[SOLVED] Small temp difference

revenantbacus

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Hello, so i just upgrade my stock intel cooler to a new cooler which is deepcool gammaxx 400 and immediately installed it on my rig, im pretty excited because that will lower my temp dramatically but then i open the hwmonitor and msi afterburner osd, the max temp before is 60 degree and after installing the new cooler, the max temp is 55 degree only. Im confused because my cpu is G4560 which is not that powerful and it should lower the temp 30 degree base on my research which im not sure. I dont know if theres wrong because i followed the deepcool tutorial video and it went perfectly smooth but the temp is just dissapointing. Please if anyone has a solution, it will probably highly appreciated, thank you!
 
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Karadjgne

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It's physically impossible to cool a cpu below ambient temp by mechanical means. If you ran the pc on an open test bench, the absolute lowest possible idle temp will be 1-2°C higher than your ambient temp. But you aren't, it's inside an enclosed box with unknown airflow. Most pc's will run idle temps of 6-12°C above outside case ambient, just because the cooler is inside the case, which is heated by the cooler, the gpu, ram, hdd, motherboard chipsets etc.

So my guess is that the pc is not in an air-conditioned space, the windows are open and you have fans to make a breeze, but that doesn't change the fact that the ambient temp in the room is still 40°C+. Which puts a 49°C idle as perfectly normal.

There's only 2 ways you can possibly drop that idle to the level your research found. Turn on the air conditioner and reduce the ambient temp in the room to @ 22-23°C (low 70's °F) or use a chemical process such as peltier or LN² or full custom loop attached to a fishtank water chiller etc. Natural physical mechanical means cannot do it, you could have the biggest, most expensive cpu cooler around, you'll still get 49°C at best.

As for load temps, did you also turn off AVX technologies, all three check boxes? If not, results will show as @ 130% over real gaming 100% temps.
 
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RodroX

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Hi, first I will try to take the readings from something more uptodate like hwinfo (https://www.hwinfo.com/download/), you have a portable version that you can donwload, and need to run the "sensors only" option.

Also while reading temps, don't run two monitor softwares at the same time (either you read from msi afterburner, or from hwinfo).

What benchmark are you using to test temps? Cinbench R15, 20, prime95, Aida64 ?

How many and how do you have your case fan coolers installed ?, With a tower cooler there should be at least 1 intake fan on the front of your case and one outake fan on the rear so they create a good airflow .

Last but not least, if you got those tems readings while playing a game, its very likely that your GPU is warming the inside of your case and so your CPU temps wont go down that much. So instead I will make the comparision using both coolers running something like Cinebench R15 or 20 multicore test, for atleast 15 to 20 mins (you can set this in "preferences" by telling the software to run for 900 to 1200 seconds).

Cheers
 
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rubix_1011

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the max temp is 55 degree only. Im confused because my cpu is G4560 which is not that powerful and it should lower the temp 30 degree base on my research which im not sure.
Can you provide information on where you are getting this research data? Can you provide the link?

Is this comparison idle or load temp?

I wouldn't ever think a 30C difference is possible unless there is a problem or incorrect mount with one of coolers being compared.
 
You need to understand some things about CPU cooling control. The automatic function of the mobo that they call "Fan Speed Control" really is NOT that, exactly. It is CPU INTERNAL TEMPERATURE CONTROL. That is, it monitors the temperature inside the CPU chip via a built-in sensor, and then manipulates the speed of the CPU cooling fans to keep that internal temp at its recommend value. (The "recommended value" number is pre-programmed into the BIOS of your mobo according to the exact CPU you have installed.) If temp is too high it will speed up the fans until it comes down to the target, then reduce speed to keep it there. If temp is too low it will slow down the fans until the temp rises to the target.

So if your CPU is NOT already running at max use and generating a VERY high temp, the use of a much better cooler may NOT reduce its temperature by much. Instead, what will happen is that the new system with higher CAPACITY to remove heat will actually run slower than your old one to provide the SAME internal CPU temperature as before. So, check the actual fan speed of your new system. It is rated for max 1500 rpm, and I bet it's running lower that that.

What your better cooler DOES have for you, though, is reserve capacity. That is, if you do push your system to max workload and higher heat generation inside the CPU, the new system should always be able to raise its fan speed enough to keep up with that and ensure the internal CPU temperature never goes too high.
 

revenantbacus

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Hi, first I will try to take the readings from something more uptodate like hwinfo (https://www.hwinfo.com/download/), you have a portable version that you can donwload, and need to run the "sensors only" option.

Also while reading temps, don't run two monitor softwares at the same time (either you read from msi afterburner, or from hwinfo).

What benchmark are you using to test temps? Cinbench R15, 20, prime95, Aida64 ?

How many and how do you have your case fan coolers installed ?, With a tower cooler there should be at least 1 intake fan on the front of your case and one outake fan on the rear so they create a good airflow .

Last but not least, if you got those tems readings while playing a game, its very likely that your GPU is warming the inside of your case and so your CPU temps wont go down that much. So instead I will make the comparision using both coolers running something like Cinebench R15 or 20 multicore test, for atleast 15 to 20 mins (you can set this in "preferences" by telling the software to run for 900 to 1200 seconds).

Cheers
Im currently using the prime95 and playing some games, the case fan installed is only 1 in the rear and 1 in the cooler and no fans on front panel at all, my gpu is not warm at all, my rx 470 average about 50 degree while playing games on high settings. Thanks for replying sir!
 

revenantbacus

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May 15, 2018
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Can you provide information on where you are getting this research data? Can you provide the link?

Is this comparison idle or load temp?

I wouldn't ever think a 30C difference is possible unless there is a problem or incorrect mount with one of coolers being compared.
Im using the HWMONITOR and MSI afterburner On Screen Display to view this temps and this is comparison of both, idle and load temp. Thanks for replying sir!
 

revenantbacus

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May 15, 2018
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You need to understand some things about CPU cooling control. The automatic function of the mobo that they call "Fan Speed Control" really is NOT that, exactly. It is CPU INTERNAL TEMPERATURE CONTROL. That is, it monitors the temperature inside the CPU chip via a built-in sensor, and then manipulates the speed of the CPU cooling fans to keep that internal temp at its recommend value. (The "recommended value" number is pre-programmed into the BIOS of your mobo according to the exact CPU you have installed.) If temp is too high it will speed up the fans until it comes down to the target, then reduce speed to keep it there. If temp is too low it will slow down the fans until the temp rises to the target.

So if your CPU is NOT already running at max use and generating a VERY high temp, the use of a much better cooler may NOT reduce its temperature by much. Instead, what will happen is that the new system with higher CAPACITY to remove heat will actually run slower than your old one to provide the SAME internal CPU temperature as before. So, check the actual fan speed of your new system. It is rated for max 1500 rpm, and I bet it's running lower that that.

What your better cooler DOES have for you, though, is reserve capacity. That is, if you do push your system to max workload and higher heat generation inside the CPU, the new system should always be able to raise its fan speed enough to keep up with that and ensure the internal CPU temperature never goes too high.
But the thing is, the people on internet had this cooler and using a high watts cpu while my cpu is only 54 watts, i think i should get to 30 degree idle and 40 degree on full load temp. Btw i use the thermal paste that comes with it and i think that could be also the reason, should i get a Arctic MX-4 to reduce my temp or the one that comes with it is totally fine? Thanks for answering my question sir!
 

revenantbacus

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30c temperatures are obsurd for a budget tower cooler. Its just not happening in prime 95 or under much load.

A g4560 can run up to around 80c safely, and then even higher without throttling.
Im from philippines so its quiete hot here and the room temperature is about 50 degree. Im so concerned about this because when i build my pc back in 2018, im using the new stock cooler that comes with the cpu and the cpu temp never went 40 temp and its 1 year now so i bought a new cooler to see if i will get better temps.
 

Karadjgne

Titan
Herald
It's physically impossible to cool a cpu below ambient temp by mechanical means. If you ran the pc on an open test bench, the absolute lowest possible idle temp will be 1-2°C higher than your ambient temp. But you aren't, it's inside an enclosed box with unknown airflow. Most pc's will run idle temps of 6-12°C above outside case ambient, just because the cooler is inside the case, which is heated by the cooler, the gpu, ram, hdd, motherboard chipsets etc.

So my guess is that the pc is not in an air-conditioned space, the windows are open and you have fans to make a breeze, but that doesn't change the fact that the ambient temp in the room is still 40°C+. Which puts a 49°C idle as perfectly normal.

There's only 2 ways you can possibly drop that idle to the level your research found. Turn on the air conditioner and reduce the ambient temp in the room to @ 22-23°C (low 70's °F) or use a chemical process such as peltier or LN² or full custom loop attached to a fishtank water chiller etc. Natural physical mechanical means cannot do it, you could have the biggest, most expensive cpu cooler around, you'll still get 49°C at best.

As for load temps, did you also turn off AVX technologies, all three check boxes? If not, results will show as @ 130% over real gaming 100% temps.
 
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RodroX

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As others mention already, if your room temps are around or over 40°C and theres no air conditionar turned it on, is not very likely you can get your cpu under 40°C at idle, or under 55~60°c while on load.

Perhaps, when you first meassured the temps back in 2018 you were on winter season and room temps were way lower ?

But then again, remember that if you add all the generated heat (as Karadijne wrote) by your mobo, ram, gpu, and etc into the equation, those temps you mention are perfectly fine.

As long as the inside of your case is clean (specially all the heatsinks) you should be fine, only thing left to do will be adding an intake fan in the front, but with those room temps, Im not so sure it will be helpfull.

As for a last thing to try out about the idle temps, you could close all unnecessary programs and , leave only 1 monitoring software ON, and then check the CPU ussage on task manager by pressing alt+ctrl+del.
If you close everything and you see your cpu usage is over 15~20%, then theres some services or something on the backgroud making the cpu work when it should be resting and if you find a way to turn whatever it is off (as long as its not an important part of Windows or other programs ) that could hep you make your idle temps just a bit lower, not by much, but just a bit more.

Cheers
 
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digitalgriffin

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Im from philippines so its quiete hot here and the room temperature is about 50 degree. Im so concerned about this because when i build my pc back in 2018, im using the new stock cooler that comes with the cpu and the cpu temp never went 40 temp and its 1 year now so i bought a new cooler to see if i will get better temps.
Unless you are using DX, (Direct eXpandion chiller) or Peltier, it is impossible for your cooler temp to be lower than your room temp. And typically for a budget air cooler will sit at least sit a couple degrees above room temp.

Some people have gone to the drastic means of submerging their radiator in a bucket of ice water to make their computer run cooler.
 

revenantbacus

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As others mention already, if your room temps are around or over 40°C and theres no air conditionar turned it on, is not very likely you can get your cpu under 40°C at idle, or under 55~60°c while on load.

Perhaps, when you first meassured the temps back in 2018 you were on winter season and room temps were way lower ?

But then again, remember that if you add all the generated heat (as Karadijne wrote) by your mobo, ram, gpu, and etc into the equation, those temps you mention are perfectly fine.

As long as the inside of your case is clean (specially all the heatsinks) you should be fine, only thing left to do will be adding an intake fan in the front, but with those room temps, Im not so sure it will be helpfull.

As for a last thing to try out about the idle temps, you could close all unnecessary programs and , leave only 1 monitoring software ON, and then check the CPU ussage on task manager by pressing alt+ctrl+del.
If you close everything and you see your cpu usage is over 15~20%, then theres some services or something on the backgroud making the cpu work when it should be resting and if you find a way to turn whatever it is off (as long as its not an important part of Windows or other programs ) that could hep you make your idle temps just a bit lower, not by much, but just a bit more.

Cheers
Well, we dont have winter seasons and if the weather is bad, the room temp is 20C even in 2018 we are sweating here but my cpu temp is only 29C on idle and 38C on full load with the stock cooler.
 
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