Silent, small size, mATX case

[adamtron]

Looking for a small. mATX case designed for silence. I have owned a Prodigy for about a year now, before that I had an iMac. I found the Prodigy too loud, and compared to a couple of my friends computers, its the quietest of the bunch. I thought it would be fairly quiet when I bought it, I got a Windforce 3X because I heard it was quiet (thank you MKBHD -_-) and an H60. The loudest part was the PSU fan, which was a Raidmax 530W. I replaced it with a CX500 and it was still to loud for my liking, but now the H60's pump was the loudest part, I dont think it was supposed to be that loud, but Corsair said it was normal. I have a low noise adapter on it, and it is tolerable. But now someone has offered me money for the system, and I agreed, so I have a $1500-$1700 budget to play with. I am looking for something like the Define R4, but preferable smaller, mATX if possible, as I do want to put a network card in. I know about the Define Mini, but it isnt much smaller than the original, and I think that with the negligible difference in size, I would just get the full sized one. I dont like having empty space in my computer (It pains me to see someone use a 900D with one PCI card, also I refuse to have empty RAM slots) which is why I like the smaller form factor (I currently use one SSD, but if I had an R4, I would probably end up scavenging for hard drives to fill it up). Any suggestions would be nice, thanks.

Amendment: I like windows, one of which the Define Mini does not have.

 

[Karadjgne]

Well I have a CM 690 ii advanced case, which has quite a bit of space inside, and a full mesh font and top, and at idle, its absolutely dead silent. So, its not quite so much the case, as what the sources of noise are. In this I found to be the fan on my h-55 was a 3pin fan, so not controllable from the CPU header. Solution: Noctua NF-F12, which at idle runs a dead silent 392 rpm, and only runs 900 rpm loaded. That's the custom fan curve I set for it. Intake 140mm's run at 500 rpm, and the h-55 is set to top exhaust, so does a respectable double duty.

You have set yourself up for a quandary. The smaller the form factor, the more important the airflow or heat will drive your fans towards unacceptable levels. The define R4 is a great case,and is about as silent as a case can be under gaming situations. Max out the fan possibilities with the largest fans you can fit, ones rated to be quiet, and tested as such, like the Noctua's. Then turn them down. Use speedfan, fan expert or other such software, not the lva's, and you'll find that even with multiple fans, you get more airflow, at a much lower rpm, and much lower if not total silence.

As far as the pump goes, pumps are pretty quiet, I have to stick my head to within less than 6 inches from an open fan slot to hear mine, and you most definitely do not put one on a voltage adapter. Fan yes, pump no, it needs to run full speed

 

[adamtron]

So if my H60 is that much louder than your H55, there is probably something wrong with it, yes? Thanks for the input, one more question, if you dont mind; what do you think about PSUs? Still going for something as silent as possible, I was thinking the Corsair RM series, I like the zero-rpm fan mode, and the fully-modularness of it. Do you have any experience with them? Thanks again.

 

[Karadjgne]

Your actual pump on the H-60 should be fairly quiet, at most a very minor ticking, the fan however is a different story. While the Corsair stock fans are really decent radiator fans, they suck for noise. I personally am not a big fan of the RM series, they have bad thermal issues, and use sub-standard capacitors. I use a Seasonic, they are the best, and I can't hear the fan at all, it has really good thermals and uses the very best components. It costs a little more, but you get what you pay for with Seasonic or Seasonic built psu's like some Antecs, XFX, Corsair Ax etc.

 

[Karadjgne]

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($189.99 @ Amazon)
CPU Cooler: Thermaltake Water 3.0 Extreme 99.0 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($109.99 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: MSI Z87I GAMING AC Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard ($159.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1866 Memory ($79.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 840 EVO 250GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($139.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($57.98 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 780 3GB Video Card ($515.91 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Arc Mini R2 MicroATX Mini Tower Case ($99.99 @ NCIX US)
Power Supply: SeaSonic M12II 650W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($106.50 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($19.98 @ OutletPC)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 (OEM) (64-bit) ($89.98 @ OutletPC)
Total: $1548.29
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-04-08 00:20 EDT-0400)

Has window, built in wifi (AC)

Use the cpu cooler as top exhaust, remove the current top fan. Remove rear exhaust fan and add to intake. no need for rear exhaust with double cooler. Should have utilities, use fan control to lower fans etc and unless you are in heavy gaming like bf4 maxed out, this rig has enough power to run quiet at high settings, and a big enough psu to not be taxed so hard it has to ramp up the fan to compensate. Its the same design as mine, only larger. The gpu is large enough you have to loose some HDD bays, so pretty much, you have no space left.

And it all matches, white fans, black and red interior, and the Gigabyte you like, but much larger...

 

[adamtron]

Thank you very much good sir. I think ill ditch the HDD (have too many laying around) and take the CPU up to a 4770k (i use it for 3D work). Other than that it seems very nice. Thanks again.

 

[Outlander_04]

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Nanoxia/Deep_Silence_4/1.html

I would ditch the water coolers. A good air cooler is likely to be better and quieter

 

[realchaos]

I don't know why you want a mini-ITX board in a mATX case. You lose out on features such as more expansion slots. I would actually change a few things in that build to fit your needs more:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($189.99 @ Amazon)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D14 65.0 CFM CPU Cooler ($71.99 @ Mwave)
Motherboard: Asus GRYPHON Z87 Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($154.99 @ NCIX US)
Memory: G.Skill Ares Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($64.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 840 EVO 250GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($139.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($57.98 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 780 3GB Video Card ($449.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Arc Mini R2 MicroATX Mini Tower Case ($99.99 @ NCIX US)
Power Supply: Corsair RM 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($89.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($19.98 @ OutletPC)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 (OEM) (64-bit) ($89.98 @ OutletPC)
Wireless Network Adapter: Rosewill RNX-N250PCe 802.11b/g/n PCI-Express x1 Wi-Fi Adapter ($21.14 @ Amazon)
Total: $1451.00
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-04-08 02:05 EDT-0400)

-Quieter cooler. The Noctua NH-D14 is extremely quiet and barely fits in the Arc Mini R2. It's 160mm tall and the case allows for a 165mm tall heatsink. Pumps on CLC are quiet noisy actually and it just adds extra noise with the fans. A high end heatsink like the Noctua will perform very closely to the CLC but also at a quieter fashion.
-mATX motherboard because why not? More expansion slots for the same price (you do lose out on a wireless adapter but you can easily add one).
-Low-profile RAM to fit the Noctua heatsink. Also cheaper and same performance.
-The Gigabyte coolers are actually on the noisier side compared to other brands due to it's 3 fan style cooler. MSI cards are pretty quiet, as are Asus and EVGA.
-Corsair RM psus are decent quality. Perhaps not the best, but if you truly want as little noise as possible then the RM is the way to go.
-Added a wireless adapter.

I know you said you hate having empty slots but come on. The motherboard has extra features for the same price, not to mention that the Gryphon overclocks better due to it's 8 power phase over the 6 of the MSI Z87I Gaming board.

 

[Karadjgne]

@realchaos the Noctua Nh-d14 is an extremely quiet cooler and I like it a lot, when its on low, less than 900 rpm it pulls @30db. The ttw3 is the same, as are just about most fans that spin at 900 rpm or lower, but the ttw3 will outperform the Noctua and doesn't dominate the case.
Why mITX? Op stated he prefers only 2 ram slots.
You have to be kidding on the RM 650 being decent right? It's one of two of the absolute worst psu's corsair makes, the other being the 750. Not only is it not quiet, it has extremely bad thermal design, its full of CapXon capacitors, and under testing failed miserably every test thrown at it mostly due to thermal shutdowns. It barely passed atx standards at load. The Seasonic is a tier1 psu and is far superior in every single way you could name, and that includes silent running.
Power phases have little to do with overclocking as such. All power phases do is increase voltage stability under extreme overclocks, and I gather tha OP games for the fun, not for the bragging rights of who has the highest OC. MSI boards are great boards, that perform well, have good reliability, lower power draw and OC quite respectfully. It also has a built in (additional card) ac WiFi, so no need to buy more.

A decent OC won't push the limits of any component in the build I outlined under any normal gaming situation, and its only when limits are reached that fans get loud, yes even the Noctua is quite loud when pushed at 12v.

 

[realchaos]

The Thermaltake Water Extreme 3.0 is a great CLC and outperforms the popular H100i for about the same price. Not saying that there's anything wrong with that, but CLC are always noisier than aircooling - it's a fact. No matter what, the pump adds extra sound and it can sometimes be quite noisy.
As I stated at the end of my previous post, while the OP prefers to have 2 ram slots so it's all filled up, I find it stupid to be spending the same amount of money for less features because you prefer to have less. Doesn't really make sense and it limits your upgrade-ability.
Power phases has a lot to do with overclocking. It increases voltage stability, as you said, and it can really help in the higher overclocks. I don't see why the OP won't go for a high overclock if he's getting a high end cpu cooler. He already has everything there, so might as well overclock to the best you can. And the extra power phases will definitely help out in that situation. Again, it's better performance for the same price.
Regarding the RM650, it's still a decent psu. Of course it's not as good as Seasonic or XFX, as I've stated previously, but it's still fine for most builds, especially if you want a fanless option for the most silence. Jonnyguru did a review on the RM650 here: http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story6&reid=363

 

[Karadjgne]

I will say, its possible that some pumps are noisy, mine isn't, so I'm a little biased. While you do make sense with the suggestion of OC if able, the whole purpose of overcooling is to slow the fans down, less noise. I'm a big fan of the NH-D14, for the price, its unbeatable as far as sound and cooling goes, especially when hooked up to the low voltage adapter and the fans are running 900rpm, but its a lan party box.

That Noctua cooler is heavy, and I couldn't in all conscience recommend a cooler that stresses a mobo/cpu as much as those large towers do, to someone who is constantly moving the pc. One good pot-hole and that could very well be the end of a good build. A CLC is the safest choice, by far, for a lan party box.

Whats to upgrade? A 780 by itself is a great card and will run any game at great settings at playable fps. being able to sli just means OP will either get better performance in 1/2 the games or possibly worse in the other half. Granted the 780 isn't a 'ti' but i'll be damned if it won't beat the pants off my little 660'ti' and twice on Sunday. I doubt there will be a game made in the next 10 years that will be beyond the playable capability of a GTX 780, but honestly.. at $1500 for a 295X2, or $3k for a Titan Z? who will be able to afford to play that game if its gpu's like that that are needed?

So... whats to upgrade? cpu and ram? well who knows whats gonna be next, revisit of Haswell, like SB-IB, it'll still be LGA 1150, and that MSI board will handle up to DDR3 3000...

Basically, imho, its a lan party box that doubles as a work station. That means it'll see a lot of single monitor days, easy for a 780. Multiple monitors, maybe at home, but then again, easy for a 780. Its light, portable, sturdy, does the job intended, quietly, cool-ly.

 

[realchaos]

Who said this is a LAN party computer? The OP mentioned nothing about constantly moving the computer around; he only mentioned that he preferred mATX so he's not wasting space. If this is a LAN party computer, then yes a CLC would be better but if it's just staying in one place with little movement then I would go for the Noctua NH-D14.

A GTX 780 will not last 10 years. With the rapid growth of technology, I would give it 3-5 years max before it cannot play games anymore (or maybe some on low). I honestly don't know why you're bringing up the 295x2 and Titan Z.

The main upgrade options on the mATX board over the ITX board is the number of RAM slots and PCIe lanes. With the ITX board, you'll have all of your ram slots filled up whereas the mATX board will still have 2 slots empty for a potential extra 8gb to make it 16gb of RAM total. Maybe the OP will start to do something that requires more RAM in the future so he can easily add more rather than replacing it. Maybe he won't go into anything that requires more RAM, but the option is always nice and more slots for the same price is a win.

Some of your points are valid if the OP is using this as a LAN box. However, since the OP never said anything about it, I'm not going to assume that it is just because it's a mATX build.

 

[Karadjgne]

Well, I did make an assumption on the lan party, based on OP former Prodigy build, majority of the ppl I have seen use that case, use it as a lan box, so if that is an error, I apologize.

I find it hard to believe a 780 will be obsolete in 3-5 years. That would mean 770 obsolete in 2-4, 760 in 1-2, and the brand new 750ti became obsolete yesterday. Unplayable? maybe for a very small selection of ultra intense gpu oriented games like BF5 will probably be, but for mainstream? no way 3-5.

Personally I'd never recommend adding Ram. That's a crapshoot in a pickle barrel by a blindman if I ever saw one. Much better to buy a new kit. In that case you get a 16Gb kit, which is the boards max anyways.
I hear what you are saying about more ram, and can even understand the reasoning behind it all. I just am of the opinion that by the time a majority of games are there that really benefit from 16Gb vrs the mainstream 8Gb, we'll be into DDR4 range for the new stuff, and ppl will be upgrading. Be about the same as ppl buying more DDR2 now, they really don't, they upgrade the pc.

I must say, in all fairness, I am a big fan of the NH-D14, and a few other aircoolers, but not on a 4770k, not with any decent overclock. That cpu just gets way too hot, and to keep the fan speeds down to near silent as possible, I think in this, a CLC would be better.

Feeling quite contrariwise in this thread, and if I come across as a little rude or opinionated, its not intentional and I'll apologize profusely in advance 😀

 

[realchaos]

Technology, especially graphic cards, advance really fast. My parent's computer uses a Radeon HD 5000 card (can't remember the exact model) that's been released about 5 years ago and it can barely play League at 720p on low-med settings. That in itself should give a pretty good idea on the rapid growth of graphic cards.

 

[adamtron]

Stop ranting in my thread!

 

[Igorious]

The ping-pong between realchaos and Karadjgne is entertaining.... 😉

In the meantime a number of months have past and hopefully by now you have the system that is powerful, compact and quiet.
Last year I too was trying to come up with a small formfactor build that would be powerful yet silent in working. Unfortunately i am not super happy with the result and am now looking for an alternative case but I came to the conclusion that no company has made what I am looking for. So if there are any R&D guys reading this, go to your drawing boards!! 🙂

The Aerocool DS case is very much NOT 'dead' silent. with an iphone app i get about 68 decibels while playing BF4 which is mainly due to the GPU and the not so sound dampening case. There seem to be 3 cases on the market that keep popping up in my search for a quiet case: Corsair Obsidian 550D, CoolerMaster silencio series and the Fractal Design R5. the smallest silencio is compact but not not super quiet and only runs 120mm fans (back and front). The R5 is the only case with 140mm fan support, very quiet but it is very big and heavy.... :-(

Anybody have see an alternative??

Here is what i put together:
- Aerocool DS case (replaced rear fan with 140mm Noctua and front with 200mm coolermaster quiet fan)
- Asus ROG Maximus VII Gene
- Intel i7-4790k (oc'ed to 4.5Ghz, so not extreem)
- Corsair H90 watercooler in push/pull with Noctua 140mm fans
- Sapphire R9 290x tri-x OC grafix card
- 2x 8GB 2133mhz RAM
- Corsair RM750 PSU (yes I managed to painfully fit it in the case!)
- 1x SSD + 1x HDD
- Asus A/C PCIe wificard
- BluRay player

 

[Karadjgne]

For this, I'll hock back to my youth when I used to install car audio professionally. Foam. Not the tight packed, shiny stuff, but the course, airy stuff. If you cover the large reflective surfaces like the inside of the windowed panel, under the drive bays, etc it'll do a respectable job of killing most higher frequency sound. Fan noise is not just one frequency, it pretty much all frequencies, almost white noise, including a butt load of harmonics. Bounce that around off a few nice hard shiny reflective surfaces and you are going to hear it, over and over like an echo. Bounce it around off millions of surfaces and it's pretty much going to die a quick death as the sound has such a high frequency but low amplitude meaning a very short range.