Some great ideas

[pat]

Archived from groups: rec.games.empire (More info?)

Yes, I'm always full of good ideas. but here are a couple worth listening
too. First, land mines in this game are poorly handled. Not how they are
used, but how they are laid. Right now they require expensive engieer units
to put down. And your valuable engineers have to use their mobility to do
that. I won't even get into the "reality" aspect of how easy it is to sew
mines and their prevalence in places like the Balkins and Cambodia. All I
will ask is when is the last time anybody actually laid land mines?

I thought so. How about a "sapper" flag on units that will allow them
or engineers to sew and remove land mines? Then create a lower tech, cheap
unit that can really make use of land mines.

Second, naval missiles blow. They are so innacurate that they don't
have a decent effect. Okay, I can easily change that when I d/l the source
and modify the plane.c file. But the real problem is with the destroyer
soak off tactic. You can build a $600, low profile ship that will attract
all sorts of naval missiles. the problem is they just fly right over the
deck because they cannot hit anything. And the reason that the missiles
attack these ships? They have the ability to carry a unit.

Again, I can go into the ship.c file and remove the ability of these
ships to carry a unit. So the problem should be solved. But why don't
we make this a stock piece of code. DD's carrying units is a real nice
feature for this ships. maybe too nice.

BTW, is anyobdy out there still alive? It's been a week since I've seen
a post to this NG. And that was by me!

Pat
AKA Overlord, batteries included

 

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"Pat" <overlord@multi.usr.ch> wrote in message
news:d62mpv$2g7e$1@multi.usr.ch...
> Yes, I'm always full of good ideas. but here are a couple worth
listening
> too. First, land mines in this game are poorly handled. Not how they are
> used, but how they are laid. Right now they require expensive engieer
units
> to put down. And your valuable engineers have to use their mobility to do
> that. I won't even get into the "reality" aspect of how easy it is to sew
> mines and their prevalence in places like the Balkins and Cambodia. All I
> will ask is when is the last time anybody actually laid land mines?

I have never laid land mines in a serious game. Cash for engineer units,
their limited mobility and my limited time prevent this from being feasible.

BTW, when does the added defense strength of mines get added - before
calculating reacting units or later when support is being added?

> I thought so. How about a "sapper" flag on units that will allow
them
> or engineers to sew and remove land mines? Then create a lower tech,
cheap
> unit that can really make use of land mines.
>
> Second, naval missiles blow. They are so innacurate that they don't
> have a decent effect. Okay, I can easily change that when I d/l the
source
> and modify the plane.c file. But the real problem is with the destroyer
> soak off tactic. You can build a $600, low profile ship that will attract
> all sorts of naval missiles. the problem is they just fly right over the
> deck because they cannot hit anything. And the reason that the missiles
> attack these ships? They have the ability to carry a unit.
>
> Again, I can go into the ship.c file and remove the ability of these
> ships to carry a unit. So the problem should be solved. But why don't
> we make this a stock piece of code. DD's carrying units is a real nice
> feature for this ships. maybe too nice.


This makes DDs too useful. This is an issue we are addressing in the
PZ4 game.

Why aren't the ships/planes/units read from text files like econfig
rather than being compile-time entities? Is there concern that this
would make unbalancing games by novice deities too easy?

> BTW, is anyobdy out there still alive? It's been a week since I've
seen
> a post to this NG. And that was by me!
>
> Pat
> AKA Overlord, batteries included

I thought PZ4 being down for the scheduled break would make
RGE very active. I guess everyone is resting for the upcoming battles!

Tom
(Ski)

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.empire (More info?)

Pat <overlord@multi.usr.ch> wrote:
> Yes, I'm always full of good ideas. but here are a couple worth listening
> too. First, land mines in this game are poorly handled. Not how they are
> used, but how they are laid. Right now they require expensive engieer units
> to put down. And your valuable engineers have to use their mobility to do
> that. I won't even get into the "reality" aspect of how easy it is to sew
> mines and their prevalence in places like the Balkins and Cambodia. All I
> will ask is when is the last time anybody actually laid land mines?

I used them in almost all games that I played in. And yes, it used that
much mob that it was a PITA to use and maybe I should have spent my time
and cash elsewhere.

>
> I thought so. How about a "sapper" flag on units that will allow them
> or engineers to sew and remove land mines? Then create a lower tech, cheap
> unit that can really make use of land mines.


> Second, naval missiles blow. They are so innacurate that they don't
> have a decent effect.

Here I disagree. Tomahawks can have a realy nice effect. I'll admit that
I often use them to *manually* target carriers and I often restict their
range to less then that of my forts and HATs.

> Okay, I can easily change that when I d/l the source
> and modify the plane.c file. But the real problem is with the destroyer
> soak off tactic. You can build a $600, low profile ship that will attract
> all sorts of naval missiles. the problem is they just fly right over the
> deck because they cannot hit anything. And the reason that the missiles
> attack these ships? They have the ability to carry a unit.
>
> Again, I can go into the ship.c file and remove the ability of these
> ships to carry a unit. So the problem should be solved. But why don't
> we make this a stock piece of code. DD's carrying units is a real nice
> feature for this ships. maybe too nice.

I am in favour of removing the units from these ships. Not because they
soak missiles, but I tend to prefer the warship/troop_transport devision
between ships. (A cs will do as a tt).

> BTW, is anyobdy out there still alive? It's been a week since I've seen
> a post to this NG. And that was by me!

*pinches himself*.

Ouch!

Yes, I seemt o be alive.

> Pat
> AKA Overlord, batteries included

--
Synchron

 

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Tom Johnson <1234thjohnson1104REMOVE1234@verizon.net> wrote:
> Why aren't the ships/planes/units read from text files like econfig
> rather than being compile-time entities? Is there concern that this
> would make unbalancing games by novice deities too easy?

No, it just hasn't been coded (yet ?)... ;-)

Zlo

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.empire (More info?)

Marc Olzheim <marcolz@hammer.stack.nl> writes:

> Tom Johnson <1234thjohnson1104REMOVE1234@verizon.net> wrote:
>> Why aren't the ships/planes/units read from text files like econfig
>> rather than being compile-time entities? Is there concern that this
>> would make unbalancing games by novice deities too easy?
>
> No, it just hasn't been coded (yet ?)... ;-)

Exactly■.

I am concerned that deities screw with game configuration and end up
running bad games. But I don't believe in programs nannying users.
Give them all the rope they want and then some. It's the Unix way.

Setting deities right is the players' job, not the code's.

■ We have ideas how this should be done. If you want to help
coding, let's talk.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.empire (More info?)

"Tom Johnson" <1234thjohnson1104REMOVE1234@verizon.net> writes:

> "Pat" <overlord@multi.usr.ch> wrote in message
> news:d62mpv$2g7e$1@multi.usr.ch...
>> Yes, I'm always full of good ideas. but here are a couple worth
> listening
>> too. First, land mines in this game are poorly handled. Not how they are
>> used, but how they are laid. Right now they require expensive engieer
> units
>> to put down. And your valuable engineers have to use their mobility to do
>> that. I won't even get into the "reality" aspect of how easy it is to sew
>> mines and their prevalence in places like the Balkins and Cambodia. All I
>> will ask is when is the last time anybody actually laid land mines?
>
> I have never laid land mines in a serious game. Cash for engineer units,
> their limited mobility and my limited time prevent this from being feasible.

I witnessed massive mining operations in LOTR I. I've laid landmines
myself occasionally.

Nevertheless, I agree that mine laying is broken. It just takes too
many commands.

Now, if mine laying were cheap and easy, I would have them everywhere.
That's not exactly realistic either. Neither side mined significant
areas of Germany during the cold war, and it wasn't for want of
explosives or perceived threat.

> BTW, when does the added defense strength of mines get added - before
> calculating reacting units or later when support is being added?

After. See info Attack.

>> I thought so. How about a "sapper" flag on units that will allow
> them
>> or engineers to sew and remove land mines? Then create a lower tech,
> cheap
>> unit that can really make use of land mines.
>>
>> Second, naval missiles blow. They are so innacurate that they don't
>> have a decent effect. Okay, I can easily change that when I d/l the
> source
>> and modify the plane.c file. But the real problem is with the destroyer
>> soak off tactic. You can build a $600, low profile ship that will attract
>> all sorts of naval missiles. the problem is they just fly right over the
>> deck because they cannot hit anything. And the reason that the missiles
>> attack these ships? They have the ability to carry a unit.
>>
>> Again, I can go into the ship.c file and remove the ability of these
>> ships to carry a unit. So the problem should be solved. But why don't
>> we make this a stock piece of code. DD's carrying units is a real nice
>> feature for this ships. maybe too nice.

While I agree that too many ships can carry (the wrong kinds of)
units, I believe that more things are broken with anti-ship missiles
than just that. If interested, have a look at
http://sourceforge.net/docman/display_doc.php?docid=16580&group_id=24031

> This makes DDs too useful. This is an issue we are addressing in the
> PZ4 game.

I believe that way too many land units are light.

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