Question Seeking advice on selecting AMD CPU

[satimis_06]

Hi all,

What will be the difference in performance for my use on following AMD CPUs;
1)
AMD Ryzen 9 7900X Processor 12C 24T 76M Cache, up to 5.6GHz, Socket AM5

and

2)
AMD Ryzen 9 7950X Processor 16C 32T 80M Cache, up to 5.7GHz, Socket AM5

I'm prepared to build a new desktop PC with 64G RAM and 4K display card using for;

Graphic Editing

and

Virtualization (VirtualBox)
with 40 cloned websites running, duplicated on the live websites running on Internet. The 40 cloned websites are not open to public,

Which AMD CPU shall I selected.

Is there any other suggestion ?

Thanks in advance

Regards

 

[Aeacus]

Comparison between the two: https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/AMD-Ryzen-9-7900X-vs-AMD-Ryzen-9-7950X/4132vs4133

Main diff is, that 7950X has 4 more cores and 8 more threads over 7900X.

For another option, i7-13700K is also good choice. Same cores/threads as 7950X, but a bit better due to core design,
comparison against 7950X: https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i7-13700K-vs-AMD-Ryzen-9-7950X/4137vs4133

Now, i9-13900K is best of them all, at current moment, with 8 cores more than 7950X/13700K,
comparison against 7950X: https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i9-13900K-vs-AMD-Ryzen-9-7950X/4129vs4133

So, if you're planning to utilize CPU render, more CPU cores/threads would be better (faster render times). But if you plan to balance render between CPU and GPU, where CPU doesn't need that many cores, i5-13600K is solid choice, and cheaper as well,
comparison against 7900X: https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i5-13600K-vs-AMD-Ryzen-9-7900X/4134vs4132

 

[satimis_06]

Hi Aeacus,

Lot of thanks for your advice.

I haven't built Intel PC for sometimes.

Just look at;
Intel Core i9-13900K Processor 24C 32T 36M Cache,up to 4.30GHz,LGA 1700
Its price not bad, with more cores

compared with : AMD Ryzen 9 7950X Processor 16C 32T 80M Cache, up to 5.7GHz, Socket AM5
80M Cache (AMD Ryzen 9 7950X) against 36M Cache (Intel Core i9-13900K)
up to 5.7GHz (AMD Ryzen 9 7950X) against up to 4.30GHz (Intel Core i9-13900K)

Your comment would be appreciated. Thanks

Regards

 

[BogdanH]

...
For another option, i7-13700K is also good choice. Same cores/threads as 7950X, but a bit better due to core design,...

-it's same amount of cores, but 13700K has only 24 threads.
That is, for heavier multi-core load, 13700X is more comparable to AMD 7900X. In this case however, I see 7900X as a better (energy efficient) choice:
13700K review at HardwareUnboxed
-other than that, in real usage, you won't notice any performance differences between 13700K and 7900X. Means, it's up to your personal decision and the price you pay.
Maybe not important in your case, but 13700 is probably the last CPU that current motherboards support. If it happens you would wish to upgrade, you can do that only by buying more powerful 13900K -or buy whole new system.

Bogdan

 

[Nighthawk117]

It's difficult to judge the performance difference because we don't know much about your workload beyond a simple overview. However I wouldn't of thought you'd notice that much difference between the two. The 7900X would be my pick but it depends on how price sensitive you are, if you can easily afford both then there is something to be said for just having the best.

 

[satimis_06]

Hi all,

Lot of thanks for your advice.

This will be a completely new PC to be built, not upgraded from an exiting PC.

New components to be purchased:

1. Asus motherboard to match the CPU selected. (I have full confidence on Asus motherboard, having used their motherboards for long time. They never made me disappointed).
2. 2TB GEN 4x4 PCIe NVMe M.2 SSD
3. 64G DDR5 4800MHz RAM

Following components already available, brand new and still packed in box;

1. MSI Twin Frozr 7 4K Graphic card
2. Corsair CS550M power supply

Used 4TB WD Hard drive - already available, solely for Data/Files storage.

Actually the price difference between

AMD Ryzen 9 7900X Processor
and
AMD Ryzen 9 7950X Processor

is not much, compared to the total cost of the new PC to be built. What I'm concerned is whether paying the difference it'll have some benefit?

Furthermore what will be your suggestion on selecting an Asus motherboard to match the CPU? I don't need WiFi. There are suggestions on Internet but I expect to hear the suggestion on this Forum.

Thanks in advance.

Best Regards

 

[Math Geek]

what you will gain is the extra cores/threads with the 7950x. that's it.

what you need to do is look at what you will need to run the vm's you wish to run. how many cores are you reserving for them, how much ram and so on. with this info you can easily add up what you will need to make it run.

for instance i have a 5900x 12 cores/24 threads. i frequently run 5 or 6 vm's and virtual switches and such. 2 cores per vm (often more), 4 gb ram plus extra to run windows as the host and so on.

add it up and i need at least 12-16 threads for the vm's plus the host OS. hence going with the 24 thread cpu. if i wanted to run even more, then i'd consider the 16 core cpu and so on. got 32 gb ram so each vm gets what it needs though i might get that to 64 gb soon.

look at what you are doing and what resources does it need?? do you need 16 cores or is 12 good enough? only you can see what usage patterns you are using to know if you have enough or not.

you say you have a 550w psu (budget model as well) and a "4k graphics card". what exact graphics card do you have? your psu may not be enough for the gpu and high end cpu. no sense putting a ton of money into a high end system and running it on a budget underpowered psu.

please add in the exact model of your graphics card so we can know if that psu is even good enough for all you want to run

 

[satimis_06]

Hi Math Geek,

Thanks for your advice.

It is a 4K graphic card.
Prined on the card: MSI Twin Frozr 7 Geforce GTX

Sorry I made a mistake on PSU. It should be CX550M, 550 Watts. No problem purchase a new PSU. It doesn't cost much.

Usually I assign 4 cores to each VM. Most the time I run 2 VMs at the same time. In seldom occasion 3 VMs max.

I suppose 64G RAM will be sufficient ?

Regards

 

[Math Geek]

MSI is the company that makes the card. twin frozr is the type of cooling fans used on that model and GTX only tells that it is an nvidia card.

needs a number like 3060, 2080 and so on. it could be a a 100w card or a 300w card

you can look in the system information and it'll say what the card or device manager under display adapters will tell you what is there as well.

with only 2 vm's. 64 gb is def overkill. 32gb would be more than ample to give each 4-8gb ram and still have plenty for the host OS. with the cost of DDR5 right now, i'd go with 32 gb and wait a year for the price to come down. then you can swap it out down the road if needed for a lot cheaper.

 

[satimis_06]

Hi Math Geek,

The graphic card is NOT in use, resting on shelve. I can take its photo and upload it here. Please advise which side of the photo you need? The fans side or the side of the printed circuit board. There is a serial number printed on the board.

I'll try to search its manual on shelve first

Thanks

Regards

Edit
====
Ah to my recollection the graphic card has been used in a short time before. The power was supplied by Corsair CX550M psu

 

[Math Geek]

oh ok. the serial number could be useful or any other numbers on it. we got some amazing people here who can often tell just by looking at the design what it is. top and bottom views would give the most info to work with

just want to be sure it'll all run as desired on what you have

 

[Aeacus]

I haven't built Intel PC for sometimes.

Reason why i suggested Intel CPUs is due to the iGPU in them, which is a great redundancy. Meaning that when your dedicated GPU (the unknown MSI Twin Frozr 7 Geforce GTX, which could be GTX 1650, GTX 1660, GTX 1660 Ti) should die or produce any other fault, you can connect your monitor to MoBo and use the iGPU, built-in to CPU, and still see the image and use the PC. None of the AMD CPUs have iGPU in them and it would be far harder to troubleshoot the issue of "PC boots but no image".

Though, with Intel CPU, F-suffix means that it doesn't have iGPU in it either. So, don't get F-suffix CPU, e.g i7-13700KF.
K-suffix means that CPU has unlocked multiplier and can be overclocked, when you use Z790 chipset MoBo.

As far as which CPU exactly to get, above suggestion of estimating your needs is actually a good one. Since you'd rather would have CPU cores left over/free, than coming short. E.g if you're unsure about core amounts and estimate ~10 cores, go with CPU that has 12 cores. Intel or AMD, doesn't matter much (except Intel CPUs have iGPU in them, which, to me, personally, is valuable).

Furthermore what will be your suggestion on selecting an Asus motherboard to match the CPU? I don't need WiFi. There are suggestions on Internet but I expect to hear the suggestion on this Forum.

I'd like to know if you go with Intel or AMD CPU beforehand, and which CPU exactly.

But until then, compatible MoBos would be:
If Intel CPU;

• Z790 chipset (most feature rich and also allows overclock of K-series CPU, e.g 13700K)
• Z690 chipset (you need latest BIOS in order to use 13th gen CPU, but otherwise almost same as Z790 chipset)
• H670, B660, H610 chipsets (consumer grade MoBos, that also need latest BIOS to use 13th gen CPU. Do not support CPU overclock, even when using K-suffix CPU)

If AMD CPU;

• X670E/X670 chipset (most feature rich)
• B650E/B670 chipset (consumer grade MoBos)

All AMD chipset MoBos support CPU overclock, as long as CPU has X-suffix.
E-suffix on MoBo chipset means "Extreme" and offers PCI-E 5.0 for both the PCI-E x16 slot (for GPU), and M.2 slot (for NVMe SSD), among other things.

Since your MoBo brand preference is Asus, here's what Asus offers regarding AMD 600-series chipset,
article: https://www.asus.com/news/lqm5i7jatfojpoyy/

It is a 4K graphic card.
Prined on the card: MSI Twin Frozr 7 Geforce GTX

Take pictures of it and upload them here: https://imgur.com/ while sharing pictures here, so we can identify the GPU.
Your GPU seems to be GTX 16-series, based on the Twin Frozr 7 cooler it has.

Sorry I made a mistake on PSU. It should be CX550M, 550 Watts. No problem purchase a new PSU. It doesn't cost much.

This PSU, at best, is mediocre quality PSU. Only good enough to power office PC without dedicated GPU. But since you plan to build high-end workstation rig, a far better and higher capacity PSU is needed.

Once we get to know what GPU you exactly have, then we can suggest the proper wattage range PSU as well. But regarding brands/models, good PSUs to go for are: Seasonic Focus/PRIME series or Corsair RM/RMi/RMx/HX/HXi/AX/AXi.
(All 3 of my PCs are also powered by Seasonic, full specs with pics in my sig.)

 

[Math Geek]

there is also some pretty nice sale prices on Corsair RMx and other units. seasonic also has many of their leadex units on sale as well (newegg store has the sales though they be elsewhere). so for around $110-130 you can get a top quality 750-850w psu that will easily handle most systems.

 

[Aeacus]

seasonic also has many of their leadex units on sale

You got a brain fart. Seasonic doesn't make Leadex series, Super Flower does.

 

[Math Geek]

lol. yah sorry about that

the super flower store on newegg has a bunch of sales. just ordered the leadex VI 850w platinum pro for $119 . with free shipping that's a heck of a deal

 

[satimis_06]

Hi all,

Lot of thanks for your advice and the link to ASUS motherboard. I'll go throught the link later.

MSI GeForce Graphic Card model:-
MSI GeForce GTX 1650 Super Gaming X
JH M3 94V-0

Regards

 

[Math Geek]

a 1650 super is light on the power needs. 100w or so at gaming load. or at least the one i have sits around 100-110w at load.

i also have a 550w psu with my 1650 super and 5900x and have no worries. i do have a better unit though in a rosewill capstone gold.

so you'd be ok with 550w psu. as others have noted though, yours is a budget model that was not the greatest new. with the nice high end cpu, i'd go ahead and get a better quality unit to power it all. you don't need 850w but a solid 550w or so would be a good idea and possibly even more to allow for upgrades in the future if you feel you might go bigger with the gpu down the road.

 

[satimis_06]

Hi Math Geek,

Thanks for your advice.

In my daily working PC the graphic comes from AMD CPU. Previously I have tested the MSI graphic card and CX550M, 550 Watts PSU on the daily working PC for about 10 days. No problem was found. To upgrade the PSU is not a problem to me.

My major concern is selecting an ASUS mobo to match AMD 7950x CPU. All models listed on the previous link are quite expensive. I'll search further before finalizing the config of my new PC

Regards

 

[Math Geek]

yah right now all the mobo's for the 7000 series are expansive. tom's has a little write up from yesterday detailing some of the reasons why

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/why-amds-ryzen-7000-and-motherboards-cost-so-damn-much

sadly, right now there is no other option but the expensive boards. they'll come down over time of course but right now, it's expensive.

 

[Aeacus]

My major concern is selecting an ASUS mobo to match AMD 7950x CPU. All models listed on the previous link are quite expensive. I'll search further before finalizing the config of my new PC

My take on this is, that when one has money to buy Core i7, i9 or Ryzen 9 series CPU (~$600 per chip), one also has money to buy other hardware that goes along with it.

Now, if one would have limited budget and is looking towards Core i3, i5 or Ryzen 3, 5, then it's understandable not being able to afford X670E or Z790 MoBo. In this case, going with Intel, e.g Core i3 and B660 chipset with DDR4 RAM, is far cheaper than going with Ryzen and DDR5 RAM.

Btw, with 600 bucks, i can get one complete PC and budget wise, that would be far more cost effective than just buying CPU. But i get that there are needs as of why to get that high-end of a system. Downside with that is, that it will cost a lot of money.

 

[satimis_06]

Hi Aeacus,

Lot of thanks for your suggestion.

I have no preset budget. My most concern is whether it is worthwhile spending that money. There is no urgence.

At present I'm fully engaged in testing my Samsung mobile phones, Galaxy S6, S9+ and S22 Ultra on ZY Smooth-Q and DJI Osmo mobile 3 gimbals. Also I'm testing remote desktop running Teamviewer.

Would tom's Hardware be the right forum for me posting "DJI Osmo action 3 vs gopro hero 10/11"? I'm considering to buy either of them.

Regards

 

[Aeacus]

My most concern is whether it is worthwhile spending that money.

Well, you need to figure out if there is a need for better PC or not.

If your current PC is enough and new PC would be "nice to have", then there's little reason to spend money on new PC.
However, if current PC isn't enough (e.g not enough CPU cores or way too long of rendering times), then new PC would be worth it.

Would tom's Hardware be the right forum for me posting "DJI Osmo action 3 vs gopro hero 10/11"? I'm considering to buy either of them.

Sure. Make a new topic in Digital Cameras subforum: https://forums.tomshardware.com/forums/digital-cameras.46/

 

[satimis_06]

Hi Aeacus,

Lot of thanks for your advice.

My daily working PC is working without problem and it can satisfy the work load,

Dail working PC - config
$ sudo lshw -C CPU

  *-cpu                     
       description: CPU
       product: AMD Ryzen 5 3400G with Radeon Vega Graphics
       vendor: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD]
       physical id: 33
       bus info: cpu@0
       version: 23.24.1
       serial: Unknown
       slot: AM4
       size: 1605MHz
       capacity: 4200MHz
       width: 64 bits
       clock: 100MHz

$ sudo dmidecode -t 2

# dmidecode 3.3
Getting SMBIOS data from sysfs.
SMBIOS 3.2.0 present.

Handle 0x0002, DMI type 2, 15 bytes
Base Board Information
        Manufacturer: ASUSTeK COMPUTER INC.
        Product Name: PRIME X570-P
        Version: Rev X.0x
        Serial Number: 190753869002923
        Asset Tag: Default string
        Features:
                Board is a hosting board
                Board is replaceable
        Location In Chassis: Default string
        Chassis Handle: 0x0003
        Type: Motherboard
        Contained Object Handles: 0

$ free -h

               total        used        free      shared  buff/cache   available
Mem:            29Gi       7.0Gi        18Gi       526Mi       4.2Gi        21Gi
Swap:          975Mi          0B       975Mi

$ sudo lsblk -e7

NAME                  MAJ:MIN RM   SIZE RO TYPE MOUNTPOINTS
sda                     8:0    0   3.6T  0 disk 
└─sda1                  8:1    0   3.6T  0 part (solely for data storage)
....
....
....
nvme0n1               259:0    0 953.9G  0 disk 
├─nvme0n1p1           259:1    0   512M  0 part /boot/efi
└─nvme0n1p2           259:2    0 953.4G  0 part 
  ├─ubuntu--vg-root   253:0    0 930.4G  0 lvm  /
  └─ubuntu--vg-swap_1 253:1    0   976M  0 lvm  [SWAP]

The graphic of my daily working PC comes from AMD CPU.

The motive pushing me to consider building a new PC are;

1. I haven't build new PC at least 3~4 years
2. The 1TB pcie gen 3 SSD running OS is almost full, leaving only about 50G space. If adding a new 2TB pcie SSD I can't add a 2TB pcie gen 4 SSD. Why I spend money on old model, pcie gen 3 SSD?
3. The PC is connected to a 32" Dell 4K Display, but I can't set Refresh Rate above 30.00 Hz. the Display will blink occasionally.

Those are reasons pushing me to consider building a new PC

Regards

 

[Aeacus]

Most cost effective would be:

• getting Ryzen 5000 series CPU (and probably better CPU cooler as well)
• more DDR4 RAM, if you want to get 64 GB in total
• 2nd NVMe SSD (since your MoBo has several M.2 slots)
• dedicated GPU
• and better build quality PSU as well, in 650W range

This means upgrade of your PC, rather than building a complete new PC.

Good CPU to go for would be Ryzen 7 5800X which gives you double the cores and threads over your current CPU,
comparison: https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/AMD-Ryzen-5-3400G-vs-AMD-Ryzen-7-5800X/m825156vs4085

-----

Or when you want to go with completely new build, then e.g this Intel build would do just fine:

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: Intel Core i7-13700K 3.4 GHz 16-Core Processor ($439.98 @ Amazon)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black 82.52 CFM CPU Cooler ($109.95 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: Asus ROG MAXIMUS Z790 HERO ATX LGA1700 Motherboard ($668.48 @ Amazon)
Memory: G.Skill F5-5600J2834F32GX2-TZ5RK 64 GB (2 x 32 GB) DDR5-5600 CL28 Memory ($409.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Samsung 980 Pro 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive ($229.99 @ Amazon)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 1650 SUPER GeForce GTX 1650 SUPER 4 GB Video Card (Purchased For $0.00)
Case: Phanteks Enthoo Pro 2 ATX Full Tower Case ($189.99 @ Amazon)
Power Supply: SeaSonic PRIME Ultra Gold 750 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($159.00 @ Amazon)
Total: $2207.38

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2022-11-05 05:57 EDT-0400

Take this build as a guideline. Also put in your GTX 1650. Oh, PC case is personal choice and feel free to switch it out (any would do, that has 165mm or more CPU cooler height, due to the NH-D15 CPU cooler). But for time being, put in one versatile full-tower ATX PC case. Also, build has 2x RAM slots free, just in case you want to go with 128 GB of RAM in the future.

Also, feel free to use pcpp (https://pcpartpicker.com/list/) and build different configurations to see what you might like.

 

[satimis_06]

Hi Aeacus,

Lot of thanks for your detailed suggestion.

I have another idea

1)
On my daily working PC
Purchase a new 2TB pcie gen 3 Nvme SSD to replace the running 1TB pcie gen 3 Nvme SSD
Install MSI GeForce GTX 1650 Super Gaming X graphic card
Install Corsair CX550M PSU
The graphic card and the psu should work without problem. I have tested them before.

If the daily working PC is working without problem. Then
2)
Remove and install
MSI GeForce GTX 1650 Super Gaming X
Corsair CX550M PSU
on my current spare PC

Config of my current spare PC
CPU - AMD 8-core Ryzen 3
RAM - 32G
Graphic card - resolution 2540 x 1024

Then I can run the spare PC on the Dell 32" 4K Display.

3)
Purchase a new graphic card and psu for my daily working PC
Purchase a new 43" Dell 4K display.

Your comment is welcome. Thanks

Regards