many or configure all of them to be control by one mouse but still got to go between them to manga them... oh you know what would be a good ideal! If I can just create a bunch of virtual machine to run ubuntu and do the same operation in each one from one machine and also have a server machine connected to it to handle datastorage and web server. Just give me a good machine I can easily configure add the amount of ram and even more if I need too, easily to expand to add the 6-8core processor.

A new question would be what machine can I use to run multiple virtual machine at ones and can manage them all from one machine. I know I need alot of ram and a strong cpu with some core preferable between 6-8cores but I'm stick on what machine to start with that can handle mutiple vms running at the same time. I know there is no one system for all things but just something nice to start with and can do the task of running multiples vms. I'm also interested in server machine and would like to connect one to this powerful machine to handle task like data-storage and retrieval. I like recommendation for two machines of what I describe in this second question.

So all you want is a single system to run virtual servers on. That is not hard, any higher end computer can do this, are you looking to build it or just buy one? In fact, just do a web search for "virtual server hardware" and you are likely to find many things.

This also depends on how many people all these servers will be handling, and the requirements needed per connection to the server. There are a thousand different configurations that can be done, from a higher end desktop setup running an i7 CPU, to a dual and quad CPU server box. All depends on what you need to run. Which I don't really see in the post as to what the requirements are to handle what you want to do.

Issue would be if you are talking about recording off this system at the same time on all of those 6-12 server instances. That will probably require 6-12 separate systems unless they are merely getting a stream from another video source. You may be able to hook up more than one camera to this system, but as to how the virtualized servers work with the hardware.

 

[mdd1963]

You can run as many Ubuntu/CentOS/Debian versions/instances as you wish under HyperV (the free hypervisor from MS), depending on how much RAM is installed, and how much CPU power you have...; only the Win Server 201X versions must be licensed, but, when virtualized (which hypervisor does not matter), you can run a pair of WS201x instances per standard license, and as many Linux servers as your hardware and bandwidth can handle...

The HyperV Manager can show summaries of your assorted VMs' status, and you may easily view a GUI within multiple windows as long as needed, although few folks really stare at server GUI outputs, and, many run most server instances these days as GUI-less/headless for best performance...(running a desktop GUI consumes resources)

There are other popular hypervisors as well, ProxMox, ESXI/Vshpere, KVM, XCP-NG....(As you discussed potentially multiple GPUs and monitors, that passthrough capabilities of some of them might be more appropriate)

HyperV is quite easy, and can be used under WIn10 Pro...(it can also be used under WIn10 Server 2016/2019 as a host, but, at $699/$799 respectively once 6 month trial has ended) Attempting to pass full poweruser desktop functionality of graphics card is another story, however, and, I'm not sure HyperV works with audio passthru at all....

https://www.onmsft.com/how-to/how-t...ing-hyper-v-now-even-easier-with-quick-create

it's certainly not designed to have multiple keyboards/mice as though it's some computer but being used by 6 people to save on workstation costs....

 

[USAFRet]

I am absolutely not convinced that virtual machines that live on a big server are the way to go here.

But lacking a real requirements spec and use case...we're all just speculating.

 

[lv2lrn4lf]

yes, from my research an i7 with 4 core or more with hyper threading plus 36gb of ram can run to my ideal up to 4-6(boost to 6 cause of hyper threading and logic brick black magic) with good performance, so i should be looking to getting an i7 with 4 or more core for better performance with running more than 6 virtual machine at one time. also with different type of virtual software one can use which just to list some that I came across; virtual box, VMWare Player Workstation, Hyper-V, and if you know some more shoot them out. Now I like a system that system to come with hot swap drives and raid2-6 for data lose concern to my who system not just my database but my whole system itself to backup(is that possible). This is why I also ask for a server machine to connect to it too or is that crazy? I still like to get a server machine unless this system is a power computer and a server machine with hot swap and raid6 for data concern lose. I guess the hard drive should be a ssd 1Tb of space and with the ability expand for more space by adding up to 6 additional drive of each being any size of gb up to 1tb each, giving me 7tb of space... and compact that can fit in a closet.

I came across this: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07L1C718W/ref=psdc_13896597011_t3_B07F7HWDXZ and the varies of other product similar to it below. would this do for my use case or something similar? it only have 16ram though.

or this https://www.pugetsystems.com/featured/8-Processors-32-Cores-56 !
Just like to have a system that I can run 6-12 virtual machine.
.

 

[USAFRet]

Here's a question that hasn't been answered:
Video of what, precisely?