SATA RAID

[george]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

does having more than 1 SATA HDD (e.g 2 in raid mode) boost performance in
premiere much??

how does the HDD determine how fast premiere/video editing works??

Many Thanks

George S

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

These are excellent questions. I see that the machine spends much of its
time reading and writing when it is processing video. There must be some
speed advantage to fast storage.


"George" <froggyville@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ca7qbb$fm7$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> does having more than 1 SATA HDD (e.g 2 in raid mode) boost performance in
> premiere much??
>
> how does the HDD determine how fast premiere/video editing works??
>
> Many Thanks
>
> George S
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"George" <froggyville@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ca7qbb$fm7$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> does having more than 1 SATA HDD (e.g 2 in raid mode) boost performance in
> premiere much??
>
> how does the HDD determine how fast premiere/video editing works??

1. Premiere will need to access frames while displaying or rendering. The
faster it can get frames in or out the better.
2. Less problems playing back the video and audio streams if the drive is
fast.

That's about it.



> Many Thanks
>
> George S
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

nappy wrote:

> "George" <froggyville@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:ca7qbb$fm7$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> > does having more than 1 SATA HDD (e.g 2 in raid mode) boost performance in
> > premiere much??
> >
> > how does the HDD determine how fast premiere/video editing works??
>
> 1. Premiere will need to access frames while displaying or rendering. The
> faster it can get frames in or out the better.
> 2. Less problems playing back the video and audio streams if the drive is
> fast.
>
> That's about it.

But those are moot points since rendering is typically done at slower than
real-time rates, so the bottleneck is the CPU, not the I/O subsystem when you're
talking about rendering performance.

Even when capturing (DV), the required transfer rate is only 3.6 MB/second, so
again, the I/O subsystem isn't a bottleneck.

This is only an issue for those doing old-fashioned uncompressed analog
capturing. If you're working with digital video or at least video captured over
a Firewire port or even USB, there's no benefit from a striped array.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Keith Clark" <clarkphotography@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40CA1835.CD674703@hotmail.com...
>
>
> nappy wrote:
>
> > "George" <froggyville@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:ca7qbb$fm7$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> > > does having more than 1 SATA HDD (e.g 2 in raid mode) boost
performance in
> > > premiere much??
> > >
> > > how does the HDD determine how fast premiere/video editing works??
> >
> > 1. Premiere will need to access frames while displaying or rendering.
The
> > faster it can get frames in or out the better.
> > 2. Less problems playing back the video and audio streams if the drive
is
> > fast.
> >
> > That's about it.
>
> But those are moot points since rendering is typically done at slower than
> real-time rates, so the bottleneck is the CPU, not the I/O subsystem when
you're
> talking about rendering performance.
>
> Even when capturing (DV), the required transfer rate is only 3.6
MB/second, so
> again, the I/O subsystem isn't a bottleneck.
>
> This is only an issue for those doing old-fashioned uncompressed analog
> capturing. If you're working with digital video or at least video captured
over
> a Firewire port or even USB, there's no benefit from a striped array.
>

True all.. but that wasn't his question. He asked how HDD speed affects
Premiere.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

nappy wrote:

> "Keith Clark" <clarkphotography@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:40CA1835.CD674703@hotmail.com...
> >
> >
> > nappy wrote:
> >
> > > "George" <froggyville@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:ca7qbb$fm7$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> > > > does having more than 1 SATA HDD (e.g 2 in raid mode) boost
> performance in
> > > > premiere much??
> > > >
> > > > how does the HDD determine how fast premiere/video editing works??
> > >
> > > 1. Premiere will need to access frames while displaying or rendering.
> The
> > > faster it can get frames in or out the better.
> > > 2. Less problems playing back the video and audio streams if the drive
> is
> > > fast.
> > >
> > > That's about it.
> >
> > But those are moot points since rendering is typically done at slower than
> > real-time rates, so the bottleneck is the CPU, not the I/O subsystem when
> you're
> > talking about rendering performance.
> >
> > Even when capturing (DV), the required transfer rate is only 3.6
> MB/second, so
> > again, the I/O subsystem isn't a bottleneck.
> >
> > This is only an issue for those doing old-fashioned uncompressed analog
> > capturing. If you're working with digital video or at least video captured
> over
> > a Firewire port or even USB, there's no benefit from a striped array.
> >
>
> True all.. but that wasn't his question. He asked how HDD speed affects
> Premiere.

It doesn't. Only a defective hard drive or improperly configured interface would
affect Premiere's rendering speed, and that would be a negative impact. There's
no way a hard drive or RAID can speed up Premiere.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Keith Clark" <clarkphotography@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40CB4DD4.133DBEF2@hotmail.com...
> nappy wrote:
>
> > "Keith Clark" <clarkphotography@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:40CA1835.CD674703@hotmail.com...
> > >
> > >
> > > nappy wrote:
> > >
> > > > "George" <froggyville@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > > news:ca7qbb$fm7$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> > > > > does having more than 1 SATA HDD (e.g 2 in raid mode) boost
> > performance in
> > > > > premiere much??
> > > > >
> > > > > how does the HDD determine how fast premiere/video editing works??
> > > >
> > > > 1. Premiere will need to access frames while displaying or
rendering.
> > The
> > > > faster it can get frames in or out the better.
> > > > 2. Less problems playing back the video and audio streams if the
drive
> > is
> > > > fast.
> > > >
> > > > That's about it.
> > >
> > > But those are moot points since rendering is typically done at slower
than
> > > real-time rates, so the bottleneck is the CPU, not the I/O subsystem
when
> > you're
> > > talking about rendering performance.
> > >
> > > Even when capturing (DV), the required transfer rate is only 3.6
> > MB/second, so
> > > again, the I/O subsystem isn't a bottleneck.
> > >
> > > This is only an issue for those doing old-fashioned uncompressed
analog
> > > capturing. If you're working with digital video or at least video
captured
> > over
> > > a Firewire port or even USB, there's no benefit from a striped array.
> > >
> >
> > True all.. but that wasn't his question. He asked how HDD speed affects
> > Premiere.
>
> It doesn't. Only a defective hard drive or improperly configured interface
would
> affect Premiere's rendering speed, and that would be a negative impact.
There's
> no way a hard drive or RAID can speed up Premiere.
>

Again.. you're missing the point. I did not say it would speed up rendering.
I merely pointed out where hard drive speed affects Premiere. In fact, the
faster the drive the faster frames will get in and out of Premiere.. while
this may not be noticable compared to rendering times. It will always affect
Premiere. Or anyother app for that matter. That's why faster drives are
made. Hope that's clear





>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

I am running Premiere Pro and have a 2.6Ghz HT CPU, with full 800Mhz
fsb, 1gig of DDR400 Ram and two 120gig Sata drives.

The Sata drives are configured in a raid 0 array (Stripe) and my whole
system performance has increased. I have definately noticed an
increase in performance when it comes to video rendering in premiere.
I can't say exactly how much, but I definately noticed a difference.

Just personal experience.....

James

Keith Clark <clarkphotography@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<40CB4DD4.133DBEF2@hotmail.com>...
> nappy wrote:
>
> > "Keith Clark" <clarkphotography@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:40CA1835.CD674703@hotmail.com...
> > >
> > >
> > > nappy wrote:
> > >
> > > > "George" <froggyville@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > > news:ca7qbb$fm7$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> > > > > does having more than 1 SATA HDD (e.g 2 in raid mode) boost
> performance in
> > > > > premiere much??
> > > > >
> > > > > how does the HDD determine how fast premiere/video editing works??
> > > >
> > > > 1. Premiere will need to access frames while displaying or rendering.
> The
> > > > faster it can get frames in or out the better.
> > > > 2. Less problems playing back the video and audio streams if the drive
> is
> > > > fast.
> > > >
> > > > That's about it.
> > >
> > > But those are moot points since rendering is typically done at slower than
> > > real-time rates, so the bottleneck is the CPU, not the I/O subsystem when
> you're
> > > talking about rendering performance.
> > >
> > > Even when capturing (DV), the required transfer rate is only 3.6
> MB/second, so
> > > again, the I/O subsystem isn't a bottleneck.
> > >
> > > This is only an issue for those doing old-fashioned uncompressed analog
> > > capturing. If you're working with digital video or at least video captured
> over
> > > a Firewire port or even USB, there's no benefit from a striped array.
> > >
> >
> > True all.. but that wasn't his question. He asked how HDD speed affects
> > Premiere.
>
> It doesn't. Only a defective hard drive or improperly configured interface would
> affect Premiere's rendering speed, and that would be a negative impact. There's
> no way a hard drive or RAID can speed up Premiere.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

nappy wrote:

>
> Again.. you're missing the point. I did not say it would speed up rendering.
> I merely pointed out where hard drive speed affects Premiere. In fact, the
> faster the drive the faster frames will get in and out of Premiere.. while
> this may not be noticable compared to rendering times. It will always affect
> Premiere. Or anyother app for that matter. That's why faster drives are
> made. Hope that's clear
>
> >

It's flawed reasoning, and silly to boot. Are you in Marketing/Sales? ;->

#1 Drives today are faster than most video applications need. The *only* video
application I've ever used that directly benefits from hard drive speed is
Mpeg-VCR and Mpeg Wizard by Womble (www.womble.com). This is because no
rendering is involved, so the processing happens as fast as the drive(s) can
pump the file through.

If someone is doing a lot of work with Womble type products and very little
rendering, then couple of striped-arrays would make a *lot* of sense for that
workstation.


#2 If an application processes frames slower than real time (slower than 25 FPS
for PAL or 29.97 FPS for NTSC), then hard drive speed is irrelevant. Even at
real-time rendering speeds, hard drive performance isn't THAT big an issue.

Case in point : a typical 2 hour recording from BeyondTV in 7 mb/sec CBR mpeg-2
is 6.75 GB. Time to copy that file from one drive to another is about 5 minutes
on my system using standard IDE drives. Time to render it to Divx is about 2
hours. So the hard drive would have to be so slow that it couldn't copy the 6.75
GB file in less than two hours before it would slow down Premiere (actually, I
use VirtualDub for rendering Divx/Xvid). Making the hard drive *faster* has
*zero* effect, because the *rendering* still takes two hours.

Therefore, hard drive speed is *not* relevant for rendering. It's relevant for
file copying and for how fast an application might *load*, or the OS *boot*, but
those operations are a *tiny* percentage of the total time spent rendering.

I hope *that's* clear. ;->

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Keith Clark" <clarkphotography@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40CCB8EB.25C71579@hotmail.com...
> nappy wrote:
>
> >
> > Again.. you're missing the point. I did not say it would speed up
rendering.
> > I merely pointed out where hard drive speed affects Premiere. In fact,
the
> > faster the drive the faster frames will get in and out of Premiere..
while
> > this may not be noticable compared to rendering times. It will always
affect
> > Premiere. Or anyother app for that matter. That's why faster drives are
> > made. Hope that's clear
> >
> > >
>
> It's flawed reasoning, and silly to boot. Are you in Marketing/Sales? ;->
>
> #1 Drives today are faster than most video applications need. The *only*
video
> application I've ever used that directly benefits from hard drive speed is
> Mpeg-VCR and Mpeg Wizard by Womble (www.womble.com). This is because no
> rendering is involved, so the processing happens as fast as the drive(s)
can
> pump the file through.
>
> If someone is doing a lot of work with Womble type products and very
little
> rendering, then couple of striped-arrays would make a *lot* of sense for
that
> workstation.
>
>
> #2 If an application processes frames slower than real time (slower than
25 FPS
> for PAL or 29.97 FPS for NTSC), then hard drive speed is irrelevant. Even
at
> real-time rendering speeds, hard drive performance isn't THAT big an
issue.
>
> Case in point : a typical 2 hour recording from BeyondTV in 7 mb/sec CBR
mpeg-2
> is 6.75 GB. Time to copy that file from one drive to another is about 5
minutes
> on my system using standard IDE drives. Time to render it to Divx is about
2
> hours. So the hard drive would have to be so slow that it couldn't copy
the 6.75
> GB file in less than two hours before it would slow down Premiere
(actually, I
> use VirtualDub for rendering Divx/Xvid). Making the hard drive *faster*
has
> *zero* effect, because the *rendering* still takes two hours.
>
> Therefore, hard drive speed is *not* relevant for rendering. It's
relevant for
> file copying and for how fast an application might *load*, or the OS
*boot*, but
> those operations are a *tiny* percentage of the total time spent
rendering.
>
> I hope *that's* clear. ;->



Again.. you are still missing the point. What I said was entirely correct.
None of what you have posted above is applicable. And again.. I never
addressed rendering per se. not sure why you can't get that.

DIVX? MPEG? Never use either.. I often work with uncompressed frames that
are often 2048x1556. Drive speed is essential all the way around. And to be
clear , again, it is irrelevant how fast drives are now days. You can not
argue that any app, Premiere or whatever, will run the same with slow
drives. My response was accurate and appropriate.


>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Flacco54" <jamesgid@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:d23cc726.0406131609.5d26d32@posting.google.com...
> I am running Premiere Pro and have a 2.6Ghz HT CPU, with full 800Mhz
> fsb, 1gig of DDR400 Ram and two 120gig Sata drives.
>
> The Sata drives are configured in a raid 0 array (Stripe) and my whole
> system performance has increased. I have definately noticed an
> increase in performance when it comes to video rendering in premiere.
> I can't say exactly how much, but I definately noticed a difference.
>
> Just personal experience.....
>
> James


Makes PERFECT logical sense that you would.






>
> Keith Clark <clarkphotography@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:<40CB4DD4.133DBEF2@hotmail.com>...
> > nappy wrote:
> >
> > > "Keith Clark" <clarkphotography@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:40CA1835.CD674703@hotmail.com...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > nappy wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > "George" <froggyville@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > > > news:ca7qbb$fm7$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> > > > > > does having more than 1 SATA HDD (e.g 2 in raid mode) boost
> > performance in
> > > > > > premiere much??
> > > > > >
> > > > > > how does the HDD determine how fast premiere/video editing
works??
> > > > >
> > > > > 1. Premiere will need to access frames while displaying or
rendering.
> > The
> > > > > faster it can get frames in or out the better.
> > > > > 2. Less problems playing back the video and audio streams if the
drive
> > is
> > > > > fast.
> > > > >
> > > > > That's about it.
> > > >
> > > > But those are moot points since rendering is typically done at
slower than
> > > > real-time rates, so the bottleneck is the CPU, not the I/O subsystem
when
> > you're
> > > > talking about rendering performance.
> > > >
> > > > Even when capturing (DV), the required transfer rate is only 3.6
> > MB/second, so
> > > > again, the I/O subsystem isn't a bottleneck.
> > > >
> > > > This is only an issue for those doing old-fashioned uncompressed
analog
> > > > capturing. If you're working with digital video or at least video
captured
> > over
> > > > a Firewire port or even USB, there's no benefit from a striped
array.
> > > >
> > >
> > > True all.. but that wasn't his question. He asked how HDD speed
affects
> > > Premiere.
> >
> > It doesn't. Only a defective hard drive or improperly configured
interface would
> > affect Premiere's rendering speed, and that would be a negative impact.
There's
> > no way a hard drive or RAID can speed up Premiere.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

nappy wrote:

> "Flacco54" <jamesgid@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
> news:d23cc726.0406131609.5d26d32@posting.google.com...
> > I am running Premiere Pro and have a 2.6Ghz HT CPU, with full 800Mhz
> > fsb, 1gig of DDR400 Ram and two 120gig Sata drives.
> >
> > The Sata drives are configured in a raid 0 array (Stripe) and my whole
> > system performance has increased. I have definately noticed an
> > increase in performance when it comes to video rendering in premiere.
> > I can't say exactly how much, but I definately noticed a difference.
> >
> > Just personal experience.....
> >
> > James
>
> Makes PERFECT logical sense that you would.
>
>

Actually, it doesn't.

He never presented a clear test case.

He said he noticed a difference, but compared to what?

The only valid comparison would be the same hard drives on the same cables in
the same system but in a non striped configuration vs a striped configuration.

If that is indeed the case, then there's nothing to dispute, but his case wasn't
presented that way.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

yak. yak.

Faster drives mean faster data access means faster....

that's how it works.


"Keith Clark" <clarkphotography@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40CF316F.57218B43@hotmail.com...
>
>
> nappy wrote:
>
> > "Flacco54" <jamesgid@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
> > news:d23cc726.0406131609.5d26d32@posting.google.com...
> > > I am running Premiere Pro and have a 2.6Ghz HT CPU, with full 800Mhz
> > > fsb, 1gig of DDR400 Ram and two 120gig Sata drives.
> > >
> > > The Sata drives are configured in a raid 0 array (Stripe) and my whole
> > > system performance has increased. I have definately noticed an
> > > increase in performance when it comes to video rendering in premiere.
> > > I can't say exactly how much, but I definately noticed a difference.
> > >
> > > Just personal experience.....
> > >
> > > James
> >
> > Makes PERFECT logical sense that you would.
> >
> >
>
> Actually, it doesn't.
>
> He never presented a clear test case.
>
> He said he noticed a difference, but compared to what?
>
> The only valid comparison would be the same hard drives on the same cables
in
> the same system but in a non striped configuration vs a striped
configuration.
>
> If that is indeed the case, then there's nothing to dispute, but his case
wasn't
> presented that way.
>
>
>