Saudi Arabia: GPU for new build, crazy prices

[Forde3654Eire]

Cheapest prices I could find so far

1) Pentium G620: $60
2) i3 2100: $116
3) i5 2300: $165

4) Athlon II X2 (all Athlons here are native dual core X2): $72
5) Phenom II X2 (plan to unlock to X4 and overclock): $107

I've decided to narrow it down to i3 2100 and Phenom II X2 unlock and overclock. Which would you guys pick?

oh man i feel your pain , i live in Gizan or Jizan whatever you want to call it and the computer stores here don't even have a single lga 1155 board , can you even imagine it ! i currently have an amd fx 8120 @ 4ghz ( a *** cpu , lags and throttles even with the latest bios update) , a ga990fxaud3 , 6950 , 850 w psu and 12 gb of corsair vengence memory . since i consider this setup as a huge fail , i waited for ivy bridge to be released , when it was released which is i guess today ,it is no where to be found on this country .Egypt on the other hand is a hole different story , when the nvidia gtx 680 was released in the US it was in stock in Egypt as well . SAME FREAKING DAY ! . Even the prices were like 200 riyals difference , come on .
So you might say " ok , buy your hardware from Egypt " , but did you consider warranty , i can't ship a hardware back and forth when/if the item gets defected.

Hey man, I used to live up north in Tabuk. Same story as Jizan. Outdated and overpriced parts. I only moved to Jeddah recently. Prices here for video cards are just astronomical.

 

[dalauder]

You stated three things earlier that need clearing up:

1) You want to "future-proof" as much as possible.
Since "future-proofing" doesn't actually work, I will take that to mean, "future upgradability". The Pentium G620 is perfectly okay. However, you will never feel like it's "good". An i3-2100 will probably do everything you want your computer to do for the next two years. Then you can drop in an Ivy Bridge i5 in 2014 and it'll be good for another couple years. Keep in mind than Z77 motherboards launched TODAY, so Z68 motherboard prices will be falling.

If you want "future-proof", consider that AM3 processors are largely on a dead-end platform. So if you intend to upgrade, you're out of luck...that is, unless Piledriver surprises us. But off of AMD's quoted 20% to 30% improvement over Bulldozer, I can't see it keeping pace with Sandy Bridge, let alone Ivy Bridge.

2) You want a CPU to match the GPU.
Some games (ex: Crysis 2) are VERY CPU heavy. An i3-2100 could run with a GTX 580 and you'd still encounter GPU bottlenecks. Some games are CPU heavy (ex: Skyrim) and you could have the i5-2400 and a 5770 and you'd encounter a bunch of CPU bottlenecks. Some games, like BF3, are hard on both. You're going to see bottlenecks that vary depending on the game you're playing.

A Phenom II x4 will not see many bottlenecks, especially if overclocked. A Phenom II x2 will. An i3-2100 lands somewhere between those two on minimum frame rates (more important) and bests them both on average frame rates (less important). Overclocking the Phenom II's alleviates this, but will not escape the truth that plenty of games want more than what a Phenom II x2 can offer. That said, I have an avid gamer friend that runs a Phenom II x2 555BE at stock speed (due to old AM2 motherboard w/o multiplier overclocking) with a GTX 470 OC that is happy with its performance. I, however, used to gaming on my i7, am frustrated watching his machine stutter occasionally in games like Just Cause 2 and The Witcher 2.

3) Unlocking Phenom II's
I've attempted to unlock three Phenom II x2's to x4's. One unlocked and overclocked +400MHz (to 3.6GHz). The other two do not unlock with the AM3 board I tried it on. The two Phenom II x2's do overclock beautifully though. I've one at 4.0GHz for over a year at roughly stock voltage producing very little heat. So the bottom line: don't count on a Phenom II x2 unlocking.

 

[dalauder]

I think the moving will cost more than the hardware. And the way jobs are where I live, I don't think anyone wants to give up a job right now.

Anyhow, I agree with the i3-2100.

But wait until Z77's become available and drop Z68 prices to make a purchase. In fact, wait until the end of April when i3-3100's or something similar are available for the exact same price.

 

[jsc]

You can just try to buy it from other websites that can ship to saudi arabia, I am sure you will find quite few and sometimes even cheaper.

The problem is not the shipping.

The problem is that Saudi customs is a crapshoot. If something comes in that a customs official objects to for any reason, it is confiscated. If something comes in that a customs official decides he wants, well, you won't see it. The problem is bad enough that many companies that do ship internationally will not insure shipments to Saudi Arabia.

The only truly reliable way of an individual to ship anything into the Kingdom is to use FedEx or DHL. And that will cost more than just buying the card locally.

 

[Forde3654Eire]

The problem is not the shipping.

The problem is that Saudi customs is a crapshoot. If something comes in that a customs official objects to for any reason, it is confiscated. If something comes in that a customs official decides he wants, well, you won't see it. The problem is bad enough that many companies that do ship internationally will not insure shipments to Saudi Arabia.

The only truly reliable way of an individual to ship anything into the Kingdom is to use FedEx or DHL. And that will cost more than just buying the card locally.

Correct there about the Saudi customs. It is indeed a real crapshoot as you say.

Alright guys, I'm convinced the i3 2100 is the way to go. According to the graph greghome posted, the i3 2100 can deliver higher minimum FPS than any Phenom II X4 on that graph. I don't want to risk getting a Phenom II X2 and then finding out it won't unlock. If daluader is correct about the Z68, prices should start dropping after the release of the Z77.

H61 is just too "barebones". Only 2 RAM slots and barely enough USB connections. It doesn't even support Intel HD graphics, and probably not even IvyBridge. I'll be stuck if my video card ever craps out on me for some reason. I wouldn't be able to get the full potential of an unlocked (much less expensive later on) IvyBridge say 6 - 7 years down the road. I'd also like to have the added benefit of USB 3.0 for the future as well as SSD caching when I do opt for a reasonably priced SSD later on.

If it comes to the worst, I'll opt for H67. The only thing I'll miss out on would be the unlocked multiplier.

Still another 3 - 4 weeks till building when I finally finish exams, so I'm still open to any suggestions.

 

[dalauder]

The i3-2100 matches or beats a Phenom II x4 at stock speeds in most tests. A nice thing about a Z68 board, is if you upgrade to the unlocked Ivy Bridge i5 (it's "i5-2500K") in two or three years, you'll be able to overclock it and that CPU will carry you through 2016.

 

[dalauder]

I dont see the need to grab the 2500K if you're running a HD6770, honestly, I've OC'ed my i5 to 4ghz like most people with a P or Z board and I dont really see the difference in 90% of the software I run, a part from the increased temperature.

Oh--I definitelly don't mean buy the i5-2500K.

What I meant was that in two years when Haswell is out, he can upgrade his i3-2100 to an Ivy Bridge i5-3570K (Ivy Bridge version of Sandy Bridge's i5-2500K). Then, if he has a Z68 motherboard, he can easily overclock that and it'll still be a solid processor come 2016. I'm also assuming that he upgrades from the 5770 to a GTX 760Ti or something like that.

 

[Forde3654Eire]

Oh--I definitelly don't mean buy the i5-2500K.

What I meant was that in two years when Haswell is out, he can upgrade his i3-2100 to an Ivy Bridge i5-3570K (Ivy Bridge version of Sandy Bridge's i5-2500K). Then, if he has a Z68 motherboard, he can easily overclock that and it'll still be a solid processor come 2016. I'm also assuming that he upgrades from the 5770 to a GTX 760Ti or something like that.

Yes, that's how I plan to do it. i3 2100 and 5770 for now. Some years down the road, this (and any current setup) will inevitably be considered out-dated. To save myself from buying a new computer, I upgrade to a 3570K (if needed) and a GTX 560 Ti or similar.

 

[Forde3654Eire]

Seems like this build is ready to get started Cases anybody?

I really like the Antec 300, but its $90 here. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129042

On the other hand, they've got these Gigabyte cases for $40
http://www.gigabyte.us/products/product-page.aspx?pid=3558#kf

And this for $30
http://www.gigabyte.us/products/product-page.aspx?pid=3552#sp

I don't know what to look for when choosing cases, but I definitely want something that'll allow tucking cables away to maintain good airflow. I'm not so sure about either Gigabyte cases. I know the Antec 300 has a very good reputation... but its overpriced here.

Any particular cases you would recommend? There are quite a good variety of cases here, surprisingly enough. Just name a few and I'll look for them.

 

[Forde3654Eire]

When looking for cases, just look for ones with even holes to strap 1 or 2 powerful exhaust fans.

For USD 30-40, you should get a Cooler Master Elite 430, not sure if they have it there though

That's grand! I believe I've seen that somewhere around. Side panel window is a big plus for me. It just doesn't feel right having the components hidden from sight. I love looking at my components. My current PC has always had the side panel off due to overheating problems.

I can see there are latches as well on the drive bays, no need for screws. Nothing much can be done about cable mess, but an empty drive bay should do the job.

 

[dalauder]

If you were going higher-end, I'd recommend one that comes with good intake and exhaust fans. But since you'll be putting fans in yourself, all that really matters is that there are places where it's possible to mount fans. Check your temps when you first build it and when you overclock your video card. You might not need any fans.

Of the two cases you linked, I like the Setto II 142 better. Both should have just a little bit of room to hide some cables behind the back panel (and behind drive bays). I like how the Setto II 142 has tool-less drive mounting.

Both are a bit narrow, so you'll want to measure how much space you have for mounting a CPU cooler before you buy one (in the event that you buy a Z68 motherboard and an overclockable CPU down the line). The i3-2100 will do fine with the stock cooler.

I've actually used that side panel vent configuration and you can mount a smaller fan to the lower opening to exhaust your GPU heat (I did that with SLI'd 8800GT's at work). You can keep your computer cool enough with that case, but it's not NEARLY as good as the Antec 300. That said, you'll probably get the same gaming performance with both cases.

These cases have top mounting PSUs. I prefer bottom mounting. In the U.S., as far as cheap cases, I like the Thermaltake V3 or V4. I don't know if those are available to you.

 

[Forde3654Eire]

I've finally found a local site which sells CPU components. I've looked through but can't seem to find anything worthwhile over my current system configuration. Could you check it out? I might have overlooked some parts without my knowing.

I've converted the page to English and US dollars.

http://www.gltsa.com/shop/index.php?route=product/category&path=25

I did manage to find this Coolmax 550W PSU. This is the only one around so far, since all Gigabyte 550W are out of stock, all that's left are the 750W ones.

http://www.gltsa.com/shop/index.php?route=product/product&path=25_36&product_id=375

 

[Forde3654Eire]

Lol I'm an Apprentice now... still a long way to Addict!

Anyway, I'm not too enthusiastic about the Setto II, but I trust dalauder's judgement, and the price is just unbeatable. I'll check out the Cooler Master 430 greghome posted, I've really got my eye set on it... hopefully its around and at a reasonable price.

I'm fixed on the selected build configuration and ready to start buying... except for the bloody power supply. I'm skeptical of the Coolmax 550W, 800+W from all the premium brands is expensive and overkill. I think I may have to settle for the 720W Gigabyte... they do have 450W version but I believe that's not enough.

I'll keep you both updated if I find matching power supplies for my build.

 

[Forde3654Eire]

if you're planning on running a HD5770 only, just use the PSU included with the CM E430

Alright, but would that included PSU be able to run an i5 3500K and gtx 560 Ti later on? If not, I'll just bite the bullet and grab the 720W Gigabyte... unless the 550W becomes available again.

 

[dalauder]

The Coolermaster and Coolmax PSUs are terrible. I believe greghome is only suggesting that you sit with the 5770/6770 and the CM E430 PSU because you're REALLY limited on your budget and those cards don't ask for much power.

The Setto II is not great. It's marginally adequate. But you didn't give me a lot of options and I didn't see the Cooler Master Elite 430. That's a nicer case.

If you upgrade to a better CPU or GPU, you absolutely do not want to use the PSU that comes with that case. But I think you can wait for the 550W Gigabyte to come back in stock and use the Cooler Master PSU for now.

 

[dalauder]

If the OP is not upgrading soon, I think he can wait

I agree he can wait. I just want to be VERY clear that the PSU that comes with the case is TERRIBLE, although probably marginally adequate for his initial setup. I only recommend it due to his lack of any viable alternatives (I don't consider the Gigabyte 750W a viable alternative).

 

[Forde3654Eire]

I'll wait till the 550W PSU becomes available again. Still some time left for building, want to get the A level exams out the way first.

 

[Forde3654Eire]

Just out of curiosity, do either of you have any insight on the yet to be released Trinity APUs? I've spoken to a few guys here, turns out the suppliers have finally decided to introduce the APU to the market...

I'm sticking by my motto here: If I can go cheaper without hindering graphics performance too much, I will. Which APU do you reckon will have similar gaming performance to the 5770?

 

[dalauder]

Just out of curiosity, do either of you have any insight on the yet to be released Trinity APUs? I've spoken to a few guys here, turns out the suppliers have finally decided to introduce the APU to the market...

I'm sticking by my motto here: If I can go cheaper without hindering graphics performance too much, I will. Which APU do you reckon will have similar gaming performance to the 5770?

I can't say for sure because I don't think Trinity benchmarks exist yet. But I've heard Trinity performance will be about 50% better than Llano. That means that none of the APUs will be as fast as the 5770--at best maybe 75% or so as fast. And in memory intensive games, the DDR3 system memory is MUCH slower than the GDDR5 you get with modern graphics cards.

Trinity is going to make more of a splash on your parent's machine--where they can use it for everything AND play all games (on low for new ones) if they want to. Trinity isn't going to give a high-end gaming experience, but it will allow all games to be played without a discrete card.

 

[dalauder]

OP, I'm closing this tab in my browser. PM me if you come back.

 

[Forde3654Eire]

Alright, this is the only 500W power supply, I've managed to find online... just got to look for it around here. It's for $75.

http://www.sa-price.com/index.php?item=794

All the other stuff is here, in case you're interested:

http://www.sa-price.com/index.php?cat=63

 

[Forde3654Eire]

Hi again guys. I'm going to start building in about 2 weeks. I've managed to find the Antec 300 for as low as $65 here. Seems to be a good bargain and I am prepared to pay the price if the case deserves it.

However, at $70, the Aerocool RS-4 is also on offer... I'm not sure about this case, it seems to offer more flexibility, but I'm not sure how it stands against the Antec 300 in terms of the build quality, heat management and noise output... opinions please on which the better buy is?

I did mention earlier the Gigabyte Setto II at $40. Is it worth paying the extra money for either the Antec 300 or Aerocool RS-4? If its not worth it, I'll just stick with the Setto II.

http://www.gltsa.com/shop/index.php?route=product/product&path=25_43&product_id=842

http://arabic.english.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=3558#kf

Note: The only 500W power supply I've managed to find to date is the Corsair CX500. 80+ certified and +12V railing with 34A.

 

[Forde3654Eire]

Corsair CX500 is for $75.

Updates on my previous post:

1) Antec I was looking at is not the 300. Its called the VSK-1000. Not so sure about it anymore... top-mount PSU puts me off... it has some cable-management though. $65
http://www.antec.com/product.php?id=704408&fid=2

2) Found a Thermaltake V3 Black Edition. Looks really nice. Bottom mount PSU, No cable management. $65
http://www.thermaltakeusa.com/Product.aspx?S=1308&ID=1913#Tab1

3) Cooler Master Elite 430 costs a whopping $130!!! Definitely a no no!!!

 

[Forde3654Eire]

Personally I'd take the Thermaltake V3, the bottom mounted PSU would be easier to manage (cables) and it kinda reminds me of my old CM E430.

and the Corsair PSU for that price is not bad.

That's a very good point you made there, the cable management of the power supply! I have been debating with myself for the past hour which would be the best pick. Don't know why I never thought of it! With the non-modular CX500, its a great idea to rule out any top-mounted PSU cases. Thanks for solving my problem!

Its down to the Thermaltake V3 Black Edition and the Aerocool RS-4. I'm waiting for daluader to give his opinion on which of these 2 would be the better option.

The Aerocool RS-4 includes 2 140mm, cable management behind the motherboard, and removable HDD cage... but for all I know this cheap Taiwanese alternative could fall apart in less than a year.

 

[dalauder]

The Aerocool RS-4 looks like a great option to me: http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Aerocool-RS-4-Case-Review/1238/7
Btw, it also has a bottom mounted PSU and is wide enough (200mm) to fit 120mm CPU fans (160mm coolers like Hyper 212+).

I mentioned earlier that my friend has a Thermaltake V4. While it's decent for a cheap case, the fan doesn't actually blow air (spins, but I put my hand up to it and couldn't feel it on either side), and the tolerances of construction are terrible (requires A LOT of physical force to remove side panels, etc.). I assume the V3 is similar.

PSU: I agree with the CX500. Looking at the prices and the limited selection, that's a decent choice.

As far as the cable management, I've found that you can stuff extra wires to the backside of the 5.25" bays in most cheap cases. So It's cables aren't too big of a problem if you bother to plan out what you're doing. I installed a CX430 top-mounted in a terrible case yesterday and don't have any major issues with cable management. If you go bottom-mounted, you'll be doing great with the RS-4 or V3.