[SOLVED] Sound Card for Big Screen Play

versionmanager

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I have played all my favorite games for years past on Big Screens. When bundled with a Dolby 7.2 stereo system it is like being at the movies. My goal is to transition off of a console (XBOX One X) and into a PC mode of play . In my opinion, sitting in front of a 75 in TV is more fulfilling than a super high-resolution Gaming Monitor. The TV I play on now is a Samsung 4K TV. Its specs can be found here:
https://www.samsung.com/us/televisions-home-theater/tvs/uhd-tvs/75--class-nu6900-smart-4k-uhd-tv--2018--un75nu6900fxza/
What is extremely confusing as I plan my Gamer/Office build is what type of GPU to buy. It seems to me that the video card is the place to start in this scenario and to build around it.

My concern is I want a card that will mature from the 1080P standard into a 4K display. Will a 2070 GPU fulfill an ability to play games on the market now and adjust to a new 4K standard with more taxing FPS once 4K becomes mainstream? If yes to a 2070, what are the specific suggested specs and possibly brand of a video card that will achieve my goal. If not, what would be the best card and a complementary Motherboard? What Ryzen CPU model would be ideal? Thanks in advance.
 

boju

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4k will depend more on gpu than cpu but would want the thread count moving forward. At least 6c/12t processors. 3600 is fine, though 3700x be preferable. Matched with 3600 CL 16 ram of 2x 16GB.

Regarding the graphics card, 3000 series might interest you and if it does, wait to find out more on what PSU manufacturers are going to do in regards to 12pin Pcie cable requirements for some higher end models.

2070 is so~so for a 60Hz 4k panel depending on game/settings and AA. 1080p upscales well to 4k so there's that too, relying on the TVs ability to do this for some titles. Something to play around with. But think what you're planning, you don't want to settle for a half-baked setup. A solid 60fps all round would be your target?


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Mainboard, x570 Gigabyte Aorus series or Asus Tuf are two of the leaders in quality.

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Regarding audio as per your title, graphics card HDMI audio directed to your AVR is the best way. Sound cards with Dolby Digital Live compression over optical is possible but for full range surround, HDMI is superior.
 

versionmanager

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4k will depend more on gpu than cpu but would want the thread count moving forward. At least 6c/12t processors. 3600 is fine, though 3700x be preferable. Matched with 3600 CL 16 ram of 2x 16GB.

Regarding the graphics card, 3000 series might interest you and if it does, wait to find out more on what PSU manufacturers are going to do in regards to 12pin Pcie cable requirements for some higher end models.

2070 is so~so for a 60Hz 4k panel depending on game/settings and AA. 1080p upscales well to 4k so there's that too, relying on the TVs ability to do this for some titles. Something to play around with. But think what you're planning, you don't want to settle for a half-baked setup. A solid 60fps all round would be your target?


--

Mainboard, x570 Gigabyte Aorus series or Asus Tuf are two of the leaders in quality.

--

Regarding audio as per your title, graphics card HDMI audio directed to your AVR is the best way. Sound cards with Dolby Digital Live compression over optical is possible but for full range surround, HDMI is superior.
Can you Please explain what you mean by and comment on:

"At least 6c/12t processors". Are you suggesting specs for the CPU? I don't understand what these numbers mean in regards to threads. What version of the Ryzen CPU will work in this situation?

"game/settings and AA"

When I see " A solid 60fps all round would be your target?" I think slow motion from a video taping perspective. How does this frame rate contribute to the game performance of the card?

What does the CL 16 of"3600 CL 16 ram of 2x 16GB" stand for?

Is " 12pin Pcie cable requirements" a new 'plug type' not currently on Motherboards? Thank you for the degree of detail and time that you have provided.
 

boju

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Sorry ill try to explain. Coming from consoles with little PC experience i gather?, this is going to be bit of a learning curve for you huh :) Well worth it in the end.

Can you Please explain what you mean by and comment on:

"At least 6c/12t processors". Are you suggesting specs for the CPU? I don't understand what these numbers mean in regards to threads. What version of the Ryzen CPU will work in this situation?
Yes specs, as in 6 physical cores and 12 logical threads. Each core using Simultaneous Multithreading to imitate each core into two cores instead of one. Helps with the work load. 3700x would be good for the longer term, 8 cores and 16 threads. Most cpus, from AMD and Intel, and also processors used in consoles have SMT.

Simultaneous multithreading (SMT)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simultaneous_multithreading

"game/settings and AA"
Anti Aliasing. A technique to enhance the image. PC games allow you to adjust this stuff so it's going to be a big change if were coming from the 'click and go' console gamer ;P Anyway, 4k + AA (or too much of it ~ eye candy), will tank performance.

When I see " A solid 60fps all round would be your target?" I think slow motion from a video taping perspective. How does this frame rate contribute to the game performance of the card?
Console game dev's try optimise games to run at or near constant desired fps levels to match the display's refresh rate. PC gaming is a little different and because you can change more the graphical aspect in games, there will be some tinkering involved finding a comfortable frame rate level your graphics card can achieve. Game's do have graphic presets but it's not always perfect.

What does the CL 16 of"3600 CL 16 ram of 2x 16GB" stand for?
Ryzen's cpu design, the way it communicates between itself and system ram, performs best with fast ram. For 3700x and other models in it's generation, people have found 3600Mhz ram is the sweet spot. Lower the Cas Latency the better (CL), but also, lower CL memory are generally more expensive. 3600MHz CL 16 ram is a common pairing for Ryzen 3xxx series and not too dear. 32GB (Gigabyte) worth of system memory, so 2x 16GB memory would be preferred heading into the future. 2x 16GB, as in two memory sticks in 'dual channel', working together for better performance.

Cas Latency;
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/cas-latency-ram-cl-timings-glossary-definition,6011.html

Dual Channel;
https://www.crucial.com/articles/about-memory/what-is-dual-channel-memory

Is " 12pin Pcie cable requirements" a new 'plug type' not currently on Motherboards? Thank you for the degree of detail and time that you have provided.
From the recent articles, it's looking like it's not going to be a huge issue. Connectors will be made available for card to be compatible with existing power supplies. I think it only relates to the RTX 3900 though but we'll see. Keep an eye on the news page here at Toms. Nvidia's newest flagship graphics card (3900) has had a Printed Circuit Board (PCB) shrink since other graphics cards making the PCIe plug smaller focusing more on cooling. PCIe plug as in the supplementary power cable connected to the graphics card for additional power.



Let me know if you're still not sure on anything i've said. Hopefully it mostly makes sense :)
 
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versionmanager

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Sorry ill try to explain. Coming from consoles with little PC experience i gather?, this is going to be bit of a learning curve for you huh :) Well worth it in the end.



Yes specs, as in 6 physical cores and 12 logical threads. Each core using Simultaneous Multithreading to imitate each core into two cores instead of one. Helps with the work load. 3700x would be good for the longer term, 8 cores and 16 threads. Most cpus, from AMD and Intel, and also processors used in consoles have SMT.

Simultaneous multithreading (SMT)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simultaneous_multithreading



Anti Aliasing. A technique to enhance the image. PC games allow you to adjust this stuff so it's going to be a big change if were coming from the 'click and go' console gamer ;P Anyway, 4k + AA (or too much of it ~ eye candy), will tank performance.



Console game dev's try optimise games to run at or near constant desired fps levels to match the display's refresh rate. PC gaming is a little different and because you can change more the graphical aspect in games, there will be some tinkering involved finding a comfortable frame rate level your graphics card can achieve. Game's do have graphic presets but it's not always perfect.



Ryzen's cpu design, the way it communicates between itself and system ram, performs best with fast ram. For 3700x and other models in it's generation, people have found 3600Mhz ram is the sweet spot. Lower the Cas Latency the better (CL), but also, lower CL memory are generally more expensive. 3600MHz CL 16 ram is a common pairing for Ryzen 3xxx series and not too dear. 32GB (Gigabyte) worth of system memory, so 2x 16GB memory would be preferred heading into the future. 2x 16GB, as in two memory sticks in 'dual channel', working together for better performance.

Cas Latency;
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/cas-latency-ram-cl-timings-glossary-definition,6011.html

Dual Channel;
https://www.crucial.com/articles/about-memory/what-is-dual-channel-memory



From the recent articles, it's looking like it's not going to be a huge issue. Connectors will be made available for card to be compatible with existing power supplies. I think it only relates to the RTX 3900 though but we'll see. Keep an eye on the news page here at Toms. Nvidia's newest flagship graphics card (3900) has had a Printed Circuit Board (PCB) shrink since other graphics cards making the PCIe plug smaller focusing more on cooling. PCIe plug as in the supplementary power cable connected to the graphics card for additional power.



Let me know if you're still not sure on anything i've said. Hopefully it mostly makes sense :)
Large reams of info! I will look at other's folks blend of pieces for their builds, your suggestions and propose a system on this board.

I came to the realization that if a machine that I build later becomes obsolete, I will build another if necessary.

What about buying a pre built from NewEgg then switching out parts, of course not the GPU! That will be the centerpiece.

At one time I saw the name of a suggested site to buy numerous parts from on Tom's Hardware but can't remember the name. Do you know it?
 

boju

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Do you mean pcpartpicker site?

You do have control over quality that goes into your own build. Often pre-builts cut costs somewhere. Like poorer psu unit, case construction or ram could be faster or larger. They're not totally bad though.

Regarding the motherboard just now, that's still the link to the processor. Go for a x570 Gigabyte Aorus Elite. Also most Ryzen boards you'll have the opportunity to upgrade processor to 4000series in future. 3700 is still an excellent cpu though so it'll most likely outlast the next gen consoles, that's almost certain.

Not sure what you meant about Windows 10, that might have been a reply to someone from another thread of yours?
 
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versionmanager

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Do you mean pcpartpicker site?

You do have control over quality that goes into your own build. Often pre-builts cut costs somewhere. Like poorer psu unit, case construction or ram could be faster or larger. They're not totally bad though.

Regarding the motherboard just now, that's still the link to the processor. Go for a x570 Gigabyte Aorus Elite. Also most Ryzen boards you'll have the opportunity to upgrade processor to 4000series in future. 3700 is still an excellent cpu though so it'll most likely outlast the next gen consoles, that's almost certain.

Not sure what you meant about Windows 10, that might have been a reply to someone from another thread of yours?
Have abandoned Pre Built, Thanks.

Yes to Parts Picker.

Sorry about the duplicate URL. This is the MB I meant:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07SVRZGMX/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1

What about the RAM at the link above?

Will the GeForce RTX 3070 bolt into a x570 Gigabyte Aorus Elite MB?

Is an Nvidia brand video card compatible with a board and a plugged in Ryzen CPU or does this GPU only pair with an Intel CPU?

Is the Acronym "RGB' I am seeing on the RAM and Motherboards reference LCD lighting in a case?

Can an M.2 SATA SSD boot and launch Windows 10?

Thanks again.
 

boju

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  • Great motherboard
  • Ram is perfect
  • Graphics cards aren't restricted to brands. Good way to end a company if they did this :)
  • RGB. Yes, lighting. Personally a gimmick to me.
From motherboard specs;
Integrated in the CPU (M2A_SOCKET):
· 3rd Generation AMD Ryzen™ processors:
  1. 1 x M.2 connector (Socket 3, M key, type 2242/2260/2280/22110 SATA and PCIe 4.0 x4/x2 SSD support)
· 2nd Generation AMD Ryzen™ processors/2nd Generation AMD Ryzen™ with Radeon™ Vega Graphics processors/AMD Ryzen™ with Radeon™ Vega Graphics processors:
  1. 1 x M.2 connector (Socket 3, M key, type 2242/2260/2280/22110 SATA and PCIe 3.0 x4/x2 SSD support)
M.2 slots support both Sata and Nvme type SSDs. Windows can be installed and boot from either. Sata type M2 uses the motherboard's chipset whilst Nvme uses the CPU's PCIe lanes. Latter is faster but can be more expensive. PCIe M2 SSDs will say the description 'Nvme'.
 

versionmanager

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Went with Motherboard and RAM. Graphics card questions next. Thank you.
Sound Card time! I The YouTube gurus are spoke highly of the RTX 3070 after the Amphere launch. I am in the middle of a build and am see claims of obsolescence with 2000 series cards. So what card do I buy. I really have never been an early adopter.

Will other vendors launch RTX 3000 series equivalents as well? If yes, when? I might need to buy a 2-70 or 2080 in the interim, Thoughts?

What is the best power supply for the x570 Gigabyte Aorus Elite MB that willpower multiple drives and peripherals? Thanks.
 

boju

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Sound Card time!
Sound card time? You said that before lol. Do you mean Graphics card with sound capabilities?

Psu list;

Around 650~750w. Corsair HXi is excellent. Corsair's AX are their premium line which start from 850w. Both offer 10 year warranty.

AX
https://www.corsair.com/ww/en/Categories/Products/Power-Supply-Units/Power-Supply-Units-Advanced/AX-Series™-80-PLUS-Titanium-Power-Supplies/p/CP-9020151-NA#tab-tech-specs

HXi
https://www.corsair.com/ww/en/Categories/Products/Power-Supply-Units/hxi-series-config/p/CP-9020072-NA#tab-tech-specs

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Go for 3070. 2080 is similar to a 1080Ti. 3070 is said to be faster than the 2080Ti. Newer support and stronger RTX performance. We'll know more soon but that's what it appears to be atm.

Stock levels may be an issue for early adopters trying to snag one so there possibly be few months wait after initial release. Be worth waiting for imo.
 

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I wanted to continue this thread. I built my rig with an RTX 3070 as the crown jewel. My parts sit in a pile and I don't want to wait until February when there is enough RTX - 3000 product out there for everyone tobuy.

In the interum, Is this GPU a decent compromise or temporary solution to get me up and running? If no, please share your insight as to why not. Thanks in advance.

EVGA GeForce GTX 1650 SC Ultra Gaming GDDR6, 04G-P4-1257-KR, 4GB GDDR6, Dual Fan, Metal Backplate
 

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No problem in doing that at all. I know you wanna scratch that itch and build it :)

Some idea how it performs. Roughly near 1060 level.

How much do you want to spend on a 'temporary' solution and how long do you want it to last realistically?

Its kind of the worat time to buy a gpu at the moment as a temporary measure
 

boju

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$160(if in US?) isn't much for something new and reasonably decent. Enough to at least enjoy something and check the components out.

Who knows how long the wait will be for availability. Could be a couple of months, perhaps longer. Just don't know. Longer ya wait, worse the timing gets.
 

madmatt30

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$160(if in US?) isn't much for something new and reasonably decent. Enough to at least enjoy something and check the components out.

Who knows how long the wait will be for availability. Could be a couple of months, perhaps longer. Just don't know. Longer ya wait, worse the timing gets.
The benefit of the 1650 super is that it will always have decent resale value because of its low power configuration.

The 1050 and 1050ti still resell for silly amounts second hand simply because some people have no other option in branded prebuilts.
 

boju

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Hmm yeah.

Ok so say they were readily deciding to buy 1650 non super. They go for around 160$, some little cheaper/pricier on Newegg, so that'll be the budget i suppose. What would you suggest for him matt? Something else, maybe hold off for the card he wants?
 

madmatt30

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Hmm yeah.

Ok so say they were readily deciding to buy 1650 non super. They go for around 160$, some little cheaper/pricier on Newegg, so that'll be the budget i suppose. What would you suggest for him matt? Something else, maybe hold off for the card he wants?
Hard to recommend a 'temporary' card really.

The 1650 super isn't a bad choice in that respect personally if I could find at a similar price (normally within $20) I'd go with a 580 8gb becaude it's a better card and will definitely last longer performance wise.

It just depends on how temporary he actually means.

Realistically when the new cards drop from amd and nvidia and they've become established items (meaning early next year imo) you're realistically only going to get $100 back for either of those cards.

If we're looking at a year or so till prices drop/establish then I think the 580 will pay dividends for the extra 10% payout now over a 1650 super.

As an example I bought a 580 about a year after it released on offer at £150.

2 months after the 5700xt released with decent aftermarket models going for around £480.

3 months back I eventually pulled the plug on a 5700xt on offer at £330.

So essentially for putting up with middling performance for around 14 months I got 2 cards for the price of one.

Whether you consider that a bargain is a personal thing.

The thing is I now have 2 setups, one with a gpu capable of good 1440p performance and even fair 4k performance and another solid 1080p gaming setup.

It all depends on what he expects gaming performance wise now at this very moment.

I have no doubt there will be a massive price war come mid 2021 on anything but the 3090.
 
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I am not a hardcore PC gamer yet but I am one on an XBOX One X. The current game of choice is Division 2. I previously played Fallout 4 (horrible graphics) and Far Cry 5 then New Dawn both of which have unbelievable graphics.

I will not resell a GPU if I can pull it to be substituted with a 30X0 in middle '21. I would liketo put this temporary card in a Dell XPS 8910. This desktop machine is used for digital picture tweaking, web surfing and Business type tasks .

The Dell Desktop is running an Intel i7 - 6700 CPU and has CORSAIR Vengeance LPX 64GB (4 x 16GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 2400 (PC4 19200) Desktop Memory. It currently has an NVidia GeoForce 750 TI card in it.

Will a 580 8gb , 5700xt , or a 1650 super , plug and plug and play in this Dell XPS board?
Given my intention outlined above, can either of you suggest another lesser expensive video card I can buy in the interim? Is it risky buying used cards? If yes from where or whom? I live in the US.

And by the way, the conversation between the two of you is not only awesome but a learning experience. I wish this type of exchange happened more often in these Forums instead of "one up man-ship".
 

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And by the way, the conversation between the two of you is not only awesome but a learning experience. I wish this type of exchange happened more often in these Forums instead of "one up man-ship".
That's nice of you to say, thanks. It's not often we get feed back like that :)

XPS system is new enough to run modern cards. Only concern might be of the power supply and PCIe connectors for additional power if went for a more power hungry card. 580 would be good if the psu is at least reasonable quality 500w and has 8pin PCIe connector. If tasks undertaken by the system is all it's needed for, i would think spending too much on a card be wasted. i7 6700 is a decent processor though and can handle 5700XT~1080Ti/RTX 2070Super level cards if were to game on it.

5600XT could be another option too. Performs quite well trading blows with RTX2060 and not too pricey; https://www.techspot.com/review/1974-amd-radeon-rx-5600-xt/

If unsure if psu in the XPS system is capable of running an RX580 or the following tiers, 1650 running off the motherboard alone would be safer.

I've never bought second hand stuff but can only imagine, besides lack of warranty, risk of not knowing for certain how it's been treated in the system or handled outside the case. There's every chance you could find a bargain well looked after card though. Amazon/Ebay are probably places id look. Newegg lists refurbs too. Check benchmarks and use listed models as reference.
 
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madmatt30

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I am not a hardcore PC gamer yet but I am one on an XBOX One X. The current game of choice is Division 2. I previously played Fallout 4 (horrible graphics) and Far Cry 5 then New Dawn both of which have unbelievable graphics.

I will not resell a GPU if I can pull it to be substituted with a 30X0 in middle '21. I would liketo put this temporary card in a Dell XPS 8910. This desktop machine is used for digital picture tweaking, web surfing and Business type tasks .

The Dell Desktop is running an Intel i7 - 6700 CPU and has CORSAIR Vengeance LPX 64GB (4 x 16GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 2400 (PC4 19200) Desktop Memory. It currently has an NVidia GeoForce 750 TI card in it.

Will a 580 8gb , 5700xt , or a 1650 super , plug and plug and play in this Dell XPS board?
Given my intention outlined above, can either of you suggest another lesser expensive video card I can buy in the interim? Is it risky buying used cards? If yes from where or whom? I live in the US.

And by the way, the conversation between the two of you is not only awesome but a learning experience. I wish this type of exchange happened more often in these Forums instead of "one up man-ship".
I'm with Boju, it is nice to be appreciated!

That dell is modern enough to run any modern gpu. The only issue is what psu is inside it.

Dell's that come with no discrete gpu or a lower end one tend to come with a 350w psu.
Some come with a 460w psu which would run upto a 5600xt without issue.

The psu can be easily replaced BUT its a case of whether the extra expense is worth it to you.

The issue with second hand cards, the 1650 super, rx 580, rx 5500xt are all on par or better than say older cards like the 1060 6gb or older gtx 970.

These cards still go for around $120 second hand from where I'm sat.

Me personally? I'd pay the extra $60 for a brand new card with warranty.
 

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