SB X-Fi Fatal1ty sound card vs Asus Z97M-Plus on board Crystal Sound 2 vs new card?

[Darkmatterx]

Title pretty much says it all. SB X-Fi Fatal1ty sound card vs Asus Z97M-Plus on board Crystal Sound 2?

I'm currently using the SB card because of the front panel it comes with and I have a pair of Sennheiser HD 558 Open Back headphones. These come with the large plug and an adapter so you can use the smaller more common jack that is used by MP3 players and phones. I also have a Logitech Z5300 (yes, that old) 5.1 sound system that I just took in to a shop to get 1 input port re-soldered and he told me the sound was still good for a set of PC speakers.

I'm asking all this and saying all this because I thought I would get better sound through the big jack port in the front panel of the X-Fi but the sound guy who fixed my Logitech 5.1 said that for the amount of watts I would need, the small connector is just fine.

So, if I don't need the front panel, then the on board sound becomes an option but I don't know the difference in quality of a newer on board sound device vs and older discreet sound card. There's also the less desirable (to my bank statement) of getting some current sound card but I wouldn't know what to get.

 

[Sam Hain]

Discreet sound cards do offer better sound quality (i.e. depth, soundstage, clarity, etc.) than onboard, especially those in recent years such as the SB Z/Zxr, Asus STX II, SBX AE-5 as examples even though onboard has come a long way.

Having said that, there are factors that can skew the quality of both discreet and onboard:

1. Quality of speakers being used
2. Quality of (recorded) source material being played back; i.e. digital music files
3. Listening environment
4. Sound-software setting variables

If you are mostly gaming and budget is of concern, save your money and stick with your onboard sound. It will do fine, especially with the speakers you have AND if you cannot tell a difference in sound quality between the SB card and onboard then you definitely have your answer.

 

[need4speeds]

The outputs on the rear of the card are separate from the front panel. So the front one is 2 channel stereo only while the 3 at the back are for center\sub Front L+R and Rear L+R. In windows you will want to configure it as 5.1 and uncheck the boxes for full sound speakers to the bass goes to the sub. (The front one will be stereo even if the rear ones are set to 5.1, they each have their own DAC's and amp) Also the impedance is different on the front it's made to be a headphone jack while the rear ones are matched for a line out.

You can run 2 sound cards and just switch back and forth in windows speaker panel. You could then try the onboard sound and the X-Fi and compare them.

 

[faalin]

I know the SB Z and Zx have the same base card the Zx just offers the external volume control that has headphones and mics plugin's. The ZxR comes with an extra card and is better for audio recording.

I run a Zx in my lan party rig and a ZxR on my home computer. The Zx is normally paired with a set of Shure 750DJ headphones and i use these at home with the ZxR, I also run a pair of Yamaha HS8 monitors for the ZxR at home.

But like Sam said, if you cant tell the difference between the on board and X-Fi Fatal1ty then two things, ether on board sound has come as far to meet the X-Fi Fatal1ty in quality, or the speakers arent up to the task of producing better sound in which a better sound card wont help anthing.

 

[Deleted member 217926]

Also that's an old card that predates true audiophile sound cards. There's no headphone amp and I don't see what DAC is used listed anywhere. The X-Fi 24-bit Crystalizer is just software processing. Fine for games but not really what you want for accurate music listening.

I use an Asus STX but I'm using it with several pair of hard to drive headphones as well. The 558s are pretty good entry level cans but I'm not sure how much they'd benefit from amping.

 

[Darkmatterx]

Sorry I should have said what speakers I had. Their old Logitech Z5300 5.1 sound system. I've had them for ages and just had 1 connection on the sub fixed by an audio guy and he listened to 2 satellite speakers to see what he thought of the sound (coming from his computer, not mine) and he said they sounded good. Someone said something about the front headphone jack would only output stereo. I'm not sure if they are talking the one on the top of my case or the one in the front panel from the X-Fi. There's also an outlet on the main controller for the 5.1 speakers. I don't know if that outputs more then stereo or not.

I haven't tried using the on board sound because I thought I needed that big port to get the best sound from my headphones but since I've been told I don't, I will try out the on board sound for the first time. Honestly though, I doubt I will be able to quantify any difference as its not my area of expertise. I was hoping that there was 1 definitive answer when comparing these 2 sound solutions.

I should also say I use the sound for Games, Movies/TV, and Anime. As far as my ears go, I can tell a difference between a normal older audio encode vs the newer, higher quality FLAC.

 

[Deleted member 217926]

Your best bet is to try both and see which one you like better. Newer motherboards can have pretty good audio. I've been using a soundcard for years but I need the amp/DAC since I'm running HD 598s, HD 600s and HD 650s off mine.

I'm still using Z 2300s which are the 2.1 version of what you have.

 

[Darkmatterx]

Any way to find out if the headphone jack at the bottom of the main sound control unit outputs only stereo or if it either does, or mimics surround sound?

Thanks!

 

[Deleted member 217926]

Should just be stereo unless you select a surround mode from the card.

 

[Darkmatterx]

Well I looked it up and that "Crystal Sound 2" or whatever they're calling the on board sound is just a Realtek. Unless Realtek has come a long way in the past 5 years I'd be skeptical about it sounding better then a dedicated sound card, although I'm not sure if I could tell the difference for sure. I wish there was a program that could analyze the audio coming through your computer and rating it vs other sound devices for quality.

 

[Deleted member 217926]

Probably the sound card is better if that's just Realtek. Now are your speakers and headphones good enough to tell a difference? Maybe.

Audio is very subjective. What sounds great to me might be terrible to you and vise versa. Go with the sound card. As long as you don't have driver issues and it doesn't start crashing your computer it's most likely better. Another mod has a high end Creative card and it crashes his system regularly. But that doesn't mean you'll have problems.

 

[Darkmatterx]

I get "Kernal Power" BSOD from time to time when my Win 10 goes to spin up the drive of my 8TB WD MyBook, but so far it has been a week and no one from WD has replied to my forum post. I think I'll send them an email since the forum isn't getting me anywhere. I'm probably going to mark your last post as the final answer since your replying to the new information about it being Realtek. I'll wait and see what if any reply you have for me regarding this post.

I may look at a new discreet card in the future. According to a guy who owns a music store and does repairs and sells both new and old stuff, my Z-5300 still sound very good. He said he'd enjoy listening to music on them. The actual black rubber speaker has always been covered by the silver cloth mesh and there are no cracks, tears, or mold anywhere on any of the speakers. My Sennheiser HD 558 Open Back headphones are more entry level, I know, but their at least entry level for a good company. It is to bad that the front earphone jack in the case and the one on the Z-5300 are probably both stereo only. Would I be able to get better sound if I used the main "out" jack with the headphones, even though that'd be a pain to do. I also can't use them for a long time cause I can't stand how hot my ears get after a while. I was hoping "open back" would prevent that issue.

BTW, what about this port that is the X-Fi's front panel? it takes the big plug.

Jack on the headphones is circled in yellow in the top right. The port it goes into is circled in light blue at the bottom left.

Lastly, I can't get Windows 10 Sound settings to stick to the spatial sound settings I pick. I've tried both Windows Sonic and Dolby Atmos but it always reverts to none after I close it, even if I apply the change before closing the window.

https://ibb.co/cLKiVH

 

[Deleted member 217926]

Yeah, I have Z 2300s. Same exact speakers and subwoofer just the 2.1 channel version. They do sound really good. The HD 558s are also pretty good. They're as good as my 598s just with a warmer, bassier sound signature. I believe they use the same driver just tuned differently. The 598s were my first 'good' pair and my gateway to good headphones. Now they're the lowest end out of the 5 pair I've got. :lol:

The port you circled is this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S/PDIF

As far as crashes try it without the card or check the event ID to see if the card is causing them. As I said above another mod has a ZxR and it crashes his Ryzen system enough that he's going to replace it at some point. I haven't had a Creative card in 7 or 8 years and I swore I'd never buy another one. I hate their drivers.

You're welcome ( anyone ) to post in the home audio thread in my sig. I was hoping to just get an audio discussion going but it's been slow.

 

[Darkmatterx]

If I recall the file most often seen in the log file is mmc.exe.

So from what I've read that port should be capable of outputting surround sound to my headphones. I'm not sure if my headphones can even handle surround though. Also, do you know why the 2 windows sound "spacial" options always revert to "None" after applying and closing the window?

Thanks

 

[Deleted member 217926]

No you can't plug headphones into that port. And any surround is going to be virtual and software based so any headphones can do it.

Mmc.exe isn't related to the soundcard and shouldn't be causing crashes. It may show in the error log but not as causing the crash. At least I don't think it does.

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/830459/microsoft-management-console-mmc-exe-experiences-memory-leaks-when-you

 

[Darkmatterx]

Um, yea I plug my 558's into it all the time. Look at the pic I provided, the jack circled in yellow was made for that size of a port. I know it works cause I've listened to lots of stuff using it. The little guy behind it fits over the big guy so you can also plug into regular jacks like the ones MP3 players have.

 

[Deleted member 217926]

I'm an idiot. That's the headphone port not the S/PDIF out. It has the little headphone symbol right under it. :lol:

The full sized 6.3mm connector is for most home equipment and the 3.5mm connector is for portable. Usually.

 

[Darkmatterx]

Well it's good to know I didn't hallucinate all those shows and movies I watched. With sound. lol

You have any idea why the 2 Windows headphone spacial options revert to none on me?

 

[Deleted member 217926]

That sounds like a driver issue.

 

[Darkmatterx]

Possibly. In the Device Manager section under "Sound, video and game controllers" it lists the X-Fi's driver as being released in Dec 2015, and I have the most up to date driver I know of. What is somewhat odd to me is that higher up in the Device Manager where it says, "Audio inputs and outputs" it says the driver in use is from July 2017.

If this is a driver issue it won't get fixed for an old card like mine. They gotta get you to buy their latest and greatest. I actually would miss the front panel and if there was a good (but not $200 top of the line) sound card that also had a similar front panel that would take the larger jack of my headphones AND output surround, either software or hardware, I'd really consider getting it.

From what I've read, SB and Asus (gawd 3/4 of my computer is Asus...) are the 2 big names but there might be others too. I don't know of one that comes with a front panel that has what I want.

Thanks

 

[need4speeds]

Go to "Creative audio control panel" and go to the tab for "Headphone Detection" uncheck the 2 boxes for "when headphone jack is connected" .
Now the speakers should work even if the headphones are plugged in.

Yes the drivers and software is really dated. The settings you need are scattered all over the place between window's own Sound settings.
And Creative's various software places. Some of the software dates back to the SB Live! 5.1 from Windows 98. Everything is there but you have to look for it a bit.

I found searching the X-Fi's help that in the top of most of the card's software panels helps. And of course googling stuff.

 

[Darkmatterx]

Actually I may need to replace it. I occasionally will get a sudden loud garbled static like noise out of my speakers for a split second. It happens randomly. I've tried uninstalling the drivers and all software for the X-Fi and reinstalling it all but it didn't help. Unless someone knows a fix for this, my next question would be what sound card should I go for? I'd like to be able to mimic surround sound with my Sennheiser HD 558 Open Back headphones which is something (if I'm understanding correctly) the large port in the front panel of the X-Fi can do, but that the small "standard" jacks/ports can't. My Sennheiser HD 558 came with the large jack with an adapter to fit into small ports although the jack with the adapter is awkwardly large and long and "solid" (doesn't bend) making it a bit of a pain.

If I'm understanding that correctly I would want another card with a convenient front end panel that I could use the large jack on the Sennheiser HD 558. If no card makes that, or it would be too expensive I'd just want to know the best mid range card I could get for a decent price.

I also don't even know if the Sennheiser HD 558 headphones can even simulate surround with either the large jack or the adapter to fit into the smaller "standard" ports like for mp3 players.

Thanks

 

[Deleted member 217926]

Simulating surround is a function of the sound card's software not the headphones. They don't matter.

You're not going to get a dedicated front interface for cheap. And you're better off plugging directly into the card than using the headphone and mic ports integrated in a case. The quality of the ports on a case can be bad enough to affect sound quality.

Headphone amp, good DAC and plenty of virtual surround for gaming. Doesn't look like the headphone port is 6.3mm but your HD 558s came with an adapter. Using adapters is quite common and you won't see any sound quality loss. Not even with audiophile equipment.

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/LmkwrH/asus-sound-card-strixsoar

To me that's the best mid range card. It may be more expensive than what you'd call mid range but high end is ~$200+ and cheap but better than integrated is ~$50+. There are probably Creative cards that fit the bill but I hate their drivers and as I mentioned above I know people who have crashes due to even high end Creative cards.

 

[Darkmatterx]

Do they make male to (split into 2) female cords for a sound cards main port or will I have to make my own? I want my speakers connected to the sound card, plus a cord that comes to the front of the case on the top that I can hook my headphones into. Going around behind my desk and swapping the speaker wires for the headphones, and then back again would be a huge pain.'

Thanks,

 

[Deleted member 217926]

Headphones and speakers plug into different ports. The only time I change anything on mine is when swapping the headphones that are plugged into the card. I swap between HD 600s and HD 650s.

You swap between the 2 with software.